Sound quality of DT...

[me7]

Yeah - I meant the mastering. JammingDude said it has worse audio than Death magnetic - I just wanted to hear it

I agree on that, it sounds more annoying than DM, worst master I've ever heard.
I like QR a lot and I tried hard to like this album, but after four listens I just can't spin it anymore.

[jammindude]

I've never heard Frequency Unknown...but it's not really a QR album.   It says it is on the cover...but it's not.  It's the ex-lead singer with a cover band.   Don't buy it because it is not really QR.    The self-titled album is the real QR...and it is one of the best albums that came out in the last year, but the worst mastering I have ever heard in my entire life.

[volwrath]

Pathetically, the dvd-a 24/96 stereo mix is actually WORSE than the cd.

Surround downmix to stereo it is

I'm considering doing this once my CD/DVD combo arrives, particularly if the default stereo mix is so bad. Is there any particular process that "downmixing" should follow? I have no idea how I'd go about doing it.

Depends what you use - foobar2000 has a handy downmix DSP that you can either use as a filter or to convert to new tracks permanently.

So step 1 is to rip with something like dvd decryptor? or maybe VLC for that matter?

[BlobVanDam]

So the HDTracks version is apparently a DR12? That's a greater dynamic range than IaW, just to put that in perspective.

I'm thinking I really need this.

[7StringedBeast]

So the HDTracks version is apparently a DR12? That's a greater dynamic range than IaW, just to put that in perspective.

I'm thinking I really need this.

Dude!  Get it!  It's amazing.  I mean, the snare still sounds fucking weird, but the mix is WAAAAAAAY better.  I just got to Enigma Machine and I have it cranking loud in my headphones and it sounds soooooo huge.  The drums actually have tons of punch and the Rudess is much clearer.  Everything has space to play.

[jammindude]

Listening to the 5.1 right now....I was about to claim that it was a bit TOO subtle. But the guitar solo from Surrender to Reason just did a bunch of 360's, so I'm happy.

[Dark Castle]

Converted my Flac download that came with the vinyl to Apple lossless, can certainly tell a difference

[me7]

So the HDTracks version is apparently a DR12? That's a greater dynamic range than IaW, just to put that in perspective.

I'm thinking I really need this.

To keep things in perspective, the HDTracks version of ADTOE contained a lot of inaudible drum peaks that "mathematically" look like a huge improvement but don't matter for human listening. Still haven't heard the DT12 HDTracks version, but it will probably be the same: better than the CD, but not as good as DR thinks it is.

[ariich]

So the HDTracks version is apparently a DR12? That's a greater dynamic range than IaW, just to put that in perspective.

I'm thinking I really need this.

To keep things in perspective, the HDTracks version of ADTOE contained a lot of inaudible drum peaks that "mathematically" look like a huge improvement but don't matter for human listening. Still haven't heard the DT12 HDTracks version, but it will probably be the same: better than the CD, but not as good as DR thinks it is.

I don't agree that the drum peaks are inaudible. If anything that, for me, is one of the main benefits of a less hot/loud master - the drum hits sit on top of the sound and so don't push the other instruments quieter each time.

I wouldn't really call myself an audiophile - for example I've never had any problem with the sound on any previous DT album. But even I have found the amazon autorip mp3s a bit too loud and tiring, whereas the HD tracks sound really nice.

EDIT: I should add that the production is still very in-your-face, but with the HD tracks you can see what they were going for, and I think it works really well.

[BlobVanDam]

So the HDTracks version is apparently a DR12? That's a greater dynamic range than IaW, just to put that in perspective.

I'm thinking I really need this.

To keep things in perspective, the HDTracks version of ADTOE contained a lot of inaudible drum peaks that "mathematically" look like a huge improvement but don't matter for human listening. Still haven't heard the DT12 HDTracks version, but it will probably be the same: better than the CD, but not as good as DR thinks it is.

I just did a direct comparison of the samples on the page, and the CD version, and while you're right that it's not as drastic an improvement as the DR number would suggest, it is still an improvement if you're on good equipment. It's definitely worth the money if you're someone who is bothered by the compression, but maybe not as noticeable on something like an iThing.

And also, while doing the comparison, I think I noticed a drum cut point in TEI. /offtopic

[me7]

Oh, it definitely sounds a lot better. I was just commenting on how the DR value is higher than IAW but the album probably still sounds less dynamic than IAW does to a human listener. I'll reserve final judgment until I get to compare the two versions in a few hours

[faemir]

The hd-tracks version is solid, stupid that the dvd-a stereo isn't the same - means people that want surround and stereo mixes have to either double-dip or pirate which is utter rubbish, plain and simple.

The snare does sound a little odd, but the rest of the album sounds good now

[TL]

My vinyl copy is still in the mail, but DR Database is saying the vinyl has an overall dynamic range of 13, with a min of 12 and a max of 14.

This is compared to 6/5/8 for the CD and MP3s, and 12/11/13 for HD Tracks and the DVD-A.

[The Stray Seed]

I have the vinyl and it sounds awesome. Every time I'm home I just listen to the analogue. It has a very beautiful and deep sound, with a lot of dynamics. If you look on this page you will see that it says "Dream Theater used definitly a seperate Master for the analogue and the HDTrack-Version of their album. Themusic sound very clear and warm. The bass and specialy the guitar and drumparts are much more transparent to hear out."

[Dark Castle]

Yeah, I got the vinyl, and it sounds wonderful

[Lowdz]

Frequency Unknown, The self titled is very very good, it just has terrible mastering.

imo FU has shit songs and shit mastering and the real QR has really good songs with shit mastering. Good job the ST was short. I couldn't have listened to 60mins worth without wanting to beat my head with a brick no matter how great the songs.

[TheOutlawXanadu]

If the DT12 HD is truly that much better, I'll probably buy it. The sound quality of DT12 is quite bad.

[ytserush]

Unfortunately most of you have to realize that the reason why albums are produced/mastered the way they are these days is because the target consumer is just going to listen to it through their head phones while doing something else, and not really even focus on the music. It's a shame, because while I think the album sounds fine, it really could sound better, but people like us who actually sit down with albums and listen to them in a traditional way are becoming an endangered breed. Who knows, maybe it will swing the our way in the coming years, but for now, we're just not the target audience.

That being said, I can say that it sounds great on my record player, and it's definitely going to get a shit ton of plays from me.

We're a dying breed.

Doesn't sound that great to me (CD so far), but it won't prevent me from listening to it.

[BlobVanDam]

If the DT12 HD is truly that much better, I'll probably buy it. The sound quality of DT12 is quite bad.

Even though it's the same mix, the better master really brings out more details, especially in the cymbals/hats and keys.

It baffles me that this master wasn't put on the CD. At worst, people won't know the difference, and at best it has made a big difference to people's ability to enjoy the album.

[Kotowboy]

BECOZ ITS NOT TEH LOUD !!!!! HAZ TO BE DA LOUDEST ON DA MTVZ !!!!!! DAT WAY PPL WILL NOE DAT DEY R DA BEZT !!!!!!

 

[mhanna49]

With regards to Frequency Unknown, I sent an e-mail to Cleopatra Records or whatever label that released it about the crap sound quality and they sent me a remixed version of the album. The remix sounds way better than the original mix. Sadly, the remixed version of Frequency Unknown sounds way better than the self-titled Queensryche album.

[jammindude]

With regards to Frequency Unknown, I sent an e-mail to Cleopatra Records or whatever label that released it about the crap sound quality and they sent me a remixed version of the album. The remix sounds way better than the original mix. Sadly, the remixed version of Frequency Unknown sounds way better than the self-titled Queensryche album.

That's probably the only category that FU will win in that comparison...but that's also setting the bar really low. (considering that the new QR album is the worst mastered album I've ever heard....yes, worse than Death Magnetic...worse than Vapor Trails). 

[Scorpion]

I have to say that while I had some problems with the stream, now that I have the CD (I think it's the 5.1 mix, downmixed, not quite sure, as I got it from my dad via Dropbox), everything is fine. But then, I'm not a person that is bothered by the audio quality easily anyway, so...

[Kotowboy]

I have to say that while I had some problems with the stream, now that I have the CD (I think it's the 5.1 mix, downmixed, not quite sure, as I got it from my dad via Dropbox), everything is fine. But then, I'm not a person that is bothered by the audio quality easily anyway, so...

Agree. I'm not overly bothered by a hot master - as long as it's not constantly distorting. I'm happy with the CD for out and about listening and

shall keep the HD version for home listening on my decent speakers.

[TheOutlawXanadu]

Bought the HD version today. It sounds significantly better. It's not night and day, but it's definitely an improvement.

[teclas]

The vinyl sounds FAN TAS TIC.  RAWWWk

[Kotowboy]

The HD of DT12 sounds like a heavier version of FII to me now. With less Reverb .

[faemir]

I have to say that while I had some problems with the stream, now that I have the CD (I think it's the 5.1 mix, downmixed, not quite sure, as I got it from my dad via Dropbox), everything is fine. But then, I'm not a person that is bothered by the audio quality easily anyway, so...

Agree. I'm not overly bothered by a hot master - as long as it's not constantly distorting. I'm happy with the CD for out and about listening and

shall keep the HD version for home listening on my decent speakers.

You can compress it via software for 'out and about' as it plays. That way it doesn't screw it over for everyone who wants an uncompressed version too, because you can't uncompress albums, and unlike Dream Theater's latest albums, most aren't on hd tracks or have good dvd-a releases.



On another note, the Systematic Chaos and Black Clouds hd tracks also sound lovely, although double-dipping for it this many years on is more than a bit lame.

[Ben_Jamin]

I think I'm going to cave and buy the HDTracks. The cd is way too loud, and I hear keyboard parts that are barely noticeable. I don't usually care about the sound that much, but this is just a bit too much for me. I hate listening to my Ipod at night with a good volume set, and then Surrender to Reason, The Bigger Picture, or The Enemy Inside begin which scares the crap out of me.

I couldn't really tell the difference from the samples because they were parts that I had no problem with on the the cd.

[Sycsa]

I'm on the fence on whether or not I should get them. Let me know what you think.

[Plasmastrike]

HDTracks for DT12 are phenomenal. That is all.

Oh, and they're also pretty fantastic for SC, BC&SL, and ADTOE. Worth it.

[Ben_Jamin]

I bought the HD Tracks...


MY GOD....Everything I found wrong with the sound has been fixed. I can hear all the subtle qualities in each song that the cd version drowns out. The mix is the same but everything is at least audible.

I agree that we all got shafted....big time.

[Perpetual Change]

HDTracks for DT12 are phenomenal. That is all.

Oh, and they're also pretty fantastic for SC, BC&SL, and ADTOE. Worth it.

Maybe, I'm just hesistant to buy all these records again, since outside of ADTOE, the other three are bottom-tier albums for me anyway.

[Prog Snob]

HDTracks for DT12 are phenomenal. That is all.

Oh, and they're also pretty fantastic for SC, BC&SL, and ADTOE. Worth it.

Maybe, I'm just hesistant to buy all these records again, since outside of ADTOE, the other three are bottom-tier albums for me anyway.

I was thinking that myself.  However, maybe it could shine a new light on the songs.

[faizoff]

Sorry if this has been asked but is the HD tracks version different than the two audio tracks found on the DVD edition of DT12? I thought the stereo and 5.1 versions on the DVD were far better than the CD version.