Author Topic: The science and nature thread v. We tried this before  (Read 63084 times)

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Offline TioJorge

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Re: The science and nature thread v. We tried this before
« Reply #420 on: July 28, 2015, 11:57:58 PM »
I'll pay a dollar to hunt him. All I gotta do is shake my badonkadonk and I can bait him ANYWHERE.






ANYWHERE!

But seriously, I can see this going PR very soon. I'll reign in my comments and just say "I wish I could bait Palmer into Cecil's pride". Also Cecil is an awesome name. Poor guy.

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Online gmillerdrake

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Re: The science and nature thread v. We tried this before
« Reply #421 on: July 29, 2015, 12:05:43 AM »
I've hunted before. I've killed a Turkey...probably two,or three dozen squirrel and three Deer. I ate all the meat and/or it was shared with family/friends who ate it. The group of guys I hunt wi and my Dad follow the rules and we harvest what Missouri's Department of conservation asks us to. What this guy did/does is not hunting and its deplorable that it's allowed.

I liken this guy to the "hunters" who tree Mountain Lions and Bears with a pack of dogs then walk up to the tree and shoot the defenseless animal. That's not hunting. Dump the dogs and try to actually 'hunt' those animals if you have the balls and want to brag about killing one of those bad a$$es.

Anyway....this is sad. It's still hard to believe you can actually pay to kill a Lion or any of those magnificent African creatures.
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Offline MrBoom_shack-a-lack

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Re: The science and nature thread v. We tried this before
« Reply #422 on: July 29, 2015, 06:27:26 AM »
Travel at light-speed from the Sun to Jupiter

I actually watched the whole thing. Spoiler alert: Make a sandwich and get a drink.
While cool for scale, I thought it was going to show us the visual affects of special relativity. :(

...ok, I found something. Read about it, but never thought to look for a demonstration before.

https://www.snotr.com/video/8149/Optical_effects_of_travelling_close_to_the_speed_of_light
That's cool!

Random thing but the game Space Engineer is using double-precision 64-bit floating point instead of 32-bit in their game engine meaning their game world can be insanely big. Currently their world has a barrier at 1,000,000,000 km, which equals to 6.6 AU. 6.6 AU is slightly more than the distance from the Sun to Jupiter.

If you decide to use your ship to travel from one side of the game world to the opposite, and you will fly on maximum speed (115 m/s), it will take you 552 years.
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Offline kaos2900

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Re: The science and nature thread v. We tried this before
« Reply #423 on: July 29, 2015, 06:39:52 AM »
Stadler, you know I'm not a mob rules guy (unless your talking about the song :metal) but I still think that paying to skin and behead an animal for no personal benefit other than saying you killed a lion or for a new rug is morally abhorrent. I know that doesn't mean much when applying the law, and maybe there is a chance that his guide screwed up and misled him. I'm not anti hunting by any means. I grew up hunting pheasants with by dad but we ate every thing we killed. I picture this guy as the asshole hunter from The Lost World who just went to kill a T-Rex.

Offline jasc15

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Re: The science and nature thread v. We tried this before
« Reply #424 on: July 29, 2015, 07:12:14 AM »
As far as I know, the justification for these types of hunts is that the proceeds are used to protect against poaching.  Thus, allowing the killing of one animal in a controlled manner may prevent the uncontrolled killing of many more by poachers.  I don't know much beyond that, or if this system is actually effective.

Offline kaos2900

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Re: The science and nature thread v. We tried this before
« Reply #425 on: July 29, 2015, 07:20:09 AM »
As far as I know, the justification for these types of hunts is that the proceeds are used to protect against poaching.  Thus, allowing the killing of one animal in a controlled manner may prevent the uncontrolled killing of many more by poachers.  I don't know much beyond that, or if this system is actually effective.

That is an argument used by some hunters and I think it really depends on the situation. For instance the guy who paid $300,000+ to kill a rhino claimed that the rhino he killed was so old that he couldn't mate anymore and was a threat to younger males. There is some logic in that. However, it looks like in most cases it's not an effective method. Considering this lion had some new cubs, it can't be used in this case.

It does look like there is more coming out on this story. Sounds like the guy is claiming he didn't realize what he was doing. Sounds like a bunch of shit to me. It also looks like this wouldn't be his first run in with the law for illegal hunting as he got in trouble for killing a black bear illegally.  My question is if he is such a great hunter, why did it take him hours to track him down and put him out of his misery unless he didn't want to be seen?

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Re: The science and nature thread v. We tried this before
« Reply #426 on: July 29, 2015, 07:30:33 AM »
It's really up to the poachers. There are scenarios where I am okay with this. For example, there are rhino species that are very endangered. Poachers want their horns and their numbers are dwindling fast. We have preserves housing dozens of these beasts. Often times, when an alpha male begins to age and be less attractive, the younger males begin to take its females. This does not sit well with the male, who may longer not even be fertile, and he begins to kill any young male that threatens his dominance. The death of offspring is the absolute last thing that these preservations need. 

They need to prevent the killing of valuable offspring by getting the aging alpha male out of the picture. For the sake of preserving the species, this is vital. They could just open the gates and let the thing go free, but in its elderly state combined with being alone, he'll be a pride's main course in no time. Knowing that there are people who will pay big money, the preserves arrange a hunt to kill an animal that's more or less doomed anyway. They figure they might as well raise $50,000 that could go toward fences, security, and anything else that could prevent poaching. The meat is often times donated to people in the surrounding communities as well.

While I don't love the idea of it, I can't necessarily hate the logic behind it.

Offline Stadler

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Re: The science and nature thread v. We tried this before
« Reply #427 on: July 29, 2015, 08:58:30 AM »
Why are you giving the thumbs down to people voicing their discontent on a site specifically meant for that purpose?
How is it different from people writing a review saying "guy was a jerk when I was there, will never go there again"? Here it is "guy is morally despicable, will never go there again".


If that's the case, why is his website down?   And it's more than just "voicing discontent".   As of now, the guy is guilty of nothing.  He made a different choice than some of us might make, and at this point we don't know whether that choice was legal or not, because a court didn't decide it yet.   Hell, if I read correctly, someone here wants to kill HIM.  For what?

How is this any different than someone going on Yelp and saying "voicing their discontent" with a dentist's homosexuality?  Or views on abortion?  Or views on healthcare?  Do I get to "hunt someone for a dollar" because they voted for Obama? 

It's mob rules. 

Offline Stadler

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Re: The science and nature thread v. We tried this before
« Reply #428 on: July 29, 2015, 09:05:04 AM »
Stadler, you know I'm not a mob rules guy (unless your talking about the song :metal) but I still think that paying to skin and behead an animal for no personal benefit other than saying you killed a lion or for a new rug is morally abhorrent. I know that doesn't mean much when applying the law, and maybe there is a chance that his guide screwed up and misled him. I'm not anti hunting by any means. I grew up hunting pheasants with by dad but we ate every thing we killed. I picture this guy as the asshole hunter from The Lost World who just went to kill a T-Rex.

And while I probably agree with you (only "probably", because I don't know all the facts, and would have little problem if the other posters are correct in the "management" aspect of this hunt) on the moral aspect of this, "morality" doesn't make any action right.  If I'm morally against homosexuality, or drug use, or gender modification, do I get to blow up someone's website and clog Yelp with my "moral" views?   Don't we lambaste the Westboro Baptist Church for this same activity, albeit because we don't like their message?  Who gets to decide what the "right" message is?  I'll tell you:  THE MOB.    And as we all know, the mob rules when you listen to fools.

What's good for the goose...

(And Kaos2900, we're good; this isn't meant to target you personally, but merely to make a point off an idea that may or may not have been tossed up by you). 

Offline Stadler

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Re: The science and nature thread v. We tried this before
« Reply #429 on: July 29, 2015, 12:01:40 PM »
BOOOOOOOO to Jimmy Kimmel.  I'm boycotting him and blowing up Yelp! about him.   Does he make his jokes and cast his judgments and opinions on stage so that his douchbag friends can sit around and tell him how great he is?    I support people having opinions, but for the life of me, I can't understand why anyone would deny another human the right to make their own decisions - as long as they are within the law - without judgment or rancor.   

Sanctimonious bastard.

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Online Chino

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Re: The science and nature thread v. We tried this before
« Reply #430 on: July 29, 2015, 12:18:58 PM »
BOOOOOOOO to Jimmy Kimmel.  I'm boycotting him and blowing up Yelp! about him.   Does he make his jokes and cast his judgments and opinions on stage so that his douchbag friends can sit around and tell him how great he is?    I support people having opinions, but for the life of me, I can't understand why anyone would deny another human the right to make their own decisions - as long as they are within the law - without judgment or rancor.   


In this case, he wasn't. If I kill someone drunk driving, I can't use the excuse "I had no idea that I was that drunk and didn't think a teen would be crossing the street at 3am. I relied on my pocket breathalyzer and the opinions of my friends to ensure I was within the legal limit.”

Offline kaos2900

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Re: The science and nature thread v. We tried this before
« Reply #431 on: July 29, 2015, 01:24:36 PM »
We're good Stads!

I don't really have a problem with what Kimmel said. It's appears he was pretty genuine. And I agree that the guy is a douche and I would  admit my bias if I was being selected from a jury pool.

Offline rumborak

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Re: The science and nature thread v. We tried this before
« Reply #432 on: July 29, 2015, 01:42:00 PM »
Regarding the "it was perfectly legal", there's a lot of places in this world where you can legally do morally reprehensible actions. There's a lot places where you can get away with having sex with a 10-year old, and places where people will shrug their shoulders when you hunted an albino man, or shot a homosexual.
Saying "well, it was legal wherever he did it" is just naive. If the guy wants to move to those places and do it there, well, that's his choice. Coming back to the US and boasting about the reprehensible deed: expect to feel the wrath of the public.

EDIT: Death threats are of course unacceptable. But Yelp reviews, hey, what do you expect. And the web page, I think the much more mundane explanation is that he either took it down himself, or it couldn't handle the load of people going to it.
« Last Edit: July 29, 2015, 01:59:11 PM by rumborak »
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Online Chino

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Re: The science and nature thread v. We tried this before
« Reply #433 on: July 29, 2015, 01:50:14 PM »
Regarding the "it was perfectly legal", there's a lot of places in this world where you can legally do morally reprehensible actions. There's a lot places where you can get away with having sex with a 10-year old, and places where people will shrug their shoulders when you hunted an albino man, or shot a homosexual.
Saying "well, it was legal wherever he did it" is just naive. If the guy wants to move to those places and do it there, well, that's his choice. Coming back to the US and boasting about the reprehensible deed: expect to feel the wrath of the public.

That's a great point. If I went to Niger, married and knocked up a 14 year old, and then brought her back to the states, I'd expect to be murdered in the days to follow.

Offline TioJorge

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Re: The science and nature thread v. We tried this before
« Reply #434 on: July 29, 2015, 02:00:13 PM »
Regarding the "it was perfectly legal", there's a lot of places in this world where you can legally do morally reprehensible actions. There's a lot places where you can get away with having sex with a 10-year old, and places where people will shrug their shoulders when you hunted an albino man, or shot a homosexual.
Saying "well, it was legal wherever he did it" is just naive. If the guy wants to move to those places and do it there, well, that's his choice. Coming back to the US and boasting about the reprehensible deed: expect to feel the wrath of the public.

EDIT: Death threats are of course unacceptable. But Yelp reviews, hey, what do you expect.

Death threats are abso-fucking-lutely acceptable. Let him stir and wallow in the paranoia. ACTUALLY killing him is unacceptable. Threats though? Shit. Send those Natural-Born-Killers-letters ALL DAY. Pretty sure if you're enough of a cunt to pay that much money to kill an animal halfway around the world, you can stir in a little bit of paranoia and think about it just a little.

Ed: Damn it, I've been sucked into it. Let's post some more Plutonium porn, guys. I dunno what that is, but I KNOW one of you mofos around here does.

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Offline Stadler

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Re: The science and nature thread v. We tried this before
« Reply #435 on: July 29, 2015, 03:27:05 PM »
BOOOOOOOO to Jimmy Kimmel.  I'm boycotting him and blowing up Yelp! about him.   Does he make his jokes and cast his judgments and opinions on stage so that his douchbag friends can sit around and tell him how great he is?    I support people having opinions, but for the life of me, I can't understand why anyone would deny another human the right to make their own decisions - as long as they are within the law - without judgment or rancor.   


In this case, he wasn't. If I kill someone drunk driving, I can't use the excuse "I had no idea that I was that drunk and didn't think a teen would be crossing the street at 3am. I relied on my pocket breathalyzer and the opinions of my friends to ensure I was within the legal limit.”

We don't, as of this moment, know that he DID anything illegal.  This is all because of moral outrage, not a reaction to a convicted felon.

Offline rumborak

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Re: The science and nature thread v. We tried this before
« Reply #436 on: July 29, 2015, 03:35:09 PM »
Since when has Zimbabwean law become the moral standard, Stadler?
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Offline Stadler

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Re: The science and nature thread v. We tried this before
« Reply #437 on: July 29, 2015, 03:35:45 PM »
Regarding the "it was perfectly legal", there's a lot of places in this world where you can legally do morally reprehensible actions. There's a lot places where you can get away with having sex with a 10-year old, and places where people will shrug their shoulders when you hunted an albino man, or shot a homosexual.
Saying "well, it was legal wherever he did it" is just naive. If the guy wants to move to those places and do it there, well, that's his choice. Coming back to the US and boasting about the reprehensible deed: expect to feel the wrath of the public.

EDIT: Death threats are of course unacceptable. But Yelp reviews, hey, what do you expect.

Death threats are abso-fucking-lutely acceptable. Let him stir and wallow in the paranoia. ACTUALLY killing him is unacceptable. Threats though? Shit. Send those Natural-Born-Killers-letters ALL DAY. Pretty sure if you're enough of a cunt to pay that much money to kill an animal halfway around the world, you can stir in a little bit of paranoia and think about it just a little.

I hope your joking, because your reaction is EXACTLY what I'm railing against.  Who are you to decide what merits "death threats"?  Do I get to provide "death threats" - are they "perfectly acceptable"? - to doctors performing abortions?  Because I find abortions morally reprehensible.  (I'm actually not kidding, though I am pro-choice).   

Object to this guy all you want, but don't forget that at some point you're going to be on the other side of the equation. 

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Re: The science and nature thread v. We tried this before
« Reply #438 on: July 29, 2015, 03:42:53 PM »
I don't even understand why killing a lion is legal anywhere.  Regardless, this guy has a prior conviction of illegally killing a black bear and also lied about where he killed it to cover up (and got caught on that lie).  He has a history of lying about his kills so there is suspicion enough that he did something illegal and knew it.  And morally, it just seems so wrong to do as something for fun.  I am all for hunting if you are actually going to do something with your kill (food, clothes, whatever it may be) to make the kill have real life value and meaning.  Traveling around the world to kill big animals for fun is just so wrong regardless of whether it is legal or not.

Offline rumborak

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Re: The science and nature thread v. We tried this before
« Reply #439 on: July 29, 2015, 03:44:35 PM »
Exactly, and I don't need some kangaroo court to tell us whether it was legal or not.
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Offline Onno

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Re: The science and nature thread v. We tried this before
« Reply #440 on: July 29, 2015, 03:47:44 PM »
Agreed.

Offline Shattered Glass

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Re: The science and nature thread v. We tried this before
« Reply #441 on: July 29, 2015, 09:58:44 PM »
Full disclosure  - my personal reaction to his is grief, and I hadn’t even heard of Cecil until he passed.  I do recognise him as a frequently photographed lion, and for that reason find it hard to believe that the dentist (who sure seemed to go hunting a lot) did not know who he was.  But there’s grief, because lions in general are amazing, and I believe that this shooting is symptomatic of our society’s relationship with animals. 

From my limited understanding of law, the legal and animal rights views should agree that this action is not lawful (but for different reasons).  Legally - I’m guessing here -  Cecil was the property of the Zimbabwean people.  He was a tourist draw, and arguably worth a great deal to their economy.  So, isn’t this is the destruction of a valuable asset, similar to if someone bombed a building?  And for the dentist to claim ignorance of who the lion was, isn’t this still gross negligence for which he is responsible?  Legally, I can see it as different to the public dismemberment of Mariusz the giraffe, because Mariusz was the property of the zoo in question.

Viewed from an animals rights perspective, then of course this is a horrible occurrence.  I am concerned though because I think any scapegoating is not appropriate.  There is a lot of societal anger which is strange in the context of it being something  that is happening all the time (i.e. animal deaths at the hands of humans) on a horribly large scale – but Cecil’s passing is like a celebrity death.  Animal advocates seem to be aware of this, and are fanning the outrage to put the larger framework of animal rights in the public eye.  This has meant that now the dentist himself is in possible danger. This seems to me an injustice to Cecil, and the pride that relied on him.  Animals have shown in experiments and in their actions that they are capable of forgiveness and compassion and are not interested in the concept of revenge but rather, survival -  in my mind, any action that threatens the dentist does not honor Cecil, but is really just done for people’s sake.

I am really hoping that there are consequences for this action – I hope that the dentist meets proper justice.  Cecil’s pride now has to face an uphill battle to survive his death without him to protect him, and there is already one less lion in the world.  The Zimbabwean people have lost a symbol of pride.  Prayers up for Cecil. 

Offline Stadler

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Re: The science and nature thread v. We tried this before
« Reply #442 on: July 30, 2015, 07:20:01 AM »
Exactly, and I don't need some kangaroo court to tell us whether it was legal or not.

God, is that a reprehensible position.  You realize that just makes YOU the kangaroo court.   I'll remember this the next time a cop says "well, I knew that black guy was a criminal; I didn't have to ask him or search him or follow any due process".   

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Re: The science and nature thread v. We tried this before
« Reply #443 on: July 30, 2015, 11:16:02 AM »

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Re: The science and nature thread v. We tried this before
« Reply #444 on: July 30, 2015, 12:14:19 PM »
Pervert lol

As much as I very much am against what this guy did whether it was legel or not, death threats and messing with his house is not right.  Two wrongs don't make a right. 

Offline Stadler

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Re: The science and nature thread v. We tried this before
« Reply #445 on: July 30, 2015, 12:32:51 PM »


See, I think that's lame.   I see no difference between that and painting a swastika on someone's front door.  It's hate, regardless of the source.

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Re: The science and nature thread v. We tried this before
« Reply #446 on: July 30, 2015, 12:49:24 PM »
I have no problem with leaving stuffed animals and stuff. The signs, especially the hateful ones, are completely unnecessary. If his practice ever sent out advertisements via emailing lists or snail mail, I certainly don't have a problem with it  :lol

Offline rumborak

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Re: The science and nature thread v. We tried this before
« Reply #447 on: July 30, 2015, 01:32:40 PM »
Exactly, and I don't need some kangaroo court to tell us whether it was legal or not.

God, is that a reprehensible position.  You realize that just makes YOU the kangaroo court.   I'll remember this the next time a cop says "well, I knew that black guy was a criminal; I didn't have to ask him or search him or follow any due process".

What? Dude, there is simply no question that he killed that lion, he has fucking pictures of it with him in it. He has a history of fines for illegally killing other animals. I feel no reason to go all "in dubio pro reo" on this guy.

And you seriously want to rest your moral judgment on a country's court system that allows child army brigades?
It strikes me you're dug your heels in so far at this point that your stance makes little sense at this point.
« Last Edit: July 30, 2015, 01:39:23 PM by rumborak »
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Offline Stadler

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Re: The science and nature thread v. We tried this before
« Reply #448 on: July 30, 2015, 03:37:08 PM »
Exactly, and I don't need some kangaroo court to tell us whether it was legal or not.

God, is that a reprehensible position.  You realize that just makes YOU the kangaroo court.   I'll remember this the next time a cop says "well, I knew that black guy was a criminal; I didn't have to ask him or search him or follow any due process".

What? Dude, there is simply no question that he killed that lion, he has fucking pictures of it with him in it. He has a history of fines for illegally killing other animals. I feel no reason to go all "in dubio pro reo" on this guy.

And you seriously want to rest your moral judgment on a country's court system that allows child army brigades?
It strikes me you're dug your heels in so far at this point that your stance makes little sense at this point.

It makes no sense because you don't agree with it.  I'm not "dug in", I'm consistent.  Allowing any reaction on moral (or legal grounds) means you allow it in all cases where someone has the same moral (or legal) reaction.   You have moral qualms with the killing of lions.  I don't, in certain circumstances.  Whether the guy is lying or not is a fair question, and I am not making a judgement on that (if I had to guess, I'd opt for "lie", but that is an unsubstantiated opinion).   

What I object to is the notion that "well, since I - and a couple other people - agree this is bad, then all bets are off, we can do what we want".  That's the attitude that only works when you have numbers.  There was a time when "a couple people" thought being black or being Jewish justified the kind of reaction you're defending.  We as a western society are striving for better.  That's why we have courts to decide these things, not martial law or street justice.   Personally, I think that kind of game hunting is immoral, so I don't do it.  Same with abortion.  But I would defend with every legal skill I have to let another person have an abortion if that's the decision she reaches, because that's how a democracy, a free society works.   "A strong democracy is how it deals with the most unsavory of ideas". 

Let's say some child pornographer spoofs your IP address and starts sending out pictures of pre-pubescent boys and girls getting buggered, and the FBI releases your name as being "under investigation".  You may or may not have ACTUALLY done anything wrong, but you are accused.  Are you ready to have that kind of assault on you, your family, and your reputation until you've had a chance to prove your case?  (I'm using a recent news thing on a director of the US TV show "Law and Order" whose IP address was found as a source for child porn). 

Offline BlobVanDam

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Re: The science and nature thread v. We tried this before
« Reply #449 on: July 30, 2015, 09:07:13 PM »
I agree with Stadler's basic point here. I don't support what this guy did regardless of the circumstances, but I disagree more strongly with the public reaction. Stupid internet social media mob mentality blowing things out of proportion, badgering and attacking anyone you disagree with while claiming to be open and understanding, jumping on the latest bandwagon.

This is generally speaking. I'm not defending the guy one bit, but it's a dark path with too much potential for wrong.

And also I think this should have its own thread at this point, because I think it's getting way off what this thread should be about.
« Last Edit: July 30, 2015, 09:15:54 PM by BlobVanDam »
Only King could mis-spell a LETTER.
Yep. I think the only party in the MP/DT situation that hasn't moved on is DTF.

Offline rumborak

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Re: The science and nature thread v. We tried this before
« Reply #450 on: July 30, 2015, 09:35:01 PM »
BTW, I am not a big fan of people posting those things in front of his practice either. And I absolutely abhor any kind of threats of violence. What I *do* think is fair game is to vent your disgust on a site that is meant for rating a public place like his dentist office. This is nothing like mobs bullying gay people, who have done nothing wrong to anybody. This man is killing endangered animals across the world.
I think asking the general public to somehow not react to his behavior, under some fake idea of "well, maybe some aliens abducted him while some imposter killed those animals; we'll have to wait until the Zimbabwean courts decide on it" is ludicrous.
"I liked when Myung looked like a women's figure skating champion."

Offline BlobVanDam

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Re: The science and nature thread v. We tried this before
« Reply #451 on: July 30, 2015, 09:43:20 PM »
It's not about not reacting, it's about what outlet they use. Spreading it on the internet, generally discussing it, or rating on a website is one thing (although I have mixed feelings about that one), but harassing the guy in real life with death threats and signs and generally ruining someone's life is going too far.
Only King could mis-spell a LETTER.
Yep. I think the only party in the MP/DT situation that hasn't moved on is DTF.

Offline yorost

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Re: The science and nature thread v. We tried this before
« Reply #452 on: July 30, 2015, 09:45:16 PM »
And also I think this should have its own thread at this point, because I think it's getting way off what this thread should be about.
Please make it stop! :lol

Offline rumborak

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Re: The science and nature thread v. We tried this before
« Reply #453 on: July 30, 2015, 09:46:13 PM »
It's not about not reacting, it's about what outlet they use. Spreading it on the internet, generally discussing it, or rating on a website is one thing (although I have mixed feelings about that one), but harassing the guy in real life with death threats and signs and generally ruining someone's life is going too far.

I think, with maybe the exception of TioJorge, everybody agrees with that.

Overall, as long as it stays peaceful, an outrage to this abhorrent practice is IMHO a good thing. To me this is like the anti-fur movement in the 80s.
"I liked when Myung looked like a women's figure skating champion."

Offline BlobVanDam

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Re: The science and nature thread v. We tried this before
« Reply #454 on: July 30, 2015, 10:10:39 PM »
It's not about not reacting, it's about what outlet they use. Spreading it on the internet, generally discussing it, or rating on a website is one thing (although I have mixed feelings about that one), but harassing the guy in real life with death threats and signs and generally ruining someone's life is going too far.

I think, with maybe the exception of TioJorge, everybody agrees with that.

Overall, as long as it stays peaceful, an outrage to this abhorrent practice is IMHO a good thing. To me this is like the anti-fur movement in the 80s.

I'm all for peaceful outrage, and spreading awareness, and him getting the deserved punishment for it, it's the part where people are getting personal and ruining this guy's life where I object to it. He's still a human being, despite being a crappy one, and he's far from the only one in the world.

And the guy is a sack of crap, that's not even being questioned by me, but I don't the idea of social media mob rules. As Stadler said, in other cases what if someone was wrongly accused, or people didn't have all the details, and people took it upon themselves to do this to someone relatively innocent (innocent enough to not have their life ruined at least)? The public shouldn't be the jury who decides this on a case by case basis, and while each person may feel they're being fair individually, the cumulative effect of all of these people can be way out of proportion to the crime and is hard to regulate. Social media can obviously be used for good here, but it's also being used for bad.

I get Stadler's point. The problem isn't so much about this case specifically, it's about where this kind of public behaviour is leading society.
Only King could mis-spell a LETTER.
Yep. I think the only party in the MP/DT situation that hasn't moved on is DTF.