Your Controversial Opinions on DT

Started by Lucidity, December 17, 2012, 07:28:25 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

0 Members and 9 Guests are viewing this topic.

FourthHorseman

Quote from: jsbru on August 19, 2013, 08:31:35 PM
Quote from: FourthHorseman on August 19, 2013, 03:01:31 PM
Yeah Yeah, and SDOIT really reminds me of Relayer!

:facepalm:

Gates of Delirium is awesome!  Topographic Oceans, on the other hand, seems to just meander aimlessly through a nebulous idea that was never fully developed.  It sounds like they didn't have a plan and just started jamming.  With SFAM, all the songs just seem to blend together as one--but not in a good way like the title track of SDOIT.  They blend together because they're all of the same narrow tone/mood/sound/whatever and there's little dynamism in this area, and there's not enough hook-based parts to give it some shape.  There has to be a balance between having a hook/riff and jamming/meandering in between.  Close to the Edge is perfect in this balance.


Okay, I see what you're getting at.

For me, SFAM has the hooks, and is very dynamic. But for some reason I find it very unlistenable.

Close to the Edge is the essence of life and nature itself put into music over 40 minutes. The only thing that DT has done that I compare to CTTE is Images and Words. Maybe.

I'm not sure if this is necessarily controversial, but Breaking All Illusions is a top 5 song for me. Probably #4 behind LTL, ACOS, and 8VM.

BlobVanDam

Quote from: Blackfield on August 19, 2013, 11:58:44 AM
Quote from: jsbru on August 19, 2013, 11:45:07 AM
SFAM is way too concept-y and is one of their worst albums.  Reminds me of Tales of Topographic Oceans by Yes.

Sometimes I think freedom of speech is a bad idea.

:lol

jsbru

Quote from: FourthHorseman on August 19, 2013, 08:59:45 PM
Okay, I see what you're getting at.

For me, SFAM has the hooks, and is very dynamic. But for some reason I find it very unlistenable.

Close to the Edge is the essence of life and nature itself put into music over 40 minutes. The only thing that DT has done that I compare to CTTE is Images and Words. Maybe.

I'm not sure if this is necessarily controversial, but Breaking All Illusions is a top 5 song for me. Probably #4 behind LTL, ACOS, and 8VM.

Yeah, there are some hooks, etc.  But it's more that both albums (Tales, SFAM) were both based entirely on one idea (Tales on four tenants of Buddhism, SFAM on one song).  Both bands had a much smaller amount of material and tried to stretch it out into an epic album (Rick Wakeman pretty much temporarily quit the band he was so frustrated with TOTO, saying that there was a few good parts, but there was so much filler in between that they just put in to make it longer, and Metropolis part 2 was based on a 20-minute song they basically turned into an album).  There's good parts of each album, to be sure, but the filler in between seems to drag on and not be very creative or interesting.

I don't actually think SFAM is their worst album.  SC or BC&SL probably are.  But I think it's down there for me.  I would have rather they stuck with Metropolis Part 2 as just a 20-minute song and then added in some other unreleased material or composed totally different songs stylistically.  I'm not a fan of concept albums in general, as I think they just limit (rather than enhance) the band's creativity.  If you have 1:20:00 minutes of music based on the same concept, it just starts to drag on and on and isn't very dynamic or stylistically diverse.  Although I am a pretty big fan of the SDOIT title track, so it can be done.

Ruba

Quote from: TheGreatPretender on August 19, 2013, 01:09:07 PM
Quote from: ? on August 19, 2013, 12:45:24 PM
IWBY isn't that bad, it's probably my favorite U2 song :neverusethis:

Oh come on, now. I Walk Beside You is better than any song U2 ever put out.

No.


TheGreatPretender

Quote from: adastra on August 20, 2013, 01:58:12 AM

Not just the best song from 8V  but best song from the whole band!

Let's not get carried away, now.

aprilethereal

There is not a single second on SFAM that I would consider to be filler. Okay, maybe the samples/noises outro of Finally Free could be a little shorter, but the actual music? No.



Quote from: adastra
link=topic=35056.msg1652178#msg1652178 date=1376989092

Quote from: aprilethereal on August 19, 2013, 11:16:52 AM
*quote pyramid*

Not just the best song from 8V  but best song from the whole band!

No

adastra

Quote from: aprilethereal on August 20, 2013, 03:20:37 AM
There is not a single second on SFAM that I would consider to be filler. Okay, maybe the samples/noises outro of Finally Free could be a little shorter, but the actual music? No.



Quote from: adastra
link=topic=35056.msg1652178#msg1652178 date=1376989092

Quote from: aprilethereal on August 19, 2013, 11:16:52 AM
*quote pyramid*

Not just the best song from 8V  but best song from the whole band!

No

Umm.. yes? Go somewhere else with your wrong opinions  :P

aprilethereal

A song that is the fourth best on its album can't possibly be the best by the band ;)

Kotowboy

Quote from: TheGreatPretender on August 20, 2013, 02:04:40 AM
Quote from: adastra on August 20, 2013, 01:58:12 AM

Not just the best song from 8V  but best song from the whole band!

Let's not get carried away, now.

I like it but there's just no way that it beats the title track.

serrano

Actually this is the thread for the "wrong" opinions.  :biggrin:

adastra

Quote from: aprilethereal on August 20, 2013, 04:51:56 AM
A song that is the fourth best on its album can't possibly be the best by the band ;)

I guess I'm the only who thinks its the best ._.

Quote from: serrano on August 20, 2013, 05:03:25 AM
Actually this is the thread for the "wrong" opinions.  :biggrin:

Haha  ;D

chaotic_ripper

I like As I Am, more than The Glass Prison.

ReaperKK

I kinda agree with you chaotic, The Glass prison is a bit too long for my tastes.

aprilethereal

TGP used to be my #1 DT song, now I'm not sure if it's even in my top 20 anymore.

Rattlehead

Quote from: aprilethereal on August 20, 2013, 08:17:40 AM
TGP used to be my #1 DT song, now I'm not sure if it's even in my top 20 anymore.

TGP used to be a top 10 DT song for me as well, but it has since fallen out of my top 20 as I feel it drags on too long; I hardly ever have the urge to listen to it any more  :-\ I'll throw in a controversial opinion in while I'm at it: I'd rather listen to TMoLS at this point and would also rank it higher. I realize the song is longer, but for some reason it just doesn't feel as tiresome to me to listen to.

aprilethereal

Me too.

And since we had some I Walk Beside You discussion earlier: I'd rather listen to IWBY instead of TGP.

BlobVanDam

Quote from: aprilethereal on August 20, 2013, 08:21:56 AM
Me too.

And since we had some I Walk Beside You discussion earlier: I'd rather listen to IWBY at this point.

Well now you're just being silly.

Lucien

I don't even like TGP that much. In fact, it's my least favorite of SDOIT.

BlobVanDam

I thought this was the controversial opinion thread, not the wrong opinion thread. :neverusethis:

TGP is DT's best metal song, easily.

YtseBitsySpider

My contraversial opinion (not truth but opinion)

Derek Sherinian was the best keyboardist DT had, followed by Kevin, and finally the beared android.

efx

Quote from: YtseBitsySpider on August 20, 2013, 09:18:20 AM
My contraversial opinion (not truth but opinion)

Derek Sherinian was the best keyboardist DT had, followed by Kevin, and finally the beared android.

I kind of agree with that.

My own personal "controversial opinion": I just can't get into SFAM. Bought it on release in 99, met the band the same day on LI for a signing. Ended up front row at the Roseland ballroom show for the DVD and still it never clicked with me. I can think of a few reasons why but considering all that I got to experience relating to that album it is a bit strange that it's at the bottom of the albums I listen to from them.
My new single Retro/Active: [url="https://open.spotify.com/track/3iQoVlyVYG9e8w7wPZweNi?si=131917e0c9d74317"]https://open.spotify.com/track/3iQoVlyVYG9e8w7wPZweNi?si=131917e0c9d74317[/url]

jsbru

Quote from: aprilethereal on August 20, 2013, 03:20:37 AM
There is not a single second on SFAM that I would consider to be filler. Okay, maybe the samples/noises outro of Finally Free could be a little shorter, but the actual music?

In my opinion, you could lop off the entire first 20 minutes of the album, and dramatically shorten Beyond This Life.  Also, I really do not like The Spirit Carries On.  It seems too much like a color-by-numbers power ballad--of which DT seems to have a few too many in the two albums post-Moore.  I miss ballads like Surrounded and Space Dye Vest.  They're more than just a reverb-y acoustic guitar, a reverb-y piano, and some heartfelt vocals.

For me, the album gets good once Through Her Eyes starts, and crecendos with Home.  At least home uses some different scales and at parts is driven by synth/bass instead of just a distorted guitar, and the female vocals on THE are a sound not yet heard with DT (and a very good idea).  Since Moore left, the band's sound has progressively been getting narrower and narrower, and this album has few exceptions.  Nearly every song after this album is either 1) distorted guitar-driven in a minor scale that changes to diminished during the jam session 2) a reverb-y power ballad with acoustic guitar and piano, or 3) a rock opera composed of the intermixing of both.  I&W and Awake have a number of songs mixed in driven by synth and/or bass: Surrounded, LSOAD, the majority of Scarred, SDV, 6:00, LTL, and parts of TTT.  Post-Moore, the synth and bass have basically moved into a supporting role beefing up a distorted guitar riff, less a few times where they pop their heads out for a cool bass lick or a ragtime solo.  ;)

BlobVanDam

Quote from: YtseBitsySpider on August 20, 2013, 09:18:20 AM
My contraversial opinion (not truth but opinion)

Derek Sherinian was the best keyboardist DT had, followed by Kevin, and finally the beared android.

:\


jsbru

Quote from: YtseBitsySpider on August 20, 2013, 09:18:20 AM
My contraversial opinion (not truth but opinion)

Derek Sherinian was the best keyboardist DT had, followed by Kevin, and finally the beared android.

I don't think this is too far off.  Derek had more of a jazzy/bluesy style.  Moore is just all over the place, but his tones definitely stood out more and were more exotic.  Rudess seems to just blend in.  I think the conflict in styles between the keyboard and the band actually adds more to the music rather than less.  They picked JR because he was easy to work with based on LTE, but that's part of the problem.  If everybody in the room is "easy to work with," you start becoming a victim of groupthink, and fall into a creative rut.  A manageable amount of personality/style clashing is good, IMO.

nicbor87

Quote from: YtseBitsySpider on August 20, 2013, 09:18:20 AM
My contraversial opinion (not truth but opinion)

Derek Sherinian was the best keyboardist DT had, followed by Kevin, and finally the beared android.

Petrucci plays keys?  :laugh:

Onno

Quote from: YtseBitsySpider on August 20, 2013, 09:18:20 AM
My contraversial opinion (not truth but opinion)

Derek Sherinian was the best keyboardist DT had, followed by Kevin, and finally the beared iOS.
I don't agree with your opinion, but FTFY.

aprilethereal

Quote from: BlobVanDam on August 20, 2013, 08:22:23 AM
Quote from: aprilethereal on August 20, 2013, 08:21:56 AM
Me too.

And since we had some I Walk Beside You discussion earlier: I'd rather listen to IWBY at this point.

Well now you're just being silly.

I really don't think we will ever agree on anything DT related. TGP is great, but I think it's a bit too long, and for what it is, IWBY is absolutely perfect.

Nearmyth

Quote from: Lucien on August 19, 2013, 07:59:34 AM
Quote from: Nearmyth on August 19, 2013, 12:17:04 AM
Thought I didn't have many at first, but looking back... Well, here we go.

Dominici sounds good on Afterlife, and actually a large portion of WDADU. I just don't think he sounds good live.

Which brings me to another point, I've never listened to WDADU in full.

These Walls is overrated.

Space Dye Vest is overrated. Slightly.

SFAM is great for the first couple of listens, but VERY quickly loses it's shine as a whole. Almost more so than any other DT album. I think the songs individually are great though.

Train of Thought as a whole is cumbersome and a bit boring, despite being on the shorter side. Again, I like each individual song.

:huh:

Sorry Lucien, I know this was your #1  ;D I think it's a great song, and I see why people like it (the chorus is nice), but to me it just sounds kind of generic among the rest of the album. It just never got ahold of me, there's a good number of other DT songs that I haven't caught on either however. Maybe it will grow on me in time.

Lucien

Well, I think A Change of Seasons is overrated.

Nearmyth


Nearmyth

Also, I think TGD is a bit underrated, but I don't really know if that's highly controversial.





:hat

TheGreatPretender

Quote from: chaotic_ripper on August 20, 2013, 07:41:49 AM
I like As I Am, more than The Glass Prison.

I like The Shattered Fortress more than The Glass Prison.

Quote from: Nearmyth on August 20, 2013, 11:23:34 AM
Also, I think TGD is a bit underrated, but I don't really know if that's highly controversial.
I think its OVERrated. I constantly see people singing praises to it, so I really wouldn't call it underrated.

Lucien

Quote from: TheGreatPretender on August 20, 2013, 11:27:36 AM
Quote from: chaotic_ripper on August 20, 2013, 07:41:49 AM
I like As I Am, more than The Glass Prison.
I like The Shattered Fortress more than The Glass Prison.

I like The Root of All Evil more than either of those.

aprilethereal

IMO the twelve step suite got weaker with every song.