Author Topic: Genesis Discography  (Read 55041 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline The Letter M

  • Posts: 15562
  • Gender: Male
Re: Genesis: Invisible Touch (1986)
« Reply #350 on: December 31, 2012, 04:31:17 PM »
Part of me actually enjoys MOST of this album, the first four songs are pretty good, but then it's hit or miss for the rest of the album.

As usual, I took the chance to integrate the non-album B-sides into my version of the album, 'completing' the Invisible Touch experience:

Invisible Touch
Tonight, Tonight, Tonight
Land of Confusion
Do The Neurotic
In Too Deep
I'd Rather Be You
Anything She Does
Domino
Feeding The Fire
Throwing It All Away
The Brazilian

And I'll agree, "Do The Neurotic" is a superior instrumental and should have been on the album, in place of OR in addition to "The Brazilian". Honestly, this is bottom-half Genesis for me, and I really like the albums that came before and after it more. It's OK, and I appreciate the fact that they wrote and released an album that was so popular world-wide, and produced so many hit singles, but that's about all it is for me. A collection of hit singles, not really an album, at least, by Genesis' standards.

-Marc.
ATTENTION - HAKEN FANS! The HAKEN SURVIVOR 2023 has begun! You can check it out in the Polls/Survivors Forum!!!

Offline Nel

  • Humorless Bore
  • Posts: 2453
  • Gender: Male
Re: Genesis: Invisible Touch (1986)
« Reply #351 on: December 31, 2012, 04:40:25 PM »
I actually quite like this one. Y'know, growing up and always hearing the singles on classic rock stations and such. When I finally heard the album on its own, I was surprised that a song like Domino was still around. I think I like it a lot more than Orbert does, I guess.  :P

It is a rather poppy album, but it does it well. Never liked Anything She Does, Throwing It All Away or The Brazilian though, and I still think the s/t was better.

I may have to give We Can't Dance a relisten before we get to it. I don't remember much about it except for really disliking a majority of that record.
Hire me. I'm talentless but malleable.

Offline FreezingPoint

  • Posts: 230
  • Gender: Male
Re: Genesis: Invisible Touch (1986)
« Reply #352 on: December 31, 2012, 05:10:11 PM »
Is Anything She Does a universally disliked song? I hate it too.

Otherwise, I love this whole album. I never really got into Domino or The Brazilian until I saw that live at Wembly DVD, but I love them now.

Aside: The Mike + Mechanics song is called Silent Running I think. I enjoy that album as well, though I think the first half is the better. Par Avion is my favorite song on that record.
avenuex.bandcamp.com

Offline Orbert

  • Recovering Musician
  • EZBoard Elder
  • *****
  • Posts: 19274
  • Gender: Male
  • In and around the lake
Re: Genesis: Invisible Touch (1986)
« Reply #353 on: December 31, 2012, 11:48:05 PM »
I know the song is "Sillent Running".  I was just taking a cheap shot at all the people who don't know it.  Or maybe I was taking a cheap shot at Mike + Company for naming the song after a cool 70's sci-fi movie I remember seeing when I was younger, but giving it a chorus which makes you think that it must be the song title instead.  Also a shot at the people who knew that Mike was the bassist for Genesis (even though he was also the guitarist by now) but could never think of his last name.  There were a a few of those in the 80's as well.  Points for knowing that it was Mike, but most of those points were lost by not knowing his last name.  Sorry, I'm an asshole that way.

I don't dislike "Domino", I just don't like it as much as I used to.  I used to cling to it as the last bit of prog that Genesis had left.  "Tonight, Tonight, Tonight" seemed semi-proggy at first, but the break really is pointless.  Are the Simmons programmable drums supposed to be the melody?  All those crazy sounds that Phil was clearly having a lot of fun with but which sound so horribly dated now?  I remember even then thinking that it was a horrible attempt to make the song seem like more than it was.  I actually like the song; it just tries to be more than it is.

So I turned to "Domino" and somehow it seemed like the opposite of "Blood on the Rooftops" from Wind & Wuthering.  Spending a quiet evening at home, relaxing, and the contrast between that and all the violence in the world, even the emphasis on the word "blood".  But whereas "Blood on the Rooftops" is beautiful and chill and a real work of art, "Domino" was, upon closer examination, just a couple of completely unrelated 4/4 songs pasted together to appear like something more.  I don't dislike "Domino" for it isn't; I dislike what it is not.  Or maybe it's the other way around.

And I'll agree, "Do The Neurotic" is a superior instrumental and should have been on the album, in place of OR in addition to "The Brazilian". Honestly, this is bottom-half Genesis for me, and I really like the albums that came before and after it more. It's OK, and I appreciate the fact that they wrote and released an album that was so popular world-wide, and produced so many hit singles, but that's about all it is for me. A collection of hit singles, not really an album, at least, by Genesis' standards.

What's somewhat confusing to me is that Mike supposedly said that the other three songs were cut because they didn't really fit the "feel" they were going for with this album.  He's quoted on the Three Sides Live video also talking about feel; he talks about how in the early days, the songs were intricate and complex and if everyone played their parts properly, then it all sounded great.  Now, the emphasis is more on "feel".

Sorry Mike, but that sounds kinda like another way to say that the songs are appealing to a listeners at a baser level.  Whether it was an intentional move towards pop, a desire to sell more records, or just becoming bored with or tired of writing art rock (which is what we called it before prog), the result is the same.  The songs are simpler, so they have to be catchy.  This is an entire album of pop songs, and one of the shortest Genesis albums of all, so it could only have benefitted from at least having three more tracks on it.  At least give your listeners more music for their money.

Offline Jaq

  • Posts: 4050
  • Gender: Male
  • Favorite song by Europe: Carrie.
Re: Genesis: Invisible Touch (1986)
« Reply #354 on: January 01, 2013, 08:17:17 AM »
Hello, I'm Jaq, a fan of every era of Genesis, and I love Invisible Touch.

Controversial opinion amongst prog fans, I know, but I'm a hard headed sort who honestly never views ANY album through the prism of the genre it's supposed to be, or the genre the band worked in. I view it in terms of how well executed it is, and by those standards, this is a fucking brilliant album. By now Genesis had shed the restraints of the prog rock genre-even by 1986, prog fans wanted bands to be stuck in 1972-so I honestly think judging the band by those terms is really unfair. They were a pop rock band, a hugely successful one, and they did it very well. There is a craft to creating good pop music, as much craft as there is in writing a 23 minute long song, and Genesis, by this time, were craftsmen.

I like every song on this album, though some more so than others. Invisible Touch is a magnificently catchy, get people dancing pop song. Tonight, Tonight, Tonight makes perfect sense when you realize what it is: it's the 12" remix of a song, but instead of being a single, it goes to the album. Land of Confusion is a simple, direct rock song, one of the few Genesis songs that is built around a memorable guitar riff. In Too Deep is a lovely ballad, one of the best the band ever did. Anything She Does is the closest thing the album has to a clunker, and even then I sing along to the chorus on occasion. There is no other pop band in 1986 that would have tackled a ten minute long song, and, yes, Domino is a ten minute long song, and the fact that it's in 4/4 shouldn't disqualify it for its ambition. (Sorry, but the notion that a song's prog qualities are directly proportional to the complexity of its time signature is something that annoys me. I could give a rat's ass less about time signatures, I just like the songs.) Throwing It All Away is built around a lovely guitar line, and has some great verse melodies. The Brazilian is a little repetitive but again, in 1986 pop bands weren't doing songs like this.

This period of time for Genesis always amuses me because of a fun little factoid. People are always all over the band because Phil Collins and his solo career ruined them. They had gone pop. They had abandoned their roots from when Peter Gabriel had been the singer! They were so much better then!

Invisible Touch (the song) reached number one on the Billboard single charts. Do you know what knocked it out of that spot?

Sledgehammer by Peter Gabriel.  :rollin
The bones of beasts and the bones of kings become dust in the wake of the hymn.
Mighty kingdoms rise, but they all will fall, no more than a breath on the wind.

Offline Sketchy

  • DTF.org Member
  • *
  • Posts: 2250
  • Gender: Male
  • More tea is required.
Re: Genesis: Invisible Touch (1986)
« Reply #355 on: January 01, 2013, 09:53:21 AM »
I've not heard the album, but I do enjoy Land Of Confusion. It has a nice riff.
This is as exciting as superluminal neutrinos. The sexy thing is that this actually exists :D

Offline KevShmev

  • EZBoard Elder
  • *****
  • Posts: 41973
  • Gender: Male
Re: Genesis: Invisible Touch (1986)
« Reply #356 on: January 01, 2013, 09:58:12 AM »
Sorry, but the notion that a song's prog qualities are directly proportional to the complexity of its time signature is something that annoys me. I could give a rat's ass less about time signatures, I just like the songs.

Agreed.  That said, Domino is pretty good, but nothing really special. 

I only listen to Invisible Touch (the song) when it comes up on my 80s playlist.

I still need to get the single edit of Tonight, Tonight, Tonight, as having gotten used to it that way back in the day, the regular version sounds too long and drawn out now.

Land of Confusion is still a damn fine song.

I have no use for either In Too Deep (awful) or Throwing It All Away (not bad, just kind of there).

I liked the video for Anything She Does, so I tend to like the song probably because of that.

The Brazilian is enjoyable.

Not a great album, but not bad either.  For a pop rock record, it is good.

Offline Orbert

  • Recovering Musician
  • EZBoard Elder
  • *****
  • Posts: 19274
  • Gender: Male
  • In and around the lake
Re: Genesis: Invisible Touch (1986)
« Reply #357 on: January 01, 2013, 10:38:13 AM »
I'm starting to come around on Invisible Touch, but it will never be a favorite of mine.  I understand that there's a demand for pop music, that it's going to exist in our society whether we like it or not.  So it might as well be of as high a quality as possible.  And while I can admire the skill that it takes to craft a really good pop song, something that will appeal to the masses, and I even get drawn in by some of it, there's a part of me that instinctively rebels against it.  I don't like the feeling that I'm enjoying something which was specifically created to appeal to me.  Now that I've spelled it out, it sounds completely stupid, but I guess that's what it is.  I've always enjoyed finding the beauty in things that others don't necessarily see, that you have to "work" to find.  When it's thrown in my face, I reject it out of hand; I might take another look at it later, if I feel like it.

So it will never be a fave, because I don't see myself listening to it enough times for it to ever grow on me.  In this past week, I've come to appreciate it more than I ever have, just as what happened with some of Yes' less-popular albums.  I've always understood the album, I know what the band was going through because I was around at the time and went through it with them.  But as good and catchy as it is, when I feel like listening to Genesis, this isn't going to be the album I reach for.

Invisible Touch (the song) reached number one on the Billboard single charts. Do you know what knocked it out of that spot?

Sledgehammer by Peter Gabriel.  :rollin

I remember that!  I thought it was amusing.

Offline The Letter M

  • Posts: 15562
  • Gender: Male
Re: Genesis: Invisible Touch (1986)
« Reply #358 on: January 01, 2013, 10:52:25 AM »
Invisible Touch (the song) reached number one on the Billboard single charts. Do you know what knocked it out of that spot?

Sledgehammer by Peter Gabriel.  :rollin

I remember that!  I thought it was amusing.

IIRC, his video for that song also beat Genesis' "Land Of Confusion" video for Music Video of The Year, too! Score one for PG!

-Marc.
ATTENTION - HAKEN FANS! The HAKEN SURVIVOR 2023 has begun! You can check it out in the Polls/Survivors Forum!!!

Offline jmarkwilson

  • Posts: 145
Re: Genesis: Invisible Touch (1986)
« Reply #359 on: January 01, 2013, 10:54:32 AM »
The album version of "Tonight Tonight Tonight" wasn't the 12" remix, the 12" remix was nearly 12 minutes long.

Offline Orbert

  • Recovering Musician
  • EZBoard Elder
  • *****
  • Posts: 19274
  • Gender: Male
  • In and around the lake
Re: Genesis: Invisible Touch (1986)
« Reply #360 on: January 01, 2013, 11:36:35 AM »
Yeah, I've heard it.  Typical remix tricks.  Instruments which originally entered together enter one at a time, making for an even longer buildup.  A few sections doubled here and there, though I admit they were done rather tastefully.  That kind of thing.  Interesting if done right, and it wasn't bad.  But I couldn't understand what they'd take such a long track and make it even longer.

I think Jaq was being metaphorical anyway.  They give you the "extended" version on the album, because you've probably heard the short version on the radio already, or seen the video, or at least the beer commercials.  It's a way of understanding why such an obviously bloated track is on the album.

As I said, it "fooled" me back in the 80's.  It and "Domino" were the two longest tracks, and had a little more going on than the rest, so that automatically made them the prog candidates.  As has been pointed out, "progness" is not really a fair criterion to use on this album, but that's said with the benefit of perspective.  At the time, Genesis fans were still mourning the passing of their favorite prog band, and with each new album, we hoped that there would be something for us.  It's only now that we can look at the whole situation and understand what was going on, the full depth and impact of the metamophosis through which the band was going.

Offline The Letter M

  • Posts: 15562
  • Gender: Male
Re: Genesis: Invisible Touch (1986)
« Reply #361 on: January 01, 2013, 11:54:24 AM »
Yeah, I've heard it.  Typical remix tricks.  Instruments which originally entered together enter one at a time, making for an even longer buildup.  A few sections doubled here and there, though I admit they were done rather tastefully.  That kind of thing.  Interesting if done right, and it wasn't bad.  But I couldn't understand what they'd take such a long track and make it even longer.

I think Jaq was being metaphorical anyway.  They give you the "extended" version on the album, because you've probably heard the short version on the radio already, or seen the video, or at least the beer commercials.  It's a way of understanding why such an obviously bloated track is on the album.

As I said, it "fooled" me back in the 80's.  It and "Domino" were the two longest tracks, and had a little more going on than the rest, so that automatically made them the prog candidates.  As has been pointed out, "progness" is not really a fair criterion to use on this album, but that's said with the benefit of perspective.  At the time, Genesis fans were still mourning the passing of their favorite prog band, and with each new album, we hoped that there would be something for us.  It's only now that we can look at the whole situation and understand what was going on, the full depth and impact of the metamophosis through which the band was going.

I agree with all of that, and I can only imagine Genesis fans were a little more forgiving than Yes fans were in the 80's. The changes (pun intended) that Yes made in the 80's were quite a stark difference than the gradual change that Genesis made. The point was, Genesis KNEW what they were doing, and gained success from it! Yes just HAPPENED to reform, and their new album just HAPPENED to produce a hit, but their sound was so different that I'm sure plenty of fans wondered why it was still Yes. At least with Genesis, there was still bits of Genesis in IT that were still them, albeit a differently focused them.

-Marc.
ATTENTION - HAKEN FANS! The HAKEN SURVIVOR 2023 has begun! You can check it out in the Polls/Survivors Forum!!!

Offline Lolzeez

  • DTF.org Member
  • *
  • Posts: 4865
  • Gender: Male
Re: Genesis: Invisible Touch (1986)
« Reply #362 on: January 01, 2013, 12:54:58 PM »
Invisible Touch (the song) reached number one on the Billboard single charts. Do you know what knocked it out of that spot?

Sledgehammer by Peter Gabriel.  :rollin

I remember that!  I thought it was amusing.

IIRC, his video for that song also beat Genesis' "Land Of Confusion" video for Music Video of The Year, too! Score one for PG!

-Marc.
Every PG album is better than the last 3 Genesis albums. Just saying.

Offline snowdog

  • Posts: 202
Re: Genesis: Invisible Touch (1986)
« Reply #363 on: January 02, 2013, 11:33:17 AM »
For the longest time the only three tracks I cared for from the album were Tonight Tonight Tonight, Domino, and The Brazilian.  And I like two of the non-album tracks Do the Neurotic and Feeding the Fire.  The release of the 5.1 box sets caused me to relisten to this and I found that I didn't mind Invisible Touch or Land of Confusion as much now.  The other tracks I still dislike, especially Throwing it All Away.

I personally love Tonight Tonight Tonight and Domino.  Though I wouldn't really call them prog.  I still find them to have good hooks and fun to listen to.  The instrumental break for Tonight Tonight Tonight in particular I really like (though I see I'm in the minority here).  I love the buildup of it and the constant drum beat.  The keyboards are very atmospheric and build nicely.  And hey I still love the Simmons during that section.

As for the non-album tracks I mentioned earlier, I think they are definitely better than the rest of the material but I can see why they might have been left off.  Lyrically Feeding the Fire isn't too different from Domino so I could see why it might seem redundant.  I agree that Do the Neurotic is the superior instrumental.  In the interviews on the 5.1 sets they mention that they didn't want 2 instrumentals on the record and that they had a choice between an instrumental that was similar to what they'd done in the past or one that was very different.  So they went with the one that was different.

Offline toro

  • wazzup
  • Posts: 1389
  • Gender: Male
  • Metal, Drums and beers they finally got it right
Re: Genesis: Invisible Touch (1986)
« Reply #364 on: January 02, 2013, 05:26:30 PM »
One of my favorite Genesis Albums.
I love Tonight Tonight Tonight so much. And I just don't get the "It's pop" jabs. It has singles, like every band that releases an album does. I know it sounds even more pop-ish thanks to the drums, but still. NOT POP(And being pop is not a bad thing either.)
I imagined the story to go more like this.

I was sitting a traffic light blaring Space Dye Vest and next to me in another car was Kevin Moore. And I'll never be open again.

Offline Orbert

  • Recovering Musician
  • EZBoard Elder
  • *****
  • Posts: 19274
  • Gender: Male
  • In and around the lake
Re: Genesis: Invisible Touch (1986)
« Reply #365 on: January 02, 2013, 11:01:06 PM »
Yeah I guess I forget sometimes that there's a middle ground, music that used to just be called Rock.  Sometimes kinda heavy, sometimes lighter, not really Prog, not really Pop, just regular Rock.  A pretty good percent of the music on my iPod is in the Rock genre.  And I admit that I do tend to use the Pop label in the derogatory sense, and it's also true that not everything on Invisible Touch is Pop.  "Tonight, Tonight, Tonight" is too weird and dark and heavy to be real Pop.  "Domino" isn't really, either.  I guess a lot of this album is just Rock.

Pop to me isn't really a genre so much as it's an attitude.  Sure, everybody wants to make music that they think people will like, but if I get the feeling that they've specifically crafted a song to have mass appeal, I whip out the Pop label.  I still think there's a difference between writing a song that you think is really good, and writing a song that you think will be really popular.  If you're shooting for the latter, you're trying to be popular, and that of course is where the word "Pop" comes from.  Was Genesis just writing the best music they could, or were they trying to be popular?

Another thing that hasn't really come up is that Genesis worked very hard in their early years to create some amazing music, and while they did have a cult following, they never broke mainstream while Peter and Steve were in the band.  This probably bothered them at least a little bit.  Certainly they didn't think "Watcher of the Skies" was going to be a Top 40 hit or anything, but it would have been nice to have made a bit more money than they did.  They finally made the big time in the 80's; I mean, they were huge.  I can't really blame them for enjoying their fame and, once tasting it, trying to keep it going.  They really had earned it.  Maybe their massive appeal in the 80's was their reward for all the awesome prog they made in the 70's that didn't make them rich.  Karma or something.

Offline ddtonfire

  • Posts: 2175
Re: Genesis: Invisible Touch (1986)
« Reply #366 on: January 05, 2013, 05:53:59 PM »
I personally know the girl that Invisible Touch was written about. I think it's a great song, has a great sound and flow, lots of energy, and there isn't too much or too little of anything in it.

The Brazalian is my favorite track off the album. It's a great example of tasteful 80's keyboard goodness.

The rest of the album is alright. Anything She Does has great energy. Every once in a while I enjoy a listen to Domino; the first verse of the second part is especially creepy. The ballads I find too sappy. I loathe the instrumental portion of Tonight^3. The single version from Turn It On Again is much better.

Invisible Touch was in fact the first album I ever owned - on cassette, too!

Offline DebraKadabra

  • Witch Goddess of Lankershim Boulevard
  • DTF.org Member
  • *
  • Posts: 8470
  • Gender: Female
  • Can I be as my god am?
Re: Genesis: Invisible Touch (1986)
« Reply #367 on: January 05, 2013, 11:35:28 PM »
Hate this album.

Agreed - it didn't age well for me even back then!

Invisible Touch (the song) reached number one on the Billboard single charts. Do you know what knocked it out of that spot?

Sledgehammer by Peter Gabriel.  :rollin

HA!  Never knew that, that's hilarious. :jets:

Every PG album is better than the last 3 Genesis albums. Just saying.

WORD.

Offline Orbert

  • Recovering Musician
  • EZBoard Elder
  • *****
  • Posts: 19274
  • Gender: Male
  • In and around the lake
Genesis: We Can't Dance (1991)
« Reply #368 on: January 05, 2013, 11:57:06 PM »
Genesis: We Can't Dance (1991)



Tony Banks - Keyboards, Background Vocals
Phil Collins - Lead Vocals, Drums, Percussion
Mike Rutherford -  Guitar, Bass, Background Vocals


No Son of Mine – 6:39
Jesus He Knows Me – 4:16
Driving the Last Spike – 10:08
I Can't Dance – 4:01
Never a Time – 3:50
Dreaming While You Sleep – 7:16
Tell Me Why – 4:58
Living Forever – 5:41
Hold on My Heart – 4:37
Way of the World – 5:38
Since I Lost You – 4:09
Fading Lights – 10:16

----------

I'd pretty much given up on Genesis by this point.  It had been years since their last album, but they hadn't done much that I liked in the past ten years or so anyway.  I thought that Abacab was okay, but a letdown after the awesomeness of Duke.  The self-titled album was a half-step back in the right direction, but as mentioned upthread, I eventually found myself content to just listen to Side One and not bother with Side Two at all.  After Invisible Touch, it was pretty clear that the old band was gone.  Invisible Touch was the last album I bought on LP, and as mentioned, it's one of the shortest Genesis albums, if not the shortest (I haven't bothered to check because it's honestly not that important).

Five years later, CDs were the norm.  Albums could now be nearly twice as long, but I wasn't thinking about that when I stood in the record store looking at the back of the CD and saw that the latest Genesis album had 12 songs on it.  (I've included track times above, but they're not on the CD.)  I did some quick math and determined that the average song length was five minutes, tops.  CDs are about an hour, right?  I didn't even bother buying it.  By this time, I'd heard "I Can't Dance" on the radio, and it was catchy, but nothing special.  I had every Genesis album up to this point, and figured I'd eventually pick this one up, but there wasn't any hurry.

My next-door neighbor picked it up, and he lent it to me.  We Can't Dance clocks in at 72 minutes and is Genesis' longest single studio album of all.  (It was actually released as a double album on vinyl, which I didn't know until today.)  There are two songs over 10 minutes long, one over seven, and a couple around six.  Okay, so I blew it.  The long songs were back.  I went and picked up a copy for myself.

Longer songs are not automatically better than shorter ones.  I understand that.  But in general, if Genesis writes a longer song, it takes its time to unfold.  If it's a story-song, it goes through numerous changes out of necessity, and probably is intercut with instrumental passages.  It may not be prog, but it will at the very least be more interesting than a five-minute pop song.  I just like longer songs because there's more to them.  The ideas are more fully explored.  I feel like they're put more into it, and I tend to get more out of it.

You've heard the hits.  "No Son of Mine" is catchy, has a great sound, and nonsense lyrics.  Okay, the lyrics obviously have some depth to them, but you'll notice that he never specifies what it was that started happening every night, why his mother cried, and why he left.  At first I thought that the narrator was being abused, but I'm not so sure.  Why is Mom crying?  And when he returns to confront his father, his father disowns him for leaving in the first place.  I'm not an expert on broken or dysfunctional families, but if his father was doing something, what sense does it make to come down on his son for leaving?  I know, we're obviously not dealing with a rational person here, but it seems like we're missing part of the story.

"Jesus He Knows Me" is social commentary, akin to "Illegal Alien" I suppose, and just as annoying.  "I Can't Dance" is okay, just nothing special.  "Hold On My Heart" got some airplay; most people couldn't tell whether it was Genesis or a Phil Collins solo song.

"Never a Time", "Tell Me Why" and "Way of the World" are basically fillers.  They sound fine, and they're not as blatantly pop as most of the songs on Invisible Touch.  There's just not a lot of meat to them, either.  I'm not a big fan of social commentary in songs.  They're good songs; I just wouldn't go out of my way to hear them.

"Since I Lost You" is, at first glance, another of Phil's "lost love" songs, of which there are actually fewer here on this very long album than there were on the previous, shorter one.  But this song actually has some meaning.  It was written after the death of Eric Clapton's son Connor.  So it's a "lost love" song, just not what you thought.  Eric is a good friend of Phil's, and Phil played the song for Eric and got his permission to include the song on the album.

"Driving the Last Spike" is the story of British Rail and the men who built the line.  They lived and died digging and cutting the roadbed and laying the track.  It's a great story-song that takes its time and tells a great story.  I love how the sounds of the hammers and spikes are hidden in the soundtrack.  I never noticed them until listening to the album on earphones.

"Dreaming While You Sleep" is amazing.  Once again, I think what makes it work is that it doesn't hurry, it doesn't rush.  You sense the darkness, you hear the sounds of the road; later, you feel the passage of time, and the guilt and the paranoia building.  What makes it scary is that it could happen to any of us.  In the blink of an eye, two lives are changed.  In the time it takes to realize what has happened, you're a few miles away, and there's an excellent chance that no one saw it.  In the time it takes to get to a TV or hear it on the radio, you are certain that no one knows.  It's your secret.  You know that coming forward would be the right thing to do, but to what purpose?  There is nothing you can do to help her.  The only thing it would accomplish is the ruining of your life as well.  You've gotten away with it.  The price?  You must live with the guilt for the rest of your life.

"Living Forever" fooled me the first couple of times.  It just seemed like another regular song, in the middle of a bunch of regular songs.  After a few verses, it goes to a keyboard break, which is cool.  It starts off a bit dark, then changes a few times, keeps going, and then the song ends.  What?  They never come back for a last verse or chorus.  A five-and-a-half minute song that's half instrumental?  Inconceivable!

See, that's what I loved about Genesis, and what I missed.  The songs with nonstandard structures.  Longer songs that told a story, or a song that leads into an instrumental.  Something different.  They'd brought it back.

"Fading Lights" is one of my favorite Genesis songs.  As the last song on the last Genesis album, the title and lyrics have a dual meaning.  It's not really prog, but it takes its time, and it does have a great instrumental break.  The break is another one from the "Cinema Show" or "Duke's Travels" mold, a series of melodies played by Tony on the keyboards while Phil and Mike keep time.  It goes through some nice changes, then comes back for a last verse.  A beautiful, heartfelt farewell to their fans.

Genesis changed a lot over their career, and while some of their later work polarizes their fans, IMO they went out on a high note.  We Can't Dance is not my favorite Genesis album, but it does have some of my favorite Genesis songs on it.  What a great way to end things.


...and then they had to go and spoil it all.  Five years later, with no new album in sight, Phil announced that he had officially left the band.  Within a year, Mike and Tony found a new singer, and hired some session players to provide drums and percussion (it's actually unclear whether they were considered regular band members), but after a weak album and a disastrous, aborted tour, Genesis officially ended, this time on a low note.  Stay tuned...
« Last Edit: July 08, 2015, 06:00:57 PM by Orbert »

Offline Nel

  • Humorless Bore
  • Posts: 2453
  • Gender: Male
Re: Genesis: We Can't Dance (1991)
« Reply #369 on: January 06, 2013, 12:12:43 AM »
I actually quite like the first two songs (low robotic elephant noise at the beginning of No Son Of Mine ftw). I honestly have thought the same thing as you about that song though. It confuses me. At first it sounds like the father is the bad guy and then it sounds like either the son is the one at fault or the father is saying "How dare you walk out on me beating your mother! You're disowned!" What the hell?  :lol

I need to relisten to the rest of this though. Everyone knows I Can't Dance, but the only thing I remember about the rest of the album is that Driving The Last Spike bores me to tears. Don't even know if I ever made it past track 5.  :P
Hire me. I'm talentless but malleable.

Offline The Letter M

  • Posts: 15562
  • Gender: Male
Re: Genesis: Invisible Touch (1986)
« Reply #370 on: January 06, 2013, 12:20:10 AM »
This is a tricky one for me. I've had a love-hate relationship with this album, mostly because growing up, I knew the first two tracks and "I Can't Dance", and maybe a couple others, but when I got into prog in my late teen years, and discovered that Genesis had a deeper background than 80's/90's pop led by Phil Collins, it surprised me how this album came about.

After discovering more about their history through the 80's, leading up to this album, I realized that I could finally appreciate the album's songs for what they are, but some of them are just still so...bland to me. Of course, half the album is full of gems, at least 4 and 5 star songs:
5/5 - No Son of Mine, Driving The Last Spike, Dreaming While You Sleep, Fading Lights
4/5 - Jesus He Knows Me, Living Forever, Since I Lost You
3/5 - I Can't Dance, Never A Time, Tell Me Why, Hold On My Heart, Way Of The World

And the two B-Sides from this album's sessions, "Hearts On Fire" and "On The Shoreline", aren't much greater, and this is a case where I don't really mind that they left any songs off. In fact, I wish they had trimmed the album DOWN a bit!!! Had they made a single vinyl-length album, I would've liked to see something like this:

Side 1 - 25:04
No Son of Mine – 6:39
Jesus He Knows Me – 4:16
Driving the Last Spike – 10:08
I Can't Dance – 4:01

Side 2 - 27:22
Dreaming While You Sleep – 7:16
Living Forever – 5:41
Since I Lost You – 4:09
Fading Lights – 10:16

And that's pushing it, with a 27 minute long second side, but it could be done. This would make for a more solid 52 minute album, losing the more filler songs. Had the album been released like this, I would rank it way above the previous 3 albums, and up there with Duke.

-Marc.
ATTENTION - HAKEN FANS! The HAKEN SURVIVOR 2023 has begun! You can check it out in the Polls/Survivors Forum!!!

Offline SomeoneLikeHim

  • The flame is gone
  • Posts: 1604
  • Gender: Male
  • The fire remains
Re: Genesis: Invisible Touch (1986)
« Reply #371 on: January 06, 2013, 04:01:55 AM »
That trimmed down version looks awesome :tup
"We can walk our road together, if our goals are all the same
We can run alone and free, if we pursue a different aim"

Offline Lolzeez

  • DTF.org Member
  • *
  • Posts: 4865
  • Gender: Male
Re: Genesis: Invisible Touch (1986)
« Reply #372 on: January 06, 2013, 05:58:29 AM »
That trimmed down version looks awesome :tup
Also,I should give this album another listen. I actually don't mind this album. Way better than that pos Invisible Touch.

Offline Orbert

  • Recovering Musician
  • EZBoard Elder
  • *****
  • Posts: 19274
  • Gender: Male
  • In and around the lake
Re: Genesis: Invisible Touch (1986)
« Reply #373 on: January 06, 2013, 07:35:25 AM »
low robotic elephant noise at the beginning of No Son Of Mine ftw

Yeah, that's a cool sound.  I have no idea what it's supposed to be, if it's supposed to be something.  I guess it's just a sound representing anguish and discomfort, which it does quite well.

I need to relisten to the rest of this though. Everyone knows I Can't Dance, but the only thing I remember about the rest of the album is that Driving The Last Spike bores me to tears. Don't even know if I ever made it past track 5.  :P

I like trains and railroad history, so "Driving the Last Spike" drew my attention.  It's not a real grabber in the traditional sense, but I like that they did it, and I liked the story it told, so it probably works for me better than most.  It is a bit repetitive, moreso than most of their more linear songs, and not in the same class as, say, "One for the Vine", but I think it's pretty good.

Offline masterthes

  • Posts: 3975
  • Gender: Male
Re: Genesis: Invisible Touch (1986)
« Reply #374 on: January 06, 2013, 08:28:57 AM »
Last Spike and Dreaming are my two favorite songs off the album. I love No Son of Mine as well. Growing up I guess this album was my introduction to prog music so it definitely holds a special place for me

Offline KevShmev

  • EZBoard Elder
  • *****
  • Posts: 41973
  • Gender: Male
Re: Genesis: Invisible Touch (1986)
« Reply #375 on: January 06, 2013, 08:33:12 AM »
Multiple choice time!

I Can't Dance is:

a) a bad dream.
b) the worst "hit" by a great band ever.
c) an embarrassment to the Genesis name.
d) a song that should be used to torture captured terrorists. 
e) all of the above.

The answer is, of course, "e."

Offline Jaq

  • Posts: 4050
  • Gender: Male
  • Favorite song by Europe: Carrie.
Re: Genesis: Invisible Touch (1986)
« Reply #376 on: January 06, 2013, 08:37:52 AM »
I first knew that Genesis had a new album coming out when I heard No Son of Mine on the radio. Given that it had been five years since Invisible Touch, and both Phil and Mike had successful solo careers, I honestly had given up on a new Genesis album anytime soon. Needless to say, I was pleased, and I rushed out to buy it as soon as it was released. I noticed how many songs were on it, and figured, much as Orbert did, that there were a lot of shorter ones on it.

Boy was I wrong.

The thing about the long songs on We Can't Dance is that, while you could make a convincing case that the long songs since Abacab were artificially long, the plus six minute long songs on We Can't Dance were organically long. They were long because they wound up long, not because, somewhere in the thought process, the band thought "okay, we need a long song here." There isn't a wasted note or section that feels overly long, even the epic length instrumental break in Fading Lights. There's some filler, as there always is in albums over 70 minutes long, but it's not in the long songs. I remember my sense of awe as Driving The Last Spike just kept building, going and going, and telling a great story along the way, the shock that came when Living Forever ended up being over half instrumental, and the delight that came as Fading Lights, which starts sounding like it's going to be a short, ambient coda to the album, turns into the best instrumental section the band had done since the Gabriel days. (Personally, I think it's only surpassed by the end of the Cinema Show for their entire careers, but I'm sure others will disagree.)

The rest of the album is a blend of quirky pop-rock and a few more of those commercial ballads the band had gotten very good at, for better or for worse, and while I could point at songs that could be cut to make it stronger, I can live with how the album turned out. And of course, I consider Fading Lights to be the last song Genesis did, and the end of their career, because it certainly FEELS like it was meant to be a capstone to their career as Genesis. It would have been going out with a bang, with a song that recalls their past glories while at the same time putting the band to bed. Alas-and to be honest, there are some good songs on Calling All Stations, make no mistake about that-it instead isn't their final moment as a band. But that doesn't take away from the fact that it's an amazing song, one of my ten favorite Genesis songs, and my personal favorite for best album closer ever.
The bones of beasts and the bones of kings become dust in the wake of the hymn.
Mighty kingdoms rise, but they all will fall, no more than a breath on the wind.

Offline masterthes

  • Posts: 3975
  • Gender: Male
Re: Genesis: Invisible Touch (1986)
« Reply #377 on: January 06, 2013, 10:48:03 AM »
By the way, I wanted to say thanks to Orbert for all these write ups. You definitely helped rekindle my interest in Genesis

Offline jcmoorehead

  • Posts: 195
  • Gender: Male
Re: Genesis: Invisible Touch (1986)
« Reply #378 on: January 06, 2013, 10:53:22 AM »
I said it earlier in this topic but this is one of the albums I grew up with so it'll always have that special place for me, looking back on it now with all I know about Genesis and the fact that I've heard their earlier material up until this one I still have to say it's a damn fine album in my eyes, even down to the title track which is silly but meh I like it.

I have got to say that while I love Dreaming While You Sleep and Driving The Last Spike I never really got into Fading Lights, that said it has been a long time since I really listened to it so I think I should give it another go.

Offline Unlegit

  • Posts: 2243
Re: Genesis: Invisible Touch (1986)
« Reply #379 on: January 06, 2013, 11:13:35 AM »
Honestly, I haven't given this album a fair chance. I'll have to relisten to it.

Offline ddtonfire

  • Posts: 2175
Re: Genesis: Invisible Touch (1986)
« Reply #380 on: January 06, 2013, 01:32:50 PM »
(Personally, I think it's only surpassed by the end of the Cinema Show for their entire careers, but I'm sure others will disagree.)

I completely agree with you, only the other way around. Fading Lights is my favorite Genesis song ever.

Offline Orbert

  • Recovering Musician
  • EZBoard Elder
  • *****
  • Posts: 19274
  • Gender: Male
  • In and around the lake
Re: Genesis: We Can't Dance (1991)
« Reply #381 on: January 06, 2013, 04:01:53 PM »
By the way, I wanted to say thanks to Orbert for all these write ups. You definitely helped rekindle my interest in Genesis

You're welcome!

I had many reasons to do these discographies, including giving myself an excuse to listen critically to every album, but another was hopefully to get others to do the same and "follow along" with me.  Genesis is still one of my favorite bands, but as with Yes, I found myself pretty much listening to the same two or three favorite albums all the time.  Doing this forced me to revisit all of their albums.

Multiple choice time!

I Can't Dance is:

a) a bad dream.
b) the worst "hit" by a great band ever.
c) an embarrassment to the Genesis name.
d) a song that should be used to torture captured terrorists. 
e) all of the above.

The answer is, of course, "e."

I don't really like it, but wouldn't go quite that far.  Not quite.  I will say, however, that the girls in the video (especially the one who loses "her blues") are pretty hot.

Offline Sketchy

  • DTF.org Member
  • *
  • Posts: 2250
  • Gender: Male
  • More tea is required.
Re: Genesis: We Can't Dance (1991)
« Reply #382 on: January 07, 2013, 12:26:07 PM »
I like We Can't Dance. It took me ages to like it, but I like it, especially Fading Lights, No Son Of Mine and Jesus He Knows Me, the latter partly because it makes me smile, and partly because I dislike the idea of tele-evangelists intensely, and so I love the way it mocks them. The only part of this album I don't like is Hold On My Heart (at least I think it's that song. Whichever one it is, they played it on their tour in 2007, and it was irritating), but yes. I like this album.
This is as exciting as superluminal neutrinos. The sexy thing is that this actually exists :D

Offline Lolzeez

  • DTF.org Member
  • *
  • Posts: 4865
  • Gender: Male
Re: Genesis: We Can't Dance (1991)
« Reply #383 on: January 07, 2013, 02:21:46 PM »
Came back from a listen to this album. It was alright. Better than the previous album. Fading Lights is good and No Son Of Mine is damn catchy. Decent.

Offline toro

  • wazzup
  • Posts: 1389
  • Gender: Male
  • Metal, Drums and beers they finally got it right
Re: Genesis: We Can't Dance (1991)
« Reply #384 on: January 07, 2013, 04:46:46 PM »
I like this album for what it is. It's definitely not the same band it once was but I hold this album dearly for personal reasons. It also has some awesome songs like Dreaming While You Sleep and one of my favorite songs ever in No Son Of Mine.
I imagined the story to go more like this.

I was sitting a traffic light blaring Space Dye Vest and next to me in another car was Kevin Moore. And I'll never be open again.