Author Topic: Amendment 64 Passes: Colorado Legalizes Marijuana For Recreational Use  (Read 124401 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Chino

  • Be excellent to each other.
  • DT.net Veteran
  • ****
  • Posts: 23726
  • Gender: Male
Re: Amendment 64 Passes: Colorado Legalizes Marijuana For Recreational Use
« Reply #315 on: August 27, 2014, 08:56:41 AM »
I thought they were a PITA. Also fairly expensive since nobody's going to make one brownie. The other thing is that it's much harder to regulate (end user side, that is). You eat one item and then 15-45 minutes later gauge what effect it had on you. I have no idea what the retail price is, but I can see how it might well be worth it.

It'd take some trial and error, but I wouldn't waste my time making brownies that could go bad if I didn't eat them fast enough. I'd make hard candies or chocolates.

Which sounds even more difficult to make.  Ive eaten what would be equivalent to a tootsie roll and its 30 dollars and cut it into 1/3rds or 1/4ths based on your tolerance.

Nah. Chocolate is a piece a cake to make. If you can make a piece of cake, you can make chocolate.

Online El Barto

  • Rascal Atheistic Pig
  • DTF.org Alumni
  • ****
  • Posts: 26206
  • Bad Craziness
Re: Amendment 64 Passes: Colorado Legalizes Marijuana For Recreational Use
« Reply #316 on: August 27, 2014, 09:51:14 AM »
I'd say that the point is that people are responding to better alternative means of getting stoned. While I have issues with Colorado's "legalization," this has been a big benefit to everybody else. As smoking becomes less and less relevant the safety issue will continue improve. While NY's law seems to be quite the sham, I could definitely see it adding some legitimacy to the cause. 
Argument, the presentation of reasonable views, never makes headway against conviction, and conviction takes no part in argument because it knows.
E.F. Benson

Offline kirksnosehair

  • DTF.org Alumni
  • ****
  • Posts: 8521
  • Gender: Male
  • Bryce & Kylie's Grandpa
    • The ANABASIS - Music Making a Difference
Re: Amendment 64 Passes: Colorado Legalizes Marijuana For Recreational Use
« Reply #317 on: August 27, 2014, 02:37:17 PM »
The morality police are offended anyway; they think marijuana shouldn't be legal under any circumstances, and know that the whole "medical marijuana" deal is just a way to get it out there legally.  But they're losing, slowly.

I see it as a stepping stone.  We have some states now where it's completely legal, and it appears to be sticking.  Others are following suit.  Some states can't make that jump, though, so they're playing the "medical marijuana" game first.  If they can get that going, get some people used to the idea that it's actually out there and crime didn't suddenly go up and children aren't being born with three heads or whatever the fuck they're all worried about, then public attitudes will slowly swing around and it will eventually get legalized there, too.  Or maybe they'll need to "decriminalize" it first, then legalize it down the road.  Baby steps, but forward steps nonetheless.


Yeah, I guess you're right.  I just find the whole "medical" charade to be silly. 

Offline kirksnosehair

  • DTF.org Alumni
  • ****
  • Posts: 8521
  • Gender: Male
  • Bryce & Kylie's Grandpa
    • The ANABASIS - Music Making a Difference
Re: Amendment 64 Passes: Colorado Legalizes Marijuana For Recreational Use
« Reply #318 on: August 27, 2014, 02:39:41 PM »
I'd say that the point is that people are responding to better alternative means of getting stoned. While I have issues with Colorado's "legalization," this has been a big benefit to everybody else. As smoking becomes less and less relevant the safety issue will continue improve. While NY's law seems to be quite the sham, I could definitely see it adding some legitimacy to the cause.


Just curious, but why did you put "legalization" in quotes?  It IS legal for adults to possess and use cannabis in Colorado.  Sure, there are conditions, but it's legal.

Online El Barto

  • Rascal Atheistic Pig
  • DTF.org Alumni
  • ****
  • Posts: 26206
  • Bad Craziness
Re: Amendment 64 Passes: Colorado Legalizes Marijuana For Recreational Use
« Reply #319 on: August 27, 2014, 02:44:56 PM »
I'd say that the point is that people are responding to better alternative means of getting stoned. While I have issues with Colorado's "legalization," this has been a big benefit to everybody else. As smoking becomes less and less relevant the safety issue will continue improve. While NY's law seems to be quite the sham, I could definitely see it adding some legitimacy to the cause.


Just curious, but why did you put "legalization" in quotes?  It IS legal for adults to possess and use cannabis in Colorado.  Sure, there are conditions, but it's legal.
Didn't mean much by it, but I mostly consider the Colorado and Washington legalizations somewhat of a sham.
Argument, the presentation of reasonable views, never makes headway against conviction, and conviction takes no part in argument because it knows.
E.F. Benson

Offline Ben_Jamin

  • Posts: 13075
  • Gender: Male
  • I'm just a man, thrown into existence by the gods
Re: Amendment 64 Passes: Colorado Legalizes Marijuana For Recreational Use
« Reply #320 on: August 27, 2014, 05:19:15 PM »
Here in New Mexico they're trying to change the pot charges from jail time to just a $25 fine. I'm hoping they pass it, but if it goes to voters a lot of people will vote for it due to the overcrowded jails being a problem.
I don't know how they can be so proud of winning with them odds. - Little Big Man

"We can't rewrite history. We can learn our own history, and share it with other people. While, we learn, from them, their history." -Me,Myself,I

Online hefdaddy42

  • Et in Arcadia Ego
  • Global Moderator
  • *****
  • Posts: 44163
  • Gender: Male
  • Postwhore Emeritus
Re: Amendment 64 Passes: Colorado Legalizes Marijuana For Recreational Use
« Reply #321 on: August 28, 2014, 06:20:57 AM »
Here in New Mexico they're trying to change the pot charges from jail time to just a $25 fine. I'm hoping they pass it, but if it goes to voters a lot of people will vote for it due to the overcrowded jails being a problem.
Well, that's one HUGE reason to decriminalize it in the first place.
Hef is right on all things. Except for when I disagree with him. In which case he's probably still right.

Offline Chino

  • Be excellent to each other.
  • DT.net Veteran
  • ****
  • Posts: 23726
  • Gender: Male
Re: Amendment 64 Passes: Colorado Legalizes Marijuana For Recreational Use
« Reply #322 on: August 28, 2014, 06:38:04 AM »
Here in New Mexico they're trying to change the pot charges from jail time to just a $25 fine. I'm hoping they pass it, but if it goes to voters a lot of people will vote for it due to the overcrowded jails being a problem.
Well, that's one HUGE reason to decriminalize it in the first place.

But what about all the jobs that will be lost from not having overcrowded prisons?

Online cramx3

  • Chillest of the chill
  • DTF.org Alumni
  • ****
  • Posts: 28507
  • Gender: Male
    • The Home of cramx3
Re: Amendment 64 Passes: Colorado Legalizes Marijuana For Recreational Use
« Reply #323 on: August 28, 2014, 06:49:04 AM »
I would wish that the money put into the jails for drug offenses could be shifted over to clinics and educational institutions for drug abuse.  That way jobs overall dont decrease and the money is going to help people and not put them in positions where they cant recover (going to jail).

Online hefdaddy42

  • Et in Arcadia Ego
  • Global Moderator
  • *****
  • Posts: 44163
  • Gender: Male
  • Postwhore Emeritus
Re: Amendment 64 Passes: Colorado Legalizes Marijuana For Recreational Use
« Reply #324 on: August 28, 2014, 07:00:04 AM »
Here in New Mexico they're trying to change the pot charges from jail time to just a $25 fine. I'm hoping they pass it, but if it goes to voters a lot of people will vote for it due to the overcrowded jails being a problem.
Well, that's one HUGE reason to decriminalize it in the first place.

But what about all the jobs that will be lost from not having overcrowded prisons?
Umm...fuck 'em?
Hef is right on all things. Except for when I disagree with him. In which case he's probably still right.

Offline Chino

  • Be excellent to each other.
  • DT.net Veteran
  • ****
  • Posts: 23726
  • Gender: Male
Re: Amendment 64 Passes: Colorado Legalizes Marijuana For Recreational Use
« Reply #325 on: August 28, 2014, 10:14:59 AM »
Great read.

https://www.vice.com/read/leading-anti-marijuana-academics-are-paid-by-painkiller-drug-companies

Quote
VICE has found that many of the researchers who have advocated against legalizing pot have also been on the payroll of leading pharmaceutical firms with products that could be easily replaced by using marijuana. When these individuals have been quoted in the media, their drug-industry ties have not been revealed.

Take, for example, Dr. Herbert Kleber of Columbia University. Kleber has impeccable academic credentials, and has been quoted in the press and in academic publications warning against the use of marijuana, which he stresses may cause wide-ranging addiction and public health issues. But when he's writing anti-pot opinion pieces for CBS News, or being quoted by NPR and CNBC, what's left unsaid is that Kleber has served as a paid consultant to leading prescription drug companies, including Purdue Pharma (the maker of OxyContin), Reckitt Benckiser (the producer of a painkiller called Nurofen), and Alkermes (the producer of a powerful new opioid called Zohydro).

Could Kleber's long-term financial relationship with drug firms be viewed as a conflict of interest? Studies have found that pot can be used for pain relief as a substitute for major prescription painkillers. The opioid painkiller industry is a multibillion business that has faced rising criticism from experts because painkillers now cause about 16,000 deaths a year, more than heroin and cocaine combined. Researchers view marijuana as a a safe alternative to opioid products like OxyContin, and there are no known overdose deaths from pot.

Offline Orbert

  • Recovering Musician
  • EZBoard Elder
  • *****
  • Posts: 17640
  • Gender: Male
  • In and around the lake
Re: Amendment 64 Passes: Colorado Legalizes Marijuana For Recreational Use
« Reply #326 on: August 28, 2014, 10:48:56 AM »
Full disclosure (for no particular reason): I work for a pharmaceutical company.  A big one, the one that produces a very well-known prescription pain killer.  We constantly have to take FDA-required training on everything from workplace safety to laws and ethics regarding pharmaceuticals.  There's so much of it that there's always at least a few on my "to-do" list, because some of them are required every year.  One of them that I just finished recently, as I do every year, specifically deals with our company's position on paying doctors to speak on behalf of our products.  We do not do it, because while legal, it is unethical.  The whole issue is painted broadly enough that speaking against medical marijuana would essentially be speaking in favor of our product, and I would be very, very disappointed to find out that we've done such a thing (even though it would benefit my company).

To the best of my knowledge, we have not done that.  My company and our product (which again, everyone would know by name) are not mentioned in the above article, and I would be surprised if they ever were.  So for what it's worth, not all pharmaceutical companies are the huge evil money-grubbing corporations the media would like you to believe.  Why yes, I think I'll have another glass of Kool-aid.  Thank you.

Offline kirksnosehair

  • DTF.org Alumni
  • ****
  • Posts: 8521
  • Gender: Male
  • Bryce & Kylie's Grandpa
    • The ANABASIS - Music Making a Difference
Re: Amendment 64 Passes: Colorado Legalizes Marijuana For Recreational Use
« Reply #327 on: August 28, 2014, 11:45:32 AM »
Full disclosure (for no particular reason): I work for a pharmaceutical company.  A big one, the one that produces a very well-known prescription pain killer.  We constantly have to take FDA-required training on everything from workplace safety to laws and ethics regarding pharmaceuticals.  There's so much of it that there's always at least a few on my "to-do" list, because some of them are required every year.  One of them that I just finished recently, as I do every year, specifically deals with our company's position on paying doctors to speak on behalf of our products.  We do not do it, because while legal, it is unethical.  The whole issue is painted broadly enough that speaking against medical marijuana would essentially be speaking in favor of our product, and I would be very, very disappointed to find out that we've done such a thing (even though it would benefit my company).

To the best of my knowledge, we have not done that.  My company and our product (which again, everyone would know by name) are not mentioned in the above article, and I would be surprised if they ever were.  So for what it's worth, not all pharmaceutical companies are the huge evil money-grubbing corporations the media would like you to believe.  Why yes, I think I'll have another glass of Kool-aid.  Thank you.


Companies -regardless of the industry- exist for one purpose:  PROFIT


As far as I'm concerned, if big pharma conducts its business in a way that does not run afoul of the current laws and regulations governing their industry, I have no problem with their marketing methods. 


I may not like the messenger or their message, but it's pretty standard practice in advertising to "go negative"  (see: pretty much every national election ever conducted)

Online cramx3

  • Chillest of the chill
  • DTF.org Alumni
  • ****
  • Posts: 28507
  • Gender: Male
    • The Home of cramx3
Re: Amendment 64 Passes: Colorado Legalizes Marijuana For Recreational Use
« Reply #328 on: August 28, 2014, 12:12:23 PM »
Great read.

https://www.vice.com/read/leading-anti-marijuana-academics-are-paid-by-painkiller-drug-companies

Quote
VICE has found that many of the researchers who have advocated against legalizing pot have also been on the payroll of leading pharmaceutical firms with products that could be easily replaced by using marijuana. When these individuals have been quoted in the media, their drug-industry ties have not been revealed.

Take, for example, Dr. Herbert Kleber of Columbia University. Kleber has impeccable academic credentials, and has been quoted in the press and in academic publications warning against the use of marijuana, which he stresses may cause wide-ranging addiction and public health issues. But when he's writing anti-pot opinion pieces for CBS News, or being quoted by NPR and CNBC, what's left unsaid is that Kleber has served as a paid consultant to leading prescription drug companies, including Purdue Pharma (the maker of OxyContin), Reckitt Benckiser (the producer of a painkiller called Nurofen), and Alkermes (the producer of a powerful new opioid called Zohydro).

Could Kleber's long-term financial relationship with drug firms be viewed as a conflict of interest? Studies have found that pot can be used for pain relief as a substitute for major prescription painkillers. The opioid painkiller industry is a multibillion business that has faced rising criticism from experts because painkillers now cause about 16,000 deaths a year, more than heroin and cocaine combined. Researchers view marijuana as a a safe alternative to opioid products like OxyContin, and there are no known overdose deaths from pot.

Makes me sick.  Although its fairly normal in politics.  Bothers me even more when you see that overdoses of pain killers have decreased in states where medical marijuana is legal.

Online El Barto

  • Rascal Atheistic Pig
  • DTF.org Alumni
  • ****
  • Posts: 26206
  • Bad Craziness
Re: Amendment 64 Passes: Colorado Legalizes Marijuana For Recreational Use
« Reply #329 on: August 29, 2014, 08:22:14 PM »
I was reading yesterday (I don't want to search for a link on my work machine) that was stating that the states with medicinal marijuana have shown a notable decrease in overdoses on prescription medication.
I was just discussing with a friend today that if I wound up strung out on painkillers, as so many people do, I'd probably switch to heroin pretty quickly. As is so often the case, it's just much easier and much cheaper to get something illegal than it is to jump through the hoops to go the legal route. Doctors will get you strung out and then the FDA and DEA clamp down and fuck up your whole world. Then wonder why people are OD'ing on H.

Turns out Sanjay Gupta had the exact same thing to say today.
Argument, the presentation of reasonable views, never makes headway against conviction, and conviction takes no part in argument because it knows.
E.F. Benson

Offline Chino

  • Be excellent to each other.
  • DT.net Veteran
  • ****
  • Posts: 23726
  • Gender: Male
Re: Amendment 64 Passes: Colorado Legalizes Marijuana For Recreational Use
« Reply #330 on: September 02, 2014, 09:33:04 AM »
Turns out Colorado has made something like $21m less in taxes than they projected. They're finding a good amount of people are still buying on the black market in order to dodge the 27% tax rate. Serves them right, IMO. First you jail people for doing something harmless, and then you say "okay, we're going to let you do this now, but we are going to take a bunch of money from you first".

Online cramx3

  • Chillest of the chill
  • DTF.org Alumni
  • ****
  • Posts: 28507
  • Gender: Male
    • The Home of cramx3
Re: Amendment 64 Passes: Colorado Legalizes Marijuana For Recreational Use
« Reply #331 on: September 02, 2014, 09:45:50 AM »
They need to find that happy medium price point to keep it off the black market.

Online El Barto

  • Rascal Atheistic Pig
  • DTF.org Alumni
  • ****
  • Posts: 26206
  • Bad Craziness
Re: Amendment 64 Passes: Colorado Legalizes Marijuana For Recreational Use
« Reply #332 on: September 02, 2014, 10:06:01 AM »
I doubt there will be that happy medium. The overhead to sell legally will still push the prices for legal bud higher than the black market. Besides which they hugely overestimated the amount of revenue they'd take in to sell the thing. Hell, they even hedged it a bit for their own purposes.

Here's what's interesting, though. They made 12 million in taxes anyway. What I'd like to know is what the net loss or gain was offsetting that from profits fighting the so-called war on drugs. I wonder what they've lost out on in seizures, fines, grant money and what not.
Argument, the presentation of reasonable views, never makes headway against conviction, and conviction takes no part in argument because it knows.
E.F. Benson

Offline kirksnosehair

  • DTF.org Alumni
  • ****
  • Posts: 8521
  • Gender: Male
  • Bryce & Kylie's Grandpa
    • The ANABASIS - Music Making a Difference
Re: Amendment 64 Passes: Colorado Legalizes Marijuana For Recreational Use
« Reply #333 on: September 02, 2014, 02:07:16 PM »
Hmm...I think over time the black market may force legal prices down.  Why would ANYONE buy an OZ of weed for $300 when they can get it close by for half that much?  Especially now that the substance itself is no longer illegal.  The only people who will buy at the dispensaries are people who want to experience the novelty of legally buying it and vacationers who don't know any locals and thus don't have any black market connections. 

Offline Stadler

  • DTF.org Alumni
  • ****
  • Posts: 29811
  • Gender: Male
  • Pointing out the "unfunny" since 2017!
Re: Amendment 64 Passes: Colorado Legalizes Marijuana For Recreational Use
« Reply #334 on: September 02, 2014, 02:35:16 PM »
Hmm...I think over time the black market may force legal prices down.  Why would ANYONE buy an OZ of weed for $300 when they can get it close by for half that much?  Especially now that the substance itself is no longer illegal.  The only people who will buy at the dispensaries are people who want to experience the novelty of legally buying it and vacationers who don't know any locals and thus don't have any black market connections.

At this point, the only compelling reason would be product safety, and while I am far from an expert here it is my understanding that there are few if any barriers to entry for the "manufacture" of marijuana, unlike other regulated substances (i.e. liquor, prescription medication, etc.) and few ways to really screw up the manufacture.

In other words, moonshine can (potentially) kill you which is why people buy their liquor from licensed dispensaries rather than drink "their own", whereas the worst that happens from a bad batch of weed is a smelly room.   Am I wrong on this?

Online El Barto

  • Rascal Atheistic Pig
  • DTF.org Alumni
  • ****
  • Posts: 26206
  • Bad Craziness
Re: Amendment 64 Passes: Colorado Legalizes Marijuana For Recreational Use
« Reply #335 on: September 02, 2014, 04:08:16 PM »
Hmm...I think over time the black market may force legal prices down.  Why would ANYONE buy an OZ of weed for $300 when they can get it close by for half that much?  Especially now that the substance itself is no longer illegal.  The only people who will buy at the dispensaries are people who want to experience the novelty of legally buying it and vacationers who don't know any locals and thus don't have any black market connections.

At this point, the only compelling reason would be product safety, and while I am far from an expert here it is my understanding that there are few if any barriers to entry for the "manufacture" of marijuana, unlike other regulated substances (i.e. liquor, prescription medication, etc.) and few ways to really screw up the manufacture.

In other words, moonshine can (potentially) kill you which is why people buy their liquor from licensed dispensaries rather than drink "their own", whereas the worst that happens from a bad batch of weed is a smelly room.   Am I wrong on this?
There's a significant amount of knowledge and effort that go into growing quality bud. It's not the stinky room that'd bother you, in fact that's more a sign of really good bud. It's that what you cranked out would taste bad and not get you all that stoned. Most would rather pay the experts for great quality bud, but some will certainly decide to grow some far superior stuff; likely the same sorts of people that roast their own coffee beans or brew their own beer.
Argument, the presentation of reasonable views, never makes headway against conviction, and conviction takes no part in argument because it knows.
E.F. Benson

Online cramx3

  • Chillest of the chill
  • DTF.org Alumni
  • ****
  • Posts: 28507
  • Gender: Male
    • The Home of cramx3
Re: Amendment 64 Passes: Colorado Legalizes Marijuana For Recreational Use
« Reply #336 on: September 02, 2014, 04:10:13 PM »
Hmm...I think over time the black market may force legal prices down.  Why would ANYONE buy an OZ of weed for $300 when they can get it close by for half that much?  Especially now that the substance itself is no longer illegal.  The only people who will buy at the dispensaries are people who want to experience the novelty of legally buying it and vacationers who don't know any locals and thus don't have any black market connections.

At this point, the only compelling reason would be product safety, and while I am far from an expert here it is my understanding that there are few if any barriers to entry for the "manufacture" of marijuana, unlike other regulated substances (i.e. liquor, prescription medication, etc.) and few ways to really screw up the manufacture.

In other words, moonshine can (potentially) kill you which is why people buy their liquor from licensed dispensaries rather than drink "their own", whereas the worst that happens from a bad batch of weed is a smelly room.   Am I wrong on this?
There's a significant amount of knowledge and effort that go into growing quality bud. It's not the stinky room that'd bother you, in fact that's more a sign of really good bud. It's that what you cranked out would taste bad and not get you all that stoned. Most would rather pay the experts for great quality bud, but some will certainly decide to grow some far superior stuff; likely the same sorts of people that roast their own coffee beans or brew their own beer.

Yea,a "bad batch of weed" would likely result in something that doesnt taste good and has little to no effect.  Not something that would be a health concern.

Online El Barto

  • Rascal Atheistic Pig
  • DTF.org Alumni
  • ****
  • Posts: 26206
  • Bad Craziness
Re: Amendment 64 Passes: Colorado Legalizes Marijuana For Recreational Use
« Reply #337 on: September 02, 2014, 06:40:53 PM »
Foul-tasting, less than potent weed is shwag. It's what the Mexicans have been selling for decades and it's what we all smoked before people started flooding the market with Cannabis Cup winners. There's always been a choice where you've got Mexican ditchweed selling for the same price it was 20 years ago, and high-grade boutique bud for 4x that amount. No doubt that situation still exists in CO as well, but there can't be much of a legal market for shwag. The mistake the CO politicians made was thinking that all of the people who were used to spending $30 for a quarter were suddenly going to start popping $75 for an eighth, or that people could fill that market void despite all of the taxation and overhead. It might eventually happen, but it's going to take RJR or Philip Morris to pull it off. 
Argument, the presentation of reasonable views, never makes headway against conviction, and conviction takes no part in argument because it knows.
E.F. Benson

Offline Chino

  • Be excellent to each other.
  • DT.net Veteran
  • ****
  • Posts: 23726
  • Gender: Male
Re: Amendment 64 Passes: Colorado Legalizes Marijuana For Recreational Use
« Reply #338 on: September 03, 2014, 09:23:41 AM »
I doubt there will be that happy medium. The overhead to sell legally will still push the prices for legal bud higher than the black market. Besides which they hugely overestimated the amount of revenue they'd take in to sell the thing. Hell, they even hedged it a bit for their own purposes.

Here's what's interesting, though. They made 12 million in taxes anyway. What I'd like to know is what the net loss or gain was offsetting that from profits fighting the so-called war on drugs. I wonder what they've lost out on in seizures, fines, grant money and what not.

I'm curious to know if that tax loss is just on the taxes expected to be generated from the weed sales alone. Surely there have been been many jobs created that are giving people disposable/taxable income. Not to mention the tourism businesses that have started up and the accessories that have probably also gotten a huge boost in sales as well.

I'd also like to know where Colorado's black market product now originates. I'm assuming it's mostly the herb that is grown locally and turned down by the dispensaries. I sure the amount of herb coming from cartel related activities has dropped significantly, which is in itself a great victory.

Online El Barto

  • Rascal Atheistic Pig
  • DTF.org Alumni
  • ****
  • Posts: 26206
  • Bad Craziness
Re: Amendment 64 Passes: Colorado Legalizes Marijuana For Recreational Use
« Reply #339 on: September 03, 2014, 09:39:20 AM »
I suspect your cartel related stuff is in higher demand than ever. Like I said, a helluva lot of smokers can't afford quality over quantity and some just don't want it. Somebody's got to supply those hundred dollar lids.
Argument, the presentation of reasonable views, never makes headway against conviction, and conviction takes no part in argument because it knows.
E.F. Benson

Offline Chino

  • Be excellent to each other.
  • DT.net Veteran
  • ****
  • Posts: 23726
  • Gender: Male
Re: Amendment 64 Passes: Colorado Legalizes Marijuana For Recreational Use
« Reply #340 on: September 03, 2014, 09:49:35 AM »
I suspect your cartel related stuff is in higher demand than ever. Like I said, a helluva lot of smokers can't afford quality over quantity and some just don't want it. Somebody's got to supply those hundred dollar lids.

Seems like a little of both

https://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/08/13/colorado-marijuana-black-market_n_5669302.html

Online El Barto

  • Rascal Atheistic Pig
  • DTF.org Alumni
  • ****
  • Posts: 26206
  • Bad Craziness
Re: Amendment 64 Passes: Colorado Legalizes Marijuana For Recreational Use
« Reply #341 on: September 03, 2014, 10:45:57 AM »
I checked a website where people post dope prices, and it seems that while shwag is officially dirt cheap in CO, it's also hard to come by from what I can tell. If so that'd kind of muddle my entire assessment. All we really know is that it's still quite early in the game and nobody really knows how it is or will play out. I'm not surprised their tax revenue is far below their estimates (aren't they always), but I'd certainly be interested in knowing why that is.
Argument, the presentation of reasonable views, never makes headway against conviction, and conviction takes no part in argument because it knows.
E.F. Benson

Online cramx3

  • Chillest of the chill
  • DTF.org Alumni
  • ****
  • Posts: 28507
  • Gender: Male
    • The Home of cramx3
Re: Amendment 64 Passes: Colorado Legalizes Marijuana For Recreational Use
« Reply #342 on: September 03, 2014, 11:07:50 AM »
If there is a demand for shwag, why doesnt the state just grow some and sell it for cheap?  I am assuming that wont help the situation completely as with taxes, itll still be more expensive.  If we can grow 30 strands then why cant we grow one more of crap weed to help people who want cheaper bud?  I have personally never heard of people who want shwag, but hey if they exist then the state should meet the demand.

Online El Barto

  • Rascal Atheistic Pig
  • DTF.org Alumni
  • ****
  • Posts: 26206
  • Bad Craziness
Re: Amendment 64 Passes: Colorado Legalizes Marijuana For Recreational Use
« Reply #343 on: September 03, 2014, 11:23:26 AM »
If there is a demand for shwag, why doesnt the state just grow some and sell it for cheap?  I am assuming that wont help the situation completely as with taxes, itll still be more expensive.  If we can grow 30 strands then why cant we grow one more of crap weed to help people who want cheaper bud?  I have personally never heard of people who want shwag, but hey if they exist then the state should meet the demand.
You're dealing with a product at such a low price point that the 25% tax would make it unfeasible when compared to the illicit variety. And while there are plenty of people who can't afford $60 eighths, there are also people who just prefer the simplicity of rolling a joint of shwag. My brother is one of them. Hell, I can actually appreciate the loss of that cultural aspect, as well. There are plenty of old timers here who will vouch to the fact that smoking ridiculous amounts of grass to try and smog out a van Spicolli style, or competing to see who can roll the biggest joint was a tremendous good time. That's something that you're not going to see when the value of bud is so high and the potency makes it completely unnecessary.
Argument, the presentation of reasonable views, never makes headway against conviction, and conviction takes no part in argument because it knows.
E.F. Benson

Offline Stadler

  • DTF.org Alumni
  • ****
  • Posts: 29811
  • Gender: Male
  • Pointing out the "unfunny" since 2017!
Re: Amendment 64 Passes: Colorado Legalizes Marijuana For Recreational Use
« Reply #344 on: September 03, 2014, 11:30:25 AM »
If there is a demand for shwag, why doesnt the state just grow some and sell it for cheap?  I am assuming that wont help the situation completely as with taxes, itll still be more expensive.  If we can grow 30 strands then why cant we grow one more of crap weed to help people who want cheaper bud?  I have personally never heard of people who want shwag, but hey if they exist then the state should meet the demand.
You're dealing with a product at such a low price point that the 25% tax would make it unfeasible when compared to the illicit variety. And while there are plenty of people who can't afford $60 eighths, there are also people who just prefer the simplicity of rolling a joint of shwag. My brother is one of them. Hell, I can actually appreciate the loss of that cultural aspect, as well. There are plenty of old timers here who will vouch to the fact that smoking ridiculous amounts of grass to try and smog out a van Spicolli style, or competing to see who can roll the biggest joint was a tremendous good time. That's something that you're not going to see when the value of bud is so high and the potency makes it completely unnecessary.

I think el Barto has it right, even if he hasn't said it in so many words:  I think there are too many factors at play and it is too early to tell how it will all play out.     The "illegals" have to run out of supply, the long-time users (who probably have a healthy distrust for anything "The Man" has his fingers into) have to come around to using the official supplies, and the price point has to settle to equilibrium.     I don't think it is realistic for anyone to think this will be a seamless and instant transition, or that early data is necessarily accurate data.   

Offline Scheavo

  • Posts: 5444
Re: Amendment 64 Passes: Colorado Legalizes Marijuana For Recreational Use
« Reply #345 on: September 05, 2014, 05:57:47 PM »
If there is a demand for shwag, why doesnt the state just grow some and sell it for cheap?  I am assuming that wont help the situation completely as with taxes, itll still be more expensive.  If we can grow 30 strands then why cant we grow one more of crap weed to help people who want cheaper bud?  I have personally never heard of people who want shwag, but hey if they exist then the state should meet the demand.
You're dealing with a product at such a low price point that the 25% tax would make it unfeasible when compared to the illicit variety. And while there are plenty of people who can't afford $60 eighths, there are also people who just prefer the simplicity of rolling a joint of shwag. My brother is one of them. Hell, I can actually appreciate the loss of that cultural aspect, as well. There are plenty of old timers here who will vouch to the fact that smoking ridiculous amounts of grass to try and smog out a van Spicolli style, or competing to see who can roll the biggest joint was a tremendous good time. That's something that you're not going to see when the value of bud is so high and the potency makes it completely unnecessary.

Since hemp/marijuana theoretically has other uses, if people just want some schwag, then deregulation and legality without all the strings attached could mean selling of schwag is simply a side business for a company that uses that hemp for other things. Isn't diversification all the craze in businesses these days?

Offline kirksnosehair

  • DTF.org Alumni
  • ****
  • Posts: 8521
  • Gender: Male
  • Bryce & Kylie's Grandpa
    • The ANABASIS - Music Making a Difference
Re: Amendment 64 Passes: Colorado Legalizes Marijuana For Recreational Use
« Reply #346 on: September 16, 2014, 01:55:13 PM »
The mistake the CO politicians made was thinking that all of the people who were used to spending $30 for a quarter were suddenly going to start popping $75 for an eighth, or that people could fill that market void despite all of the taxation and overhead. It might eventually happen, but it's going to take RJR or Philip Morris to pull it off.


I can just see it now:


Pall Mall "Gorilla Stix" Marijuana Cigarettes



Online El Barto

  • Rascal Atheistic Pig
  • DTF.org Alumni
  • ****
  • Posts: 26206
  • Bad Craziness
Re: Amendment 64 Passes: Colorado Legalizes Marijuana For Recreational Use
« Reply #347 on: September 16, 2014, 03:01:37 PM »
The mistake the CO politicians made was thinking that all of the people who were used to spending $30 for a quarter were suddenly going to start popping $75 for an eighth, or that people could fill that market void despite all of the taxation and overhead. It might eventually happen, but it's going to take RJR or Philip Morris to pull it off.


I can just see it now:


Pall Mall "Gorilla Stix" Marijuana Cigarettes
Perfect. It lends itself well to all of the derogatory terms they'll earn for being weak and tasting like shit.
Argument, the presentation of reasonable views, never makes headway against conviction, and conviction takes no part in argument because it knows.
E.F. Benson

Offline Chino

  • Be excellent to each other.
  • DT.net Veteran
  • ****
  • Posts: 23726
  • Gender: Male
Re: Amendment 64 Passes: Colorado Legalizes Marijuana For Recreational Use
« Reply #348 on: October 02, 2014, 08:24:13 AM »
Well Philly made some moves

https://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/10/02/philadelphia-decriminalizes-marijuana_n_5919896.html

Quote
Those possessing 30 grams or less of marijuana will be cited and fined $25. Those smoking in public will be cited and fined $100, or made to perform nine hours of community service.

Online cramx3

  • Chillest of the chill
  • DTF.org Alumni
  • ****
  • Posts: 28507
  • Gender: Male
    • The Home of cramx3
Re: Amendment 64 Passes: Colorado Legalizes Marijuana For Recreational Use
« Reply #349 on: October 02, 2014, 08:31:03 AM »
A move in the right direction and an east coast city too.