Video Game Thread v. Wii4One

[Sir GuitarCozmo]

Continuing my streak of being many years behind the times, I'm currently playing FF7: Crisis Core on my PSP.  Love.  It.  Only FF game I've ever played, so I'll have to see if there are others for the PSP that are as good or better.

[Nick]

A light detour from story, a quick note on characters. FF13 had some of the most god-awful characters/dialog I've ever been subject to.

[Lynxo]

A light detour from story, a quick note on characters. FF13 had some of the most god-awful characters/dialog I've ever been subject to.

Oh God yes, it was awful.

[Sir GuitarCozmo]

As noted, I'm way behind times.  I just played Assassin's Creed: Bloodlines for the PSP earlier this year.  But I'm quite surprised at how very vivid and high quality some of the cut scenes on Crisis Core are on the PSP.

[Podaar]

I picked up Dishonored a few weeks ago, after not gaming for nearly half a year, and have been obsessing over it. The day before yesterday I finished my second play through alternating missions between low and high chaos trying to determine where the breaking point of the "morality" is. I can bare witness to it being a razors edge. Literally, one kill can take you from being respected part of the plot to restore the Empress and cure the plague to being a raving blood thirsty tyrant trying to impose your will on the Empire full of rats, plague riddled revenants and self possessed plotters. I would have loved a more gradual morality system but it's easy to see why they did it the way they did.

I think for my next run through I'll try to get the "clean hands" and "shadow" achievements.

Oh, and the game play is the smoothest and most immersive first-person game I've ever played. It's a real joy moving through the missions.

[Kotowboy]

The Last of Us would like a word with you.

One exception doesnt prove the rule.

[Chino]

The Last of Us would like a word with you.

One exception doesnt prove the rule.

I've never even played it  My friends do nothing but rave about the story.

[Progmetty]

I got the Sony headphones, they're pretty decent but it does get hot under there for me and I know it's a me problem, I've always been an ear buds guy, I'll get used to it.
I absolutely never play FPS or online multiplayer so the sound issue you guys were talking about isn't a problem for me.

[Lucien]

I bought Okami a while back after mastering the demo. Everything about it is great, gameplay, plot, MUSIC...

[ariich]

The Last of Us would like a word with you.

One exception doesnt prove the rule.

I'm more interested in plot than anything else.

[Nick]

The Last of Us would like a word with you.

One exception doesnt prove the rule.

I'm more interested in plot than anything else.

The Last of Us... god yes. This goes so well with what I said earlier. Great gameplay, great graphics, and then man, that amazing story and how well it's told, the proper use of a few cut scenes for added depth, just takes it into game of the decade discussion.

I think it's under appreciated for it's story, so I'd like to give a shout out to the God of War core (1, 2, and 3). Obviously they had to take many liberties, but the way they interweaved classic mythology into it was so well done throughout the series, and then the ending to 3... how satisfying that was, and how perfectly it ended the story.

[Randaran]

The Last of Us would like a word with you.

One exception doesnt prove the rule.

I'm more interested in plot than anything else.

The Last of Us... god yes. This goes so well with what I said earlier. Great gameplay, great graphics, and then man, that amazing story and how well it's told, the proper use of a few cut scenes for added depth, just takes it into game of the decade discussion.

I think it's under appreciated for it's story, so I'd like to give a shout out to the God of War core (1, 2, and 3). Obviously they had to take many liberties, but the way they interweaved classic mythology into it was so well done throughout the series, and then the ending to 3... how satisfying that was, and how perfectly it ended the story.

Yes, GoW3 has one of the most satisfying endings in a medium that is not all that friendly towards storytelling, though that is another debate.

[Dark Castle]

In all honesty I though God of war 3 had one of the weakest endings in game I'd ever seen

[Progmetty]

I wish I could play Last of Us, my brother-in-law bought it and I was gonna play it after him but he got it stuck in my old PS3 which suffered the blue light problem and needs ps3 surgery which I don't have time or will to do heh
My favorite game plot was Silent Hill 2, followed by LA Noire, Red Dead Redemption and Heavy Rain.

[Sacul]

I might be one of the few who plays games just for the plot .

I bought Okami a while back after mastering the demo. Everything about it is great, gameplay, plot, MUSIC...

I just beat it a few day ago. It took me around 32 hours with some secondary missions, but it was glorious all the way through. I absolutely loved the OST - Japanese folk is so beautiful.

[TheGreatPretender]

To me, the gameplay comes first and foremost. You can have a great story and graphics, but without great gameplay it's pointless as a game. Once great gameplay is established graphics and story must be added to take a game to a higher level.

Yeah, but I think good gameplay, without plot or art direction can get just as tedious. I mean, I don't care how good the gameplay is, if the characters are annoying, and the main protagonist is unlikable and unrelatable, then it'll completely remove me from immersion. And if a game has no storyline at all, then while I might have some passive fun with it for a little while, ultimately, I won't feel motivated to pick it up.
So really, I think everything is important, and really excelling in one can easily make up for some drawbacks in the other. Silent Hill 2 is a good example. The gameplay isn't bad, but it is a bit clunky, but the visual style and the storyline more than make up for it. Of course, if the gameplay is complete ass, then yeah, no graphics or story in the world are going to save it. But personally, I'd take a game with okay gameplay, but a fantastic plot and great art style, over a really fun game with terrible characters and/or ugly art direction.

[ThatOneGuy2112]

I don't think I've ever played a game with outstanding gameplay but terrible art direction. Might be just me, but I've yet to encounter one like that.

Inversely for me, I'd much rather play a game that's fun and immensely replayable with an average story (or even little to no story) than a game with a terrific story but boring and unmemorable gameplay. I play games for their gameplay. If I really wanted a good story, I'd probably go read a good book or watch a good movie. If the game has a good story, then all the more power to it, but it should at least have some sense of well-constructed game design and fun gameplay to back it up, or else it's unlikely I'll find myself coming back to it.

[TheGreatPretender]

If I really wanted a good story, I'd probably go read a good book or watch a good movie.

See, the problem I have with statements like this is that video games make for an incredibly powerful storytelling medium, and allowing for interaction gives you more power and potential than a movie or a book ever could. Of course, gameplay is the most important, because the experience has to be engaging, and oftentimes you experience the story through gameplay. But the point is that it really bugs me when people just dismiss story in games as "unimportant". Heck, some of the best games I've ever played, the gameplay WAS the story. Games like Dragon Age, Mass Effect, Fallout, etc., half the fun is being able to drive the narrative the way you want, and shaping the game world the way you see fit.
The way story is told in games is still fairly new, and still very much developing, but it shouldn't just be dismissed entirely. There have been some very great and very successful games that wouldn't have been nearly as popular if it wasn't for their narratives.
Different games have different purposes, and of course, I don't need a story in my Tetris, but with certain genres, story is absolutely integral to the experience.

[ThatOneGuy2112]

See, the problem I have with statements like this is that video games make for an incredibly powerful storytelling medium, and allowing for interaction gives you more power and potential than a movie or a book ever could. Of course, gameplay is the most important, because the experience has to be engaging, and oftentimes you experience the story through gameplay. But the point is that it really bugs me when people just dismiss story in games as "unimportant". Heck, some of the best games I've ever played, the gameplay WAS the story. Games like Dragon Age, Mass Effect, Fallout, etc., half the fun is being able to drive the narrative the way you want, and shaping the game world the way you see fit.
The way story is told in games is still fairly new, and still very much developing, but it shouldn't just be dismissed entirely. There have been some very great and very successful games that wouldn't have been nearly as popular if it wasn't for their narratives.
Different games have different purposes, and of course, I don't need a story in my Tetris, but with certain genres, story is absolutely integral to the experience.

I'm not exactly dismissing story in video games as "unimportant". I just don't feel it to be a requirement to make a game that's great overall. When I'm looking to buy a new game, for example, I go by what looks to be the most fun and engaging to play, not necessarily how enticing the story will be. Basically, gameplay takes the priority, for me personally.

I agree, video games are an entirely different medium from literature and films, and the level of interaction is the main game-changer here. But whereas in both of those, the story takes up a much larger role in most cases, in video games, they're made to make you immersed in the game's environment and the game's reality, something that does not, to me, necessarily have to have a good story in order to achieve.

Let's look at the Mario games, for simplicity's sake. Plumber guy goes off to save a princess from an evil king. Big whoop. Not much to the story there, but there's a reason those game are ultra iconic and memorable for thousands upon thousands of people. They're fun to play and, for a while, the Mushroom Kingdom feels so real to the player.

[TheGreatPretender]

But then maybe that's generalizing a bit too much. I mean, I don't know what kinds of games you play. But I honestly can't imagine someone who's a fan of Japanese RPGs being interested in an RPG which has great gameplay with as I mentioned, terrible, annoying characters and an unengaging plot. Story is probably one of the most important factors in an RPG, as long as the gameplay isn't so bad it's outright tedious.

Whereas, with certain games, or genres, such as puzzle games, of course the puzzle factor has to be fun, and rarely do any puzzle games have a storyline, nor do they need one. So it really is about the genre. Sometimes you just want to scratch your noodle, or kill stuff, and there are certain genres that are designed just for that.

But personally, even for a game with a storyline where I mainly care about the gameplay, like inFamous, or Batman Arkham games, if such a game had a terrible storyline, I'd see no point in playing it. The storyline doesn't have to have the most character development or anything, but it should at least be okay. The characters and the world at least have to make sense in the context of the gameplay. If I'm completely uninterested in the story, like let's say the past several Resident Evil titles, no matter how fun, I'm absolutely not interested in playing them.

[The King in Crimson]

It's funny how so many people are dissing Destiny's lack of decent plot.


I don't think anyone spends £50 on a new game because the story looked good.


It's always about graphics and gameplay. I never hear / see gamers comparing games for their plot.

Then you aren't reading enough. Plenty of games are noted for their stories and while that number may be less than the amount of games that have negligible or shit stories, that does not invalidate their existence. For example:

The Last Of Us
Spec Ops: The Line
The Mass Effect Series
The Fallout Games
Planescape: Torment
System Shock 2
Deus Ex
Bioshock
Bioshock: Infinite
Half-Life 2
Star Wars: Knights of the Old Republic
Vampire: Bloodlines
The Walking Dead (the Telltale Games)
Chrono Trigger
*Insert Your Favorite Final Fantasy Game Here*
Plus probably a bunch of other games I've never played.

All (well, most...) rely on the interactivity of video games to further their plots either via the mutability of the player's choices or how video games can make you an active participator in the events of the story. I can read a book or watch a movie to witness a story unfold or I can play a game to feel like a part of it as it unfolds around/with me.

I've played plenty of games that were light on story and were more enjoyable for their gameplay so I'm not knocking games like Destiny (I played World of WarCraft for years ffs), but to say that gamers don't care about story or that games don't have good stories is just so very, very wrong.

I personally think games are at their best when great stories are married with great gameplay, yet I've also loved games like Planescape: Torment that have relatively weak gameplay, in general, or games like The Walking Dead where the 'gameplay' is just a succession of dialogue choices and quick-time events. Art style is important too, but a beautiful-looking game ain't going to make up for a shallow story and weak gameplay, whereas great gameplay or a great story can make up for weaknesses in the others categories. That's why I could never get into Borderlands.

[adace]

I personally think games are at their best when great stories are married with great gameplay

My thoughts exactly. Games with negligible story like Destiny or Titanfall are great when you want some quick, no-frills, fun gameplay, but games like Mass Effect and Dragon Age are much more memorable and stronger overall because of their great stories.

[TheGreatPretender]

I personally think games are at their best when great stories are married with great gameplay

My thoughts exactly. Games with negligible story like Destiny or Titanfall are great when you want some quick, no-frills, fun gameplay, but games like Mass Effect and Dragon Age are much more memorable and stronger overall because of their great stories.

Well, obviously it's best to have a bit of everything, but the big question is does "quick, no-frills, fun gameplay" constitute a $60 price tag? For me personally, I would say absolutely not. And the same would go for a game with great story and mediocre gameplay.

But honestly, there have been games where going into them, I was really excited for the storyline, and had absolutely no idea what the gameplay was gonna be like. Luckily, with most of them, I enjoyed the gameplay quite a bit. Games like Beyond: Two Souls, I knew very little about what it would play like, and only knew that I was a fan of what the developer made before it, but still, I knew that the narrative aspect of it was going to be extremely strong, and the graphics absolutely blew me away, and that was enough to sell it to me at full price.

[Lucien]

I would buy Okami for double whatever price it was sold at on release. 100% worth it. I've gotten a couple hundred hours out of the game out of new-game-+ content and trying to complete all the sidequests. Brilliant story, brilliant music, the art direction might as well be porn, and the gameplay is rowdy and fun, not to mention satisfying for some of the bigger creatures in the game. The storyline alone is long enough to where you'll have spent over 20-30 hours AT LEAST if you just charge straight through the game without doing any of the sidequests. It's probably my favorite videogame ever.

[Kotowboy]

I've played plenty of games that were light on story and were more enjoyable for their gameplay so I'm not knocking games like Destiny (I played World of WarCraft for years ffs), but to say that gamers don't care about story or that games don't have good stories is just so very, very wrong.

I didn't say they don't *care* about it - just that I don't think gamers buy games *primarily* based on the games plot. Genre yes.

Oh and I loved Borderlands.

[ariich]

I agree with literally everything that TheGreatPretender is saying on this page. Like with any medium, story is really important, but so are other more technical aspects (in this case graphics and gameplay, with books it would be good use of language, in films it would be good directing, acting, effects, etc.).

Video games are a really unique way to tell stories because of the more direct immersion and interactivity, and because the player can have an impact on the story. Focussing only on gameplay, for me, is akin to focussing movies only on special effects and good action.

EDIT: Which I suppose gets to the crux of it - different games/films/books can have different strengths. I enjoy some action films with not much plot if the directing style etc. are really enjoyable. Similarly, I enjoy some games with not much plot if they are fun to play. But mostly the games and films I engage with the most and would want to play/watch again are those with great stories.

[Kotowboy]

I love playing Destiny and literally have no idea about the plot.

Conversely I love Borderlands 2 partly because I love the plot so maybe i should shaddap

[TheGreatPretender]

The problem I have with people saying that "plot in games is unimportant" as a general statement is that it gives the developers a really bad message. It spreads the idea that gamers don't care about plot, so developers don't need to put a lot of effort into their storylines when they do make them. Not every game needs a great storyline, but we really should just raise our expectations, and say, we're paying $60 for this game, there had better be more to it than just mindless fun gameplay.

Thankfully, it seems the developers that make the kinds of games you want to play (and replay time and again) for their awesome plot are exactly the kinds of developers that realize that it is important. Guys like Bioware and Naughty Dog, they know their fans give a shit about the plot. So hopefully more developers will realize it.
Heck, even the developers of Mortal Kombat started hiring professional writers to write the actual scripts for their story modes, in a fighting game, that's really something. And honestly, Mortal Kombat is probably my very favorite game franchise ever, so seeing so much effort put into the storyline makes me very happy.

[Chino]

The problem I have with people saying that "plot in games is unimportant" as a general statement is that it gives the developers a really bad message. It spreads the idea that gamers don't care about plot, so developers don't need to put a lot of effort into their storylines when they do make them. Not every game needs a great storyline, but we really should just raise our expectations, and say, we're paying $60 for this game, there had better be more to it than just mindless fun gameplay.

I played 250 hours of Skyrim and have no idea what it was about other than dragons were coming out of the ground and they needed to die. I loved every second of it.

[TheGreatPretender]

I played 250 hours of Skyrim and have no idea what it was about other than dragons were coming out of the ground and they needed to die. I loved every second of it.

So you didn't do any of the quests? Where the characters asked you to do stuff, you do stuff, or tell the characters where to stick it, or go to another character and tell him where to stick it, or choose to stick it to him yourself?

[Dark Castle]

Guys I've figured it out!

Some people don't play for the story, others do 

I love a good story, but if a game doesn't need one(a good story), or it's strong enough that it doesn't matter that it doesn't have one (Titanfall) then it doesn't matter to me. Titanfall is great, and the work that dev team puts in to keeping it fresh (the DLC, new game modes, all the fixes they do) make it more than worth the $60 price tag. I've put so much time into that silly game. And on the flip side of the coin I got completely caught up in the new Tomb Raider's story, I could hardly put the game down because I needed to find out what happened next, same with Mass Effect.

[ariich]

I think story is definitely becoming a bigger part of video games, which is a good thing. And although some people may say that "story is unimportant" or whatever, I think developers are getting the message that actually gamers do want good stories. Look at the absolute backlash against Bioware for Mass Effect 3 - that nothing to do with art style or gameplay, that was purely a story issue.

[Chino]

I played 250 hours of Skyrim and have no idea what it was about other than dragons were coming out of the ground and they needed to die. I loved every second of it.

So you didn't do any of the quests? Where the characters asked you to do stuff, you do stuff, or tell the characters where to stick it, or go to another character and tell him where to stick it, or choose to stick it to him yourself?

No, I did 250 hours worth of those. I talk to a character. They tell me I need to find something. I follow the map and repeat.

[TheGreatPretender]

Yeah, but even you yourself said, "I don't play this for the story, but I do play this for the story."
Honestly, when I see people say they don't play for the story, it always seems like they have a certain game in mind. It's always like, "Look at Mario. It doesn't need a story, and it's tons of fun." Or Titanfall, as your case may be.
But then you mention other games, what about Final Fantasy? What about Mass Effect? and it's like, "Oh, well THOSE games, of course I play THOSE for the story. It's amazing!"

All I'm saying is, it's not fair to say that the story in games doesn't matter, I think it's only fair to say that the story in some games doesn't matter, or that story in games doesn't always matter.

[Dark Castle]

I think story is definitely becoming a bigger part of video games, which is a good thing. And although some people may say that "story is unimportant" or whatever, I think developers are getting the message that actually gamers do want good stories. Look at the absolute backlash against Bioware for Mass Effect 3 - that nothing to do with art style or gameplay, that was purely a story issue.

Which was a stupid issue. Not getting the ending you want doesn't mean the company making the game fucked up.