Steven Wilson v. To. The. Bone.

[KevShmev]

Wilson has been pretty open about the times his music was too much of a homage to his influences (see: Voyage 34).  I think the Floyd references in Time Flies (Dogs, Sheep, Time) are intentional, given the subject matter of the song.

I do agree that it is a bit eyebrow-raising to hear him talk so openly about having to possibly abandon the guitar because it's not "in" anymore as a mainstream lead instrument.  Given his age, I think there is definitely a part of him that wants to be more mainstream than he has been prior to now (don't most musicians want their music to be heard by as many people as possible??), and I think the deaths of Bowie and Prince inspired him to explore a different side of his musical self, which was evident at times on To the Bone and seems to be on most of the songs we've officially heard from The Future Bites so far, which is obviously closer to what is mainstream now than the music he did for much of his career before then.  Not everyone wants to wallow in prog obscurity forever.  

[HOF]

I have a lot to say but I'll try to keep it short.

He made a living off of aping retro prog. Then he decided  it was cliche. Btw, he completely ripped off the total structure of Dogs.

Saying the guitar is dead and electronic music is the future means trends are important to him. That troubles me. He spent many years bucking trends. Now he wants to be trendy and relevant.

GVF doesn't deserve sagging. He comes off as pretentious.

I've truly loved a lot of his music but from here forward, I might be done. He can follow his muse and seek to be hip and trendy. Nothing wrong with that. But I'll pass on this album and this attitude.

SW has been chasing trends at least since Radiohead and Tool were the bees knees. He’s kind of always been this way (trying to maintain that he is cool and relevant while other artists are dinosaurs or simply rehashing old ideas).

[emtee]

Yes, he was very open that Time Flies was an homage. Nonetheless, even though I love the song, it borders on thievery.

He can do whatever he wants. He'll gain some young fans and lose some old ones.

[Buddyhunter1]

Personally, I didn't interpret that interview as him saying he's transitioning away from the guitar because it isn't trendy any more. Like I said, it hasn't been trendy for over a decade now, and he must realize that as well. If he truly was a trend chaser he would have dropped the guitar years ago. And while his new stuff is electronic, it's still quite retro and doesn't really sound like most popular electronic music today, at least to me. I highly doubt it's something that'll win the kids over.

He kept making guitar-driven music for years despite it not being popular because that's just what interested him, and interests change over time. He says he got bored of the guitar, and I have no reason to doubt that. I'm guessing it's probably just where he's at right now and that interest will probably get sparked again sometime in the future. Desire for popularity could be a slight influencing factor there too, but when is it not?

The trendiest thing about this new album is probably the songs BEING IN ALL CAPS.

[KevShmev]

My impression has never been that he chases trends, but that is new music is influenced by whatever he is listening to at the time.  He was doing the 5.1 for bands Yes, King Crimson and Jethro Tull, and that was right around when he did Grace, The Raven and HCE, and then he did the ones for XTC and Tears for Fears, and then boom here came To the Bone.  And of course it seemed like the early 00's was his big metal phase, which is when PT incorporated a little into their sound starting with In Absentia.

[HOF]

My impression has never been that he chases trends, but that is new music is influenced by whatever he is listening to at the time.  He was doing the 5.1 for bands Yes, King Crimson and Jethro Tull, and that was right around when he did Grace, The Raven and HCE, and then he did the ones for XTC and Tears for Fears, and then boom here came To the Bone.  And of course it seemed like the early 00's was his big metal phase, which is when PT incorporated a little into their sound starting with In Absentia.

That’s a fair assessment. I don’t have a problem with him incorporating trends or whatever he’s listening to BTW. But it is a little rich for him to slag other bands for not being original.

[Buddyhunter1]

Mostly unrelated: To The Bone is a great album. Super underrated. People only shit on it because Permanating is on it.

[HOF]

Mostly unrelated: To The Bone is a great album. Super underrated. People only shit on it because Permanating is on it.

Permanating is my favorite song on the album. I think it’s a great song. The album is fine, but like other SW music I just hardly ever feel the need to put it on.

[Ben_Jamin]

 

This is what I love about Steven Wilson, and musicians that just don't give a shit what they're fans think and say, and will do whatever the fuck they want, because they are the artist.

Steven feels like Guitar based music is heading toward a trend of slowly going away, or more that style of music, just as Jazz did. And I agree with him about where the music is going, Urban, Electronic, R&B. People still use the saxophone, he's just saying how The Saxophone was the guitar back in the age of Jazz, it was the solo instrument. Now that guitar took over that, in that era. In this era, something new is going to replace that Guitar as a solo instrument, and take over it's spotlight.

Then he goes on to respond to the Question asked by the interviewer, and is responding to the example the interviewer gave with the Rolling Stone Magazine, and gave his opinion on that question posed by Rolling Stone.

And I agree with him about Greta Van Fleet. I mean, they are supposedly the best, as they are popular, and they sound like Led Zeppelin, and rehash of that old sound. So in Stevens eyes, it's doing nothing new with it, and the bands that are doing some good interesting new stuff with the guitar is not mainstream. He acknowledges there is still music with guitar that is good, but his point is that those Guitar bands are not in the mainstream.

But, when he says, the new sound will have some electronic element, I think of bands like Polyphia, Chon, Plini, Arch Echo. These bands are putting these R&B, Hip-Hop, beats and putting them with Electronic sounds, and making guitar licks off of that.

But, it seems that he is upset that a band like Greta Van Fleet is popular while these bands like Polyphia whom are doing new things with Guitar are not popular. And to me, that feeling made him utilize other ways of making music, and experimenting with making a new sound, one that is liked by the masses, and that is the current electronic sound and style that his current album has.

[nobloodyname]

Wilson is British and has strong opinions, so it's nearly impossible for him to NOT insult someone when he speaks.

I'm British and I approve of this message

People losing their shit about him again... love it. As someone who grew up very close to Steven's manor, it's like listening to a friend in a pub. I can see why people would choose to take offence but there is none intended whatsoever.

As for The Future Bites? Best album I've heard this year (I say that with my tongue in my cheek, obviously, at this stage) and there's a strong chance it'll remain that way until in 31 December, too.

[gazinwales]

English, when people ask where I was born or about my accent I say I am from England, not Britain, or the UK. 

[Kwyjibo]

If you have to degrade other bands to make your point, that's never a good idea. But then SW for me was always a little bit of a pretentious dick, right from the start, so no surprise there. And I think he does it on purpose.

[Fritzinger]

I might be bursting into this discussion but I had the please of writing a review for The Future Bites and I thought I'd share it with you guys 

http://www.loudhailermagazine.com/album-reviews/the-future-bites-by-steven-wilson/

[ErHaO]

Here is the thing though, I don’t think Steven's latest music necessarily sounds more novel than his previous works when looking at music in general. Sure, it is recognisably SW, but it has a lot in common with electronic music from the last 30-40 years.

I love To The Bone btw, and I like Permeating.

[nobloodyname]

I might be bursting into this discussion but I had the please of writing a review for The Future Bites and I thought I'd share it with you guys 

http://www.loudhailermagazine.com/album-reviews/the-future-bites-by-steven-wilson/

That is very well-written and knowledgeable review. Good read, thank you.

[faizoff]

Well that escalated quickly...

Kidding aside, it's a pretty standard Steven Wilson interview with pretty standard Steven Wilsonisms. Should have the new album in a week fingers crossed. Can't wait. I haven't heard a single second of the album so far and I'm sure I'll be a fan of it regardless.

[RoeDent]

I fundamentally disagree on the point that there is something different in every Porcupine Tree album. With the four metal albums they basically made the same album four times. They're interchangeable, and with The Incident they went to the well once too often. The solo career, however, is quite different. Every album is truly unique and vastly different from the last.

[PixelDream]

I'm quite lukewarm to all the singles so far. I didn't even return to 12 Things I Forgot after hearing it for the first time, and that's the first time ever for me. Always when there's a new PT or SW track, I'm playing the shit out of it.

We'll see though. I'm not holding my breath because I've basically heard more than half of the album and it's not very promising. Has nothing to do with the electronic direction though, I like electronic music. It's not radical enough and way too radio friendly for my tastes. I like the Kid A approach a bit more.

[Buddyhunter1]

Why is this man still releasing singles for a 40 minute album that comes out this Friday?

Not even gonna listen to this one, I can wait three days.

[Zantera]

I used to think SW & PT were super diverse with every album having a unique feel to it, but a decade after my initial binge period and with all the music I have discovered since then, I think a lot of it blends together. That's not necessarily bad though, some people tend to put a lot of emphasis on an artist changing with every album but I don't think there's anything bad with having a sound and staying true to it either - it depends on the artist. And no, I'm not saying Raven is the same thing as Bass Communion or The Future Bites is the same thing as The Sky Moves Sideways but there's an element there that you recognize and I do think SW has more variety to his repertoire than some other artists, but he also isn't like Ulver or something where every album is a drastic turn.

I'm still pretty hyped for new SW music. He's not one of my favorites anymore but I'm more curious in him doing something that feels new and weird for him with The Future Bites than I would be in him doing a Raven 2.0 or whatever else.

[Ben_Jamin]

If you have to degrade other bands to make your point, that's never a good idea. But then SW for me was always a little bit of a pretentious dick, right from the start, so no surprise there. And I think he does it on purpose.

I do too, and I highly enjoy when the artist or bands do these things on purpose. They know their audience follows them like sheep, and will say stuff just to get them riled up, Or even put on a persona. It's why I hilariously laughed when Devin Townsend even told that to the audience when he made them Boop, and they just laughed. 


But then this part of that interview explains the concept better than I can...

The Future Bites is a record whose themes explore the intersections of consumerism and identity in the social-media age. Songs such as “King Ghost” ask how much our sense of self is tied to The Id that we present online. The album queries why we’re so keen to brand ourselves through our products. Yet, for all its serious introspection, The Future Bites also displays the wry humor of its promotional website. For instance, the song “Personal Shopper” features Elton John—whose extravagant shopping sprees are the stuff of legend—listing a series of conspicuous consumption items: “teeth whitening...deluxe edition box sets...volcanic ash soap….”

See, that's why he got Elton John to do the shopping list, because he is known for being a "personal shopper".

and this one, which is really important to understand Stevens views of music and the music buisness and how people view music. I may just end up buying that book when it's released...

The main things I’ve done in lockdown, that I probably wouldn’t have done otherwise, are the [Album Years] podcast with Tim [Bowness] and working on my book, which is a really big project. It’s about my ideas about music. There’s a chapter in there about my feelings about my relationship with fans and social media. There’s a chapter on my ideas about how to listen to music—do away with this notion of genre for a start. I talk about my philosophy about making music and how I try to avoid having a set of parameters that you work within. So the book’s been really interesting and I’m really proud of the way it’s coming. That’s taken up a lot of time. I’ve carried on working on music.

I 100% agree with him about listening to music. It's why I love genre blending music, and when bands do genre covers of songs that are not close to that genre. Rush is actually really close to Reggae sound, and they proved it by doing a full intro/verse to Working Man, in the Reggae Style, I fucking loved it and did not expect that at all...

And this one....

The answer to your question is, does it help to undercut the kind of artifice side of it? Possibly a little bit. I’ve realized from experience that this is what a lot of people actually want. If I post something on Instagram or Facebook about a new album I’m about to release—something I’ve worked on for three years of my life, writing the demo, recording, mixing, mastering, promoting, sweating blood, sweat, and tears, you know, to make this album—I’ll get a certain amount of likes and comments. If I post a picture of me doing something silly with my dog, I get twice as many comments and interactions! [Laughs.]

This is partly what the album is about. It’s about the change in the climate of social media and how everyone there really only sees the world reflected back through this prism of social media. On the first sort of real song on the record, “Self,” there’s a line in the song that says, “Self sees a billion stars, but still can only self-regard.” And it’s the idea that we used to, as a species, look out at the cosmos. We used to look at the universe and be curious about the world we live in. And now we just look at this little screen on our phone to see how many likes our Instagram posts have got, how many comments our Facebook posts have got, how many views our YouTube post has got. So there’s a much more kind of insular sense of engaging with the world through the prism of social media.

There’s something a bit tragic about that for me. I think a lot of the interest in music now has understandably waned in the face of almost an overload of music, just the noise of constant noise, of new music being released into the world. And how do you get above that noise? Well, one of the ways to get above that noise is to, I guess, make more out of the cult of personality into showing more of your private life, your personal life. I’m okay with that. I’m proud of my family and proud of my wife, my kids.

I would highly suggest reading that interview...

Steven says a lot of things I agree with him about....

And these all lead into the question where he mentions Greta Van Fleek. You have to read these to understand what he means when he mentions Greta Van Fleet, and how they play into the context of which Wilson is describing.



One last thing...I laughed my ass off at this...

But this is my point. It’s not about the utility of it. It’s about the box ticking. It’s like, “OK, got that. Got that. Oh, yeah, that’s good, the rare 7-inch remix that only came out in Iceland for a week. Yeah, that’s on there, great. The rare bootleg board tape from the Plumpton Festival recorded in the toilets at the back of the [venue]. Yeah, got that. Okay, great. Tick, tick, tick. Oh my God. I can’t believe they’ve missed out the rare Guatemalan sex dance mix. Shit, it’s a disaster!”

[Ben_Jamin]

Personally, I didn't interpret that interview as him saying he's transitioning away from the guitar because it isn't trendy any more. Like I said, it hasn't been trendy for over a decade now, and he must realize that as well. If he truly was a trend chaser he would have dropped the guitar years ago. And while his new stuff is electronic, it's still quite retro and doesn't really sound like most popular electronic music today, at least to me. I highly doubt it's something that'll win the kids over.

He kept making guitar-driven music for years despite it not being popular because that's just what interested him, and interests change over time. He says he got bored of the guitar, and I have no reason to doubt that. I'm guessing it's probably just where he's at right now and that interest will probably get sparked again sometime in the future. Desire for popularity could be a slight influencing factor there too, but when is it not?

The trendiest thing about this new album is probably the songs BEING IN ALL CAPS.

Just slap the label of Justin Bieber, Taylor Swift, or even Porcupine Tree. It'll sell then, and make his point even more greater. 

[Peter Mc]

Why is this man still releasing singles for a 40 minute album that comes out this Friday?

Not even gonna listen to this one, I can wait three days.

Same, I’ve heard enough of the album already, I want some surprises left.

[Zantera]

Part of me thinks the way he's been releasing singles and pretty much the whole album before it releases is just a reference to how the music business in general seems to be going. I feel like with popular music there seems to be more buzz around singles than albums and we've gone from a 'album is an art form' to 'making playlists with individual songs' mentality.

Considering pretty much everything he's done to market this album has been like this, it wouldn't surprise me if the over-feeding us on singles is done by purpose. It's not like he does it normally after all.

[Buddyhunter1]

Let's hope he didn't make the album bad on purpose as a commentary too.

[cramx3]

Wasn't the album supposed to be released awhile ago and it got pushed back due to the pandemic?  If that's the case, I can see why they release songs like this so that the casual fans don't forget about the album.

[KevShmev]

I listened to all five songs from the proper album that have been officially released and all sounded good.  I suspect the rest of the album will be even better, as SW does not strike me as the kind of guy who will put all of the best stuff out as pre-release singles.  Ya know those comedies that end up not being funny and you think, "all of the funny stuff was in the trailer." I don't see that happening here.

In SW WE Trust!!

[ErHaO]

Let's hope he didn't make the album bad on purpose as a commentary too.

The singles amount to around 65% of the album, so anyone  now has a clear indication for what is the quality of the majority of the album.

I am not feeling it, unfortunately. But I appreciate SW going into the artistic direction that he wants to.

I do listen to To The Bone and Love You To Bits quite a lot , so I do not have an aversion for SW pop and/or disco.

[Ben_Jamin]

Part of me thinks the way he's been releasing singles and pretty much the whole album before it releases is just a reference to how the music business in general seems to be going. I feel like with popular music there seems to be more buzz around singles than albums and we've gone from a 'album is an art form' to 'making playlists with individual songs' mentality.

Considering pretty much everything he's done to market this album has been like this, it wouldn't surprise me if the over-feeding us on singles is done by purpose. It's not like he does it normally after all.

He even released his B-Side:EP digitally, and it's up on Youtube. 

[Buddyhunter1]

I think if Steven wanted to make a commentary on the dominance of the single over the album in modern times, he should have done a "Song Machine" type thing like the new Gorillaz album. It ended up working out really well for them.

[goo-goo]

Does the bluray include a Making of Documentary? I have always enjoyed those.

[faizoff]

Does the bluray include a Making of Documentary? I have always enjoyed those.

Reading the description, it doesn't look like there is one. I too have loved all the making of docs so far. The last one was probably my favorite. I loved the fly on the wall footage of recording in that tiny studio he went to and how they settled on the guitar tones, it was a very fun watch.

[pfillion]

New single is up

https://youtu.be/G_yW8ornhK4

[Ben_Jamin]

New single is up

https://youtu.be/G_yW8ornhK4

That atmosphere reminds me of ZETA. I love that ethereal, floating like, atmosphere.

[kirksnosehair]

Wow, yeah, I began thinking he was going somewhere I have no interest in going musically, but these songs he's releasing are confirmation that there is nothing here for me.  It's not surprising since I only really like about 25% of the material he's ever put out, and that includes Porcupine Tree who have exactly 2 albums that interest me.  I think there are a total of 4 albums of his that I like.  In Absentia and Deadwing are the only PT albums I have any interest in and The Raven and Hand.Cannot.Erase are the only two solo albums I have any interest in so I was expecting I wouldn't like his new stuff and my expectations were on the money.   Just because I wanted to hear what they sound like I downloaded a Gretta Van Fleet album last night.  It didn't do much for me either.