Star Trek: The Next Threaderation

[BlobVanDam]

I'm a completionist, so I keep every episode, and I watched TATV through once when I first watched the entire series. I have to see everything at least once, and at the very least I was curious to know if it was as bad as everyone said, and it sadly was.

But it's better with the Troi/Riker thing included, because at least then you can reasonably dismiss the entire piece of crap as a bad holodeck recreation based on faulty information. : Even without the TNG wrapper, the episode stinks anyway. It's no loss to just skip it.

Terra Prime makes for a better finale too, and it ended with some good emotional scenes, especially by Phlox.

[rumborak]

The one I almost completely skipped was the "everything sucks on Earth" episode, where Phlox is bothered by racism etc. It's like, they couldn't rest a single second on the Xindi achievement.

[rumborak]

But yeah, I agree, too many forced throwbacks. Especially the Tellarites and the Orions, both of whom, let's be honest, were just plain TOS "alien of the week" nonsense.
I was about the post the sentence "at least they left the Gorn in TOS", but then I realized, that's actually the biggest shit show

[BlobVanDam]

"biggest shit show"? What do you mean?

The Gorn does appear in ENT S4, and it's all CG. Joy!

[El Barto]

But yeah, I agree, too many forced throwbacks. Especially the Tellarites and the Orions, both of whom, let's be honest, were just plain TOS "alien of the week" nonsense.
I was about the post the sentence "at least they left the Gorn in TOS", but then I realized, that's actually the biggest shit show

¿Que?

[BlobVanDam]

If he's dissing Arena, I'm going to fashion a rudimentary cannon out of whatever I have lying around, and take him out.

[El Barto]

I'd dis the Gorn, but Arena was a good episode. Good commercial, though.

[rumborak]

I'm not dissing the original TOS Gorn episode, that one is a classic. I'm talking about the CGI Gorns in ENT. The episode hasn't come up yet, but I remember that they just totally ruined them.

And yeah, I love that ad

[El Barto]

Oh, I thought you were watching ENT for the first time.

[rumborak]

So, last episode of ENT. Man, the whole thing is supposed to play during the Pegasus, but Riker and Troi look like they partied for a whole week

[BlobVanDam]

Yeah, that wasn't believable for a start.
Besides that, what did you think of that one?

[rumborak]

It's an unfortunate episode for sure. I mean, you can tell what they were trying to do, both make it a sendoff to *all* of Star Trek, and at the same time show the beginning of the Federation.
It's just that, it all came together the wrong way. For example, because everything is in the holodeck, and not time-synchronous either, you just never get invested in the fact that we're witnessing the birth of the Federation.
And Tripp's death was just so shoehorned in and unnecessary.
I read a review of the episode somewhere, and the reviewer also made the good point that it's really weird how the whole crew apparently went into total stasis for 6 years, with no personal or professional growth. Especially Tripp and T'Pol who had a child together the episode before and at the end hold hands, apparently just noodled on for 6 years with nothing happening, only to think about it suddenly.
I think the episode could have been a lot more believable if they had showed the crew having grown/changed etc. Maybe some person died (like Troi in All Good Things), Tripp and T'Pol being married etc.

[Kotowboy]

I was thinking about Enterprise the other day.

The actual quality of the show aside - I was thinking about the design of the ships

Because it's a modern TV show - so it has to look futuristic compared to our time - but at the same time has to look LESS futuristic than Kirks' Enterprise from

the original TV show... Must have been interesting for the Production Designers !

[rumborak]

It's even more complicated than that, because while TOS was futuristic, it was 1960s futuristic. Take for example the huge red triangle between Sulu and Chekov. It's an item of Enterprise's future, but it also clearly is a 1960s person's idea of the future.
And don't get me started on Spock's "shine in the eyes blue light" device.

[El Barto]

It's even more complicated than that, because while TOS was futuristic, it was 1960s futuristic. Take for example the huge red triangle between Sulu and Chekov. It's an item of Enterprise's future, but it also clearly is a 1960s person's idea of the future.
And don't get me started on Spock's "shine in the eyes blue light" device.

Uh, typing too fast or did you have some weird brain-fart where you got stuck between English and Deutsch? 

Agree with both assessments, though. From a design standpoint they were in a tough way. Add to that having to stay within canon (at least when they bothered).

[El Barto]

I've decided Rocks and Shoals is probably the best episode of DS9 that isn't called The Visitor or In the Pale Moonlight. Several different plot elements all work wonderfully. Aside from the excellent Sisko/Remataklon story, you've got the ultimate slimy Vorta, the turning point with Kira the collaborator, and the Vedik hanging herself in dramatic (and very cinematic) faction. Very well written and directed, to boot.

edit: Oh, and the fact that they redshirted one of the federation crewman was a great touch.

[BlobVanDam]

It's even more complicated than that, because while TOS was futuristic, it was 1960s futuristic. Take for example the huge red triangle between Sulu and Chekov. It's an item of Enterprise's future, but it also clearly is a 1960s person's idea of the future.
And don't get me started on Spock's "shine in the eyes blue light" device.

It's kind of hard to design a ship interior that looks less high-tech than TOS era. They really did their best making the Enterprise (Reliant, same thing) interior look futuristic in In a Mirror Darkly, but no matter how you light it, those painted wooden sets just look super cheesy.

[El Barto]

Defiant, bitch!

[BlobVanDam]

My bad. I knew that. I just woke up, so my brain isn't operating at what little capacity it usually manages yet.

[El Barto]

But you're right. Brightly lacquered balsa wood doesn't really look very spacey. And the chairs were straight out of a 60's ultramodern wetdream. Yet at the same time it actually did seem more like a functional spaceship than most of the others. D's bridge looked like the break room at Google HQ, and the rest of it might as well have been the Pacific Princess. Defiant just looked cluttered with people working wherever they could find a spot. At least with Enterprise they did actually make it look functionally thought out. Similar bridge. All the decks and quarters seemed cold and metallic. The engine room looked like it was lifted from a Russian Submarine.

[rumborak]

It's even more complicated than that, because while TOS was futuristic, it was 1960s futuristic. Take for example the huge red triangle between Sulu and Chekov. It's an item of Enterprise's future, but it also clearly is a 1960s person's idea of the future.
And don't get me started on Spock's "shine in the eyes blue light" device.

Uh, typing too fast or did you have some weird brain-fart where you got stuck between English and Deutsch? 

You just have to read it the right way
I meant it in the "shine-in-the-eyes blue light" device kind of way.

[rumborak]

But yeah, ENT Enterprise was the most functional-looking bridge.
But, I also have to take exception to it at the same time, because it really only looked functional because it appealed to our current sense of functionality. Frankly, the Enterprise just looked like a US Army bridge (just like everything else in that show looked like from the US).
So, I actually would rather say DS9 did the most believable merge between futuristic design and functionality. It was the only non-ENT show where I thought "yeah, people could live like that".

[BlobVanDam]

But you're right. Brightly lacquered balsa wood doesn't really look very spacey. And the chairs were straight out of a 60's ultramodern wetdream. Yet at the same time it actually did seem more like a functional spaceship than most of the others. D's bridge looked like the break room at Google HQ, and the rest of it might as well have been the Pacific Princess. Defiant just looked cluttered with people working wherever they could find a spot. At least with Enterprise they did actually make it look functionally thought out. Similar bridge. All the decks and quarters seemed cold and metallic. The engine room looked like it was lifted from a Russian Submarine.

I won't fault TNG for that, since they were intentionally going for that look, as if space travel had gotten to the point where it basically was an ocean liner, hence the families travelling on board. I recall they even originally planned to have couches on the bridge at one point. I think it's pretty typical of '80s futuristic design. In the 1960s, just getting into space at all was futuristic enough.
You also have to keep in mind that Roddenberry had a huge boner for all things navy, which probably influenced the desire for functionality in the early designs. He wanted submarines in space.

Defiant actually had a pretty good bridge, and it's not all too different to the NX bridge, and it looked the most legit of the TNG era bridges. The whole NX had a very functional look, I guess because they had to strip it back to the bare basics to make it a plausible pre-cursor to TOS, and to separate it from the shiny plastic TNG era.

[El Barto]

I won't fault TNG for that, since they were intentionally going for that look, as if space travel had gotten to the point where it basically was an ocean liner, hence the families travelling on board. I recall they even originally planned to have couches on the bridge at one point. I think it's pretty typical of '80s futuristic design. In the 1960s, just getting into space at all was futuristic enough.
You also have to keep in mind that Roddenberry had a huge boner for all things navy, which probably influenced the desire for functionality in the early designs. He wanted submarines in space.

I can see that working if you want a Starship Bistromath sort of thing, where the ship flies itself and you have nothing to focus on other than adventure. But they had 200 years of experience to tell them that lots of important stuff happens on the bridge. If you're going to be blowing people up and overseeing the welfare of a whole shit-ton of cruise passengers, you need a bridge and not a lounge.

I wonder why they never piped Muzak throughout the ship?

[hefdaddy42]

Starship Bistromath

I know what it looks like.

[King Postwhore]

This news should make some of the old school Star Trek fans happy.

https://www.comingsoon.net/movies/news/389701-breaking-bob-orci-removed-from-star-trek-3#/slide/1

[Kotowboy]

Oh My Fucking God - Please Jesus in heaven let Edgar Wright direct it. Oh my holy fuck yes.

[King Postwhore]

I knew you'd be fapping.

[Kotowboy]

I was totally cool with Orci directing it because I wanted him to prove everyone wrong.

But if Edgar Wright gets the gig that would be a piece of fried gold.

Edgar would be perfect as he can do sci - fi as proven with World's End and action as proven with Scott Pilgrim and Comedy as with...well..everything..

And he's meticulous about plot and characters. So he'd be ideal.

If not him then JJ is probably free now since i'd imagine photography on SW7 is done.

[BlobVanDam]

Never heard of this guy, never seen any of his movies, and it seems like a really oddball choice to me, but it's not Orci, so that's still an improvement.

[Kotowboy]

Never heard of this guy, never seen any of his movies, and it seems like a really oddball choice to me, but it's not Orci, so that's still an improvement.

Edgar Wright ?! 

Shaun of The Dead
Hot Fuzz
Scott Pilgrim Vs The World
The World's End
Was going to direct Ant Man but quit.

Also directed the UK TV Show Spaced. And most of his stuff has been with Simon Pegg so you'd get a good Pegg performance !

He'd be the perfect choice.

[King Postwhore]

Blob, I've loved every movie he's done so far.

[BlobVanDam]

Never heard of this guy, never seen any of his movies, and it seems like a really oddball choice to me, but it's not Orci, so that's still an improvement.

Edgar Wright ?! 

Shaun of The Dead
Hot Fuzz
Scott Pilgrim Vs The World
The World's End
Was going to direct Ant Man but quit.

Also directed the UK TV Show Spaced. And most of his stuff has been with Simon Pegg so you'd get a good Pegg performance !

He'd be the perfect choice.

Never seen any of them, and none of them seem to relate to this style of movie at all. But I'm not pre-judging, as I've never seen his stuff. And I doubt I could like it any less than Into Darkness, so there's nowhere to go but up.

[King Postwhore]

Blob, check out Shaun Of the Dead, Hot Fuzz and The world's End.  All great comedies with fun writing.  Not Star Trek Style but you'll like them.

[BlobVanDam]

Meh, not interested. You should know I'm pretty fussy with what I watch.