The Friends Appreciation Thread

[MoraWintersoul]

The characters in Friends got a little bit Flanderized over time (especially Joey), but it's nothing like what happened in TBBT. Generally it was as if they wanted to do 20 different types of jokes and only had 7 characters to assign them to. I haven't watched all of the Chuck Lorre shows but both I watched are practically the same show; men behave objectively repulsively and can't get laid, there's a revolving door of hot guest actresses they orbit around, then they inexplicably land someone and they do husband and wife jokes, then they fight because one of them is the worst person alive, and on it goes. This was that but with a thin veneer of geek culture, and people were generally turned off by how it was sold as "the smartest sitcom" when it was just one of those overgrown fratbro wankfests but with jokes about Star Trek. Friends only had a few of those "oh my god, how do you even have friends, let alone a girlfriend/boyfriend" moments, like that time Ross was attracted to his cousin.

[Stadler]

That's a good assessment of the Lorre blueprint.  I mentioned that I get TBBT after the news in the evening and late at night, and I get Two And A Half Men in the same way (TAAHM is on after TBBT in the evening, and in the spot of TBBT on weekends).  I swear some of the jokes are the same, even if the settings are different.  Mom is also on, on a different channel, on weeknights after the evening news and before a double-shot of King Of Queens, and that's right in there, except with female characters.  But Allison Janney's character in Mom might as well be Charlie Sheen's character in TAAHM, just after rehab.

[pg1067]

My point is BBT generally has a similar reputation as Adam Sandler movies or Nickelback (' You have terrible taste is you like ...........')  Whereas Friends generally has a lot more goodwill towards it.

As I said I find shows have a lot in common and both use similar comedy tropes - just wondering why the reputations of the shows in generally different.  Unless I'm misreading it?  Or is Friends that much better and I just don't see it?

There are certainly similarities, but I think Friends is much better.  Two or three primary reasons for that.  First, BBT had a couple of what I think were unnatural character evolutions.  Sheldon seemed more natural or organic, but Amy was very much not.  In my opinion, all of the character evolutions in Friends were natural.  Second, BBT's quality fell off at some point (I couldn't say exactly when).  While there were really good episodes all the way to the end, the first half of the series was, IMO, notably better than the second half.  Friends, on the other hand, and IMO, was much more consistent throughout.  Third, and this is purely subjective for me, I'm pretty much exactly the same age as the Friends characters (when the show premiered in Sept. 1994, the main characters were all around 25, and I was a month shy of my 27th birthday).  It therefore felt familiar and relevant to me.  It was "real."  It's one reason why re-examining the show based on current political correctness bugs me.  Straight guys didn't want to be mistaken for being gay, and we made fun of overweight people.  It's the way it was (and still is, but you just can't be vocal about it).

I think the intellectual aspect (that could be poor word choice on my part) of TBBT is a big turnoff for a lot of people. The show really takes it to another level and really rams it down your throat constantly. People either hate it from the get go, or they begin to get tired of it over time.

It rubs me sometimes. Like 1:20 of this clip: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C4_IFKA9LOY
I get that Sheldon is Sheldon, but to me it feels like a cheap and lazy way for the show to remind its viewers that its a "smart" show.

That whole interaction between  Sheldon and Penny was HILARIOUS!

Also, I think Friends is just more relatable to people. It's hard for me to really connect to anyone on TBBT, whereas with Friends, there's a lot of things across basically every character's arc that resonate with me and points in my life. I actually feel things watching Friends. There are genuinely sad moments in that show that remind you that life is just kind of shitty sometimes. I actually feel for the characters on it. 

Yes, yes, and more yes.


I'll now go google what it means to become "Flanderized."

[KevShmev]

  Friend, on the other hand, and IMO, was much more consistent throughout.  Third, and this is purely subjective for me, I'm pretty much exactly the same age as the Friends characters (when the show premiered in Sept. 1994, the main characters were all around 25, and I was a month shy of my 27th birthday).  It therefore felt familiar and relevant to me.  It was "real."  It's one reason why the reasons why re-examining the show based on current political correctness bugs me.  Straight guys didn't want to be mistaken for being gay, and we made fun of overweight people.  It's the way it was (and still is, but you just can't be vocal about it).

Well said.  As funny as Friends was and still is for me, the "real" moments of the first few seasons were what really made you like the characters.  Like Joey finding out his dad had a girlfriend on the side, or Rachel realizing how rough it was going to be dealing with her parents who were en route to a divorce, or Jack visiting Monica to see how she was doing following her breakup with Richard (one of my favorite "awwwww" moments of the series), or the real emotions Joey and Chandler felt when "breaking up" as roommates and then their coming back together once Eddie was kicked to the curb.  That half-hug/half-dance Joey and Chandler do when they reunite as roommates still stands as possibly the greatest moment of the series.  You can't help but smile and give a little fist pump when watching that.

[ZirconBlue]

More or less correct, and the name of the episode, "The One Where Ross Got High," is a bit misleading since it refers to an event that happened basically a decade prior, and it was a relatively small part of the episode.

"The One Where Ross Will Have Had Gotten High"

[Zantera]

The Friends characters did get flanderized over the years but weirdly a lot of it still worked for me. Ross originally was the 'average guy' with the best moral compass but some of my favorite moments were the crazy things he did in later seasons that were unrealistic for the character but still funny. Like the Unagi episode and every interaction he had about 'attacking' his friend and ex. Joey kinda got the Homer Simpsons treatment where he started off as a guy who was a bit stupid and clumsy but ultimately would do anything for his loved ones, but then turned into a grown up man child who befriends an 8 year old kid at the house Chandler/Monica are buying and she's at a higher intellectual level than him.

In contrast I think TBBT had a few solid seasons at the start but similar to another Chuck Lorre show, 2 ˝ Men, it never reached the height of Friends (imo) and once the formula was nailed down they just ran it into the ground. That show could have ended 5-6 seasons earlier and it wouldn't have made a big difference, whereas I enjoyed Friends pretty much all the way until the end.

[Kotowboy]

Yeah they definitely made Joey more stupid towards the end.

I remember thinking seaosn one of "Joey" wasn't terrible - but my "Friends" loving family said season 2 was awful.

[Zantera]

Making fun of a character being dumb is like the laziest way to get a laugh but it's just very hit & miss for me because if it feels too dumb then you can't relate it to someone actually doing it and it doesn't quite work. I get a good laugh from the episode when Chandler and Monica needs a letter of recommendation for their adoption agency and Joey uses the computer 'hacks' he learned from Ross to replace the words with more intelligent sounding words. This is funny to me because this was a feature we found in school when I was a kid and so the joke kinda hits for me because I can relate, even if Joey is an adult who should know better, I can buy the scenario. On the flip side, several seasons into the show (i forget which season) Joey asks Ross "Seriously, who would you sleep with, Monica or Rachel?" to which Ross replies "Dude you're sick" and Joey replies "Oh yeah I forgot you had the Rachel thing". I just don't believe anyone being that stupid to where they forget one of their closest friends is the brother of another of their closest friends to where this exchange happens. The episode where he buys the sailing boat and he thought the point was to guess the price of the boat is also a bit of a groaner to me because I don't believe he's THAT stupid.

And who could forget this classic?

[KevShmev]

I probably said this already in the thread, but I didn't like how they made Phoebe too ambivalent about her friends' feelings later in the series.  She was a very caring and great friend early on, but then in Season 7 she is letting it slip that Joey was who Monica wanted to sleep with in Paris and didn't give two craps about how that reveal affected Chandler.  That was totally out of her character for her, and not in a good way.

[Kotowboy]

But also - after 10 years - you don't want your characters to be the exact same person they were in Episode 1.

Something Happens - Chandler quips. Monica tidies up. Joey doesn't understand & Phoebe says something wacky.

Repeat for 10 years.

That's literally TBBT.

[Zantera]

But also - after 10 years - you don't want your characters to be the exact same person they were in Episode 1.

Something Happens - Chandler quips. Monica tidies up. Joey doesn't understand & Phoebe says something wacky.

Repeat for 10 years.

That's literally TBBT.

I think Kev's point is Phoebe changes for the worse which I think is a fair complaint. You want your character development to feel positive. Chandler for example IMO grows as a character and when he and Monica are ready to have kids, he's had an evolution and I can buy him becoming a dad.

As for TBBT I think some characters stayed the same but it suffers from the problem of everyone ending up in a relationship and becoming boring instead.

[Stadler]

But also - after 10 years - you don't want your characters to be the exact same person they were in Episode 1.

Something Happens - Chandler quips. Monica tidies up. Joey doesn't understand & Phoebe says something wacky.

Repeat for 10 years.

That's literally TBBT.

I think Kev's point is Phoebe changes for the worse which I think is a fair complaint. You want your character development to feel positive. Chandler for example IMO grows as a character and when he and Monica are ready to have kids, he's had an evolution and I can buy him becoming a dad.

As for TBBT I think some characters stayed the same but it suffers from the problem of everyone ending up in a relationship and becoming boring instead.

I've written about this a lot; there's "growth" and then there's just "converging on the middle of the road".   The former is something like The Sopranos (I know we're not talking about comedies now; if you want that, maybe M*A*S*H, or maybe King Of Queens).  Then there's everyone sort of moving towards the middle, blunting the edges that we thought were so funny and fresh in the beginning.   I know I'm the minority here, but I just don't want a Sheldon with normal human feelings, engaging in "coitus" because it's a fun diversion.   I don't want a Walowitz magically becoming a great dad, only a short time after patrolling late-night MMRPG's for "sex" with trolls that proclaim to be "women", but we'll never really know.   If you run out of ideas, end the show.   

[Lonk]

Looks like they will start filming the reunion in April

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.nydailynews.com/snyde/ny-friends-reunion-april-david-schwimmer-20210305-cimlpeo5hjgr7m3qjbk3hksffi-story.html%3foutputType=amp

“In a little over a month, I’m heading out to L.A.” the man who played Ross told Andy Cohen on Wednesday. “Finally. We figured out a way to film it safely, and there’s gonna be a portion of it that we film outside.”

 

[pg1067]

So...HBO (or whoever) announced that the reunion special that was filmed within the last couple months will be airing on May 27 on HBO Max (no idea if or where it will air outside the U.S.).  Yay!  HOWEVER, they announced this list of "guest stars":



Some of these folks are important recurring cast members (Elliott Gould and Christina Pickles as Ross and Monica's parents, Tom Selleck as one of Monica's early love interests, James Michael Tyler as Gunther from Central Perk, and Maggie Wheeler as Chandler's on-again-off-again girlfriend Janice).

A couple of these are lesser guest stars (Larry Hankin as a downstairs neighbor from the first few seasons, Thomas Lennon as a blackjack dealer from the Vegas episodes, and Reese Witherspoon as one of Rachel's sisters).  Lennon is a bit of an odd choice among all of the major names who showed up in Friends at some point (many before they became big names), but he was in The Odd Couple with Matthew Perry, so maybe that's why.

The rest of these names had NOTHING at all to do with friends.  When this list was released, I had no idea who/what BTS, Cara Delevingne and Malala Yousafzai were.  I've since learned that, supposedly, one of the guys in BTS learned English by watching Friends reruns, and a couple of the others have publicly commented about being Friends fans.  I'm just a bit miffed since every second of screen time we get hearing about how Kit Harington binged Friends during breaks from Game of Thrones (or whatever) is a second that we don't get to hear from the folks actually involved with the show.

I know a lot of folks somehow only learned recently that this reunion isn't a scripted episode (even though that's been publicly known ever since this was announced back in early 2020 or whenever it was) and are bummed about that.  I'm fine with that, but this "guest" list makes me look forward to the reunion a bit less than I otherwise would, and I really hope they don't turn this into "celebrities fawning over the Friends cast."

We shall see.

[KevShmev]

Yeah, I thought the same thing when I saw that.  Why do I give a crap what Justin Beiber, Lady Gaga or Cindy Crawford think about this?  I can see bringing back some of the actors who played minor or guest characters, but the six should have been enough.  This feels like a cheap way to get more viewers.

[Adami]

Yeah, I thought the same thing when I saw that.  Why do I give a crap what Justin Beiber, Lady Gaga or Cindy Crawford think about this?  I can see bringing back some of the actors who played minor or guest characters, but the six should have been enough.  This feels like a cheap way to get more viewers.

Yea. This is feeling more and more like a generic retrospective with the “main event” being the original cast on stage answering generic questions and reflecting. Maybe I’m wrong but I’m not hyped about this. And I love Friends.

[Cool Chris]

I started a good discussion on another forum about the strength of Seinfeld's supporting cast and guest roles. Director John Sturgis, (it was him I believe) believed the stars would take care of themselves, but the success of a film could hinge on the "guts" or the supporting players. Jerry, Jason, Julia, and Michael all aced their roles, but the show would be nothing (ha ha!) without the numerous people they encountered and interacted with. Consider a character like The Soup Nazi, who was on screen for maybe 5 minutes, became a cultural phenomenon.

I don't place Friends on the same pedestal as Seinfeld, but I do believe they also did well with many of their recurring/guest roles. I loved Elliott Gould as Ross and Monica's dad.

I didn't recognize a few names on that list. I only know Thomas Lennon from Reno 911! A few of those I would need the qualifier of "You know, they played so-and-so on Friends."

[T-ski]

How do you make Friends even more unwatchable? Put James Corden in it.

[soupytwist]

How do you make Friends even more unwatchable? Put James Corden in it.

"An absolute cunt."

Description of Corden by someone I know who worked along side him when he was doing the 'One Man, Two Guvnors' theatre show.

[Stadler]

James Corden is one of those celebrities that I just can't warm to.  I like some of the things he's done (that segment with McCartney in Liverpool is legendary, and he's done some funny stuff with Harry Styles), but it always seems... forced, like he's trying too hard to be liked.   I can absolutely imagine him being a c*** behind the scenes.  Jimmy Fallon is another one (though I like him a bit more than Corden), as is Mario Lopez.  It's almost like they're trading on their neediness.

[krands85]

[pg1067]

How do you make Friends even more unwatchable? Put James Corden in it.

"An absolute cunt."

Description of Corden by someone I know who worked along side him when he was doing the 'One Man, Two Guvnors' theatre show.

I barely know who he is and know nothing about him.

At the end of the day, based on what I've heard about BTS fans, this will probably get a shload of them to watch who might not otherwise have watched.  I don't know that any of the others are really going to bring viewers who wouldn't otherwise watch.  I've seen lots of folks express annoyance about this and relatively few express opinions like, "OOOH!  I love David Beckham!  That's so cool that he'll be involved."  I mean...Cindy Crawford is (or used to be) hot, but I don't really care what she thinks about Friends (or, really, anything).

We'll see.

[Anguyen92]

What, no Brad Pitt in this one?  Too much awkwardness?

[Adami]

What, no Brad Pitt in this one?  Too much awkwardness?

I doubt it. I know he did a video chat that's online with Jennifer during quarantine and they seemed just fine. Guess they couldn't get back everyone who ever guest starred. Gotta make room for Justin Bieber BTS.

[jingle.boy]

I could've gone for some Elle McPherson.  Or (the other) Adam Goldberg (not really, but Eddie was a great character).

[pg1067]

I could've gone for some Elle McPherson.  Or (the other) Adam Goldberg (not really, but Eddie was a great character).

Yeah...if they really felt the need to have a supermodel, they had one who was actually in the show!  The fact is that there were enough big names who were actually on the show that most of these folks are real head scratchers.

[KevShmev]

Since this appears to be a one-off, it wouldn't surprise me if they feared a slight backlash due to the stupid ass criticism the show has gotten about not being diverse enough and added a bunch of these stars to get fans of them to watch it and ensure a high rating.  Coming back after all of these years and getting a less-than-stellar rating would be a tough pill for them to swallow, I would imagine.

[Adami]

Looks like James Corden is the dude asking them questions and stuff. Dunno what anyone else is doing besides reflecting and stuff.

[faizoff]

Is this just a conversation type of episode? Or a Friends in character episode with guest stars?

[Adami]

Is this just a conversation type of episode? Or a Friends in character episode with guest stars?

Mostly the first. Looks like they’ll do some fun stuff and have recreated the sets. But there’s no script or anything.

[Stadler]

I could've gone for some Elle McPherson.  Or (the other) Adam Goldberg (not really, but Eddie was a great character).

Yeah...if they really felt the need to have a supermodel, they had one who was actually in the show!  The fact is that there were enough big names who were actually on the show that most of these folks are real head scratchers.

I think Kev has it right. 

[pg1067]

I could've gone for some Elle McPherson.  Or (the other) Adam Goldberg (not really, but Eddie was a great character).

Yeah...if they really felt the need to have a supermodel, they had one who was actually in the show!  The fact is that there were enough big names who were actually on the show that most of these folks are real head scratchers.

I think Kev has it right.

Well...if your goal is to address "the stupid ass criticism . . . about not being diverse enough," Cindy Crawford, David Beckham, Justin Bieber, James Corden, Cara Delevingne and Kit Harington aren't really going to help.

[KevShmev]

The point that was that fans of those stars will watch just to see them and thus result in higher ratings.  Justin Beiber has over 100 million Twitter followers (don't ask me how), and there are bound to be many who are not necessarily fans of Friends who may tune in just to see him.  I see this is streaming on HBO Max, so not sure how that will work overall as far as rating go and whatnot, but the end goal here obviously is to get as many people to watch as possible, by whatever means necessary.

[Adami]

The point that was that fans of those stars will watch just to see them and thus result in higher ratings.  Justin Beiber has over 100 million Twitter followers (don't ask me how), and there are bound to be many who are not necessarily fans of Friends who may tune in just to see him.  I see this is streaming on HBO Max, so not sure how that will work overall as far as rating go and whatnot, but the end goal here obviously is to get as many people to watch as possible, by whatever means necessary.

I think for that, it's not ratings but how many new subscribers they can get.

[Stadler]

The point that was that fans of those stars will watch just to see them and thus result in higher ratings.  Justin Beiber has over 100 million Twitter followers (don't ask me how), and there are bound to be many who are not necessarily fans of Friends who may tune in just to see him.  I see this is streaming on HBO Max, so not sure how that will work overall as far as rating go and whatnot, but the end goal here obviously is to get as many people to watch as possible, by whatever means necessary.

Because a lot of people like his music.   I'm not a huge fan, because I don't really like the style much, but I think "U Smile" is a GREAT song.