Author Topic: An interesting article about bombings  (Read 1623 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline rumborak

  • DT.net Veteran
  • ****
  • Posts: 26652
An interesting article about bombings
« on: April 16, 2013, 08:41:00 PM »
https://www.cnn.com/2013/04/16/opinion/bergen-bombings/index.html?c=us

Especially interesting I thought that the majority of attempted bombings were actually from right-wing extremist groups, not Islamic groups.
"I liked when Myung looked like a women's figure skating champion."

Offline jsem

  • Posts: 4912
  • Gender: Male
Re: An interesting article about bombings
« Reply #1 on: April 17, 2013, 07:36:21 AM »
Very relevant, and it has been known for a long time.

Offline Perpetual Change

  • DTF.org Alumni
  • ****
  • Posts: 12264
Re: An interesting article about bombings
« Reply #2 on: April 17, 2013, 08:00:49 AM »
Not really surprising. There's a revolutionary, pro-“justified violence” streak that runs through American thinking. Though that kind of thinking usually is actually the polar opposite of real conservatism, it's something we've inherited all the way down from 1776.  Even though conservatism naturally adheres to tradition and is cautious toward change, in the American case that “tradition” happens to be a violent and revolutionary one. 

Liberals are more likely to question the traditional American thinking, and probably more likely to oppose American Conservatism's bias toward reactionary violence as a solution to problems, even when it comes to critiquing the nation's highly mythologized creation story. Right wingers, on the other hand, often fully accept the idea that says “in 1776, it was OK to shoot at The Man”. And you can pretty much follow the extreme, violent wing of American conservative thinking down from there, from 1776 through the Civil War and right down to the Boston earlier this week.

Not that liberal thinking is necessarily any better: it has its share of issues, too. But we're talking about the conservative nutjob gunmen here, so...
« Last Edit: April 17, 2013, 08:06:00 AM by Perpetual Change »

Online El Barto

  • Rascal Atheistic Pig
  • DTF.org Alumni
  • ****
  • Posts: 22455
  • Bad Craziness
Re: An interesting article about bombings
« Reply #3 on: April 17, 2013, 08:20:29 AM »
The overwhelming majority of attempted bombings are orchestrated by the FBI. I suspect that's the difference between the 380 people indicted and only 77 who managed to procure materials.

What surprises me about the Boston thing is that nobody seems to pick up that it happened on tax day. That's the first thing I thought of when it happened. Patriot Day, whateverthehell that is also sounds like it might be relevant. That's why I assumed right winger from the start.
Argument, the presentation of reasonable views, never makes headway against conviction, and conviction takes no part in argument because it knows.
E.F. Benson

Offline rumborak

  • DT.net Veteran
  • ****
  • Posts: 26652
Re: An interesting article about bombings
« Reply #4 on: April 17, 2013, 10:17:34 AM »
The overwhelming majority of attempted bombings are orchestrated by the FBI.

o_O?

Evidence for such a claim?
"I liked when Myung looked like a women's figure skating champion."

Online El Barto

  • Rascal Atheistic Pig
  • DTF.org Alumni
  • ****
  • Posts: 22455
  • Bad Craziness
Re: An interesting article about bombings
« Reply #5 on: April 17, 2013, 10:29:26 AM »
The overwhelming majority of attempted bombings are orchestrated by the FBI.

o_O?

Evidence for such a claim?
They're sting operations. I wasn't suggesting that they were actually trying to bomb us. Pretty much anytime you hear about a terrorist being busted in this country, it was somebody the Feds recruited and set up. Those sorry bastards in Florida were the best example, but it really applies to the majority of terror arrests here.
Argument, the presentation of reasonable views, never makes headway against conviction, and conviction takes no part in argument because it knows.
E.F. Benson

Offline Orthogonal

  • Posts: 916
  • Gender: Male
Re: An interesting article about bombings
« Reply #6 on: April 21, 2013, 07:59:36 PM »
Interestingly, the older brother was on the FBI radar from 2011 and was even brought to the US attention by Russia as a potential threat. They interviewed him and his family and apparently dropped him for some reason.

Also, isn't islamic extremist another leaf from the same branch as right-wing extremists? It seems the majority of bombings do come from the right. Although, typically, an American far right extremist will bomb a government institution, not civilians, while the islamic extremists have typically gone after civilians. Both are politically motivated, but to achieve different ends.

Offline Scheavo

  • Posts: 5444
Re: An interesting article about bombings
« Reply #7 on: April 21, 2013, 08:11:41 PM »
There really isn't a difference between targets.... American far-right extremists have gone after civilians numerous times. Oklahoma City. The Atlanta Olympics. The Unibomber. I'm sure there's more I don't know about, but those come off the top of my head.

Online gmillerdrake

  • Proud Father.....Blessed Husband
  • DTF.org Member
  • *
  • Posts: 13257
  • Gender: Male
  • 1 Timothy 2:5
Re: An interesting article about bombings
« Reply #8 on: April 21, 2013, 08:23:49 PM »
Found this site when surfing around. It has a lot of info. on it.

https://www.markhumphrys.com/left.right.violence.html

I found the section where he points out that a few of the 'right wing' nut job's from the past were far from right wing....it's just the label they get immediately.
Without Faith.....Without Hope.....There can be No Peace of Mind

Online El Barto

  • Rascal Atheistic Pig
  • DTF.org Alumni
  • ****
  • Posts: 22455
  • Bad Craziness
Re: An interesting article about bombings
« Reply #9 on: April 21, 2013, 11:53:53 PM »
There really isn't a difference between targets.... American far-right extremists have gone after civilians numerous times. Oklahoma City. The Atlanta Olympics. The Unibomber. I'm sure there's more I don't know about, but those come off the top of my head.
I don't think McVeigh considered the Murrah building to be a civilian target. I also wouldn't call Kaczinsky a far-right extremist.


Found this site when surfing around. It has a lot of info. on it.

https://www.markhumphrys.com/left.right.violence.html

I found the section where he points out that a few of the 'right wing' nut job's from the past were far from right wing....it's just the label they get immediately.
Look forward to giving that more than cursory perusal. I will say that based on my quick skim, he's missing the point about some of the bad guys. Just because you hate Bush, the war and Jews doesn't mean that you aren't still a right-winger. Looks like that's a problem with several of the guys in that section.
Argument, the presentation of reasonable views, never makes headway against conviction, and conviction takes no part in argument because it knows.
E.F. Benson

Offline Scheavo

  • Posts: 5444
Re: An interesting article about bombings
« Reply #10 on: April 22, 2013, 12:38:29 AM »
There really isn't a difference between targets.... American far-right extremists have gone after civilians numerous times. Oklahoma City. The Atlanta Olympics. The Unibomber. I'm sure there's more I don't know about, but those come off the top of my head.
I don't think McVeigh considered the Murrah building to be a civilian target. I also wouldn't call Kaczinsky a far-right extremist.


Ya, he was mostly going after a federal building, but he happened to pick one with a ton of civilians, in a highly populated civilian area. I think it's fair to say he wanted to kill some people in the process - it was supposed to be relation for Waco afterall.

And righto on Kaczinsky, got off track into just civilian targeted bombings.

Point still stands though, that Muslim extremists and other extremists don't differ in substance of their targets. It's always "the enemy," whether that's the Feds or just Americans, or whomever you conceive of as the enemy.

Offline Orthogonal

  • Posts: 916
  • Gender: Male
Re: An interesting article about bombings
« Reply #11 on: April 25, 2013, 05:37:26 PM »
The overwhelming majority of attempted bombings are orchestrated by the FBI.

o_O?

Evidence for such a claim?

I think he is referring to this.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CwTpJ1EoV6A

Online El Barto

  • Rascal Atheistic Pig
  • DTF.org Alumni
  • ****
  • Posts: 22455
  • Bad Craziness
Re: An interesting article about bombings
« Reply #12 on: April 25, 2013, 05:49:34 PM »
He didn't mention who he was referring to, but the most recent one was some kid who was boarding a flight to go fight for the free Syrians. Not sure why that's a crime.
Argument, the presentation of reasonable views, never makes headway against conviction, and conviction takes no part in argument because it knows.
E.F. Benson

Offline Super Dude

  • Hero of Prog
  • DTF.com Member
  • **
  • Posts: 16200
  • Gender: Male
    • The Nerdy Millennial
Quote from: bosk1
As frequently happens, Super Dude nailed it.
:superdude:

Offline Super Dude

  • Hero of Prog
  • DTF.com Member
  • **
  • Posts: 16200
  • Gender: Male
    • The Nerdy Millennial
Re: An interesting article about bombings
« Reply #14 on: April 28, 2013, 09:15:54 AM »
By the way, after just watching CNN's coverage this morning, I have to say that the people of Boston are dealing with this whole thing with about 150% more grace and dignity than everyone in American media, the Young Turk included.
Quote from: bosk1
As frequently happens, Super Dude nailed it.
:superdude: