Author Topic: Lonely Hearts Club Thread v. The Strong Grip  (Read 279487 times)

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Offline Chino

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Re: Lonely Hearts Club Thread v. The Strong Grip
« Reply #3220 on: April 10, 2019, 10:42:08 AM »
Remember: Don't show her your penis unless she asks signs the waiver first.

Have a notary and in independent witness present as well, just in case.

Offline TheCountOfNYC

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Re: Lonely Hearts Club Thread v. The Strong Grip
« Reply #3221 on: April 11, 2019, 10:48:33 PM »
Remember: Don't show her your penis unless she asks signs the waiver first.

Have a notary and in independent witness present as well, just in case.

Nah I know she wants to take it slow and I’m gonna respect that.
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Offline Phoenix87x

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Re: Lonely Hearts Club Thread v. The Strong Grip
« Reply #3222 on: April 12, 2019, 05:14:57 AM »
Remember: Don't show her your penis unless she asks signs the waiver first.

Have a notary and in independent witness present as well, just in case.

Or take her on a date at a courthouse, that way the judge, jury, and lawyers are all right there ready to go.

Offline SystematicThought

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Re: Lonely Hearts Club Thread v. The Strong Grip
« Reply #3223 on: May 20, 2019, 09:01:04 PM »
I’m going to really put myself out there and sound like a moron, but I just want to express what’s been going on and you guys are great to talk to and I couldn’t think of another place to put it. Anyways, this girl that I’ve talked about in this thread before (like three years ago or so). We work together and in the three years since I’ve last talked about it, we still really haven’t done anything, but we’ve hung out outside of work and I think just about everyone that works at our store thinks we date. I’ve had one of the employees in the meat department tell me that people have asked about us and are wondering when someone is finally going to make a move (me personally, I think we’re just both afraid to do anything).

This is where I’m going to sound stupid.
About a month ago, she became distant, moody, irritable, and just would have random angry outbursts. I said to myself, “Oh, it’s that time of the month. This has happened before, I’m gonna give it a few days and all will be good.” This started on a Thursday, then it was Easter, so I didn’t see her until Monday. On a normal morning, we get there around the same time. I’ll usually be working on something in an aisle, when she gets there before she starts working on something, she’ll usually come over and say hi, sometimes we talk for awhile, but it’s just usually good small talk. The Monday after Easter, she comes over and says hi, but there’s no small talk. She just says she’s gonna go sleepwalk through the milk cooler and get some stuff done. I can tell she’s still tired and kinda moody. Still going on, that’s fine, this will blow over.

Since that Monday (the 22nd of April), there’s been days where she’ll still come over and say hi, other days I won’t see her for awhile and when we do talk she is just so distant, the conversation is very quick and sometimes I can tell she’s having bad headaches. Two weeks after that, she disappears into the bathroom for a little while and she comes out, she’s like a new woman. Our conversation is happy and she’s talking about her family again, namely her niece, and she’ll do an impression of her conversation with her from the weekend. I breathe a sigh of relief. Things are normal again. The rest of that day was good. Next day, it was right back to being what it was the week prior, she’s distant and tired. This has continued since that day. There’s moments where she’s normal and we seem to get along great. Then shortly thereafter, it’s right back to tired and irritable.

Part of me wants to just say “Hey, if I said or did something that hurt you or made you mad, I just want to say I’m sorry” But then there’s the fact that she has been mad at me before. Like “Get the hell away from me” angry or “I don’t want to talk to you right now” angry. When she’s mad at me, she won’t say a word to me. She’ll just keep walking right by me. We work the same shift, so we leave together. We’ll wait for each other if one of us isn’t ready, or we’ll help each other so we can leave. When she’s angry at me, she won’t wait. This has rarely happened, but she’ll have no interest in being around me when it does happen. She’ll just go. This past month, there seems to be a feeling of “Don’t leave without me” from her. No matter how shitty of a day it’s been between us, she’ll still tell me she’s done with everything or that she’s ready to leave.

Tonight, I think we said a total of maybe 15 words to each other and she didn’t say hi this morning, she just went right to work. We still left together. I walked ahead of her, but she forgot something in the cooler and walked back to grab it, I just kept walking. I waited for her right by the swinging doors before the back door to the parking lot.

   Me____________________________Her
         ____________________________

When she came out of the cooler, she didn’t know where I went, and I could see her expression was “Where did Ted go?” She locked eyes with me and kind of smiled and started walking towards me. I feel like she was kind of relieved that I was still sticking around waiting for her. This may seem inconsequential and meaningless, but I feel like if she was mad at me, she wouldn’t care if I was waiting and I feel like she would tell me just to leave without her or vice versa, she just leaves.

I just feel like I should say something. I just don’t know what. If it is a really bad period, I don’t want to make her mad by making it seem like she can’t be herself and can’t have her own emotions around me. On the flipside, if she is mad at me and not saying anything about, I really don’t want to alienate her from me and ruin what I feel like could be a future. We’re super close when everything is good between us. Obviously we give off a vibe that multiple employees have asked me about us.

Where I feel stupid is asking the question: “Can a period/cycle be so bad that your whole mood for a month is just negative and angry and you’re tired all the time?” I’ve never had to deal with this before really.

In this situation, what do I say? How do I throw out an apology without sounding like a needy person? I just can’t think of anything I’ve said in the past month that would make her mad to the point that she’s mad at me for this long. This all started a month ago on a Thursday. I worked Tuesday and everything was great. I don’t work Wednesday. Come back Thursday, it’s been downhill or middling since.

I’m sorry for the long post, but it felt good to write it out.

Thanks guys.

Also, she’s 33 If that helps out at all.
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Offline MoraWintersoul

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Re: Lonely Hearts Club Thread v. The Strong Grip
« Reply #3224 on: May 21, 2019, 07:36:24 AM »
Where I feel stupid is asking the question: “Can a period/cycle be so bad that your whole mood for a month is just negative and angry and you’re tired all the time?” I’ve never had to deal with this before really.
A period can make you angry and moody for the duration of a period, because you're experiencing a lot of discomfort and don't have the energy to manage your emotions and responses and be pleasant to everyone all the time. This doesn't sound like that, and it doesn't sound like she's angry at you (the world doesn't revolve around you!). Personally, I'd wait til you start walking away from work at the end of your shift and say something like "hey, I noticed recently you've been moodier and tired, is something going on that I can help you with? wanna do something fun together this weekend to get your mind off things?"

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Offline Lonk

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Re: Lonely Hearts Club Thread v. The Strong Grip
« Reply #3225 on: May 21, 2019, 07:53:20 AM »
Where I feel stupid is asking the question: “Can a period/cycle be so bad that your whole mood for a month is just negative and angry and you’re tired all the time?” I’ve never had to deal with this before really.
A period can make you angry and moody for the duration of a period, because you're experiencing a lot of discomfort and don't have the energy to manage your emotions and responses and be pleasant to everyone all the time. This doesn't sound like that, and it doesn't sound like she's angry at you (the world doesn't revolve around you!). Personally, I'd wait til you start walking away from work at the end of your shift and say something like "hey, I noticed recently you've been moodier and tired, is something going on that I can help you with? wanna do something fun together this weekend to get your mind off things?"

That was going to be my suggestions. Though I wouldn't use the word "Moodier and tired", I would maybe use "you haven't been yourself lately". But yeah, suggest something for you guys to do to get her mind off of things.

Also 3 years and nothing? what are you waiting for?
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Offline JayOctavarium

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Re: Lonely Hearts Club Thread v. The Strong Grip
« Reply #3226 on: May 21, 2019, 09:15:58 AM »
That was going to be my suggestions. Though I wouldn't use the word "Moodier and tired", I would maybe use "you haven't been yourself lately". But yeah, suggest something for you guys to do to get her mind off of things.


My thoughts exactly. Don't use the term "moodier".
I just don't understand what they were trying to achieve with any part of the song, either individually or as a whole. You know what? It's the Platypus of Dream Theater songs. That bill doesn't go with that tail, or that strange little furry body, or those webbed feet, and oh god why does it have venomous spurs!? And then you find out it lays eggs too. The difference is that the Platypus is somehow functional despite being a crazy mishmash or leftover animal pieces

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Offline Stadler

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Re: Lonely Hearts Club Thread v. The Strong Grip
« Reply #3227 on: May 21, 2019, 11:17:26 AM »
I mean this to be friendly, a sort of "DTF kick in the ass", but if you guys are in your 30's, a little directness isn't going to hurt anything at this point.   I think Mora nailed it with the recent behavior  - "Anything you want to talk about, anything I can help you with?" - and as for the bigger picture, I don't know; unless you like precisely where you're at, a direct approach isn't going to end the world.

I look at it this way:  if you want MORE with this woman, she ought to be worth it. FOR ME - your mileage may vary - "worth it" means, in part, being able to speak your mind freely, including "I want to make out" (or whatever tack you take).   In other words, if you put your heart out there and she tramples it, one, I'm so sorry (shouldn't have listened to some dude on the interwebs!) and two, that perhaps wasn't the girl for you.  And "coworker" doesn't fly, because you said you've already broken the fourth wall and gone out outside of work and everyone already thinks you're "dating". 

(Kidding about the first one, not at all joking about the second.)

Offline Phoenix87x

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Re: Lonely Hearts Club Thread v. The Strong Grip
« Reply #3228 on: May 21, 2019, 02:27:54 PM »
Are you going out with her or not?

Have you had sex with her? Have you kissed her? anything at all physical?

If not, then you are in the friendzone, and I wouldn't waste anymore time with this. The friendzone is desert wasteland and a man can drive himself mad trying to get out. If its been 3 years, then she has already made up her mind about you. There's no more mystery to you. and There's billions of other women out there that you can start fresh with. Do not cause yourself anymore pain, seriously. The length of your post already tells me that this is weighing heavy on you. 

And stop trying to apologize. You didn't do anything. . Be strong, confident, decisive and stop constantly worrying about what she is thinking about you. If she's in a mood, she's in a mood. It is what it is.

And if you are wondering, "Why isn't she hot for me?" then ask yourself, "what is actually attractive about me?"

Are you in shape? Do you eat well and take care of yourself? Do you have cool hobbies and passions that you dedicate your time to? What are you doing career wise? Are you going to try and do anything besides a grocery store? Are you an alpha or a beta? 

If the answer is no, then start changing that. Go to the gym. Get in shape. Start pursuing your passions. Make yourself into someone that a girl actually wants to be with. And just for the record, A partner should compliment your life, not be the sole focus. You will set yourself up for some severe pain if you make your partner the sole focus of your life.

Don't chase her. Be somebody worth being with and if she's interested, then she will come to you. And if not, then big whoop, like I said there's billions of other girls out there. Move on to the next one. DO NOT sit there and have One-itis. Another massive mistake that young men make.

And I'm sorry if any of this hurts your feelings, but I will never bullshit you. You are 25 so I don't expect you to know any of this shit yet. I sure as hell didn't know at 25, but I know it damn well at 32 and I wish someone would have told me. This exact situation I put myself through when I was your age, so I don't want to see it keep happening.

**And also, I totally agree with Stadler. And Mora made good points as well.
 
« Last Edit: May 21, 2019, 02:34:56 PM by Phoenix87x »

Offline SystematicThought

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Re: Lonely Hearts Club Thread v. The Strong Grip
« Reply #3229 on: May 21, 2019, 11:37:10 PM »
Hey guys, thanks for all the responses. I’m not gonna lie, I felt a whole hell of a lot better after writing everything out. Maybe that’s all I needed. I woke up and read Mora’s response and it really stuck with me when you said “The world doesn’t revolve around you” It’s true and I thought about the fact that there’s still interactions, there’s still leaving together, there’s still normal conversation. It’s just sparse and not as interactive.

I ended up not saying anything to her today because although she was distant this morning, she opened up a bit more later on and at the end of the day, we had a nice conversation and joked around. It felt good. There’s a manager at our store that we both aren’t a fan of. She leaned in and whispered in my ear as he walked by that she was getting sick of him. We laughed, it felt like a normal day.

And I totally understand the whole idea of I’m wasting my time. I get the friendzone concept. A guy at work that I’ve known for 18 years, I consider him a brother, used to tell me that it was a waste of time, but he’s come around and sees something there. He too wouldn’t lie to me about that.

It’s a complicated situation. It’s my family’s store, we’re a small store, my dad’s the boss. He’s made it known that he’s not a fan of store relationships (oddly enough, because he met my mom while working together at another store). She’s also a very private person. Like I said, she’s 33 and to be honest, I don’t think she’s ever been in a relationship. She still lives with her parents. As far as I know, she doesn’t have any friends except through her sister’s social circle (whom she’s told me she’s not really a fan of and her old roommates (met through her sister). She’s not an impulsive person. Last year when we were talking about relationships, I said that I’m not the kind of guy that wants to jump in a relationship, I’d rather take it slow and see where it goes, she said she was glad that I said—she was the same way. People’s general reaction to her is that she’s cold, quiet, and, for lack of a better term, weird. To me, she’s the funniest person I know. She’s the complete package—smart, funny, beautiful, and creative.

I appreciate all the comments though, it really means a lot. And don’t worry Phoenix, I don’t take any offense to what you said. I appreciate it! Usually, I don’t let this stuff get me down, but for some reason this whole thing has been getting me down. The post probably was a bit longwinded, but I’ve been bottling it up and didn’t want to get to a point where I was beating myself up over it. Also, after writing out the post, I felt a bit petty. She’s moody, she can act the way she wants, I just need to move on with my life and this will blow over. I’m optimistic.
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Offline lordxizor

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Re: Lonely Hearts Club Thread v. The Strong Grip
« Reply #3230 on: May 22, 2019, 01:16:23 PM »
I get the friendzone concept. A guy at work that I’ve known for 18 years, I consider him a brother, used to tell me that it was a waste of time, but he’s come around and sees something there.

Let me just point out one thing. It doesn't matter if your friend thinks there's something there. It doesn't matter if everyone you know thinks you'd be great together or that they think she likes you too. None of that means jackshit. I was in a friendzone-like situation many years ago and I remember feeling so good when my friends asked how things were with her or confirmed they thought she liked me too. All that was doing was distracting me from reality, which was that we weren't together and that I was too chickenshit to ask her out or tell her how I felt.

My honest, frank advice for what it's worth: the next time you see her, tell her you like her and that you'd like to take her out on a date this weekend. Don't make a huge deal about it, but be obvious that you're asking her out in a romantic way and not just as friends. Stop wasting your time overanalyzing everything and wondering how she feels. Fucking ask her!

Don't waste another day hoping for more. Make it happen. If she doesn't say yes today, she's not going to say yes tomorrow, or next week, or next month. If she does say yes, you get to see where it goes today instead of tomorrow or next week, or next month.

You have nothing to lose. Just do it man!

This is advice I very much wish I would have followed 16 years ago.

Offline Stadler

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Re: Lonely Hearts Club Thread v. The Strong Grip
« Reply #3231 on: May 22, 2019, 01:56:50 PM »
I have a man-crush on Lordxizor right now.   

That is gold.  Not suggesting it's necessarily "easy" to do, but the friendzone happens, largely, from taking the easy way out in the first place, and a lot of what follows is just "rationalizing".   

Offline Adami

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Re: Lonely Hearts Club Thread v. The Strong Grip
« Reply #3232 on: May 22, 2019, 01:59:04 PM »
I have a man-crush on Lordxizor right now.   

That is gold.  Not suggesting it's necessarily "easy" to do, but the friendzone happens, largely, from taking the easy way out in the first place, and a lot of what follows is just "rationalizing".

I'd never friendzone you.
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Offline MoraWintersoul

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Re: Lonely Hearts Club Thread v. The Strong Grip
« Reply #3233 on: May 22, 2019, 05:01:45 PM »
Don't waste another day hoping for more. Make it happen. If she doesn't say yes today, she's not going to say yes tomorrow, or next week, or next month. If she does say yes, you get to see where it goes today instead of tomorrow or next week, or next month.
Yeah, I mean... same. From everything you told us, it seems like it's ready to all pour out into the open. You both get all the excitement and anticipation of the early stages of a relationship right now, and all the validation of a deep emotional friendship that develops later too, without saying or doing anything too risky or forward. That's nice (I've had platonic friendships that worked like that, because I or the other party couldn't get involved at the time), but you're both human people who'd also like to make out, bone, or get married some day, so why not take a risk and see if it can work out with each other? Maybe she doesn't want it, maybe she prefers getting her emotional warm fuzzies through an extremely close friendship with you without going out of her comfort zone. That's nice. And maybe you don't wanna risk the friendship. But if you don't get this closure and either get together or proceed into a normal, less attached friendship, as soon as her or you get another interesting relationship prospect, that friendship is getting dropped like a hot potato (oh, I've been dropped a lot), because suddenly you will have what you actually needed with this friendship. Risk it. Ask her out. Do it.

That is, if you don't wanna make it weird at your job. But it's already weird with people thinking you're dating...

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Offline Phoenix87x

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Re: Lonely Hearts Club Thread v. The Strong Grip
« Reply #3234 on: May 23, 2019, 08:12:38 AM »

That is, if you don't wanna make it weird at your job. But it's already weird with people thinking you're dating...

That's another really good point that was on my mind as well. I will absolutely never get involved with someone at work again. And here are two examples why: 

Example A -  When I was early 20's, almost identical to this situation. Girl I was sort of friendly with, but nothing established yet. I was in the friendzone, but did not know it. I asked her out, and made it known I was looking to date. Now that I spilled the beans that I was romantically interested, she became SUPER distant and would now completely avoid me, since she did not have those feelings. Made work super awkward. 

Example B- 3 years ago, The girl I was engaged to and was in a long term relationship for years with. We did work together and when the relationship went bad, and ended extremely bad, having to work together was a nightmare. Now, not only was it Awkward, but extremely painful too. Thank god, I was able to get a different job and haven't had to see her since. Its extremely hard to get closure and move on when you are seeing a person you truly loved on a regular basis. And the look in their eyes is no longer "I love you with all my heart", its now "I feel nothing for you". I have felt no greater pain in my life.

Now that's just me. Of course, do what you feel is right for you. I'm just throwing out some food for thought for consideration.
« Last Edit: May 23, 2019, 08:20:40 AM by Phoenix87x »

Offline Stadler

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Re: Lonely Hearts Club Thread v. The Strong Grip
« Reply #3235 on: May 23, 2019, 08:32:31 AM »
I get the work stuff - I've experienced that too, and won't again, for various reasons - but based on what I've read, we've already steamrolled past that stage. 

Bottom line is, SystematicThought needs to be really honest with himself, and ask:  "Can I live like this for the next five, ten years".   If the answer is "yes", well, we the peanut gallery needs to shut the hell up (myself foremost).  If it's ANY other answer, then he's got limited choices, and the best one is by far to "act". 

What if she shows up next week and says "I was at the dentist, and met the man of my dreams. Holy f***, this is IT! Aren't you happy for me?"  What are you going to say/do/think?   If there is any shred of "I shoulda..." then you need to act.

What if she DOESN'T show up next week and someone who knows her says "Yeah, she bought a bus ticket to LA and said she's pursuing her dream of being a dead call girl on NCIS before Mark Harmon retires for good."   What are you going to say/do/think?   If there is any shred of "I shoulda..." then you need to act.

I could do this all day long.  I know for me - and you may be very different - there is not ONE girl I regret sharing my feelings with (even if it went nowhere), but there is more than one that I think "I shoulda...".    Don't be Stadler.  ;)

Offline Lonk

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Re: Lonely Hearts Club Thread v. The Strong Grip
« Reply #3236 on: May 23, 2019, 09:08:48 AM »
...
« Last Edit: May 23, 2019, 10:19:31 AM by Vmadera00 »
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Offline cramx3

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Re: Lonely Hearts Club Thread v. The Strong Grip
« Reply #3237 on: May 23, 2019, 09:17:38 AM »
WARNING, super long and personal story below:

So I am back to being a member of the lonely hearts club.  My gf of 2+ years and 3 years since our first date dumped me last week.  It was a total shock and hurt so much.

Lets start by saying I was very unsure about relationships starting this one.  I previously had ended an engagement with my college girl and our nine year relationship 5 years ago.  I went single for 2 years dating many women and really just thinking I'd probably never find the right one.  I ended every single "relationship" with girls I met because I always found a flaw that made me think I couldn't spend the rest of my life with that person so I'd move on.  I had met this girl though and after months of dating, there was nothing to complain about.  In fact I enjoyed our time so much, I totally stopped talking to any other girls and became hooked on her.  I was still really unsure about being in a relationship although I had kind of already committed myself, eventually we talked more about it and agreed to become a couple.

Two awesome years flew by, I don't think we even had our first argument until after a year of dating, we just got along so well.  Even then, we just laughed it off in a way.  We would discuss it and quickly resolve the issue and think, wow this is how we fight? This is great, we just talk about it upfront and move on.  I knew communication was something I was poor with in my past relationship.  Thought I had always been so open and honest with her that it would lead to things being great together.

This year comes along and it's her last semester in grad school (and she works a full time job as well) so she is super busy and stressed.  My year starts off crazy busy at work and I had to travel for about 3 out of 5 weeks at one point.  I was super busy and when I got back from all my travels (I haven't had any trips for a couple months now) I was burnt out.  I had little desire to do anything besides just the basic, let's chill.  I didn't realize, but I think this played a huge role in her feelings.

Meanwhile, she was super busy so she often wouldn't be able to hang out much but we saw each other at least twice a week but we wouldn't do much, watch tv and go to sleep or whatever.  Sex was fine, nothing crazy but it existed so I don't think that played a role here although I do wonder since she was a virgin if maybe it did play a role in her long term thoughts.  I know for me, I was satisfied for sure with sex.  Anyway, over the course of these few months, she had asked me to like go to a park or go out with her friends once or twice and I had shot these things down, I had not wanted to do anything.  She once invited me to dinner at her parents but like dinner was in 10 minutes and I had said nah I'm not ready to go out.  I know I was kind of in a depressed burnt out state in general and she seemed to be as well. 

Two months ago, my brother notifies me that he is moving out of my house and in with his gf.  Good for him, and it's no issue for me although it sucks to lose his rent payments, having my whole house to myself I thought would be nice too, especialyl since when my gf was over and his gf were over, it would be kind of annoying at times.  Regardless, this opened the door for my gf to eventually move in.  She had brought it up before and my answer then was we will talk more about it once my brother is gone.  So knowing this, we eventually had this conversation where I asked her if she would move in eventually, not immediately because I kind of wanted time with the house plus she needed to finish school and hopefully get a new job.  So this conversation didn't go well, at all. 

I asked her about moving in and out came some things she had been hiding I guess.  She said she was contemplating ending the relationship for months and was unhappy.  Now, I know we were/are both burnt out but I didn't take that as her unhappy with me or our relationships, we still had a lot of fun together just chilling.  So I am just shocked.  Her only issue for her unhappiness she says is because I haven't put enough effort into spending time with her friends and family.  This is true, no doubt.  But she had asked me what, like 2 times over the last 5 months to do anything?  It just didn't make much sense, she broke up with me and it was a tough two days.

We talked and agreed this was not what we wanted.  It made no sense to me.  We had such a perfect relationship and were just about to move forward, something she expressed she wanted before.  Well, she said I need to try harder, fine.  I do and I will.  Betwen then and last week, she had asked me once to go out with her friends.  I did, it was fine.  Her friends are super cool, I like them a lot, I just struggle sometimes with large groups of people I don't know well.  I get a bit socially awkward.  Whatever, I kept it cool and the night was fine.  Had a few beers and we went home and enjoyed the rest of our night together that night.  Come last week, she's acting distant and I ask her whats wrong so she says she needs to come over.

She breaks up with me, right to the point quickly.  Says I don't put enough effort and I say, how cna you even say that when you didnt give it time and I did go out the one time she asked.  She said I didn't stay out long enough that night?  ??? The night was fine, she didn't complain when we left nor the rest of the night when we chilled at my house.  She leaves and we go 5 days wtihout talking.  I was realyl struggling dealing wtih this internally but just kept thinking, she's freaking out a bit because school is ending now and things are changing.

I reach out and say I can't take it and this isn't right and we need to try and talk because I am not happy accepting this ending.  She comes over and we both pretty much just cry and hold each other and I just lay it all out.  Say I love you and she left that night, her last words were that she needed that talk.  Next day I don't hear from her at all, but I know the following day is her graduation and her family was throwing a party.  I wanted to be there for her and be with her.  She had not invited me to be there, I was really upset.  I broke and asked her why she hadn't invited me.  She said she did want to invite me but I could only go as her friend and we would not be togehter.  I couldn't do it.  I couldn't agree to just pretend things are OK for her family and friends, I couldn't just be her friend.  I didn't think I could go and not cry.  I don't know if this was a ploy to make me uncomfortable or because this was her friends and family.  If she had just accepted me I would have gone but she broke up with me and I couldn't put myself together. 

We haven't spoke since, it's been almost a week now.  She went to Europe on vacation with her friend.  She needed it for sure and this was something she had wanted to do for a long time, and the only reason  I wasn't goign was because those plans dated back before we met so she wanted to do this with her friend.  That's fine by me, I was happy she booked her trip.  But it kind of just leaves me sitting her wondering wtf just happened.  I'm shocked, stunned, saddenned, hurt, and honestly so angry at her now.  SHe said maybe when she gets back we could talk, and all my friends and family said she probably needs time, which is fine, I just wihs she could have taken her time without breaking my heart first.  Now I am just filling up with rage from her.  If she comes back, how can I accept this?  I do love her, and I had started feeling like my relationship issues were resolved and I could live a happy life with someone and even get married.  I've told her this before too.  I was always honest.  I just can't accept her excuses for ending something so special and so good and if she were to come back, which I am not thinking she even will, how could I go on? 

I'm looking forward for myself at this point, another week of crying myself to sleep isn't going to do me any good.  Thanks for reading, if you did, that was really long and not fully thought out but just my rambling and thoughts going through my head.

Offline Stadler

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Re: Lonely Hearts Club Thread v. The Strong Grip
« Reply #3238 on: May 23, 2019, 09:58:59 AM »
If you just want to vent, I totally understand that.   You may not want someone butting in with their annoying, irrelevant two cents.



But if you are open to it....




I think you might be best served with patience.  I'm not promising you that she is coming back.   But I am fairly confident, not having met her, that you both are trying to process some intense emotions while under great stress, both physically and mentally, and that doesn't always lead to solid, final, and comfortable decisions.    Time is not comfortable or easy, but if your goal is true understanding, then time is your friend.  The stressors won't last forever, and when they are gone, she will be left with "truth", such that it is.   It still might not work for you, but at least you might be able to get an answer that makes more sense and is more rooted in understanding and less impulsive.   

I went through something similar to this during college.   I dated a girl for about two years, and as we neared the end, it became stressful, almost unbearably so.   Moreso for her than me - I'm not really a "closure" kind of guy, so things like graduations and what not don't really register with me - but there's a lot of fear with certain people when milestones arise, and fear makes us do things impulsively.   I was reading the autobiography of Jackie Martling this past weekend and when he left the Stern show (he asked for a ridiculous amount of money, and was denied), in the space of a couple months, he lost his job, got a divorce and quit drinking.   Fundamentally, he subconsciously cleaned house.   I'm getting a vibe of that here with your girl.

Offline cramx3

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Re: Lonely Hearts Club Thread v. The Strong Grip
« Reply #3239 on: May 23, 2019, 11:09:52 AM »
Yes, patience.  I don't understand and I accept I may never, but I think part of what makes me feel like I am unable to be patient (which I struggle with regularly btw) is I feel like this tied in with my brother moving out, I just feel old af and coming home to an empty house is just pretty depressing.  I'll get used to it and maybe love it eventually (I'm doing a bit of work around the house to make it a bit nicer and more usable since a bunch of it is empty now) but it feels like the pile up makes me struggle with just being patient with things. 

Offline Stadler

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Re: Lonely Hearts Club Thread v. The Strong Grip
« Reply #3240 on: May 23, 2019, 11:17:14 AM »
As someone who IS old AF, I totally understand where you're coming from.   

Offline TheCountOfMinnesota

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Re: Lonely Hearts Club Thread v. The Strong Grip
« Reply #3241 on: May 23, 2019, 11:22:19 AM »
Cramx3, I'm sorry to hear that.  A breakup like what you just experienced is as painful as the death of a loved one. If you do not reconcile, then I wish you strength through the process of moving on.  However, I think there is hope for reconciliation if you still want that.  Like Stadler, I hope you're open to some unsolicited advice.  Here goes...

Reading your post, two strong themes emerged that I think contributed to the breakup:

1 - the acute stress of finishing grad school and work travel/craziness, combined with general life stress (dealing with depression, figuring out living situations, dealing with social awkwardness, etc)
2 - your girlfriend came to view you as a passive participant in the relationship

Regarding point #1, she was likely at one of those "OMG, I'm graduating and now the REST OF MY LIFE starts!" moments where you begin to question everything.  Were you available emotionally to her throughout the semester?  Was she there for you?  Were you both taking time to listen to each other and talk about the challenges you each were facing?  When you knew that she was at an especially stressed moment, did you ever try to pamper her in any way to help alleviate what she was experiencing?  Regarding the living situation, was she clear in her desire to move in with you once your brother moved out, and did you express the desire for some 'time alone' in your house ina way that made it clear that you didn't want 'time away' from her?

Regarding point #2, she said she wanted you to try harder, and you took that to mean saying yes to the occassional invitation from her to do something with friends/family.  Cramx3, she wanted YOU to initiate some of that!  She wanted you to propose going for a walk, going to the park, going out with friends/family, etc.  Nobodoy wants to be the person who is never invited/always inviting others, because it eventually makes them feel unwanted.  You likely thought of your time together relaxing and watching TV or whatever as quality time, and she did not.  Man, this one is classic because in my experience men and women have very different ideas about what consistutes quality time. 

Take this with a grain of salt, because I'm no relationship expert and I only know about your situation what you posted below.  However, I personally identify with a lot of what you wrote about yourself and so I felt compelled to write back.  I learned this all the hard way, especially the part about initiating quality time and reading between the lines to know when my partner needed me to be there for them emotionally.  I wish you the best!
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Offline cramx3

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Re: Lonely Hearts Club Thread v. The Strong Grip
« Reply #3242 on: May 23, 2019, 12:06:11 PM »
Appreciate it

Lots of questions, but to just say, I think your 2 point about being passive may be it.  I was there for all her stress and needs during this time, but she often didn't talk about problems that I had been causing.  I know for me, I don't always talk about my issues, but I was pretty open that my only issue was feeling burnt out and exhausted, which is something I only started recently feeling better about (of course right as I get the ax). but yea, you are probably right.  Maybe because I didn't initiate more of our activities.  I was pretty open about my reasonings why all along though.  I remember coming back from amsterdam and just saying, I have no desire to do anything for a few weeks.  She seemed to accept it, I didn't think it was an issue, but maybe because I never really got out of that rut and start to make plans with her had an effect.  This definitely came up in our last talk too about how I hadn't made plans with her in awhile.  Although, we were also in the process of booking a vacation this summer together so it's not like I totally was ignoring her, but yes, she is right, I didn't do a good enough job including her friends and family in my own plans.

Having said that, I still struggle to think she could walk away just because of that, for all the problems we could work on, I think this is fixable and I said I was willing.

Offline ReaperKK

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Re: Lonely Hearts Club Thread v. The Strong Grip
« Reply #3243 on: May 23, 2019, 12:29:30 PM »
Cram I read through the post and I’m sorry to hear all of this went down, heart break is a real motherfucker. I had sort of a similar experience with my last serious relationship, I was done with school and she was going to nursing school. We drifted apart, me due to work and her due to attending a new school and being busy. The relationship ended and I took it very hard.

More unsolicited advice but from a slightly different angle from count and stadler; Try not harp on what ended the relationship or quantify things into she wanted me to do x and I did x but it didn’t work out. She has most likely had these feelings for a while, maybe longer than letting on or there might be other issues she has that she doesn’t want to address. Whatever it may be I think for the time you should focus on yourself, you may never get the closure that you want. Eventually in my old relationship I found out the closure I was looking for was actually a reason my ex could give me that I could rationalize and try to work on, I wasted a lot of time thinking about what went wrong. Try to put your mental energy on focusing on goals that you may have with work or personal development, be open if your ex reaches out. If she does that’s great and there may be a future, if she doesn’t well you’re already a few steps ahead on moving forward.

Anyway, I’m a few drinks in and rambling so apologies!

Offline ReaperKK

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Re: Lonely Hearts Club Thread v. The Strong Grip
« Reply #3244 on: May 23, 2019, 12:32:49 PM »
Just read your post, I doubt she walked away For a single reason. I doubt most people do unless it’s something major like infidelity, she may have more issues that she doesn’t want to share or discuss.

Offline cramx3

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Re: Lonely Hearts Club Thread v. The Strong Grip
« Reply #3245 on: May 23, 2019, 01:33:00 PM »
Thanks, glad I gave you some reading material on your vacation  :lol

Offline MoraWintersoul

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Re: Lonely Hearts Club Thread v. The Strong Grip
« Reply #3246 on: May 23, 2019, 01:48:14 PM »
I echo what everyone had said. Sometimes you just do drastic things all at once, process things differently,freak out over nothing,  and you both got caught up in that. Maybe she will come back and you will resume your relationship, maybe she won’t and you’ll get over her. One girl I talk to did something similarly drastic recently and broke up with her boyfriend, but she realized she loved him so much and they both made each others’ lives so much better, so she asked him to take her back and now they’re very happy.

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Offline cramx3

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Re: Lonely Hearts Club Thread v. The Strong Grip
« Reply #3247 on: May 23, 2019, 02:12:31 PM »
I echo what everyone had said. Sometimes you just do drastic things all at once, process things differently,freak out over nothing,  and you both got caught up in that. Maybe she will come back and you will resume your relationship, maybe she won’t and you’ll get over her. One girl I talk to did something similarly drastic recently and broke up with her boyfriend, but she realized she loved him so much and they both made each others’ lives so much better, so she asked him to take her back and now they’re very happy.

OOC how long did it take for her to realize that?  It would be awesome if she came back from Europe and was like "yea, this is a mistake and with a fresh head, we can work through these issues because we love each other" but if she comes back and I still don't hear from her, I don't know how long I go waiting.

Offline MoraWintersoul

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Re: Lonely Hearts Club Thread v. The Strong Grip
« Reply #3248 on: May 23, 2019, 02:19:21 PM »
I echo what everyone had said. Sometimes you just do drastic things all at once, process things differently,freak out over nothing,  and you both got caught up in that. Maybe she will come back and you will resume your relationship, maybe she won’t and you’ll get over her. One girl I talk to did something similarly drastic recently and broke up with her boyfriend, but she realized she loved him so much and they both made each others’ lives so much better, so she asked him to take her back and now they’re very happy.

OOC how long did it take for her to realize that?  It would be awesome if she came back from Europe and was like "yea, this is a mistake and with a fresh head, we can work through these issues because we love each other" but if she comes back and I still don't hear from her, I don't know how long I go waiting.
A few months. Certainly don’t wait, go out and live your life. Maybe you will realize some things as well - maybe, while you love her and wish her well, you want someone who will not fail the stress test of a relationship. You did mention you had a very mild and content relationship, and that she was inexperienced - maybe she’s out for something she imagines as better than what you guys had. Either way, so many things may happen that need you to keep your thinking cap on and really process your emotions and know what you’re dealing with. So by all means keep thinking about this and don’t go off looking for a rebound right away, but don’t pine. You’re a cool guy with lots to do.

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Offline Harmony

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Re: Lonely Hearts Club Thread v. The Strong Grip
« Reply #3249 on: May 23, 2019, 02:27:40 PM »
I don't know how long I go waiting.

My 2 cents.  Don't wait.  Don't rush into things but don't put your life on hold.  Life is too damn short.  If she comes back from Europe and decides she wants to try again, then you make your decision to either try again or not.  If she comes back from Europe and you don't hear from her, you move on with your life and if 2 years from now she wants to try again, you evaluate your options then.  You may not even want to try again.  You might be in a new and improved relationship.  Who knows?  But give yourself the option to move on to new relationships when you are ready to.

Sorry you are going through this.  FWIW, I saw a friend last weekend and her cousin is a mutual friend of mine.  Her cousin was helping her spouse of 35 years do the dishes just before Easter and he turned to her and told her he wanted to move out of the house.  According to her, there was no inkling that anything was wrong in the marriage.  It doesn't seem to be an affair. What it sounds like to me is that he's extremely overwhelmed - lost a great job about a year ago, doesn't like the job he's in, kids are newly and finally up and out, financial stress, yadda yadda yadda.  He's telling her he needs space to breathe and figure it out.  And while she's hurting, she's allowing him to do what he needs to do to figure it all out.

It can happen to the best of relationships.  It takes courage to let her go and figure it out.  So good on you for not pressuring her right now.  Best to take some time and focus on yourself right now.  Finding yourself a good therapist - if you don't already have one - might be a helpful thing.  Good luck!
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Offline cramx3

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Re: Lonely Hearts Club Thread v. The Strong Grip
« Reply #3250 on: May 23, 2019, 02:34:32 PM »
Thanks, I just think that's what I am struggling with and patience now.  The idea of moving on or maybe getting back together which leads me to feel like I can't totally commit to either and makes me feel like an emotional wreck.  I think her youth adds something to this as well, I don't feel like her potential desires to do and experience more should be a reason to end things, she could have spoke up about it and we could work on it.  I felt like we had that relationship, clearly I was wrong by being blindsided, but I really thought we could speak up to each other about anything but I'm sure there is more to this than she told me.

Thanks Harmony as well, just saw your post while writing the above. 

The cool thing about all this is that my friends and family have been there for me, it's been nice to see the guys all kind of help me out a bit, or try to.  I'm road tripping solo to the Avantasia concert tomorrow, I hope this helps clear my head a bit.

Offline ReaperKK

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Re: Lonely Hearts Club Thread v. The Strong Grip
« Reply #3251 on: May 23, 2019, 02:36:42 PM »
I echo what everyone had said. Sometimes you just do drastic things all at once, process things differently,freak out over nothing,  and you both got caught up in that. Maybe she will come back and you will resume your relationship, maybe she won’t and you’ll get over her. One girl I talk to did something similarly drastic recently and broke up with her boyfriend, but she realized she loved him so much and they both made each others’ lives so much better, so she asked him to take her back and now they’re very happy.

OOC how long did it take for her to realize that?  It would be awesome if she came back from Europe and was like "yea, this is a mistake and with a fresh head, we can work through these issues because we love each other" but if she comes back and I still don't hear from her, I don't know how long I go waiting.
A few months. Certainly don’t wait, go out and live your life. Maybe you will realize some things as well - maybe, while you love her and wish her well, you want someone who will not fail the stress test of a relationship. You did mention you had a very mild and content relationship, and that she was inexperienced - maybe she’s out for something she imagines as better than what you guys had. Either way, so many things may happen that need you to keep your thinking cap on and really process your emotions and know what you’re dealing with. So by all means keep thinking about this and don’t go off looking for a rebound right away, but don’t pine. You’re a cool guy with lots to do.

Well said, don't wait. I spent way too long waiting myself and you'll never get that time back.

Offline cramx3

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Re: Lonely Hearts Club Thread v. The Strong Grip
« Reply #3252 on: May 23, 2019, 02:42:04 PM »
Thanks, that was a big regret of mine when I broke things up with my last x, which was the wasted time part.  I'm only getting older and this has made me feel 20 years older mentally.  I'm going to rock out so good tomorrow. 

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Re: Lonely Hearts Club Thread v. The Strong Grip
« Reply #3253 on: May 23, 2019, 02:46:55 PM »
Don't search but don't close yourself off.  Maybe you'll be ready or maybe you won't be yet. Don't force it and try to find a date.  Let it be natural.
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Offline cramx3

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Re: Lonely Hearts Club Thread v. The Strong Grip
« Reply #3254 on: May 23, 2019, 02:49:41 PM »
I've got little interest in finding a date right now.  I'm going to work on myself, specifically my weight.  If a girl pops into my life, thats one thing, but I'm not looking to hook anyone into my life right now, that's for sure.