Genesis Discography

[Jaq]

Been trying to find the oboe on this album since I bought the vinyl copy and saw it credited. Your guess is as good as mine. 

[jammindude]

Supper's Ready has replaced "Cygnus X-1" (the entire piece...both books 1 & 2 together) as the single greatest piece of music ever recorded by anyone...ever...

[Sketchy]

Been trying to find the oboe on this album since I bought the vinyl copy and saw it credited. Your guess is as good as mine. 

Yeah, still not found that. I'm guessing it's probably in Supper's Ready or possibly Get 'Em Out By Friday. Not quite sure though. But yeah, I thought Supper's Ready probably had the cello in that first part.

[DebraKadabra]

Rankings -

Supper's Ready
Can-Utility and the Coastliners
Watcher of the Skies
Time Table
Horizons
Get Em Out By Friday

[LieLowTheWantedMan]

I think the cello might also be in Willow Farm. Or that could be keyboard, but I'm not sure.

EDIT: Nevermind, pretty sure it's keyboard.

[Orbert]

Also, a side-note to the band calling "Apocalypse In 9/8" as being in "9/8" when it's really 9/4 is funny because in countless video and written interviews with Rutherford/Collins/Banks, they labelled "Turn It On Again" as being partly in 13/8, which is unlikely as the groove is more like 13/4. I suppose they never did quite get it right, even after a few more albums after "Supper's Ready".

Maybe it's a British thing, or just a thing the guys in Genesis do, but I've heard them refer to the "Turn It On Again" riff as 13/8 as well, when I would certainly call it 13/4.  True, you can technically call it a slow 13/8 with the eighth note getting the beat, but it's customary to assign the beat to the quarter note; you use /8 when there are obvious subgroupings.  Note quite a written rule, but certainly an unwritten one, and definitely the norm.

Bought this one along with Nursery Cryme on the same day, and actually was so stunned by how good Nursery Cryme was that I didn't get to Foxtrot for a few days, though I do recall my best friend remarking "hey, it's the Nursery Cryme!" as he looked at the cover of Foxtrot while we were listening to NC together; I always liked the use of the previous cover in the background of Foxtrot's. It was, in fact, an album I blasted at a friend of mine's New Year's Eve party (while sneaking the occasional kiss from his sister, I will admit I had no shame during my drinking days.) I came to Foxtrot as "the album that had Supper's Ready on it" but, bizarrely enough, for me, it was operating at a distinct disadvantage. As I'll explain further when we get to Seconds out, that live version of Supper's Ready was my first side long song, and you never forget your first love. It took a while for the studio version, which felt clunkier and sometimes slower than the far more upbeat, almost sleek version of Supper's Ready on Seconds Out, to really work for me. But, of course it did, and it took its place amongst the legendary epics of the period.

And at last, there's Horizons. I remember, in the mid 80s when Hackett and Steve Howe formed GTR, there was special about the band that, amongst other things, had Hackett performing Horizons, which prompted a cheerful FUCK YEAH from me, amusing my best friend to no good end. Horizons is my favorite solo guitar piece, that should sum it up nicely. Foxtrot is sheer brilliance, and my favorite Genesis album if you lined up their entire discography.

I think the Nursery Cryme cover might be included because of the reference to "The Musical Box" in the "Willow Farm" lyrics.  Interesting that it should be mentioned at all in a song on the next album, and maybe Whitehead threw it in there for the same reason, because it's mentioned in the lyrics, and the cover reflects the contents of the album itself.

I've mentioned it before, but I too started with Seconds Out and worked backward, thus I was quite familiar with the live version of "Supper's Ready" by time I acquired Foxtrot (at the same time as Nursery Cryme).  The studio version felt much drier at first, and it still does.  Peter relies more upon the intensity of his voice and the emotion he puts into it.  Phil is more one to belt it out with lots of echo and bombast.  The part with "Six six six is no longer alone!" is a perfect example.  Peter states it; it has some force to it, but the words themselves make their impact.  Phil is wailing by this point; the buildup of Tony's Hammond solo has come to a head and it's truly the Apocalypse.

I would've liked to have seen that GTR special you mention.  Steve and Steve.  I always thought it was kinda cool that the guitarists from my two favorite prog bands were both Steve H., and they even formed a band together later.  I got more into Genesis in college, and my roommate introduced me to a bunch of prog bands I'd never heard of, including Khan and Gong, both featuring Steve Hillage on guitar.  Another Steve H.

[Jaq]

The funny part about the whole bit where Gabriel blasts out "666 is no longer alone!" for me is a story I saw in a video about the making of Foxtrot, where there was a bit of a creative conflict over how the song should go. Tony Banks wanted the part after the organ solo to be instrumental, with maybe wordless choir vocals, but Peter Gabriel started singing over it and Banks went, "okay, that works." In the Gabriel days, there was a lot of times where Banks wanted to do lengthy, of course, keyboard sections, but Gabriel would come in with an idea that made things a lot better. In the case of Supper's Ready, what Gabriel added worked big time. I've seen live versions of Supper's Ready with Gabriel singing on Youtube, and they're pretty good, but the Seconds Out version will always have a high spot on my Genesis lists. Gabriel once said that Phil sang Supper's Ready better but Peter understood it better, and I agree with that.

The worst thing about the GTR special? I owned a VCR, had blank tapes, and didn't have the sense to tape the damn thing! In addition to talking about the entire album, it had Howe playing his solo piece from the album, I think one of his Yes solo pieces, and Hackett playing (well, syncing) his instrumental Hackett To Bits from the GTR album. Why I didn't tape it I'll never know.

[Orbert]

I think Tony just likes to write music, not necessarily "songs".  I know there are parts in The Lamb Lies Down on Broadway that were originally conceived of as instrumental, but Peter came in with piles and piles of lyrics and started fitting them in the best he could.  I'm of two minds regarding that.  First, I think it's really cool that he listens to music like that and come up with a vocal line (words, melody, everything) that works.  The music sounds complete to me, but Peter listens to it and hears a canvas for him to paint upon.  It's a gift, for sure.

On the other hand, I sympathize with Tony.  It seems like it would be frustrating to have what you consider to be a finished piece, and someone decides that it needs words on top of it.  Not all the time, but I'm sure it happened often enough that Tony would sometimes wish a piece could've stayed the way he'd written it.

Bummer about the GTR special.  But it's for the best.  If you had recorded it and still had the tape, I would be jealous.  This way, there's no reason for jealousy, and jealousy is bad, so it's really better this way.

[Jaq]

There did come a little tension in regards to how Gabriel saw the lyrics working with the music later, but I'll save that story for the next time, when we get to the song that really summed the problem up best. Hint: it ends in Epping Forest. 

[LieLowTheWantedMan]

Funny. Apocalypse in 9/8 sounds a lot more like 9/8 than 9/4 to me.

[Octavaripolis]

Oh.. This album.. I remember always seeing it everywhere a couple of years ago. Never really gave it a listen..

For a yes-fan like me, how do you think it would be if I listened to it?

[Zydar]

Oh.. This album.. I remember always seeing it everywhere a couple of years ago. Never really gave it a listen..

For a yes-fan like me, how do you think it would be if I listened to it?

Orgasmic.

[Nekov]

My dad has this album in Vinyl and I remember the first time I listened to it I sat down in the living room and played it. I was immediately blown away by Watcher in the skies and at that moment I knew I had to check out more of Genesis. That song still remains as my favorite Genesis song.

[Octavaripolis]

Oh.. This album.. I remember always seeing it everywhere a couple of years ago. Never really gave it a listen..

For a yes-fan like me, how do you think it would be if I listened to it?

Orgasmic.

I better give it a shot then.

[Sketchy]

I would've liked to have seen that GTR special you mention.  Steve and Steve.  I always thought it was kinda cool that the guitarists from my two favorite prog bands were both Steve H., and they even formed a band together later.  I got more into Genesis in college, and my roommate introduced me to a bunch of prog bands I'd never heard of, including Khan and Gong, both featuring Steve Hillage on guitar.  Another Steve H.

Canterbury Scene <3<3<3

[The Letter M]

Funny. Apocalypse in 9/8 sounds a lot more like 9/8 than 9/4 to me.

What about "Riding The Scree"?

-Marc.

[Orbert]

Funny. Apocalypse in 9/8 sounds a lot more like 9/8 than 9/4 to me.

You can count it either way, and if Genesis says it's 9/8, then it's a slow 9/8.  It's just that the convention calls for beats to get the quarter note, and you use /8 when the beats are subdivided and grouped, especially when grouped unevenly as they are here.  There is the 4+3+2 grouping going on, so that would be an argument for 9/8.

I would've liked to have seen that GTR special you mention.  Steve and Steve.  I always thought it was kinda cool that the guitarists from my two favorite prog bands were both Steve H., and they even formed a band together later.  I got more into Genesis in college, and my roommate introduced me to a bunch of prog bands I'd never heard of, including Khan and Gong, both featuring Steve Hillage on guitar.  Another Steve H.

Canterbury Scene <3<3<3

Yeah, that's some cool stuff.  We listened to a bunch of Gong and National Health and Hatfield and the North and a bunch of stuff I don't even remember.  This was the roommate who would hit the used record store and come home with a bunch of LPs he'd paid $2 each for, we'd check them out for a week or two, then he'd sell them back for 50 cents each and grab another batch.  He thought of it as "renting music".  This was 1980, pre-Internet, and it was the best way to check out music for cheap.

[KevShmev]

Supper's Ready and Can-Utility and the Coastliners are top 10 Genesis songs in my book.

Watcher of the Skies is awesome musically, especially the intro, but the vocal melodies are fairly ordinary; just a bit too jumbled, like they jammed too many words into a small space or something.  It's just not a song you want to sing along to.

Time Table and Get 'Em Out by Friday are both enjoyable, but neither really stands out.

Horizons is a good instrumental.

Overall, Foxtrot is really, really good, but it's not a top 3 Genesis studio album, for me.

[Mladen]

Ranking:

Supper's ready
Horizons
Watchers of the skies
Can-Utility and the Coastliners
Get Em Out By Friday
Time Table

I rarely return to the bottom three songs. Those are the ones preventing this album from being one of my favorite Genesis records. Nothing wrong with them, they just haven't left an impression on me, no matter how many chances I give them.

The upper half, on the other side...   

[Orbert]

Oh.. This album.. I remember always seeing it everywhere a couple of years ago. Never really gave it a listen..

For a yes-fan like me, how do you think it would be if I listened to it?

Yes is my favorite band, with Genesis a close second.  I recommend checking out Foxtrot, but don't expect it to be anything like Yes.  They're both amazing bands, but very different in both their approach to songwriting and their overall sound.

Also, as with all prog, listen to it a minimum of two times, and if at all possible, a third time, six to 24 hours later.

[crazyaga]

Foxtrot is an awesome album AND IT HAS A FOX ZOMG

[Nel]

Also, as with all prog, listen to it a minimum of two times, and if at all possible, a third time, six to 24 hours later.

Like a doctor explaining a prescription. 

[Orbert]

Exactly!  Your system cannot absorb it all at once.  Take too much new prog at once, and you risk your system rejecting it outright.  You have to let it work, then take another dose.  Only then can you grok it in fullness.

[DebraKadabra]

Foxtrot is an awesome album AND IT HAS A FOX ZOMG

 

[Mosh]

Love this album, Supper's Ready is one of the greatest things ever.

Supper's Ready
Coastline
Watcher
Time Table
Horizons
Get 'Em Out

[DebraKadabra]

Mosh, your rankings are exactly the same as mine!

[Mosh]

Mosh, your rankings are exactly the same as mine!

 

[Lolzeez]

Love this album, Supper's Ready is one of the greatest things ever.

Supper's Ready
Coastline
Watcher
Time Table
Horizons
Get 'Em Out

Switch Time Table with Get 'em out and that's my list! By the way, Can Utility is one of my favorites.

[Orbert]

Funny. Apocalypse in 9/8 sounds a lot more like 9/8 than 9/4 to me.

Dammit.  Last night I was playing the bass part in my mind, and it's in 9/8, no question.  Then I played the drums, and they're in 9/8.  Then I looked over at Tony (in my mind) and there he sat, ignoring all of us, playing in 4/4.  Silly git.

9/8 it is.  I've been misled by this bad sheet music book I got 30+ years ago that had it transcribed in 9/4, so I've always thought of it as 9/4 despite all evidence to the contrary.

But finally, I have seen the light!  It really is in 9/8!

[The Letter M]

Funny. Apocalypse in 9/8 sounds a lot more like 9/8 than 9/4 to me.

Dammit.  Last night I was playing the bass part in my mind, and it's in 9/8, no question.  Then I played the drums, and they're in 9/8.  Then I looked over at Tony (in my mind) and there he sat, ignoring all of us, playing in 4/4.  Silly git.

9/8 it is.  I've been misled by this bad sheet music book I got 30+ years ago that had it transcribed in 9/4, so I've always thought of it as 9/4 despite all evidence to the contrary.

But finally, I have seen the light!  It really is in 9/8!

I mean, I've always heard it as a very fast 9/4, especially considering how the Tony's part feels like it's in 4/4 where the same quarter-note beat is the same duration as in the 9/4 part. But to each their own, I suppose!

-Marc.

[Orbert]

Genesis Live (1973)



Tony Banks - Keyboards, 12-String Guitar, Backing Vocals
Phil Collins - Drums, Percussion, Backing Vocals
Peter Gabriel - Lead Vocals, Flute, Tambourine
Steve Hackett - Electric and Acoustic Guitars
Mike Rutherford -  Bass, Bass Pedals, 12-String Guitar, Backing Vocals


Watcher of the Skies
Get 'Em Out by Friday
The Return of the Giant Hogweed
The Musical Box
The Knife

----------

In the 70's, it was the norm for bands to release an album per year, sometimes more.  Thus, when it became apparent that the next album Selling England by the Pound was not going to be ready any time soon, Charisma Records got nervous.  It was very important to keep your big-name acts out there in the public eye and ear.  The solution was usually to release a live album or a "greatest hits" album, so that you had some kind of new release to fill the gap.

As it happened, The King Biscuit Flower Hour had recently made a recording from the Foxtrot tour for radio broadcast.  The King Biscuit Flower Hour was a radio program based in the United States showcasing live music from popular bands.  They made good-quality live recordings, then sold them to radio stations for broadcast.  In this case, however, Charisma purchased the recording and released it as the next Genesis album, Genesis Live, therefore the recording was never aired.

The good news is that the performances on this album are stellar.  Genesis had hit their stride and were playing extremely well, reproducing their intricate arrangements live and gaining both critical and popular approval.  The sound is clean, considering the equipment and conditions of the time, and the mix is very good.

The bad news is that there was not enough material for a double album, which was the norm for a live album.  King Biscuit broadcasts were typically an hour, including commericals, and although they had recorded just over an hour's worth of material, that was only enough for about 1 1/2 LP sides.  The decision was made to cut "Supper's Ready" and release Genesis Live as a single LP.

----------

It really does sound great, and the band was in top form.  Somehow including their epic "Supper's Ready" would have made this a five-star release, easily.  For many years, there were rumors of bootlegs from this show, but none turned out to be authentic.  Finally, an odd "test pressing" of Genesis Live was found.  Apparently, someone had experimented with spreading the contents across four LP sides.  Since details are scarce, everything is handwritten, and no song titles are given, it's impossible to tell what the proposed track listing was going to be, but the important thing is that the recording exists.

Here is a link to the page at The Genesis Museum where the curators have actually made available an mp3 of the famous recording.  It's only 128kbps, variable, but it's definitely genuine.  If you're like me (which is actually a scary thought, but anyway...) you'll put this on your iPod following "The Knife" for a complete version of Genesis Live.

[The Letter M]

I *love* Genesis Live, and like many, I do wish that "Supper's Ready" had made the cut, but at least we now have the Rainbow live show (though some fans are harder to please as they still want a version from the Foxtrot tour). Still ironic that the album cover depicts a performance of "Supper's Ready" without actually having the track on the album. Whoops

The track list is a hit, and it's got all of their (other) epics and long-form tunes from their 2nd-4th albums. As Orbert said, great performances, and "The Knife" absolutely smokes. It's a great way to end the record, and the band is just on FIRE the whole album. Had this been a FULL double album (meaning about 80-100 minutes of music), it would certainly rival Yes' Yessongs as one of the greatest prog live albums of the 70's.

As a single LP, though, it's still got a lot to offer, but Charisma really missed the boat on not trying to get a whole show, and THEN some.

-Marc.

[DebraKadabra]

I always thought that Seconds Out was the sole live album of the Peter Gabriel days.  Guess I was wrong.

[The Letter M]

I always thought that Seconds Out was the sole live album of the Peter Gabriel days.  Guess I was wrong.

Peter Gabriel wasn't on Seconds Out, which was released over 2 years after Peter left the band.

And up until Genesis Archive 1, Live was the only officially released live material featuring Peter Gabriel in the band.

-Marc.

[DebraKadabra]

Gah!  I was completely mistaken all the way around then.