Official KISS thread

[Orbert]

Stadler, I don't suppose there's any chance you'll ever do a "proper" discography for KISS, is there?  I was really looking forward to going through the catalogue chronologically and getting the dirt on all the changes and all the details.  By jumping around the way you did, that journey-through-time aspect was lost.  I didn't end up following.  But I'd still love to go through the discography with someone who really knows all aspects of the band, and you seem the guy to do it.

if everyone doesn't mind a little repeat, I'd do it.  Sure. 

I would love it!

I don't want to make it like there's only one way to do a discography.  I like it when people find different ways to do things; it keeps things interesting.  But if ever there was a band who's been through some changes and a lot of crazy shit, it's KISS.  I think they're worth another look.

[Stadler]

There's a lot I could add going chronologically; give me a week or so to get my thoughts in order and I'll give it a whirl. 

[Zydar]

Oh a Kiss discography thread would be very nice.

[WilliamMunny]

For those who aren't aware, I highly recommend checking out the following article: grantland.com/features/chuck-klosterman-kiss-hall-of-fame

Klosterman may be an aquired taste for some, but I think he's a fantastic writer, and regardless of whether or not you agree with his 'grades,' this article is an excellent primer for anyone looking to become for familiar with the Kiss catalog.

[DTA]

I appreciate some of the more agressive bits in the 80s indeed. Creatures, Lick it up and Animalize are almost as good as the early classics in my opinion. However, Asylum and Crazy nights are a bit too bright and sweet for my taste.

I also think that the raw production on the early albums does not take away from the heaviness of the songs. To my ears, when it comes down the riffs and guitar playing overall, it's just as powerful as the 80s albums I mentioned.

Speaking of the pop influences, I'm suprised Gene's album doesn't appeal to you more. It's very catchy.

Gene's album is good. I like Man Of 1,000 Faces and Mr. Make Believe quite a bit. I do enjoy a lot of the lower ranked albums on my list, but if I'm in the mood for Kiss, it's generally going to be the ones I ranked higher. 70's production just turns me off. Everything sounds thin and a lot of the power seems to get lost (mainly with guitar-based music - Yes and Genesis albums from the 70's sound fine to me).

Stadler, I don't suppose there's any chance you'll ever do a "proper" discography for KISS, is there?  I was really looking forward to going through the catalogue chronologically and getting the dirt on all the changes and all the details.  By jumping around the way you did, that journey-through-time aspect was lost.  I didn't end up following.  But I'd still love to go through the discography with someone who really knows all aspects of the band, and you seem the guy to do it.

if everyone doesn't mind a little repeat, I'd do it.  Sure. 

Oh hell yeah...looking forward to this!

For those who aren't aware, I highly recommend checking out the following article: grantland.com/features/chuck-klosterman-kiss-hall-of-fame

Klosterman may be an aquired taste for some, but I think he's a fantastic writer, and regardless of whether or not you agree with his 'grades,' this article is an excellent primer for anyone looking to become for familiar with the Kiss catalog.

Great read, thanks for posting

[cfmoran13]

There's a lot I could add going chronologically; give me a week or so to get my thoughts in order and I'll give it a whirl.

I'll be very interested in reading this.  Your current ranking for the albums has me scratching my head a bit.  While I admit Revenge (21) might be a little overrated in its adoration from most fans, the mere existence of Unholy would have to put the album higher than both Sonic Boom (10) and Monster (14).  Other than the opening tracks on both albums, the rest of both is pretty forgettable.  Monster should be way lower just on the merits (or lack thereof) of Take Me Down Below, which includes their cringy-est lyrics since Read My Body. 

And, personally, I'd rather listen to Carnival of Souls than at least 7 or 8 of their other albums.  It's definitely not a true KISS album (following yet another trend).  But, it has some pretty good rock songs.  Pauls whimsy "I Will Be There" and Gene's "In My Head" are the only songs I'd really skip.  I just wish they would've allowed Toby Wright to properly finish the album.  The finished album is not much better sounding than the bootleg version I had a year before it was released.

Obviously, these are just my opinions.  But, I've loved and been frustrated by this band for almost 40 years.  We definitely agree that Peter Criss' solo album is the worst release to wear the KISS logo on the cover, though.  If I had to rank my top 3 albums...

1. Dressed To Kill - 1st record I ever owned.  Sound is light-years ahead of HTH's sludgy mess.  Has a hidden gem with "Getaway".
2. Paul Stanley - Top to bottom solid album.  Truest solo album to KISS sound.
3. Creatures Of The Night - Great album.  Unfortunately, it came out a few years too late to save them.

[Ben_Jamin]

I just had to look at page 2...

Here is my vid of Kiss playing Love Gun with Paul Stanley on Center Stage, here in Albuquerque New Mexico. It turned out pretty decent I think. And I Was Made For Loving You with a funny mishap. 

 Kiss - Love Gun

Kiss - I Was Made For Loving You

[TAC]

Just had a run through of Dressed To Kill.

I wanted to mention She. It has aged greatly for me. I never liked it..ever. But over the last few years, I've been able to enjoy it.

It has three issues that prevented me from liking it.

1. Not uncommon in the Kiss catalog, but I really don't care for songs so blatantly about sex.
2. It's a Gene song, which somehow makes the sex songs feel a lot creepier than when Paul sings them..lol
3. It's mid tempo, which I do not like generally.



But musically, the song is so badass. I like it a lot more nowadays.

[King Postwhore]

That album cover is gold as well.

[TAC]

Yeah, it's actually one of my favorite album covers of all time.

[Mladen]

Just had a run through of Dressed To Kill.

I wanted to mention She. It has aged greatly for me. I never liked it..ever. But over the last few years, I've been able to enjoy it.

It has three issues that prevented me from liking it.

1. Not uncommon in the Kiss catalog, but I really don't care for songs so blatantly about sex.
2. It's a Gene song, which somehow makes the sex songs feel a lot creepier than when Paul sings them..lol
3. It's mid tempo, which I do not like generally.



But musically, the song is so badass. I like it a lot more nowadays.

Are you sure you are a KISS fan? 

[WilliamMunny]

Just had a run through of Dressed To Kill.

I wanted to mention She. It has aged greatly for me. I never liked it..ever. But over the last few years, I've been able to enjoy it.

It has three issues that prevented me from liking it.

1. Not uncommon in the Kiss catalog, but I really don't care for songs so blatantly about sex.
2. It's a Gene song, which somehow makes the sex songs feel a lot creepier than when Paul sings them..lol
3. It's mid tempo, which I do not like generally.



But musically, the song is so badass. I like it a lot more nowadays.

Are you sure you are a KISS fan? 

Lol—I had a similar thought. I LOVE Kiss because of Gene. IMO, every member was important in the classic lineup, but if Paul was, well, Paul, then Gene was John Lennon, and I'd have no use for the beatles if not for Lennon.

That being said, I am glad you revisited 'Dressed to Kill,' TAC—for my money, 'Dressed to Kill' is the best of the first three, and easily a top-5 KISS record for me overall (I love all eras, so my list is pretty eclectic).

[Stadler]

Dressed to Kill is a little slight to me compared to Hotter Than Hell.  I always viewed Kiss in segments (much like Rush), in that you had three studio records, then a live record, then three studio records, then a live record... and I always liked the second records in the group best, then the first, then the third. 

But having said that, "She" has always been a solid favorite.  I LOVE the riff, and I love the sort of "duet" vocals, and despite what TAC said, to me that's one of the Gene songs that ISN'T creepy but is sort of... I don't what the word is, but it's a got a vibe to it that's almost sexy and  dangerous.  "She walks by moonlight, no one really knows... the powers are within her, as she takes off her clothes".  To a 15 year old boy, that's like a Viagra/Spanish fly casserole.  Certainly more lascivious than "I'm 93 you're 16", or "And my love is in plaster, and yes, she's the collector.  She wants me all the time to inject her." which are, to me, just flat out comical.

There was also a book I had back in middle school by a rock journalist named Robert Duncan.  Bear in mind that then we didn't know what Kiss looked like, we didn't know what they were like as people, we didn't know that Paul was the calculated businessman, Gene was the raging egomaniac, Ace was the druggie and Peter the miserable malcontent.  And there was a chapter in that book that was weird as fuck but PERFECTLY captured the image, the aura of Gene Simmons.   And "She" will always remind me of that.

By the way, anyone heard this? (From the Kiss Box Set)  Or this?  TAC, who does that remind you of?   

[TAC]

Or this?  TAC, who does that remind you of?

Jethro KISS?

[TAC]

That being said, I am glad you revisited 'Dressed to Kill,' TAC—for my money, 'Dressed to Kill' is the best of the first three, and easily a top-5 KISS record for me overall (I love all eras, so my list is pretty eclectic).

I also love all eras, but Hotter Than Hell is easily my favorite KISS album.

[cfmoran13]

I am glad you revisited 'Dressed to Kill,' TAC—for my money, 'Dressed to Kill' is the best of the first three, and easily a top-5 KISS record for me overall (I love all eras, so my list is pretty eclectic).

'Dressed To Kill' has always been my favorite KISS album.  Yes, it has one of the most tired and overplayed rock anthems of all-time, RaRAN.  But, I love the rest of the material.  It doesn't hurt that it was the first new piece of music I ever bought.

[WilliamMunny]

I am glad you revisited 'Dressed to Kill,' TAC—for my money, 'Dressed to Kill' is the best of the first three, and easily a top-5 KISS record for me overall (I love all eras, so my list is pretty eclectic).

'Dressed To Kill' has always been my favorite KISS album.  Yes, it has one of the most tired and overplayed rock anthems of all-time, RaRAN.  But, I love the rest of the material.  It doesn't hurt that it was the first new piece of music I ever bought.

You know what's crazy? I think, at this point, I prefer the studio version of 'Rock 'n Roll' All Night' to the Alive version. Don't get me wrong, the live version is genius, but I'm soooooo played out on it, where as the studio version just feels more fresh to my ears. Also, regardless of the 'played out-ness' of it (I totally agree btw), I NEVER tire of hearing Ace's solo.

[cfmoran13]

I am glad you revisited 'Dressed to Kill,' TAC—for my money, 'Dressed to Kill' is the best of the first three, and easily a top-5 KISS record for me overall (I love all eras, so my list is pretty eclectic).

'Dressed To Kill' has always been my favorite KISS album.  Yes, it has one of the most tired and overplayed rock anthems of all-time, RaRAN.  But, I love the rest of the material.  It doesn't hurt that it was the first new piece of music I ever bought.

You know what's crazy? I think, at this point, I prefer the studio version of 'Rock 'n Roll' All Night' to the Alive version. Don't get me wrong, the live version is genius, but I'm soooooo played out on it, where as the studio version just feels more fresh to my ears. Also, regardless of the 'played out-ness' of it (I totally agree btw), I NEVER tire of hearing Ace's solo.

The other day, I heard Poison's version of RaRAN (Less Than Zero soundtrack) for the first time in ages.  I forgot that they did a studio version of the Alive! version.  I don't like their version.  But, I appreciate the fact that they did the version with the guitar solo.

[bl5150]

I am glad you revisited 'Dressed to Kill,' TAC—for my money, 'Dressed to Kill' is the best of the first three, and easily a top-5 KISS record for me overall (I love all eras, so my list is pretty eclectic).

'Dressed To Kill' has always been my favorite KISS album.  Yes, it has one of the most tired and overplayed rock anthems of all-time, RaRAN.  But, I love the rest of the material.  It doesn't hurt that it was the first new piece of music I ever bought.

A big fave of mine too for many of the reasons already covered.  It's got a bit of everything ............heavy tracks, lighter tracks , party anthems and a sense of humour.  I know a lot of people dislike it but I always loved Room Service for its cheeky un-PC vibe.

[Lowdz]

I am glad you revisited 'Dressed to Kill,' TAC—for my money, 'Dressed to Kill' is the best of the first three, and easily a top-5 KISS record for me overall (I love all eras, so my list is pretty eclectic).

'Dressed To Kill' has always been my favorite KISS album.  Yes, it has one of the most tired and overplayed rock anthems of all-time, RaRAN.  But, I love the rest of the material.  It doesn't hurt that it was the first new piece of music I ever bought.

A big fave of mine too for many of the reasons already covered.  It's got a bit of everything ............heavy tracks, lighter tracks , party anthems and a sense of humour.  I know a lot of people dislike it but I always loved Room Service for its cheeky un-PC vibe.

I love it. Hotter Than Hell is my favourite of the first three. Although the first has all those classic songs I hardly ever play it.

[cfmoran13]

And, here is why Vinnie Vincent is a total douchebag...

http://vinnievincent.com/product/vinnie-vincent-hand-writtenlyrics/

If anyone gives him anything for this, he/she's an asshole!  He stiffed people on a $200 (or however much it cost) box set 30 years ago.  Who in their right mind would give him $1000's for this?!?  They're probably photocopies of his hand-written lyrics with a real signature at the bottom.  Did he even wrote the lyrics to those KISS songs in the first place?!?

Elsewhere in his "Shop" section, it says "Due to scheduling and heavy demand, please allow 6-8 weeks for shipping."  He lives in Nashville and only schedules things in the Nashville area.  He's cancelled 2 of the only 3 appearances he's scheduled in the past 2 years.  What's the problem?!?

[TAC]

Anyone have an extra 30k lying around?

https://reverb.com/item/48283349-eric-carr-of-kiss-personal-drum-set-1989-custom-hits-tour-cannon-24x32-bass-drums-authenticated-coa

[TAC]

Now this is something I'm interested in.

https://bravewords.com/news/kiss-off-the-soundboard-live-in-des-moines-1977-due-in-september


Finally a classic tour from this Off The Soundboard line.

[Orbert]

Ha ha, talk about warts and all!  I would love to hear a soundboard of KISS.  Seriously.  I don't know if I've ever heard what they can "really" do in real time, since Alive! is supposedly overdubbed, and the others to various degrees.  But a soundboard presumably will be unadulterated.

[TAC]

Ha ha, talk about warts and all!  I would love to hear a soundboard of KISS.  Seriously.  I don't know if I've ever heard what they can "really" do in real time, since Alive! is supposedly overdubbed, and the others to various degrees.  But a soundboard presumably will be unadulterated.

Hopefully.

They've had a number of Off The Soundboard releases, and I haven't heard any of them. This is the earliest date of any show. I don't even think they've released any 80's shows.  So I have no idea of the quality of if anything is...fixed. But I am pumped for this and will be a great replacement for Alive II, where two of the songs are studio tracks with the crowd piped in. And this will have the proper running order for the tour.


EDIT: Was just listening to the last release which was Donnington '96. Now I'm even more pumped!!

[Stadler]

Is it, though (unadulterated)?  It's one CD, so all, what, 17 songs are in 80 minutes... that seems short to me. Maybe they cut out the banter and the spaces in between. 

[TAC]

Is it, though (unadulterated)?  It's one CD, so all, what, 17 songs are in 80 minutes... that seems short to me. Maybe they cut out the banter and the spaces in between.

Kiss’ shows weren’t that long. Looks the the full setlist.

[frogprog]

That is a sweet set of Ludwig drums!

[cramx3]

https://blabbermouth.net/news/kiss-mocked-online-after-displaying-australian-flag-during-concert-in-austria

 

[TAC]

Oh my.

[DragonAttack]

^
 

As to early 'soundboards', I came across this years ago and divided it up onto disc for a KISS (and Prince and now Queen) fanatic.  It's from 'The Brewery' in East Lansing 1974  night before 'Dressed To Kill' was released.  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gTmCMz5xcUA

'She' and the guitar solo are excellent, with lots of subtle variations to the 'Alive' version.  btw....is there an 'unofficial' name to this self titled LP Side One ending tune?

'Dressed To Kill':  my favorite of the original three (if most of the ten seconds of silence between songs is removed). 

On to memory lane:  my older cousin took me to a Bob Seger show at The Brewery for my first concert the year before (they did allow minors to enter at the time). It changed its name to 'The Silver Dollar Saloon' a few years later.  In '80, I saw REO Speedwagon at the now torn down Civic Center, went to The Silver Dollar afterwards (20-30 minute drive) and the band then showed up and played for twenty minutes (they also played benefit softball games against the FM radio DJs on a couple of tours). 

A few years later, after seeing Rainbow, then going to the bar, the band showed up, and I had a drink with drummer Bobby Rondinelli.  I might have gotten an acknowledging 'nod' from Blackmore....

[Orbert]

Holy shit!  I grew up maybe a mile from The Brewery, later The Silver Dollar Saloon, and was there many times.  Rush also played there in the early years.  Our guitarist's older brother always told the story of how Ace stood on his table and took a solo, and 1974 sounds about right.  Could've been the same show.

[Stadler]

Holy shit!  I grew up maybe a mile from The Brewery, later The Silver Dollar Saloon, and was there many times.  Rush also played there in the early years.  Our guitarist's older brother always told the story of how Ace stood on his table and took a solo, and 1974 sounds about right.  Could've been the same show.

I'm pretty sure Cheap Trick did a fair amount of work there.

Jealous over the Blackmore story.  He used to hang at a bar near Redding, CT where he lived (I lived two towns over in Monroe) but I never saw him there.

[Stadler]

^
 

As to early 'soundboards', I came across this years ago and divided it up onto disc for a KISS (and Prince and now Queen) fanatic.  It's from 'The Brewery' in East Lansing 1974  night before 'Dressed To Kill' was released.  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gTmCMz5xcUA

'She' and the guitar solo are excellent, with lots of subtle variations to the 'Alive' version.  btw....is there an 'unofficial' name to this self titled LP Side One ending tune?

[/quote]

I don't really follow the question; the side one ending tune on the self-titled LP is "Let Me Know".  They used the coda for that for the end of "She" for a number of years.  I don't know that the coda was ever named, officially or unofficially, but I can't find anything.

Interesting is that Ace stole the solo from Robby Kreiger of the Doors ("Five To One") and then Mike McCready of Pearl Jam stole it back ("Alive")!

[DragonAttack]

^
‘Side One Coda’ works for me. 

And, ‘holy crap’, Ace did steal it, but I had never noticed until today after all these decades. Yet another 

The Silver Dollar: I was two miles away as the crow flies on Lake Lansing Road. Some return trips were longer, slower, and not nearly as direct