Author Topic: All musicians unite! - The Musicians Chat Thread  (Read 97169 times)

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Offline tiagodon

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Re: All musicians unite! - The Musicians Chat Thread
« Reply #420 on: July 15, 2014, 11:34:20 AM »
Congrats, man! I know how it feels like to play without enjoying the moment. It sucks. But you rocked. Life sucks anyway. Just keep going!

Online Orbert

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Re: All musicians unite! - The Musicians Chat Thread
« Reply #421 on: July 15, 2014, 12:29:42 PM »
So we rocked, but didn't know it.

:lol I like this. It wouldn't be rock n roll if everything went smoothly.

I forgot to mention William, the sound man, who was amazing.  He's friends with Jim, who organized everything, and also Mike and Karen from my band, as Mike used to play in a band with Jim, and I met William last summer at a thing at Mike's house where Mike and Jim's band played, and William ran sound for the whole thing (got all that?) which was also a multi-band event.

Anyway, we couldn't hear shit from on stage and just had to trust that the sound man was gonna somehow make it all sound good, or at least as good as possible, and he did just that.  I've heard audio from four songs now, and the mix is great.  We're all war-scarred veteran rockers and know the drill.  Doesn't matter, you just keep playing, and trust your sound man, 'cause there's nothing else you can do.  We were very fortunate to have him at the sound board.

William, you are the man. :tup

Offline Lucien

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Re: All musicians unite! - The Musicians Chat Thread
« Reply #422 on: July 15, 2014, 01:14:55 PM »
Which reminds me, last Saturday I played the final concert with the American Festival for the Arts, where we played three amazing pieces:

Prelude to Die Meistersinger von Nurnburg, Wagner
Piano Concerto No. 4 Mvt. 3, Beethoven
Polovetsian Dances 8/17, Borodin

It was an awesome concert.
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Offline Onno

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Re: All musicians unite! - The Musicians Chat Thread
« Reply #423 on: July 16, 2014, 02:58:04 AM »
That's awesome Lucien! And congrats on having done your first gig Orbert  :tup

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Re: All musicians unite! - The Musicians Chat Thread
« Reply #424 on: July 16, 2014, 08:56:02 AM »
Our church band (we provide music every Sunday) is preparing for a concert at the end of August.  Looking forward to that, we will be able to "stretch" a little as musicians and play some stuff we wouldn't ordinarily get to play on Sunday mornings.
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Re: All musicians unite! - The Musicians Chat Thread
« Reply #425 on: July 16, 2014, 10:47:01 AM »
Which reminds me, last Saturday I played the final concert with the American Festival for the Arts, where we played three amazing pieces:

Prelude to Die Meistersinger von Nurnburg, Wagner
Piano Concerto No. 4 Mvt. 3, Beethoven
Polovetsian Dances 8/17, Borodin

It was an awesome concert.

Sounds awesome!  But why is it the final concert?


Our church band (we provide music every Sunday) is preparing for a concert at the end of August.  Looking forward to that, we will be able to "stretch" a little as musicians and play some stuff we wouldn't ordinarily get to play on Sunday mornings.

Cool!  One of our guitarists wanted to do something like that, but for some reason we never really went anywhere with the idea.  Maybe we should revisit it.

Offline Lucien

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Re: All musicians unite! - The Musicians Chat Thread
« Reply #426 on: July 16, 2014, 03:18:49 PM »
Well, there were other concerts that we did of slightly more obscure material. This was awesome, well-known stuff, on an awesome stage.
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Re: All musicians unite! - The Musicians Chat Thread
« Reply #427 on: July 20, 2014, 05:10:21 AM »
Our church band (we provide music every Sunday) is preparing for a concert at the end of August.  Looking forward to that, we will be able to "stretch" a little as musicians and play some stuff we wouldn't ordinarily get to play on Sunday mornings.

Cool!  One of our guitarists wanted to do something like that, but for some reason we never really went anywhere with the idea.  Maybe we should revisit it.
One song I have suggested to our director is Marvin Gaye's "Wholy Holy."  It's very much a soul/jazz/mellow gospel feel, from the What's Going On? album.  I doubt she will go for it, but I think it would be loads of fun.
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Online Orbert

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Re: All musicians unite! - The Musicians Chat Thread
« Reply #428 on: July 20, 2014, 08:15:46 AM »
Why wouldn't she go for it?  The genre, or the message?  We've gotten away with everything from "secular yet spiritual" (My Sweet Lord, Put Your Hand in the Hand, Spirit in the Sky) to things with "a positive message" (Let It Be, Saturday in the Park).  Of course, we're Protestants, so maybe we get more leeway.

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Re: All musicians unite! - The Musicians Chat Thread
« Reply #429 on: August 01, 2014, 11:06:00 AM »
Why wouldn't she go for it?  The genre, or the message?  We've gotten away with everything from "secular yet spiritual" (My Sweet Lord, Put Your Hand in the Hand, Spirit in the Sky) to things with "a positive message" (Let It Be, Saturday in the Park).  Of course, we're Protestants, so maybe we get more leeway.
If she doesn't go for it (no ruling yet), it would be for musical reasons, not the message.

She is (and there is really no other way to say this) very, very white.
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Online Orbert

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Re: All musicians unite! - The Musicians Chat Thread
« Reply #430 on: August 03, 2014, 03:56:51 PM »
That's a bummer.  I understand some people feel very strongly that only "traditional" music should be played in church, but numbers are down overall and that's a fact, and one way to help draw in new people is make the service more interesting and/or fun, or at least less boring, and playing music at least from the 20th century if not the 21st can help a lot.

Offline tiagodon

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Re: All musicians unite! - The Musicians Chat Thread
« Reply #431 on: August 03, 2014, 05:52:02 PM »
Imagine churches without music... I think the main thing keeping christianity alive is music.

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Re: All musicians unite! - The Musicians Chat Thread
« Reply #432 on: August 03, 2014, 11:12:56 PM »
That's always been true, though.  Songs of praise have always been an integral part of worship.  I agree that today, though, it's probably more important than ever.  The problem comes when the people in charge have trouble distinguishing between service and entertainment.

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Re: All musicians unite! - The Musicians Chat Thread
« Reply #433 on: August 04, 2014, 12:58:03 PM »
That's a bummer.  I understand some people feel very strongly that only "traditional" music should be played in church, but numbers are down overall and that's a fact, and one way to help draw in new people is make the service more interesting and/or fun, or at least less boring, and playing music at least from the 20th century if not the 21st can help a lot.
Oh, we do plenty of non-boring, more contemporary praise music.  My wife and I have even written a few that we have done in the past; I may post some one of these days.

But we are basically white, and not nearly black enough for my tastes.  Especially the director.  She's pretty uptight, and "paper-trained", if you know what I mean.
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Re: All musicians unite! - The Musicians Chat Thread
« Reply #434 on: August 04, 2014, 02:30:02 PM »
Ahhh, now I get it.  Marvin Gaye is... not white.  The literal interpretation of your words actually blew right past me.  I guess that's a good thing; it just confused me for a minute.

Still, that's too bad.  We would be able to play that song no problem, and our congregation is all white except for one person: me.

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Re: All musicians unite! - The Musicians Chat Thread
« Reply #435 on: August 08, 2014, 06:37:17 AM »
We are definitely all white.  We definitely need more non-white.

This Sunday she has us working on (just as pre-service music, which is when we generally do something not as serious) Amazing Grace to the tune of the Eagles' Seven Bridges Road.  I was skeptical until rehearsal last night, but it came out pretty good.
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Offline tiagodon

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Re: All musicians unite! - The Musicians Chat Thread
« Reply #436 on: August 08, 2014, 03:54:27 PM »
I read these days some news about christian rock bands. Seems like many musicians in these bands are atheists and play only for the money or the spotlight.
It became a business of its own, totally separated from the church and its message (if there's any).

Offline Shadow Ninja 2.0

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Re: All musicians unite! - The Musicians Chat Thread
« Reply #437 on: August 08, 2014, 04:10:31 PM »
That seems odd to me. I got the impression that most Christian bands didn't make that much at all.
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Re: All musicians unite! - The Musicians Chat Thread
« Reply #438 on: August 08, 2014, 08:13:17 PM »
They don't, for the most part.
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Offline BlobVanDam

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Re: All musicians unite! - The Musicians Chat Thread
« Reply #439 on: August 08, 2014, 11:56:13 PM »
Doesn't seem like a very lucrative niche to me. :lol
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Offline tiagodon

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Re: All musicians unite! - The Musicians Chat Thread
« Reply #440 on: August 09, 2014, 04:37:31 AM »
It probably won't make you rich, but surely you can make a living.
If you have a dream of becoming a "rock star", get on stage, make a crowd sing along, the easiest way is attending a church, show the "praise dept" you can play or sing, start playing on sundays... Man you get what most underground bands don't get: a crowd and a stage! Every week!
Nobody has to know you are an atheist. And you are there, fulfilling your dream, being a "rock star". And if your band is good enough, maybe you can reach other churches stages with the support of the president of your church. Who knows, in the future, making a record with the money of your dear church members...

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Re: All musicians unite! - The Musicians Chat Thread
« Reply #441 on: August 09, 2014, 06:17:16 AM »
It probably won't make you rich, but surely you can make a living.
If you have a dream of becoming a "rock star", get on stage, make a crowd sing along, the easiest way is attending a church, show the "praise dept" you can play or sing, start playing on sundays... Man you get what most underground bands don't get: a crowd and a stage! Every week!
Nobody has to know you are an atheist. And you are there, fulfilling your dream, being a "rock star". And if your band is good enough, maybe you can reach other churches stages with the support of the president of your church. Who knows, in the future, making a record with the money of your dear church members...
That sounds awful.

If word of something like this ever got out, that person would rue the day.  It would be a short-lived career.  Christians would drop them in a heartbeat.

Why in the world would you fake it?  Especially in a genre as difficult to stand out in as Christian music?  That's just a total lack of class, and the mark of a true asshat.
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Offline tiagodon

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Re: All musicians unite! - The Musicians Chat Thread
« Reply #442 on: August 09, 2014, 06:31:19 AM »
It probably won't make you rich, but surely you can make a living.
If you have a dream of becoming a "rock star", get on stage, make a crowd sing along, the easiest way is attending a church, show the "praise dept" you can play or sing, start playing on sundays... Man you get what most underground bands don't get: a crowd and a stage! Every week!
Nobody has to know you are an atheist. And you are there, fulfilling your dream, being a "rock star". And if your band is good enough, maybe you can reach other churches stages with the support of the president of your church. Who knows, in the future, making a record with the money of your dear church members...
That sounds awful.

If word of something like this ever got out, that person would rue the day.  It would be a short-lived career.  Christians would drop them in a heartbeat.

Why in the world would you fake it?  Especially in a genre as difficult to stand out in as Christian music?  That's just a total lack of class, and the mark of a true asshat.

Agreed. I have a friend that tried it. I guess he is still trying...

Offline PuffyPat

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Re: All musicians unite! - The Musicians Chat Thread
« Reply #443 on: August 16, 2014, 10:41:13 AM »
Show #2 for Night Tribe tonight. Super excited to play live again. We're doing pretty much the same set, but with an extended jam/intro for one of the songs that we worked on a bit yesterday. we only have 20-25 minutes, so it's not a whole lot to work with, but I think we have a really solid 20+ minutes right now, so that works really well for us.
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Re: All musicians unite! - The Musicians Chat Thread
« Reply #444 on: August 28, 2014, 06:32:34 PM »
Update on Orbert's Band

It's been a while, but not a lot has been happening.  We played another gig, another freebie.  When originally scheduled, it was to be our first gig.  The neighborhood party in the neighborhood where John (band leader) lives.  His wife is on the planning committee and we got booked for the entertainment.  At the time (April or May I believe) we were just starting to put our second set together, but figured we could have two sets down by the end of July.  Then that other gig came up, the charity gig where we rocked but didn't realize it, and it was two weeks earlier, so it was our first gig.  This party was just that, a party.  Free food and drink, in which we tried not to indulge too heavily, and we were also much looser, having played our first gig already.  So we were even better this time.





So now we're into the business of getting our third set together, which around here is a "full night".  You can play out with only three sets because (1) a lot of places only need two or three hours of live music a night, and (2) you can repeat songs from the first set if necessary because no one stays that long, and if they do, they're too drunk to care.

And the problems have started to arise again.

Our singer, Karen, is not a prima donna.  She's actually really cool.  She's just a flake, and really busy.  Because we all work day jobs and the band is just a thing, we mostly communicate via email.  Emails go around with songs and people offer feedback, and we vote, and we have the next three songs we're going to work on, and at some point we notice that Karen hasn't said anything, then she finally speaks up and doesn't like one of the songs and one of the other ones is okay, but there's this other song which is probably better for her voice.  And she's right, but it would have been nice if she'd said something a week earlier.

Her excuse is that she's so busy, so can't check her email every day or every night like a lot of people, but every couple of days (more like once a week or two weeks, but whatever).  And then there are "thousands" of emails piled up, so she has to kinda skim through them.  This means that she's often late to the conversation, gives her input on things that we'd thought we decided weeks earlier, and in general causes chaos.  She's said from the beginning that without a lot of free time, what she'd really like to do with this band is "just show up and sing".  And hey, once we get the third set nailed down, we can coast a little bit.  All any of us have to do is just show up and do the songs.  All this more timely communication won't be so critical, as long as everyone knows when the gigs and practices are.  And we'll need to add and drop songs from time to time, but that's down the road, too.  But we're not there yet.  Right now, we need everyone to participate.  It's really not that hard.  Just keep your head in the game for another month or so, and we can get this figured out.

And there's now an added complication.  Our bassist, Mike, is Karen's husband.   He's a great guy, an excellent bassist, all that, but if Karen goes, he goes too.  He has another band, but joined this one because we needed a bassist and he had never actually played in a band with Karen before.  He knows she's a flake.  Not difficult to get along with in the classic sense, difficult to get along with because she's not all there.  But when she does get around to giving her input, she's right.  The standing rule is that if you don't provide your input, you can't complain about the output.  Ever try telling a female that?  I'm sorry if that's sexist, but it's generally true.  And even if it weren't, there's still the problem that she's our lead singer, a damned good one, and if we try to "lay down the law" she could just decide that it's not worth it, and we lose a great singer and a great bassist.  We don't want her gone; we want her to get her shit together.  But we shouldn't have to schmooze one of our own band members.

John related to us the parable of The Scorpion and The Frog.  If you don't know it, look it up.  I knew it already.  The basic message is: people don't change, they do what they do.  She's not going to change, and we can't expect her to.  If it's a problem, we either learn to deal with it, or do what's necessary, which is to can her, and we lose Mike, too.  And hell, I'm mostly in it because of Mike and Karen, so that gives me something to think about, too.  Right now, we're pretty good.  We're getting better.  We will probably be able to find another singer and bassist, but that will take time, and it will take time getting them up to speed, and dammit, I hate doing things over and over again.  We've been through this shit so many times already.

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Re: All musicians unite! - The Musicians Chat Thread
« Reply #445 on: August 28, 2014, 09:58:56 PM »
If she's married to another member of the band, why is she behind on this stuff? Get Mike to keep her informed on band emails, so when you vote on something, he can just get her input and put it in his email, or let her know what's going on. Am I missing something?
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Offline Lucien

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Re: All musicians unite! - The Musicians Chat Thread
« Reply #446 on: August 28, 2014, 10:25:41 PM »
If she's married to another member of the band, why is she behind on this stuff?

Yeah, that confused me quite a bit as well.
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Re: All musicians unite! - The Musicians Chat Thread
« Reply #447 on: August 28, 2014, 11:31:58 PM »
Mike is as frustrated by this as the rest of us, but because he is her husband, he knows that there's nothing he can do.  He cannot persuade her to read her emails and vote on the songs for the band, he cannot force her to do anything.  She says she knows, yeah yeah, she'll get to it.  Then another week goes by.  It is confusing, in a way.  I too would have thought that because this is something they're involved in together, that there would be more of an incentive for each of them to stay on top of things, try hard to make it succeed.  Mike is always on top of things, always knows his parts, but that's because we're not exactly doing challenging songs, he's been playing a long time and knows most of them anyway, and is a real pro.  But this isn't even about the playing.  It's about answering your fucking email and honoring the commitment to the band.

Mike has also said that he doesn't want to be the "liason" between her and the band.  He's not going to ask her what songs she decided on and let us know for her.  He's not going to tell her that there's a new email from John and we need to read it.  First of all, that's stupid.  I wouldn't put him in that position.  She's an adult, she should answer her email.  Second, and this is just a guess, but I'm thinking even if he asked her, she'd just say she hasn't had a chance to think about it, and she'll get to it.

As of tomorrow, it will have been another week.  As with the scorpion and the frog, I don't think things are going to change, and if we let her ride us, she'll sting us and we'll all drown.  What makes it worse is that it hasn't always been like this.  We haven't even been doing this very long, only about eight months, and at first everybody was into it.  I guess she got bored with it or something, and just doesn't want to make the effort, and the fact that her husband is in the band doesn't make any difference.

Maybe she is a prima donna after all.  I've known Karen a long time, she's a friend, so maybe I'm not seeing things clearly.  But this is a clear-cut case of something not happening because she doesn't want it to happen, and it will happen when she's damned good and ready.  I've always seen it as flakiness.  John called me and used the same word.  He said he didn't want to offend me or anything, but Karen is "a real flake".  It's weird because she's such a nice person, a real sweetheart, that I can't imagine that she's doing this on purpose.  But she's got us over a barrel.  We can't make a move without her.  And that's gotta change.

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Re: All musicians unite! - The Musicians Chat Thread
« Reply #448 on: August 29, 2014, 12:56:25 AM »
Mike has also said that he doesn't want to be the "liason" between her and the band.  He's not going to ask her what songs she decided on and let us know for her.  He's not going to tell her that there's a new email from John and we need to read it.  First of all, that's stupid.  I wouldn't put him in that position.  She's an adult, she should answer her email.  Second, and this is just a guess, but I'm thinking even if he asked her, she'd just say she hasn't had a chance to think about it, and she'll get to it.

Seems like it would be a simple enough thing to do without causing any problems, but I officially do not understand people. Hopefully things get sorted without the band taking a couple of steps backwards.
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Re: All musicians unite! - The Musicians Chat Thread
« Reply #449 on: August 29, 2014, 01:10:52 PM »
I just don't understand how someone cannot get around to checking email more than once a week in 2014.


Maybe that's just because I'm young.
I just don't understand what they were trying to achieve with any part of the song, either individually or as a whole. You know what? It's the Platypus of Dream Theater songs. That bill doesn't go with that tail, or that strange little furry body, or those webbed feet, and oh god why does it have venomous spurs!? And then you find out it lays eggs too. The difference is that the Platypus is somehow functional despite being a crazy mishmash or leftover animal pieces

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Re: All musicians unite! - The Musicians Chat Thread
« Reply #450 on: August 29, 2014, 01:16:00 PM »
Yeah, checking my email is literally the first thing I do when I wake up, before even getting out of bed. :lol


But then again, I have no life, so take that for what it's worth.
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Re: All musicians unite! - The Musicians Chat Thread
« Reply #451 on: August 29, 2014, 03:29:40 PM »
I have a life... and I check my email literally several times an hour. It's not hard when my phone notifies me of every piece of spam that comes in to my inbox...
I just don't understand what they were trying to achieve with any part of the song, either individually or as a whole. You know what? It's the Platypus of Dream Theater songs. That bill doesn't go with that tail, or that strange little furry body, or those webbed feet, and oh god why does it have venomous spurs!? And then you find out it lays eggs too. The difference is that the Platypus is somehow functional despite being a crazy mishmash or leftover animal pieces

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Re: All musicians unite! - The Musicians Chat Thread
« Reply #452 on: August 30, 2014, 05:53:29 AM »
Yeah, even my mother (who can barely computer) checks her email multiple times a day.

There is no way she is "too busy" to check her email and get back with you guys.  You aren't her backup band, you are a band together.  It's not just something she does when she feels like it, because it's not just her life, its all of your lives.  You guys have to plan things, and communication is the key.

There is REALLY no excuse if her husband is in the band.  If she can't be assed to check her email, then he should discuss these things with her when HE reads HIS email.  Refusal to do this on his part is just as disrespectful to the band as her not doing it herself.  They both need to get their shit together.
Hef is right on all things. Except for when I disagree with him. In which case he's probably still right.

Online Orbert

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Re: All musicians unite! - The Musicians Chat Thread
« Reply #453 on: August 30, 2014, 11:55:48 AM »
Yeah, that's what it's looking like.  As I've mentioned earlier, they're both really laid-back people, always relaxed and chill.  What I didn't realize is that's because they don't seem to give a shit about anything, if they don't want to.

We all have our priorities, we all have different things going on in our lives.  The band is just a hobby, an amusement on the side, for all of us.  There's still a presumed "minimum level of commitment" from all involved, but that obviously varies from person to person.  The question then is how much shit are you willing to put up with from the others, because it is just a side thing, we're not making any money and never will, and it's still fun to get together and play.  That's all I'm in it for, anyway.  Right now, I've got some other shit going on at work and in my home life, and this break with the band has actually come at a pretty good time, so I haven't been that worried about it.  It's frustrating, but I have other shit to worry about, too.

Offline tiagodon

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Re: All musicians unite! - The Musicians Chat Thread
« Reply #454 on: August 31, 2014, 01:54:22 PM »
My suggestion woulb be: get rid of the girl. She's gotta go, you know that. It won't work. If her husband decides to go as well, that wouldn't be professional! If she is too busy even to pay attention to her own husband, then I guess he would not mind... But if he does, find another bass player.