Star Trek: The Next Threaderation

[hefdaddy42]

Klingon Warnog Beer is coming

[BlobVanDam]

The Facebook page has been pimping this, and it looks so lame. Come on, at least make it blood wine! This beer would be beneath a Klingon, except maybe Worf. It's just a cheap cash-in.

[hefdaddy42]

Yes, of course it is.

[The King in Crimson]

Prune juice or GTFO.

[ddtonfire]

Prune juice or GTFO.

A warrior's drink.

[ddtonfire]

About 2/3 through my TNG watch-through. I'll be tackling DS9 and Voyager next.

Just began a favorite episode of mine:

[Kotowboy]

I think TNG holds up really well for a sci-fi show that started in the latter half of the 80s.

The first season shows it's age the most with its synthy score and camera work but season 2 onwards improves dramatically.

Plus in Season one - you can tell nobody was really trying. It was only when the show improved in Season 2 they all started acting a bit better

[ddtonfire]

I'd say your insight is pretty spot-on! Agree here.

[El Barto]

Wait a minute, they were actually trying to act?

[Kotowboy]

Here comes the " none of TNG could act " line.

[El Barto]

Nah, my criticism of TNG is that they're all awful characters. Bad acting is a hallmark of all of the ST series, and my favorite of them (DS9) probably has the worst acting of all. It just rarely makes any difference since they invent their characters anyway.

[Kotowboy]

I'd say TNG had the best acting overall.

Stewart. Frakes. Burton. The best 3 in my book

Then Spiner and Dorn but only playing their primary characters.

But that's been discussed already.

And I'd take Wes Crusher over Jake Sisko any day.

[El Barto]

Wes was more a victim of Roddenberry's horrible vision of the future than anything else. The problem with all of them was that they were supposed to be flawless paragons of humanity, which had the effect of making them completely inhuman. If Wesley had ever acted like an obnoxious teenager it might have been better, but in GR's world where nobody is allowed to have faults and tension isn't allowed he was just whiny and boring. Calling Beverly a cow just once probably would have made him a perfectly decent character.

Anyhoo, my point here was that the reason the second season was better wasn't because they started trying, but because they had properly formed their characters. You spend the first season putting together who you're playing, take a nice long vacation, and then when you get back it's to an already established persona of your own making.

[Kotowboy]

The production was different too. The ship was lit differently. The 80s synthesiser score was out and - yes - everyone seemed more into it.

[The King in Crimson]

The production was different too. The ship was lit differently. The 80s synthesiser score was out and - yes - everyone seemed more into it.

The improvements in the writing helped a bit too.

[Kotowboy]

Speaking of lighting - I  the cinematography in Generations.

[BlobVanDam]

Speaking of lighting - I  the cinematography in Generations.

Those Enterprise D interiors never looked better. The warm exterior lighting looked much nicer than the cold interior lighting they usually had to use.

[Orbert]

Had to use?

[BlobVanDam]

I just meant with the limitations of pumping out a TV show, as opposed to a movie where they could take the time to light it awesomely.

[Kotowboy]

Also they added new terminals along the side of the bridge which I didn't notice for a while.

Generations feels like a warm film to me. The Enterprise lighting - The firey Nexus. Veridian III.

And First Contact feels really cold for some reason. 

[BlobVanDam]

First Contact has the ship largely taken over by the Borg, plus a bleak Earth ravaged by war. I think that's probably why it was colder.
Generations had a lot of scenes with the Enterprise parked next to a star, then a lot of scenes on a hot desert planet. Makes sense that it seemed warm!

[Kotowboy]

Warm lighting. Also warm story wise. There's a lot of emotion in Generations. FC is mostly just Die Hard in space.

[Kotowboy]

I obviously am not saying that I think Frakes isn't a good director because he clearly is - but his two trek films are my two least favourite TNG movies.

I know everyone puts FC up there with Khan and Country ( ) - but I find it quite boring actually.

[BlobVanDam]

I definitely put FC up there with TWOK, and above TUC. It's easily my 2nd or 3rd favourite Trek movie. And anything is better than Nemesis. At the very least Frakes could have done better than that.

[King Postwhore]

You are in the minority Kotowboy sir!   BBC America has been playing a ton of TNG so I got to see on of my favorite episodes, "Déjà Q.

[Kotowboy]

TOS Movies:
 Khan > Country > Voyage > Motion > Spock > Frontier

TNG Movies:

Gen > FC > Nemesis > Insurrection. [ Despite finding FC a bit boring compared to Gen - I do prefer it to Nemesis sorry Jammindude. ]

JJ Movies:

2009 = Into Darkness. I still can't decide which I like more.

[BlobVanDam]

I'll play along.

TOS:
TWOK > TVH > TUC > TFF = TSFS > TMP

TNG:
FC > Gen > (or maybe =) Insurrection > Nemesis

JJ:
2009 > ID

[Kotowboy]

You think that The Motion Picture is worse than Final Frontier ?

[BlobVanDam]

You think that The Motion Picture is worse than Final Frontier ?

I think that TFF is so bad that it's awesome. To me it most closely captures the spirit of TOS, and I find it highly enjoyable for the camp value.
TMP isn't terrible, but it's just so damn boring. Overly drawn out with nothing happening for the most part, with little redeeming value.

[Kotowboy]

i don't actually find TMP boring at all.


I find Insurrection more boring than TMP in all honesty.

[BlobVanDam]

I find Insurrection much more enjoyable. Some really nice character moments, and things actually happen.

If TMP isn't boring, I honestly don't know what is. That wormhole scene actually manages to slow down time to a crawl to the point where I want the pain to end. It would have worked as an episode, but it failed as a movie.

[Orbert]

I just meant with the limitations of pumping out a TV show, as opposed to a movie where they could take the time to light it awesomely.

Ah, got it.  I thought maybe it was because of the limitations of the cheap videotape they used or something like that.

I think that TFF is so bad that it's awesome. To me it most closely captures the spirit of TOS, and I find it highly enjoyable for the camp value.

Yes!  It's actually one of my favorites, because it's fun (and also because I don't really think it's that bad).

[El Barto]

Recently watched the first two episodes of DS9-7. While I agree Ezri was a lousy character, she actually started off really interestingly. When she was a ditzy, dumb kid who couldn't figure out what the hell was going on she was a perfectly good character. I think they developed her too fast so that she became one of the gang too quickly, and she just wasn't very interesting as part of the core group. They should have kept her clueless for a while, as the idea of a girl who never wanted to be joined and had no preparation whatsoever for it is a damn fined idea.

[BlobVanDam]

I just meant with the limitations of pumping out a TV show, as opposed to a movie where they could take the time to light it awesomely.

Ah, got it.  I thought maybe it was because of the limitations of the cheap videotape they used or something like that.

It was all shot on 35mm film, so that shouldn't have been a problem even after being converted to tape. But obviously the whole process was never going to look as good as a movie that was edited on film too, so maybe that was a factor too.
If you compare the old DVD versions of TNG (which are from the tapes) to the remastered TNG rescanned from film, there's a huge difference.

I think that TFF is so bad that it's awesome. To me it most closely captures the spirit of TOS, and I find it highly enjoyable for the camp value.

Yes!  It's actually one of my favorites, because it's fun (and also because I don't really think it's that bad).

Well that makes a whole two of us then. Glad to be in good company at least.

[Orbert]