Author Topic: Star Trek: The Next Threaderation  (Read 143957 times)

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Offline Kotowboy

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Threaderation
« Reply #175 on: August 08, 2013, 09:12:15 AM »
*deep breath* :lol

I grant you that they had a lot more bluster than Star Trek had in the past but if they intended to bring Star Trek up to date and reach a new audience

then they achieved that with flying colours.

As I said before - as long as they don't turn into sunglasses wearing heroes in capes firing two phasers in slow motion and walking away from explosions

and saying a cheesy quip after every action sequence then it's all good :lol

Offline Bolsters

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Threaderation
« Reply #176 on: August 08, 2013, 09:21:45 AM »
I just think there's a lot more going on thematically and plot wise in the last two films that your usual gung-ho action film.
Well, maybe I was a bit harsh. But I do think there was too much emphasis on the big action sequences. They could have done with a bit less reliance on that and more of what I mentioned, I thought.

Offline Kotowboy

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Threaderation
« Reply #177 on: August 08, 2013, 06:26:27 PM »
Another thing I noticed is that when they're in the observation lounge - every character has to have a line - even if it's to state the bloody obvious.


Offline ZirconBlue

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Threaderation
« Reply #178 on: August 09, 2013, 08:23:48 AM »


I laughed harder than I should've at that.

As for where I'd like to be, I'd say DS9 for all the same reasons Rumby mentioned.  As for deep cleaning, I'm sure the holodeck can just use the transporter technology to get everything inside the room, and just dump it into space.  Of course, that would get the galactic environmentalists after the Federation.

Can you imagine some alien race comes to a large nebula they've never seen before, and it just turns out it's the Federation's dumping ground for space-smile?


I don't think it gets beamed into space.  More likely it gets sent back to the replicators.

Offline BlobVanDam

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Threaderation
« Reply #179 on: August 09, 2013, 08:25:33 AM »


I laughed harder than I should've at that.

As for where I'd like to be, I'd say DS9 for all the same reasons Rumby mentioned.  As for deep cleaning, I'm sure the holodeck can just use the transporter technology to get everything inside the room, and just dump it into space.  Of course, that would get the galactic environmentalists after the Federation.

Can you imagine some alien race comes to a large nebula they've never seen before, and it just turns out it's the Federation's dumping ground for space-smile?


I don't think it gets beamed into space.  More likely it gets sent back to the replicators.

It's reassuring to know that recycling in the future consists of pumping every bodily fluid and solid back into making food.
Only King could mis-spell a LETTER.
Yep. I think the only party in the MP/DT situation that hasn't moved on is DTF.

Offline Kotowboy

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Threaderation
« Reply #180 on: August 09, 2013, 08:39:06 AM »
It gets pumped into making people so why not food ? :neverusethis:

It probably just gets obliterated. Like - broken down into neurons or whatever. Like a flash clean or something.



I want to know what sonic shower is. It doesn't look like they use water - that sounds crap to me. Not much nicer things in life than a good hot shower.

Offline BlobVanDam

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Threaderation
« Reply #181 on: August 09, 2013, 08:41:20 AM »
It gets pumped into making people so why not food ? :neverusethis:

I have so many responses to that, but I'm just going to sit content that you made a joke involving semen.
Only King could mis-spell a LETTER.
Yep. I think the only party in the MP/DT situation that hasn't moved on is DTF.

Offline Kotowboy

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Threaderation
« Reply #182 on: August 09, 2013, 08:41:49 AM »
I have so many responses to that, but I'm just going to sit content that you made a joke involving semen.

It's as close as you'll get :lol

Offline BlobVanDam

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Threaderation
« Reply #183 on: August 09, 2013, 08:44:06 AM »
I always took a sonic shower as just trying to make it sound more science fictiony. I don't recall seeing any attempted explanation as to how it works. Much like how "gigaquads" was their vague measurement of computer data storage so they didn't get laughed at in 20 years for choosing something small.
Only King could mis-spell a LETTER.
Yep. I think the only party in the MP/DT situation that hasn't moved on is DTF.

Offline Kotowboy

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Threaderation
« Reply #184 on: August 09, 2013, 08:45:14 AM »
I always took a sonic shower as just trying to make it sound more science fictiony. I don't recall seeing any attempted explanation as to how it works. Much like how "gigaquads" was their vague measurement of computer data storage so they didn't get laughed at in 20 years for choosing something small.

:lol I love thinking back to my first ever computer - which was an Acorn Electron and I think it has a 52kb memory or something riduculously small by today's standards.


Edit : 32kb ! https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Acorn_Electron

Offline BlobVanDam

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Threaderation
« Reply #185 on: August 09, 2013, 08:51:32 AM »
I always took a sonic shower as just trying to make it sound more science fictiony. I don't recall seeing any attempted explanation as to how it works. Much like how "gigaquads" was their vague measurement of computer data storage so they didn't get laughed at in 20 years for choosing something small.

:lol I love thinking back to my first ever computer - which was an Acorn Electron and I think it has a 52kb memory or something riduculously small by today's standards.


Edit : 32kb ! https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Acorn_Electron

In the movie Short Circuit 2, the robot announces how it has 500 megabytes of memory. Might impressive for 1988, but for 2013, not so much. :lol
Maybe Star Trek was smart enough to realize that Moore's Law would make fools out of them, so they just went with a fictional measurement system. I figure that a "quad" is a new type of computer storage method altogether in the future, maybe not even base 2, and not using standard bytes.
Only King could mis-spell a LETTER.
Yep. I think the only party in the MP/DT situation that hasn't moved on is DTF.

Offline Kotowboy

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Threaderation
« Reply #186 on: August 09, 2013, 08:55:57 AM »
It's the same as Sci-fi..

If you're gonna make a film in the future - either don't put a date on it OR make it so far in the future that it won't matter.

It's when films put " in 2019 AD " and it's all flying cars etc. Just don't do it. 

It's 2015 in 18 months and we're still no closer to flying cars or hoverboards.


Sci fi films should just say " In the distant future.. . "




* Maybe by the 24th century in TNG land - they have virtual storage too. Not like banks of hard drives.

Offline BlobVanDam

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Threaderation
« Reply #187 on: August 09, 2013, 09:00:13 AM »
It's the same as Sci-fi..

If you're gonna make a film in the future - either don't put a date on it OR make it so far in the future that it won't matter.

It's when films put " in 2019 AD " and it's all flying cars etc. Just don't do it. 

It's 2015 in 18 months and we're still no closer to flying cars or hoverboards.


Sci fi films should just say " In the distant future.. . "

I actually prefer it when there is a year, because I think it gives some reality to the situation, like they've made an attempt to extrapolate from the current day to the future, and given it more thought. Obviously, the other side of it is that extrapolating the future is very difficult to do, so it's always going to be incorrect in ways they couldn't predict.

In the case of BTTF2, they actually intentionally took it a bit further into the future (as they apparently also took 1955 a little further back to exaggerate the culture clash), and had some fun with it, rather than trying to accurately predict the future. A lot of it was tongue in cheek commentary on the present day, as much as it was a future setting.

That's my favourite movie scene and set of all time, btw. :tup
Only King could mis-spell a LETTER.
Yep. I think the only party in the MP/DT situation that hasn't moved on is DTF.

Offline Kotowboy

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Threaderation
« Reply #188 on: August 09, 2013, 09:06:09 AM »
I do like how future Hill Valley is basically the same as 1985 - just a bit shitter and as ever - technology just doesn't work a lot of the time.


Bob Zemeckis did say he didnt want the typical future of gleaming white buildings everywhere.

Pretty sure I saw an article on BTTF2 where they pointed out some things in 2015 that we have now that we didn't when they made the film.

Offline BlobVanDam

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Threaderation
« Reply #189 on: August 09, 2013, 09:08:18 AM »
Do we have a BTTF thread? I'd really like to continue this line of thought, but I don't want to get too far off topic here. :lol
Only King could mis-spell a LETTER.
Yep. I think the only party in the MP/DT situation that hasn't moved on is DTF.

Offline Kotowboy

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Offline rumborak

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Threaderation
« Reply #191 on: August 09, 2013, 07:06:23 PM »
Got TWOK on right now. It's amazing, the acting difference between "This is Ceti Alpha Five!!' And "Khaaan!!".
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Offline Kotowboy

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Threaderation
« Reply #192 on: August 10, 2013, 07:34:54 AM »
I always thought Khaaaaaaan! was Kirk pretending so that Khan thought he had won - when in reality - The Enterprise was waiting to beam them all up.


Slightly new Discussion !

Didn't wanna start a new thread....

Funniest lines in Star Trek.

I laughed my arse off when Riker and Picard were teasing Wesley about Beverly going away for a year . .

" Who's going to tuck you into bed now , Wesley ? "

Worf : " *sigh* I believe I will sir. "

 :lol :rollin

Offline Orbert

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Threaderation
« Reply #193 on: August 10, 2013, 07:40:00 AM »
I always thought Khaaaaaaan! was Kirk pretending so that Khan thought he had won - when in reality - The Enterprise was waiting to beam them all up.

We find that out later.  At the time, it's hard to say whether it's Kirk pretending to be all mad, or William Shatner overacting as usual.

Online El Barto

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Threaderation
« Reply #194 on: August 10, 2013, 12:13:39 PM »
JJ didn't kill Star Trek, he just made it popular by making it not really Star Trek. I'll take Voyager over JJ's empty Big Mac of a movie franchise any day. Enterprise was the series that wore out the franchise and killed it off, and they didn't even really want to make that, the networks wanted that.
I certainly agree about Voyager topping the Abram's fair. I don't think Enterprise killed the franchise as much as just plain old saturation. Enterprise certainly could have been much, much better, but a pretty good hiatus between Voyager, which was already not sitting well with the diehards, would have certainly helped their cause. For that matter, I think Voyager's biggest issue might have been being the follow up to the immensely popular DS9. It's not a bad show at all. People just got hooked on the greatly inferior TNG and the greatly superior DS9. Voyager just slipped in there and didn't click.
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Offline Kotowboy

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Threaderation
« Reply #195 on: August 10, 2013, 12:57:41 PM »
TNG inferior to Voyager. . . O_o



 :rollin :rollin :rollin

Offline JayOctavarium

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Threaderation
« Reply #196 on: August 10, 2013, 12:58:27 PM »
I'd suck on that pipe ^
I just don't understand what they were trying to achieve with any part of the song, either individually or as a whole. You know what? It's the Platypus of Dream Theater songs. That bill doesn't go with that tail, or that strange little furry body, or those webbed feet, and oh god why does it have venomous spurs!? And then you find out it lays eggs too. The difference is that the Platypus is somehow functional despite being a crazy mishmash or leftover animal pieces

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Offline Laich21DT

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Threaderation
« Reply #197 on: August 10, 2013, 01:00:46 PM »
People just got hooked on the greatly inferior TNG
Wait, what?
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Offline Kotowboy

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Threaderation
« Reply #198 on: August 10, 2013, 01:00:58 PM »
Voyager has weak plots - terrible wooden acting and really unimaginative characters and situations considering they were in the Delta Quadrant.

Plus it has some of the worst episodes of Trek EVER

Offline JayOctavarium

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Threaderation
« Reply #199 on: August 10, 2013, 01:19:08 PM »
Your acting is terribly wooden


 :yeahright
I just don't understand what they were trying to achieve with any part of the song, either individually or as a whole. You know what? It's the Platypus of Dream Theater songs. That bill doesn't go with that tail, or that strange little furry body, or those webbed feet, and oh god why does it have venomous spurs!? And then you find out it lays eggs too. The difference is that the Platypus is somehow functional despite being a crazy mishmash or leftover animal pieces

-BlobVanDam on "Scarred"

Offline The King in Crimson

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Threaderation
« Reply #200 on: August 10, 2013, 01:37:53 PM »
JJ didn't kill Star Trek, he just made it popular by making it not really Star Trek. I'll take Voyager over JJ's empty Big Mac of a movie franchise any day. Enterprise was the series that wore out the franchise and killed it off, and they didn't even really want to make that, the networks wanted that.
I certainly agree about Voyager topping the Abram's fair. I don't think Enterprise killed the franchise as much as just plain old saturation. Enterprise certainly could have been much, much better, but a pretty good hiatus between Voyager, which was already not sitting well with the diehards, would have certainly helped their cause. For that matter, I think Voyager's biggest issue might have been being the follow up to the immensely popular DS9. It's not a bad show at all. People just got hooked on the greatly inferior TNG and the greatly superior DS9. Voyager just slipped in there and didn't click.
Greatly inferior? Yeah okay.

I'll play devil's advocate here and just say that TNG and Voyager are more like brother and sister with their highly variable quality issues and similarly episodic content. When you really get down to it, there aren't that many differences between the shows aside from the fact that, despite opening with one season of irredeemable shit, TNG has some episodes that are true classics, the kind that stand up to the test of time and are still good today. Does Voyager? I like some Voyager but I can't think of any episodes that could qualify as 'classics.'

TNG does get kind of a free pass for successfully bringing Trek back to television, but at its best, it was much better than the best of Voyager.

Offline Kotowboy

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Threaderation
« Reply #201 on: August 10, 2013, 02:37:16 PM »
Pretty sure i've watched all the best ( i.e. non-Troi centric ) episodes of TNG.

Started DS9 now :)

Offline rumborak

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Threaderation
« Reply #202 on: August 10, 2013, 04:04:56 PM »
Voyager really struggled to find enemies anyone cared  about. In the end they resorted to pull in the only pre-Voyager enemy they could get away with, the Borg. It saved the series for sure, but it's a bit sad the series couldn't stand on its own.
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Offline Orbert

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Threaderation
« Reply #203 on: August 10, 2013, 04:57:48 PM »
It is sad.  I thought the whole idea was that they'd be encountering new stuff, stuff completely unlike anything we'd ever seen before, since they were on the other side of the galaxy.  Exploring the unknown again.

We got a few semi-interesting things, a lot of dumb things, and The Borg: The Next Generation.

Offline The King in Crimson

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Threaderation
« Reply #204 on: August 10, 2013, 05:18:54 PM »
The Hirogen were kinda the standouts, I thought, with the organ-stealer aliens running in second (can't recall their name atm). Neat concept, too bad they weren't utilized enough.

The Kazon were actually not that bad, more mediocre really. Not developed enough or menacing enough to make it as a primary antagonist, but I think with a bit more work and in smaller doses they could've been effective. They certainly weren't 'Ferengi with energy whips' bad like some make them out to be. :)

Offline Orbert

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Threaderation
« Reply #205 on: August 10, 2013, 05:26:22 PM »
I guess I'm still too old-fashioned about some things.  I just don't understand why every show has to have a recurring bad guy and/or a continuing story arc.  There seem to no longer be any truly episodic television shows, where each episode tells a self-contained story, and it's good because we already know the characters and thus they don't have spend a lot of time dealing with that.  Yes, there are a couple of standalone episodes here and there, then it's time to return to the "main" bad guy, or have another episode which advances, sometimes only slightly, the ongoing story arc.

Is this because television has evolved and become more sophisticated?  Or simply because some people like to think so?

Online El Barto

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Threaderation
« Reply #206 on: August 10, 2013, 07:10:09 PM »
I'll play devil's advocate here and just say that TNG and Voyager are more like brother and sister with their highly variable quality issues and similarly episodic content. When you really get down to it, there aren't that many differences between the shows aside from the fact that, despite opening with one season of irredeemable shit, TNG has some episodes that are true classics, the kind that stand up to the test of time and are still good today. Does Voyager? I like some Voyager but I can't think of any episodes that could qualify as 'classics.'

TNG does get kind of a free pass for successfully bringing Trek back to television, but at its best, it was much better than the best of Voyager.
The best of TNG was better than the best of Voyager. On average, Voyager was the better show. As I've stated numerous times before, the distinction is the horribly uninteresting and inhuman Roddenberry idealizations of people. Once he croaked and we got real characters, the shows improved, even if the stories weren't always as good.


edit: damn, and after defending Voyager, I just watched one stinker of an episode. Projections, where the Dr. can't tell what's real and what's holographic. It started out pretty good with a crisis situation, and tanked into a an endless string of mindfucks featuring one of TNG's worst creations, Barkley. Yeesh.
« Last Edit: August 10, 2013, 09:51:01 PM by El Barto »
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Offline The King in Crimson

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Threaderation
« Reply #207 on: August 10, 2013, 09:59:06 PM »
I guess I'm still too old-fashioned about some things.  I just don't understand why every show has to have a recurring bad guy and/or a continuing story arc.  There seem to no longer be any truly episodic television shows, where each episode tells a self-contained story, and it's good because we already know the characters and thus they don't have spend a lot of time dealing with that.  Yes, there are a couple of standalone episodes here and there, then it's time to return to the "main" bad guy, or have another episode which advances, sometimes only slightly, the ongoing story arc.

Is this because television has evolved and become more sophisticated?  Or simply because some people like to think so?
Episodic television still exists, the difference is it doesn't dominate like it used to.  Which is good, IMO.  It's nice to have a bit of variety now and again. :)

I'll play devil's advocate here and just say that TNG and Voyager are more like brother and sister with their highly variable quality issues and similarly episodic content. When you really get down to it, there aren't that many differences between the shows aside from the fact that, despite opening with one season of irredeemable shit, TNG has some episodes that are true classics, the kind that stand up to the test of time and are still good today. Does Voyager? I like some Voyager but I can't think of any episodes that could qualify as 'classics.'

TNG does get kind of a free pass for successfully bringing Trek back to television, but at its best, it was much better than the best of Voyager.
The best of TNG was better than the best of Voyager. On average, Voyager was the better show. As I've stated numerous times before, the distinction is the horribly uninteresting and inhuman Roddenberry idealizations of people. Once he croaked and we got real characters, the shows improved, even if the stories weren't always as good.
Except Voyager didn't really have interesting characters to balance that out except for maybe Tuvok, the Doctor, Seven and (depending upon the day of the week) Janeway. Torres was alright too, I guess, but Chakotay, Kim and Paris were incredibly boring and wasted potential. When you think about it, that's about the same amount of boring to not boring that TNG had.

Offline rumborak

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Threaderation
« Reply #208 on: August 10, 2013, 10:43:19 PM »
I never liked Torres. I also never bought for a moment that Paris was in love with her, if only for the fact that her half being Klingon made her be PMS in overdrive. I don't know, where they could have portrayed a woman successfully merging her strong and her sensitive side, all one ever got was a bitchy Torres. One of the best episodes was actually the one where she was split in half. Suddenly one had two coherent characters.
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Offline BlobVanDam

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Re: Star Trek: The Next Threaderation
« Reply #209 on: August 11, 2013, 12:32:30 AM »
Voyager had plenty of good bad guys of the week, and recurring bad guys didn't make a lot of sense anyway, aside from maybe the Borg, being as dominant as they were.

The Kazon were the most awful bad guys in Trek history, but they ditched them really quickly by the start of the 3rd season, and incidentally, the show instantly improved dramatically. Then it improved further once they got 7 of 9 and switched to full CG spaceships and battles. I think the show had a lot of the best action scenes in all of Trek because they were able to use CG.

Overall I think their one off aliens were as good as any of the other Trek series, as they had to rely more on them due to not being able to return to the familiar ones all too often. And when they did, they ended up being horribly contrived, like the random Klingon tribe, or the Ferengis who happened to get stranded along their path, or anything involving Troi and Barclay. I would have preferred they have no contact with Earth at all until the finale, then see the shock as they arrive, instead of the deflated ending we got.



Kind of a random tangent, but there was a funny line in the most recent episode of NTSF:SD:SUV. One of the main characters is played by Kate Mulgrew, aka. Captain Janeway. They were investigating an alien, and she says "Aliens don't exist. They were made up by Gene Roddenberry so indoor kids could have something to live for." :rollin
Only King could mis-spell a LETTER.
Yep. I think the only party in the MP/DT situation that hasn't moved on is DTF.