Great JP Interview

[son_ov_hades]

As far as the production goes, it is pretty shitty.  Long before I listened to Dream Theater I listened to a lot of underground recordings of European black metal so I can tolerate bad recordings and it will not affect me listening to it but still, comparatively it is pretty crappy.

Once you've listened to Ildjarn, you're immune to bad production.  I totally love When Dream And Day Unite, its better than most Dream Theater albums including Six Degrees Of Inner Turbulence.

[Madman Shepherd]

As far as the production goes, it is pretty shitty.  Long before I listened to Dream Theater I listened to a lot of underground recordings of European black metal so I can tolerate bad recordings and it will not affect me listening to it but still, comparatively it is pretty crappy.

Once you've listened to Ildjarn, you're immune to bad production.  I totally love When Dream And Day Unite, its better than most Dream Theater albums including Six Degrees Of Inner Turbulence.

Holy crap I had never heard that so I looked it up.  Wow.  The worst i had heard before that was Ulver or the Mayhem semi-official live recording of Live in Leipzig. 

[son_ov_hades]

I love black metal, but Ildjarn is just too fucking much.  I don't think Live In Leipzig sounds bad at all, maybe that's why When Dream And Day Unite sounds great to me. 

[tiagodon]

I still don´t understand the Kevin Moore novel!
JP says in the interview that they started the band (JP, KM, JM...), that they were obsessive with playing and then became the top guys in the neighborhood and all that... And today Kevin Moore is like "I got  nothing to do with these guys", "forget about me"... Can anyone tell me what actually happened?

[KevShmev]

Kevin Moore became disinterested with the DT style of music, didn't seem to like it when the band got popular, and he grew apart from the others.  It happens.  Very few friendships are for life.

[tiagodon]

You would be probably right if his behavior were not so weird towards it. Rich Wilson, the guy that wrote the band's biography, tried to interview him in order to bring more material to the book, but the guy shut the door!
Something else might have happened!
If I just got out of a band because I was no longer interested in its style, it would still be a pleasure to say something for a biography!
KM's behavior is too intense and negative towards the band. Something else might have happened.

[King Postwhore]

Most of the bands I was in or seen other friends in bands leave because they were not happy with the progression in the band and they did not have enough input into it.  Sen it too many times.  They write music the band is not fond of and they become disenchanted with the music and bandmates.

[hefdaddy42]

Something else might have happened!

It didn't.  He's just a weird dude who wants to make his music.

[ReaPsTA]

Kevin Moore became disinterested with the DT style of music, didn't seem to like it when the band got popular, and he grew apart from the others.  It happens.  Very few friendships are for life.

I think what's off putting about KM is how he basically shuns DT from his life.

DS has never gone out of his way to be remembered as a DT keyboardist (they fired him after all), but he played the WDARU show and does some DT/LTE stuff with the PSMS project.

[MoraWintersoul]

Who says he shuns DT from his life? Just because he doesn't bring up DT as often as MP does, it doesn't mean that his own opinion on the split isn't out there, if you look for it. He had no problem collaborating with MP on the OSI project ten years ago, either (even though it turned out MP did have a big problem with that). And why would he play on DT's anniversary performances? For us, DT is a big deal; for him, it's likely just a band he played in in his twenties before he even figured out what he actually wanted to do in his life.

Don't get me wrong, if I could live in an alternate reality, it would be one where Kevin found a way to do DT and Chroma Key on the side (because it's not like we ended up getting many Chroma Key/KM solo albums since the split, anyway), or the one where he climbed on stage with DT in 2000 or 2004 or 2014 and did Space-Dye Vest with them. But he doesn't want to and there is no bigger argument behind it. Maybe, if he stayed in the band longer, him and MP would have blown up, due to how opposite their personalities are, but up until 2000 or so, out of all DT members, MP was the one that regularly emailed KM and sent him new DT CDs and stuff like that. It's clear he wanted to keep in touch, and his desires to keep in touch included KM performing with DT on anniversaries and such. KM didn't want to do that a couple of times when he was invited (it's all in the Score drummer DVD commentary, and other sources, I'm not speculating), MP didn't have much fun working with him on OSI either and that was it. But there are no confirmations that they were ever in an argument during the time of the split.

[Invisible]

Who says he shuns DT from his life? Just because he doesn't bring up DT as often as MP does, it doesn't mean that his own opinion on the split isn't out there, if you look for it. He had no problem collaborating with MP on the OSI project ten years ago, either (even though it turned out MP did have a big problem with that). And why would he play on DT's anniversary performances? For us, DT is a big deal; for him, it's likely just a band he played in in his twenties before he even figured out what he actually wanted to do in his life.

Don't get me wrong, if I could live in an alternate reality, it would be one where Kevin found a way to do DT and Chroma Key on the side (because it's not like we ended up getting many Chroma Key/KM solo albums since the split, anyway), or the one where he climbed on stage with DT in 2000 or 2004 or 2014 and did Space-Dye Vest with them. But he doesn't want to and there is no bigger argument behind it. Maybe, if he stayed in the band longer, him and MP would have blown up, due to how opposite their personalities are, but up until 2000 or so, out of all DT members, MP was the one that regularly emailed KM and sent him new DT CDs and stuff like that. It's clear he wanted to keep in touch, and his desires to keep in touch included KM performing with DT on anniversaries and such. KM didn't want to do that a couple of times when he was invited (it's all in the Score drummer DVD commentary, and other sources, I'm not speculating), MP didn't have much fun working with him on OSI either and that was it. But there are no confirmations that they were ever in an argument during the time of the split.

Why am I a noob in the forum but still knew that as soon as KM was mentioned you would've appeared in his defence? I agree with most of what you said, but I still think it's weird how he refuses to appear in everything DT related like The Score So Far, Lifting Shadows or reunion one time performances. Actually, it would've made more sense if he was in "I don't want anything to do with DT anymore" kind of style, but reading his interviews kind of clash with his other attitude towards the band.

I don't think it has anything to do with the band becoming popular, I think it was more simple: he wasn't into DT style anymore. And I don't see the problem with that. He actually acknowledges that without DT he wouldn't have been able to do the other stuff he did bacause everyone knows him from Dream Theater, but I find it weird that he just won't appear for at least a testimony of the band earlier days. I get it if he doesn't want to perform in a concert, but seting aside 30 minutes of his life to talk about the band for a documentary or book doesn't seem a lot of effort I think. That's the only part I find strange about him, all the other things I completely understand. I don't even think he has a problem with the other guys, if anything I only heard Portnoy bash him, not the other way around.

[MoraWintersoul]

Why am I a noob in the forum but still knew that as soon as KM was mentioned you would've appeared in his defence? 

Well, there's like three or four of us interested in KM's post-DT stuff that post on the DT side of the forum, and I imagine the other guys have done this often enough in my absence, it's only fair I replaced them this one time

If you think about it, it's really not just a half an hour, he'd have to talk about all the earliest history of the band and go through his reasons for leaving the band for the 100th time. That's at least several phone interviews. And not to say I doubt Rich Wilson's diplomatic skills, but god knows how he was approached, or whether he had preconceptions about Lifting Shadows. Rich posted once on the forum saying he hung up after about 20 seconds, maybe it was just the words "Dream Theater", "book" and "you" appearing in the same sentence that made him hang up

He was never asked about why he refused to talk for the bio, and I'd actually like to hear the precise reason, but based on everything we know about Kevin Moore, spending hours talking about stuff he did 20 years ago is just not something he'd like to do. And yeah, you're right, it's really only MP that ever bashed him, and even that was a long time ago.

[Invisible]

Long time you mean less than 5 years ago or more? And I'm actually more interested as for why he wouldn't appear on The Score So Far, and I don't think he needs several phone interviews, more like "you have 30 minutes, ask me whatever you like and then use what you can from that, then it's over". You won't expect this guy to provide you every little detail.

[theseoafs]

(even though it turned out MP did have a big problem with that)

What's that about?

[MoraWintersoul]

(even though it turned out MP did have a big problem with that)

What's that about?

Blistering.com: One of the other bands you’ve been involved with OSI, their most recent album Blood is the first not to feature you on drums. Was it just scheduling problems that meant you couldn’t be involved with it?

Portnoy: No it wasn’t a time factor, it was really a chemistry factor that boils down to my experience doing the first two OSI albums. To be honest with you working with Kevin Moore [former Dream Theater, Chroma Key] is just not much fun. He’s really a very… I’ll put it politely, he has his ways of working which aren’t very conducive to collaboration and it was kind of frustrating the first two albums that I did with him that I did not have any reception to collaboration. That’s alright ‘cause I’ve done sessions where I’ve just gone on and played drums, like with Neil Morris or the G3 tour with John Petrucci, I’m fine with that, but as long as it’s still fun. But it’s not even fun with Kevin, he’s just very uptight, serious, so I figured “why would I do this again? It’s not anything I can contribute to artistically.” It’s not even really that much fun. So I passed on doing it. It’s a shame because Jim Matheos [Fates Warning, Gordian Knot] is one of my best friends and I love him and I’d still love to work with him in some sort of project. But it really isn’t a fun situation for me with OSI.

That's just the first result I found, there was also a radio interview that went into more detail about it. Basically, Mike's been looking forward to doing something with Jim Matheos for years, and when the opportunity came up, it was also the time when Jim and Kevin were talking about doing stuff together, and both of these things became one band, through Jim. And due to Kevin's specific way of working with songs (sending files back and forth, sometimes totally chopping up ideas and making them into something new, at other times leaving them "unharmed"), Mike ended up having very little creative control even over his own drum parts, let alone the general direction of the music. So he found that very frustrating.

Frankly, I don't think he was in the wrong about being frustrated over that, there's no way he could have known what the project would end up sounding like, but, again frankly, I love OSI and Kevin so I don't particularly care

Long time you mean less than 5 years ago or more? And I'm actually more interested as for why he wouldn't appear on The Score So Far, and I don't think he needs several phone interviews, more like "you have 30 minutes, ask me whatever you like and then use what you can from that, then it's over". You won't expect this guy to provide you every little detail.

My brain might be jamming, but I think the last time MP invited KM to appear for something DT-related was WDADRU - I don't think he was invited for The Score So Far?

[Invisible]

You found the "nice Portnoy" interview about that, I found this:

“I honestly went in there with an open mind and I was truly excited to work with Kevin again,” he sighs. “I was hoping that it was going to be a great experience. But it ended up being more of the same old shit that it was when he left Dream Theater.”

“Basically when I’m making music with other people, I want it to be fun and I want it to put a smile on my face. At the end of the day, making those records with Kevin wasn’t fun. He’s not a fun person to work with. He’s a very depressing and stubborn personality and there’s no reason in my life or my career that I need to subject myself to that sort of personality.”

“I’d rather work with people who are enjoying the process. And if anything, making those two albums showed me in no uncertain terms that if Kevin hadn’t left Dream Theater, then Dream Theater would have broken up many, many years ago. So him leaving the band was probably the greatest ever thing that ever happened to Dream Theater.”

“There’s no way Dream Theater could exist with that type of personality. As you know they are now doing a third album which they didn’t even bother asking me about as they already know my feelings on the subject.”

https://www.metalhammer.co.uk/news/dream-theaters-portnoy-if-kevin-moore-hadnt-left-wed-have-broken-up/

 

Oh, and it hadn't ocurred to me that they might not even call him for The Score So Far because he refused on WDADRU, although I have no idea which was the situation then.

[?]

According to Lifting Shadows, MP asked Kevin to appear at the Score show:

"I remember I asked him out to do the Score show and the performance of When Dream and Day Unite in Los Angeles and he didn't do them," recalls Mike. "But thank God he didn't do them, because if he did, those shows would have been about him. And the Score show wasn't about him. It was about us. That night was about us celebrating doing it for twenty years and not celebrating the people who walked out and left us behind."

Regarding the WDADRU show:

"Well, Kevin's a bit odd," jokes Mike. "I think musically he doesn't want to be associated because he's in such a different place. If you listen to his new Chroma Key album there's nothing on there that has anything to do with playing progressive music. It's all soundscapes and soundtrack-type ambience. So musically he just wants to make his own statement in a whole different genre, and has no interest in playing keyboards in a progressive metal band. I did extend the invite for him to join us in LA for the 15th anniversary When Dream and Day Unite gig, but in retrospect I can't picture him up there playing Metropolis with us. I mean, I don't know if he could or whether his fingers can even move like they used to ten years ago. But I don't think he would even have any interest in it, being up on stage with us playing Metropolis or Learning to Live. That's just not where he's at. So I think that was the musical reason why he wants to be detached from us. And then there's the personal reason. I think he just wasn't interested in the fame and the glory. He had a taste of it when the Images and Words album broke, but that was enough for him to want to escape it. I just can't picture him wanting to go back in and be put back in the spotlight like he would be if he was ever to do anything with us again."

Also, if you look at Kevin's Twitter page, the description says: "Of OSI (with Jim Matheos), Chroma Key (solo project), film soundtracks (as self), hired gun (as others), Dream Theater (former self)" Of course he's not 100% serious, as the "hired gun" bit makes clear, but he just points out that he didn't find his own voice as an artist until he left DT.

I think Mike is right in saying that Kevin doesn't want to be associated with DT's style of music anymore, because it's so different from what he's doing now, but he IS still making progressive metal with OSI (although Jim Matheos has called their music straightforward rock - wtf Jim? ) and I'd argue that Chroma Key is progressive as well, albeit not prog (inb4 prog vs progressive debates). I'm also sure that with a bit of practise Kevin could've learned those old songs again (after all, he played a song with Fates Warning in Athens in 2005), but the bottom line is that he didn't have the will or interest in that.

I can understand why some fans find Kevin's reluctance to have anything to do with DT weird or even insulting, but he has just moved on and become a different person. I don't hink he owes anything to DT or DT fans - it's not like DT was a launchpad to superstardom for him! Some people just prefer to look forward instead of back; you shouldn't be forced to take part in a class reunion in your old school if you don't want to go there.

[MoraWintersoul]

You know, what really puzzles me is that Mike gave such a nice and reasonable explanation as to why Kevin wouldn't do the WDADRU show, but he was still offended about it

we should really quit with the off-topic discussion though, we've defended Kevin's right to do whatever he wants successfully enough

[?]

You know, what really puzzles me is that Mike gave such a nice and reasonable explanation as to why Kevin wouldn't do the WDADRU show, but he was still offended about it

we should really quit with the off-topic discussion though, we've defended Kevin's right to do whatever he wants successfully enough

What puzzles me more is that Jim called OSI straightforward rock

But yeah, we should stop

[Madman Shepherd]

On his his facebook or twitter or whatever KM posted a link to those kids playing Pull Me Under so he definitely doesn't completely ignore that. 

[Kotowboy]

Probably coz he gets royalties for it