Author Topic: All musicians unite! - The Musicians Chat Thread  (Read 96689 times)

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Offline Orbert

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Re: All musicians unite! - The Musicians Chat Thread
« Reply #455 on: August 31, 2014, 10:47:47 PM »
If her husband decides to go as well, that wouldn't be professional!

Can't agree there.  He only joined the band because his wife's the singer.  I wouldn't expect him to stay in if we axe her.  Why would he?  He owes nothing to the band.

Online hefdaddy42

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Re: All musicians unite! - The Musicians Chat Thread
« Reply #456 on: September 01, 2014, 06:25:48 AM »
Exactly.  No reason for one to stay if the other goes.
Hef is right on all things. Except for when I disagree with him. In which case he's probably still right.

Offline tiagodon

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Re: All musicians unite! - The Musicians Chat Thread
« Reply #457 on: September 01, 2014, 12:53:10 PM »
Very recently I had to "fire" my keyboard player for not keeping up. He was always behind. The guy wouldnīt answer our emails, the guy wouldnīt pay attention to the changes made in the songs. He was always using the "busy" argument - work, family, kids... He is a very good keyboard player, but was lacking dedication.
Suddenly we noticed that 6 months had gone by and we had only composed 3 songs. He was slowing us down. I had to get rid of him and find somebody else.
Keeping someone like this in the band is bad business. This sort of person gets on your nerves. Suddenly what was supposed to be fun became a nightmare.

Offline Orbert

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Re: All musicians unite! - The Musicians Chat Thread
« Reply #458 on: September 01, 2014, 01:43:27 PM »
I agree with that.  If he's not pulling his weight to a level others are okay with, actually falling far short and making up excuses all the time, that's no good.  It comes down to the goals set forth by the band, which everyone involved has agreed to.

Our band was never supposed to be a full-time anything.  It is and always has been something to get together to do for fun, a chance to play some songs and get out and maybe entertain some people.  The work and practice involved was to be minimal because bar songs aren't exactly challenge for anyone who's been playing for a while.  The problem is that it takes a certain amount of effort up front to get to that level, and our singer has suddenly (or maybe not so suddenly) decided that she can't make even that much effort.

I guess I've steered it back around to our situation.  I wasn't sure if you were giving an example to support your argument or just providing a relevant anecdote.  It sounds like our two bands are pretty different in terms of goals and structure, so I think it's important to keep that in mind.  But in any situation, someone not pulling their weight to the previously agreed-upon standard is a bad thing.

Offline Orbert

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Re: All musicians unite! - The Musicians Chat Thread
« Reply #459 on: September 26, 2014, 05:31:03 PM »
The other shoe drops.

Three weeks or so ago, John the band leader says that it's time to start working up that third set.  Emails go around, songs are picked, we decide on a next practice date: this Sunday at 5:00.  We've all been working on the new songs.  Karen actually participates in the email discussions, even makes some good suggestions.

Today she sends an email to everyone in the band, saying that she's really sorry, she's been trying to come to terms with this, but she's decided that she just can't continue with the band.  She says she knows she's let us down, she's tried to keep the band balanced with all of her other commitments, but it's just not working, etc.  In a way, it's a relief.  Things were looking better for a while, but I was kinda wondering how long it would last.  Scorpion and frog.

Mike, her husband, sends an email.  He's blown away!  "Respectfully, Karen, WTF?!"  He's pissed.  He's been working on the songs, a couple hours each, and she should've said something sooner.  Not only that, but he's her husband and this is how he finds out she's quitting the band they're both in?

Yeah, we kinda knew that these two didn't always communicate on things, but whoa.  Blindsided by his own wife.  And pissed about it, and blasting her on a Reply All to the whole band.

I wonder if this means he'll rethink his position on staying in the band.  He said he wouldn't stay if we fired her.  That would be understandably awkward, as it means that even if he voted to keep her, he stayed in a band that voted to can his own wife.  But this is different; she quit, obviously he had no idea that it was coming, and he's pissed.  Also, on a selfish level, I'd rather we didn't have to find a new bassist and a new singer at the same time.  We were just going to come off a two-month break; this could kill the band.

Offline Orbert

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Re: All musicians unite! - The Musicians Chat Thread
« Reply #460 on: September 26, 2014, 05:37:53 PM »
Ha, she just sent another email, all indignant, saying that he's the one that encouraged her to quit.  And some other things.

John sent texts to the rest of us (leaving Mike and Karen out) right after Mike's email, advising us to just keep quiet, let them spat.  Of course!  I've got a front row seat, I don't want to mess up the show.

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Re: All musicians unite! - The Musicians Chat Thread
« Reply #461 on: September 26, 2014, 05:39:58 PM »
:clap:
Hef is right on all things. Except for when I disagree with him. In which case he's probably still right.

Offline tiagodon

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Re: All musicians unite! - The Musicians Chat Thread
« Reply #462 on: September 26, 2014, 06:17:43 PM »
I saw this coming, man! I told ya before the situation wouldn't hold itself. I've walked that road. I'm glad you guys got rid of her!

Offline Orbert

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Re: All musicians unite! - The Musicians Chat Thread
« Reply #463 on: September 26, 2014, 07:56:08 PM »
Well, we didn't actually get rid of her; she quit.  But yeah, either way, we are rid of her.

Offline BlobVanDam

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Re: All musicians unite! - The Musicians Chat Thread
« Reply #464 on: September 26, 2014, 08:09:05 PM »
Whoa, that's some drama! I've been waiting for the update on this band. It's the backbone of the musician chat thread. :lol
Only King could mis-spell a LETTER.
Yep. I think the only party in the MP/DT situation that hasn't moved on is DTF.

Offline Orbert

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Re: All musicians unite! - The Musicians Chat Thread
« Reply #465 on: September 26, 2014, 08:20:15 PM »
:lol

Sadly, the emails have stopped.  I think they both said their respective pieces and have calmed down enough to realize that Reply All is not the proper forum for a husband-wife spat.

So this Sunday's practice is cancelled now.  I'm not surprised.  Steve (lead guitar) told me a while back that he was checking out another female singer, and she was pretty good, but he didn't want to jump the gun or have anyone get upset, so he hadn't contacted her or anything.  Shit, now it looks like we just should've pulled the trigger back then.

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Re: All musicians unite! - The Musicians Chat Thread
« Reply #466 on: September 26, 2014, 08:47:31 PM »
:lol

Sadly, the emails have stopped.  I think they both said their respective pieces and have calmed down enough to realize that Reply All is not the proper forum for a husband-wife spat.


You think? :neverusethis:

So she can't reply to emails at regular times, but then after she quits, it's constant. :lol She has some serious communication issues.
Only King could mis-spell a LETTER.
Yep. I think the only party in the MP/DT situation that hasn't moved on is DTF.

Offline Orbert

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Re: All musicians unite! - The Musicians Chat Thread
« Reply #467 on: September 27, 2014, 10:13:38 AM »
The past couple of weeks, it seemed like she'd actually figured it out.  As I said, she participated in the discussions about which songs to do next, who's singing what, what key, that kind of thing.  She was making an obvious effort to communicate and make it work, basically solving the only real problem we had with her.  Then suddenly "I can't do this anymore, I quit."

I think Mike's reaction was real, I think it caught him completely off guard, and he went ahead and shared his reply with everyone to let us know that he was just as shocked as we were.

Then she had to defend herself of course, saying he was the one who encouraged her to quit.  I honestly can't see that, it doesn't make any sense, but I can imagine it being a twisting of certain conversations.  She's really busy, she's got so many things going on, she can't handle it all, and he says maybe she should consider dropping something.  Too many plates in the air, something's gonna fall and break.  The topic comes up a few more times, the way it does between a married couple, and again the only advice he can offer is to cut back on the number of things she's trying to do at once.  So she quits the band.

If there had been a next email, it would have been from Mike, saying "I said to quit *something*, not quit the band we're in *together*!"  That's my guess.

Offline Orbert

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Re: All musicians unite! - The Musicians Chat Thread
« Reply #468 on: September 30, 2014, 12:38:21 PM »
Shit.  So Mike is out, too.  He says it has nothing to do with the band itself, as he likes us and likes playing with us, but has everything to do with trying to build back his relationship with his wife.  Apparently they've been having problems lately, have been separated on and off, and this is why he didn't see it coming, and earlier could not commit to being the liason between her and the band.  Communication has been strained of late, and dropping out of the band will help them both.  He's said from the beginning that he's only in it because of Karen, so this isn't really a surprise, just disappointing.  But I didn't know about all the shit that's been going on behind the scenes.  So there ya go.  We need a new singer and a new bass player.

Offline tiagodon

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Re: All musicians unite! - The Musicians Chat Thread
« Reply #469 on: September 30, 2014, 12:48:07 PM »
Well, keep on going... You have a keyboard, just do the bass lines and ask for the drummer to improve on the bass too.
Ask one of the guitar players to sing till you find a new singer.
Maybe, after all this adaptation process, you find out you donīt need anybody else in the band!  :biggrin:

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Re: All musicians unite! - The Musicians Chat Thread
« Reply #470 on: September 30, 2014, 12:57:40 PM »
One of the guitarists does some lead vocals.  Actually, he's been doing about 2/3 of them up until now, but that was never the plan.  It was supposed to be about 2/3 Karen and 1/3 Steve, but since Karen never picked songs and wouldn't sing songs she didn't like, Steve ended up singing more, but we've got a couple of female singers lined up, so John said to watch our emails for audition times.

As for the bass, I've done keyboard bass before, but never in a "real" rock setting (church band only).

I know your suggestions were half tongue-in-cheek, but we've actually knocked around the different variations already, and really do need to replace each of them.

Offline sneakyblueberry

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Re: All musicians unite! - The Musicians Chat Thread
« Reply #471 on: September 30, 2014, 03:11:46 PM »
Keyboard bass sounds like such a better option, over having a living, breathing bass player :lol I say that as a bass player myself.  You would have a much more versatile sound. 

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Re: All musicians unite! - The Musicians Chat Thread
« Reply #472 on: September 30, 2014, 05:18:04 PM »
The problem is that we've specifically picked a lot of songs because they have keyboards in them.  And songs with keyboards... tend to actually have keyboards (plural).  Piano and strings, organ and piano, piano and synth, etc.  If it's not a basic guitar-rock song, then at least half the time, I'm going two-handed already, so covering bass as well just isn't an option.

Offline sneakyblueberry

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Re: All musicians unite! - The Musicians Chat Thread
« Reply #473 on: September 30, 2014, 07:11:58 PM »
What about a midi foot controller/keyboard thing? I have one thats one octave and it comes in handy when I need both hands.  Granted you probably couldn't get too tech with it, then again I don't know how good you are with your feet :lol

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Re: All musicians unite! - The Musicians Chat Thread
« Reply #474 on: September 30, 2014, 08:38:12 PM »
I'm not a organist.  That is, not a real organist, the kind who can run scales with their feet.  Besides that, you have to be sitting down to do that.

Bass pedals and even keyboard bass are no substitute for a real bass player.

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Re: All musicians unite! - The Musicians Chat Thread
« Reply #475 on: September 30, 2014, 08:40:27 PM »
Fuck it Bob. Fly me out there. I'll play bass.
I just don't understand what they were trying to achieve with any part of the song, either individually or as a whole. You know what? It's the Platypus of Dream Theater songs. That bill doesn't go with that tail, or that strange little furry body, or those webbed feet, and oh god why does it have venomous spurs!? And then you find out it lays eggs too. The difference is that the Platypus is somehow functional despite being a crazy mishmash or leftover animal pieces

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Re: All musicians unite! - The Musicians Chat Thread
« Reply #476 on: October 01, 2014, 08:33:40 AM »
Thanks for the offer, Jay.  I'm not sure how well it'd go over with the others, telling them there's this guy I know from the Internet, and we need to pay to fly him out for an audition, but I'll keep it in mind.  ;)

I guess John has been in contact with Rob, our original bass player, who dropped out to fight his cancer which had come back.  Actually, he never lost contact with him; he said he talks to him every couple of weeks, and he (Rob) knows our situation and has offered to fill in if we need it.  I asked John how Rob's treatments have been going, if he's up to it, all that.  Turns out Rob hasn't started his treatments yet.  He's been putting it off.  I thought he dropped out of the band because he was going to be dealing with that, and John said that's what he thought, too, but apparently not.  So I guess I don't know what's going on there.  But we weren't talking about getting him back in the band, just that he'd offered to fill in if we need it.  But with no gigs lined up, and no singer, that's not an issue right now.

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Re: All musicians unite! - The Musicians Chat Thread
« Reply #477 on: October 01, 2014, 11:03:06 AM »
You'd also have to pay for a decent bass and rig... seeing as I have a piece of shit bottom of the line Samick and a 15 watt amp.


Do we have a deal>
I just don't understand what they were trying to achieve with any part of the song, either individually or as a whole. You know what? It's the Platypus of Dream Theater songs. That bill doesn't go with that tail, or that strange little furry body, or those webbed feet, and oh god why does it have venomous spurs!? And then you find out it lays eggs too. The difference is that the Platypus is somehow functional despite being a crazy mishmash or leftover animal pieces

-BlobVanDam on "Scarred"

Offline sneakyblueberry

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Re: All musicians unite! - The Musicians Chat Thread
« Reply #478 on: October 01, 2014, 09:41:16 PM »
I'm not a organist.  That is, not a real organist, the kind who can run scales with their feet.  Besides that, you have to be sitting down to do that.

Bass pedals and even keyboard bass are no substitute for a real bass player.

I'm not even a keyboardist and I manage to play simple stuff, I think you'd have a far easier time doing it than I seeing as you have actual keyboard skills :lol

I'd bet my bass rig that noone besides the musicians in the room would notice there was no bass player there :lol most people just think I'm playing electric guitar at our gigs. 

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Re: All musicians unite! - The Musicians Chat Thread
« Reply #479 on: October 01, 2014, 11:36:35 PM »
So our singer isn't putting in nearly as much effort as the rest of us in the band, which is something we've been struggling with for the last year. I've spoken to him about if multiple times and he just gave me the same old "Okay man", "you got it man" bullshit. So we've decided to kick him out of the band, which is gonna take place on friday. I'm kinda bummed about it cause I've known the guy since the first grade, and I get the feeling he's gonna take it really personally. *sigh*

Offline Orbert

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Re: All musicians unite! - The Musicians Chat Thread
« Reply #480 on: October 01, 2014, 11:39:40 PM »
That sucks.  Axing someone you know and have known for a long time is rough.  I've only actually known Karen and Mike for three or four years, but she was holding us back, and if it had come to a vote, I probably would've voted to axe her.  And I would've felt shitty about it.

Offline tiagodon

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Re: All musicians unite! - The Musicians Chat Thread
« Reply #481 on: October 02, 2014, 06:07:00 AM »
Itīs the old dichotomy friendship x business.
People must have a rational attitude in order not to mix it up.  Being a good friend has got nothing to do with being a good business partner.

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Re: All musicians unite! - The Musicians Chat Thread
« Reply #482 on: October 06, 2014, 11:59:26 AM »
For the next six weeks or so at church, I will be moving over to acoustic guitar because a guitarist is taking a leave of absence.  We have new guy who does percussion/drums, so he will be sliding over to my spot.

It will be good to play guitar again for awhile.
Hef is right on all things. Except for when I disagree with him. In which case he's probably still right.

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Re: All musicians unite! - The Musicians Chat Thread
« Reply #483 on: October 06, 2014, 01:02:14 PM »
Be prepared.  All those people who forgot or didn't realize that you play guitar will be coming up to you afterwards, saying "Wow, you play drums and guitar? You're so talented!"

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Re: All musicians unite! - The Musicians Chat Thread
« Reply #484 on: October 06, 2014, 01:12:52 PM »
Be prepared.  All those people who forgot or didn't realize that you play guitar will be coming up to you afterwards, saying "Wow, you play drums and guitar? You're so talented!"
Yeah, I get that every time I switch things up.

The funny thing is that I'm only talented enough that people who don't play anything think I'm pretty good.  I have no illusions about my abilities.   I am serviceable, but not much beyond that.  With guitar, I am strictly rhythm.

It's kind of funny.  Not sure how else to explain it, but when I play guitar, I'm thinking of drums, and when I play drums, I'm thinking of guitar.  It's like I'm playing one THROUGH another. 

I need the work on guitar anyway.  I am playing a wedding in a couple of weeks, I need the practice lol
Hef is right on all things. Except for when I disagree with him. In which case he's probably still right.

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Re: All musicians unite! - The Musicians Chat Thread
« Reply #485 on: October 06, 2014, 03:20:50 PM »
Cool!
We have something in common! I also play the guitar and the drums.
I have 2 bands today: one for the guitar and the other one for the drums!
People say I'm a pretty good guitarist. But I got tired of it and started taking drums lessons! Life is too short to spend it all playing only one instrument! :biggrin:
Anyway, I'm having a hard time trying to think as a drummer! I started to study jazz drummers to work it out!

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Re: All musicians unite! - The Musicians Chat Thread
« Reply #486 on: October 06, 2014, 04:01:32 PM »
I think I get what Hef is talking about.  Whatever instrument you play, if you're in an ensemble, what you play shouldn't just be played in isolation.  You should always be thinking about how what you're doing contributes to the group as a whole.  That's especially important in a cover band, as it's usually a given that you won't have the exact same instrumentation as on the original recording.  During the chorus, there's extra background vocals, or maybe some strings or something.  You might not have that available, but you can fill things in a bit with keyboards.  During the guitar solo, be ready to add something, otherwise things will sound empty even with the guitar solo going on because up to this point he was providing a second rhythm guitar.  That kind of thing.

Piano is my main instrument, but when I'm playing solo or accompanying someone, I'm thinking about the original arrangement.  When it gets to the heavy part of the song, where the drums kick in big time and the guitars start hitting power chords, I have to emulate that on the piano.  Big chords straddling middle C so they have some guts, octaves in the left hand, and play everything percussively.  During the quieter parts of the song, lighten up, arpeggios and open inversions, maybe some flourishes in the right hand.  I'm playing the piano, but thinking about the drums, guitars, bass, anything else that's going on in the song, even if it's just in my head, because it will come out through my hands.

Offline tiagodon

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Re: All musicians unite! - The Musicians Chat Thread
« Reply #487 on: October 06, 2014, 04:34:09 PM »
It's much easier to think for the group as a guitar player than as a drummer!
I am a soloist when playing the guitar. So I'm not interested in a kind of drumming that is just "the guy in the back". My guitar playing is obviously affecting my drumming attitude. I want to be a Portnoy kind of drummer! I don't want to be an AC/DC kind of drummer!
So it's really hard to build a song as a drummer (if you want to be more than just the metronome of the band).I mean, to orchestrate the syncopation, to work the possible combinations inside the bars, to keep the tempo...
God, how I respect the drummers! Tough instrument!

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Re: All musicians unite! - The Musicians Chat Thread
« Reply #488 on: October 06, 2014, 08:39:16 PM »
I think I get what Hef is talking about. 
Yeah, sounds like you do.  :tup
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Re: All musicians unite! - The Musicians Chat Thread
« Reply #489 on: October 13, 2014, 11:22:01 AM »
Be prepared.  All those people who forgot or didn't realize that you play guitar will be coming up to you afterwards, saying "Wow, you play drums and guitar? You're so talented!"
BTW, this exact same thing happened yesterday after our service  :lol
Hef is right on all things. Except for when I disagree with him. In which case he's probably still right.