Haken v. new single Nightingale (April 26)

[cramx3]

damn, another delay 

[Evermind]

Oh come on

[Buddyhunter1]

just put it up for streaming at this point

If they're waiting for live shows to come back this album isn't coming out this year.

[Ben_Jamin]

Honestly, in these times of streaming. There is no excuse an album shouldn't be released on time. If the packaging is a part of the entire concept, I'm sure many people are willing to wait for a physical release. It's the music we enjoy and want,  and go see performed, the other stuff are just nice extras.

I understand if an artist wants to be pretentious and require the listener to buy both the music and packaging/artwork in order to understand the concept or emerge oneself more into it...(Cough...SW...Cough).

With all that said. I'm still convinced it's the name of the album and Haken don't want to give in and rename it because it's the entire point of the name of the album, it being their 6th album and a concept about a VIrus.

[goo-goo]

Shit...two more weeks.

[KevShmev]

Lame.

At least with Steven Wilson's album, he pushed it (way) back once instead of faking out the fans every few weeks with, "okay, the release date is NOW almost here, oh wait, no it's not."  I would think a band that seems to want to connect with their fans would know that, with no concerts and live sports right now, THIS is the time to make your fans happy with new music, not constantly delaying the release of it.  This won't affect my potential enjoyment of it, but this is oft-putting.

[ariich]

I completely understand Kev, but honestly it really is outside of the band's control and it's at least as frustrating for them as it is for the fans.

[KevShmev]

Let me guess: the jugheads at the record company are worried that releasing the album when they can't tour will hurt the eventual concert sales? 

I just don't buy that.  If the album is good, fans won't forget about it in a month.

[NoFred]

It’d be interesting to hear more about why, not cause it matters or we deserve to know, but because this is the third delay. There has to be something unique to this situation.

[The Letter M]

I wonder if the new Kansas album will get delayed again, too...weird. It's a bit upsetting and unfortunate, but I can understand if it's something out of their control. Like many others, though, I do wish that outlets that had orders for the album would offer up digital downloads of the album available for fans to listen to, but only for those who have bought, or will buy their discs (so as to give an incentive for folks to order the physical product).

-Marc.

[the_silent_man]

Last Friday saw the release of both Lamb of God and Protest the Hero. We've also had Testament's and Trivium's album at peak virus time back in April. So the virus is not delaying the release of a lot of albums, must be something else.

[Fritzinger]

I completely understand Kev, but honestly it really is outside of the band's control and it's at least as frustrating for them as it is for the fans.

I was just gonna write this. Don't be angry at the Haken boys, I'm sure this is the last thing they want.

[IDontNotDoThings]

Do we know if the issue is still the shipping during the pandemic? Because I'm starting to doubt that that's the only reason, considering how many other IO releases have come out in June. Especially so, considering that I don't think anyone confirmed the delay was because of the pandemic in the first place.

Some of the online Haken circles I'm in have speculated that the band in going through some internal conflict right now (namely towards Diego), which I really hope isn't true, but with how little information we have right now in these uncertain times, it could be fucking anything. 

[Fritzinger]

Do we know if the issue is still the shipping during the pandemic? Because I'm starting to doubt that that's the only reason, considering how many other IO releases have come out in June. Especially so, considering that I don't think anyone confirmed the delay was because of the pandemic in the first place.

Some of the online Haken circles I'm in have speculated that the band in going through some internal conflict right now (namely towards Diego), which I really hope isn't true, but with how little information we have right now in these uncertain times, it could be fucking anything. 

Oh no oh no oh no oh no oh oh no oh no oh no.

Please let this Haken lineup be stable. It's perfect. I hope the boys are not having beef with each other.
Where did you find this information?

[IDontNotDoThings]

Do we know if the issue is still the shipping during the pandemic? Because I'm starting to doubt that that's the only reason, considering how many other IO releases have come out in June. Especially so, considering that I don't think anyone confirmed the delay was because of the pandemic in the first place.

Some of the online Haken circles I'm in have speculated that the band in going through some internal conflict right now (namely towards Diego), which I really hope isn't true, but with how little information we have right now in these uncertain times, it could be fucking anything. 

Oh no oh no oh no oh no oh oh no oh no oh no.

Please let this Haken lineup be stable. It's perfect. I hope the boys are not having beef with each other.
Where did you find this information?

From the Haken discord server, & some screenshots of Facebook fan groups that my gf has shown me. I should specify that this is pure speculation, but the things that I've seen brought up are:
-Diego recently released a new EP, which Haken hasn't promoted
-Diego is the only Haken member to not appear on their twitch streams, which are a big bonding event for the other members
-Diego's been really low in the mix of the Virus tracks we've heard so far
-No official personnel have come forward with a definitive reason why Virus has been delayed three times so far

I really don't think that any of these points prove it, & I certainly hope it's just a coincidence, but I'd be lying if I said I wasn't really worried too.

Edit: on second thought, I don't think I should be spreading rumours like this, but I'll let you know whether anything gets confirmed or denied, if someone else doesn't post it here first

[Fritzinger]

Yeah I did some research in Haken Haven and Reddit, and found some of those things too. I'm seriously concerned, Haken is arguably my favourite of all "newer" bands.

By the way, the band has not confirmed that last postponement of the release date, or am I missing something?

[IDontNotDoThings]

Yeah I did some research in Haken Haven and Reddit, and found some of those things too. I'm seriously concerned, Haken is arguably my favourite of all "newer" bands.

By the way, the band has not confirmed that last postponement of the release date, or am I missing something?

A lot of emails have been sent to pre-orderers saying the release has been postponed. Google Play also lists July 24th as the release date, but idk if the other sites have updated yet (they hadn't when I checked this morning).

[RoeDent]

Dammit! This thing's never coming out. It better be the best thing they've ever done at this rate.

I managed to get a Pattern-Seeking Animals CD last month, so CD production is clearly still happening at IO, and things are being relaxed now so that should no longer be an issue. It's obviously something else, something they're not telling us.

[KevShmev]

That would suck if any conflict resulted in Diego leaving the band. I’ve said for awhile that he’s the band’s MVP. But the last two albums and these new songs we’ve heard from Virus all seem to be pushing the guitars more up front, which was a contrast to the first three albums all of which had a great keyboard/guitar balance. Maybe he’s not happy about taking a lesser role. I get it if these delays of the new album are out of their control, but to stay mum and not put some kind of statement out to the fans to smooth things over is very odd.

[RoeDent]

Maybe there's legal ramifications?

[goo-goo]

Maybe there's legal ramifications?

Not sure though about this. If they are changing the credits of the songs, then they would have to reprint the artwork and credits in sleeves, etc. But I remember DT did the songwriting credits on the legal/business aspect side with the appropriate credit and songwriter, etc, and just printed "music by Dream Theater, lyrics by ...." on the cd sleeves.

Legally, they can work it out on the side with the album being released at the same time.

On the Twitch thing, maybe just  the time zones don't work for Diego. I think he lives in Mexico City.

[Northern Lion]

I really hope this news isn't true.  I've been so excited for this album to come out.  I wonder if Diego isn't happy with the mix?  If the album has been delayed again, this could really hurt their sales.  The singles are there to build up excitement right before the album lands, and with so much wait time that hype goes away.

[Max Kuehnau]

Maybe there's legal ramifications?

Not sure though about this. If they are changing the credits of the songs, then they would have to reprint the artwork and credits in sleeves, etc. But I remember DT did the songwriting credits on the legal/business aspect side with the appropriate credit and songwriter, etc, and just printed "music by Dream Theater, lyrics by ...." on the cd sleeves.

Legally, they can work it out on the side with the album being released at the same time.

On the Twitch thing, maybe just  the time zones don't work for Diego. I think he lives in Mexico City.

for all I know (and based on what I've read) he recorded most (if not all) of his keyboard parts in Mexico City,yes. Ross' vocals as well if I'm not mistaken. ("The Bunker, Mexico City" is indicated in the album liner notes for Vector anyway)

[goo-goo]

Only thing I can think off that might be a more realistic issue versus to what has been posted would be that Diego just decided to play with Devin Townsend. He was playing double duty with them and found it to be a better role and outlet than what he currently has with Haken. Also, Devin has been rescheduling some of the European shows and maybe there's a scheduling conflict with Haken's plans.

My gut tells me it's just a logistics issue with printing/manufacturing plants and shipping. If the product is coming from Europe, maybe there are some shipment delays with the distributor, pressing plants, customs, Fedex/UPS/DHL. I know I/O had some distributor issues right before the Covid thing and some releases were delayed a bit as well. Remember, the machine doesn't really start going until about 3 months prior to release date. The original one was June 5. If you go back 3 months, that's around March. That's when everything came to a halt. So by the time you get going, pressing plants have already been delayed with the already scheduled releases, plus the new incoming orders, that's just a massive backlog. I know I have had issues with small packages shipping from Europe..Took two months for a non-registered mail package. Customs is another area where there are delays (some of my overseas clients have had issues just getting us parts to us). Some clients have said that UPS and Fedex is only delivering the products using their expensive tiers. Shipping hubs from Fedex and UPS have also been affected and trying to adjust to the new Covid measures. I wouldn't panic yet until an official announcement is posted. I know the band hasn't explicitly said anything about the delay. They only mentioned unfortunate circumstances beyond the label and band's control...which might be what I am talking about in this last paragraph on logistics.

[The Letter M]

From Facebook

Hi all, we hope everyone is doing well out there!
We’ve been informed that our new album ‘Virus’ will now be released on Friday 24th July 2020.
We can only apologise for any inconvenience and disappointment this causes. We really, really appreciate everyone for their support and ongoing patience during these unprecedented times. We don’t take it for granted!

-Marc.

[Northern Lion]

Based off that, it looks like it is a logistics issue and not an internal band issue.  Which is good news.  Still sucks that the album has been delayed again.  But, I will support the band and this will be a day 1 buy for me.

[cramx3]

Only thing I can think off that might be a more realistic issue versus to what has been posted would be that Diego just decided to play with Devin Townsend. He was playing double duty with them and found it to be a better role and outlet than what he currently has with Haken. Also, Devin has been rescheduling some of the European shows and maybe there's a scheduling conflict with Haken's plans.

I think this would be a terrible move for Diego.  I love Devin and Devin is a bigger "brand" than Haken, BUT Devin is known for switching musicians and his "backing band" so I couldn't imagine anyone leaving their main band to join Devin and think that would be permanent.  However, maybe doing the double duties has made some scheduling difficulties and has lead to Diego not being as involved as he previously was.  I'd be really upset if he left Haken, but my gut is going with this being a logistics issue.

[me7]

We should start a guessing game about when the album will be released.

[ariich]

We should start a guessing game about when the album will be released.

Perhaps being optimistic, but I think 24th July will stick.

[Evermind]

I'll go for 8th August just for the sake of it

[cramx3]

We should start a guessing game about when the album will be released.

Perhaps being optimistic, but I think 24th July will stick.

If it doesn't, there's got to be something seriously wrong.  At least if the band doesn't come out with an explanation, another delay without reason will have me seriously worried.

[Max Kuehnau]

All this will expand into Toolian proportions concerning release dates and taking bets about them

[me7]

Toolian... This should become a word.

[RoeDent]

If the album has been delayed again, this could really hurt their sales.  The singles are there to build up excitement right before the album lands, and with so much wait time that hype goes away.

If I may take this another way, I'd say IO's current method of releasing half the album as singles before the album's release isn't really good for album hype. I feel like they start promotion for it a bit too far out.

[Train of Naught]

If the album has been delayed again, this could really hurt their sales.  The singles are there to build up excitement right before the album lands, and with so much wait time that hype goes away.

If I may take this another way, I'd say IO's current method of releasing half the album as singles before the album's release isn't really good for album hype. I feel like they start promotion for it a bit too far out.

Three singles is fairly standard, which seems the case for most of the InsideOut releases. The timing (given the album's original release date) was also completely fine. No point in releasing any singles if you don't give at least some space between them and the album release.

I'm not the biggest fan of IO so I haven't followed many of their releases, but the sweet spot for me is somewhere around 2 months between first single and/or album announcement and the street date, and 2 or 3 singles.

EDIT: Also, the band had a tour planned later this year that they stuck with even when it looked like they probably should cancel it. Maybe this somehow affected the album release, since they most likely wanted to combine this album release with the tour for promotional purposes. When they found out the tour won't happen and can't be announced, I find it likely that the label decided that they don't depend on getting the album out ASAP anymore and perhaps moved around the album release to make more sense on its own merits rather than being the medium to promote their tour.