Maybe this has been discussed before, but what if Mike Portnoy replaced Ulrich?

[bosk1]

I'm twenty nine years old

It was at this point in your post that I realized you don't have sufficient music cred to be discussing Metallica with me.

[Progmetty]

For me first and foremost is the guys playing ability, not how he looks.

Sadly that argument doesn't hold up for bands who wish to be commercially successful.

+ That was the last and smallest point I mentioned, could be just me.
Adami I don't think it's a sad matter, it's part of showmanship and the package as a whole.

[Progmetty]

I'm twenty nine years old

It was at this point in your post that I realized you don't have sufficient music cred to be discussing Metallica with me.

Something tells me there's enough of a joke in there to keep me from getting offended by that comment but also I'm pretty sure there's a lot of other Metallica fans of that age around here as well.

[Adami]

For me first and foremost is the guys playing ability, not how he looks.

Sadly that argument doesn't hold up for bands who wish to be commercially successful.

+ That was the last and smallest point I mentioned, could be just me.
Adami I don't think it's a sad matter, it's part of showmanship and the package as a whole.

It's logical, but sad for ugly guys like me.

[Progmetty]

Haha c'mon man no one said anything about looks as in facial features or anything like that. Besides you're handsome mofo 

[bosk1]

Please DON'T be offended.  It was completely a joke.  (sorry if that wasn't clear)  I don't really have much more to say on the Trujillo issue.  I just don't see any issue with him fitting the band.  My point about them filling Cliff's spot was merely just as a hypothetical.  Hypothetically, IF they had auditioned Trujillo at that point in time, based on his ability, reputation, and image, my response back then would have been along the lines of, "it makes total sense that they would take a look at that guy."  I'm not saying Jason didn't make sense.  I'm just saying that Trujillo would have made just as much sense from the standpoint of most of the fans.  Claypool, on the other hand, has the chops, but I can see why they felt he didn't fit.  And I think most fans would have felt the same way the band did.  I didn't know they had looked at him, but I agree with their decision completely.  He's a phenominal player, but doesn't really seem to fit.  Anyhow, not really much more to say about it.  We just don't happen to agree on that point.

[King Postwhore]

For me first and foremost is the guys playing ability, not how he looks.

Sadly that argument doesn't hold up for bands who wish to be commercially successful.

Very true but Metallica already was selling like wildfire.

I also remember Claypool in an interview say that he got the chance to audition because he was good friends with Kirk Hammet in high school but he went in their joking and the others were serious as a heart attack so he knew he didn't get the gig.

[Progmetty]

Claypool, on the other hand, has the chops, but I can see why they felt he didn't fit.  And I think most fans would have felt the same way the band did.  I didn't know they had looked at him, but I agree with their decision completely.  He's a phenominal player, but doesn't really seem to fit.  Anyhow, not really much more to say about it.  We just don't happen to agree on that point.

That's cool man, we seem to agree about Les Claypool's awesomeness though 
This actually reminded me of an old Metallica documentary I saw sometime in 1999 and had on VHS for the longest time, it was how I know about Claypool audition. Looked it up on youtube just now and here it is, Claypool explains what happens and he's hilarious: this link is to the exact time mark where they mention and interview him so you guys don't have to go through the whole thing, I just remembered where it was exactly cause I've seen that documentary over and over back in the day heh

[Adami]

For me first and foremost is the guys playing ability, not how he looks.

Sadly that argument doesn't hold up for bands who wish to be commercially successful.

Very true but Metallica already was selling like wildfire.

I also remember Claypool in an interview say that he got the chance to audition because he was good friends with Kirk Hammet in high school but he went in their joking and the others were serious as a heart attack so he knew he didn't get the gig.

They had popularity but no commercial success. All of their commercial success came with Newstead.

[Progmetty]

^ That had nothing to do with Newsted though, it was MOP going Gold then Platinum and the One music video in 88 putting them on MTV and such. They were heading to that point and Newsted just happened to walk in around their breakthrough time.
It was also around the time when Hetfield started growing facial hair which helped Metallica a lot

[bosk1]

facial hair

Sometimes, the correct answer is the most obvious.

[Adami]

^ That had nothing to do with Newsted though, it was MOP going Gold then Platinum and the One music video in 88 putting them on MTV and such. They were heading to that point and Newsted just happened to walk in around their breakthrough time.
It was also around the time when Hetfield started growing facial hair which helped Metallica a lot

lol clearly I wasn't saying Newstead was the cause of their success. Just that it happened when he joined the band.

[King Postwhore]

All of their commercial success stems from going with Bob Rock and changing their sound to a more commercial sound.

And yes their first video from the album before helped tremendously.


So I'd say the video and the stylistic change put them into another stratosphere. Not Jason Newstead.

[Adami]

God damnit I didn't say Newstead had anything to do with their success! I just said it happened during his time in the band!


Also, damnit king don't eat that kid!

[King Postwhore]

Dammit I can't read. I just eat little children!!

[DebraKadabra]

2. You might have seen Metallica live in the 80's with Cliff and lived through the RTL and MOP release dates and consequent tours but that's somewhat of a hardcore case and rarity as -even in the older age group- it's somewhat exclusive to U.S. audience, not even casual music audiences, but the people who found Metallica without MTV or radio*. Point being regarding the 80's and Cliff Burton: With no videos, radio play or T.V attention, if you're not in California or an absolute hardcore of a metal head with metal head connections: you have no "stuck" image Metallica with Cliff Burton.
* I know there are at least 5 people of that group here including Barto, Orbert and chefkingshmegland.

You'll have to add me to that group, dude - I heard of Metallica through my friends in high school, which was WAY before AJFA/the video for "One".
 
Sorry to just quote that part of your post though - carry on, folks!

[Progmetty]

So I'd say the video and the stylistic change put them into another stratosphere. Not Jason Newstead.

God damnit I didn't say Newstead had anything to do with their success! I just said it happened during his time in the band!

Guys, it's Newsted 

[Jaq]

It's like this for me:

I got into Metallica in late 1984. Local radio station had a metal show after midnight on Friday, they played For Whom The Bell Tolls, I went "what the fuck is THIS and where can I buy it?" and went out the next day and bought Ride The Lightning. I was a first day buyer of Master of Puppets.  I think I qualify for being a hardcore Metallica fan back in the day. And yet...I don't have the whole "Cliff is the guy I grew up with" thing going. He was the bassist on their first three albums. Then came Jason, who actually has the longest tenure in the band in terms of albums he played on-AFJA, Black, Load, Reload, the cover album, S&M, the live box set from 93 or so-and then Rob. I can understand perfectly why someone would say "Jason is who I think of as the bassist of Metallica," though. He was there the longest, played on the most albums, was on the most concert videos and music videos. Cliff? Let's face it, I loved the guy's work, but he probably could have walked by me in the local mall back in 85 and I wouldn't have had a clue who he was. Rob? One album he actually played on. To some people, Jason  WAS the bassist of Metallica, especially the fan base that arrived in 1991. Really don't understand why the discussion started 

[Adami]

Guys, it's Newsted 

Whatever, like he matters.

[Progmetty]

Guys, it's Newsted 

Whatever, like he matters.

I can almost hear the loud gum chewing with that line 

It's like this for me:

I got into Metallica in late 1984. Local radio station had a metal show after midnight on Friday, they played For Whom The Bell Tolls, I went "what the fuck is THIS and where can I buy it?" and went out the next day and bought Ride The Lightning. I was a first day buyer of Master of Puppets.  I think I qualify for being a hardcore Metallica fan back in the day. And yet...I don't have the whole "Cliff is the guy I grew up with" thing going. He was the bassist on their first three albums. Then came Jason, who actually has the longest tenure in the band in terms of albums he played on-AFJA, Black, Load, Reload, the cover album, S&M, the live box set from 93 or so-and then Rob. I can understand perfectly why someone would say "Jason is who I think of as the bassist of Metallica," though. He was there the longest, played on the most albums, was on the most concert videos and music videos. Cliff? Let's face it, I loved the guy's work, but he probably could have walked by me in the local mall back in 85 and I wouldn't have had a clue who he was. Rob? One album he actually played on. To some people, Jason  WAS the bassist of Metallica, especially the fan base that arrived in 1991. Really don't understand why the discussion started 

I don't remember but it's been a fun one 
So did you actually get to see them live in the 80's? if so which tour?

[pain of occupation]

a little late to the thread, but what the hell...

Why hasn't enybody called out the OP on Lars leaving the band and then managing or producing the next album.

WUT?!

whats wrong with the hypothetical? the scenario in general isnt THAT absurd. isnt it whats gone down with YES in recent years?

also, i agree with a lot of what progmetty has to say...in fact, i'll just come out and say it, Newsted is more metallica than any other current or former member of the band. (guess i better go throw this statement in the controversial opinions thread while im at it)

[King Postwhore]

You do know how controling Lars is and the fact that not once has he talked about leaving the band so that's why it is silly. 

It's obvious that Yes can rotate members in and out and they have no problem comming back but metallica is a different beast.  That's why.

[Dublagent66]

I think MP is a better drummer than LU, but it wouldn't help Metallica much.  Their problem in my opinion is songwriting, not the drums.  I lost interest in Metallica way back in the Load days.  Everything since then isn't even close to the reason I liked them.

It certainly wouldn't help MP much unless he's just looking for a giant pay raise.  I have the Adrenaline Mob album and MP's drumming is great, but the album is just ok and I wouldn't call it groundbreaking.  I don't think the hypothetical would work for anyone involved.