Nakedness around non-spouse

[AndyDT]

I've got a good body, thanks be to God, but I don't think it's right to be exposing it any more than necessary to men or women.

I do martial arts and you get lots of guys walking around with their gi unfastened. Also we have to train with women and the top can get loose. I was listening to a seminar from a prominent American protestant minister and he was saying that physical nakedness should be part of spiritual nakedness in marriage and only part of marriage

If you're swimming then I can understand it's not really practical to cover up, but in martial arts is it appropriate to train with women both for semi-nakedness reasons and the physical contact aspect?

What about around other men? In the changing rooms there's often men standing naked in front of each other. In an extreme case I saw (for two seconds until I walked away) a married guy flapping his penis around with moisturiser in front of another guy who was making no effort at modesty when talking to him.

[Adami]

lol it's fine Andy. You can be topless around other people, god won't mind.

[PlaysLikeMyung]

best


thread


ever

[Silver Tears]

I often flap my penis around with moisturiser in front of people, I didn't think it was a bad thing 

[MasterShakezula]

You, sir, think too much.  Calm down a bit, relax, and things will make sense. 

[ClairvoyantCat]

hehehehehehehe

penis

[SeRoX]

What the hell I just read? 

[Ħ]

If you don't want to be naked around other people, then don't be naked around other people. I don't like changing in front of people in locker rooms, especially if I know them. So I don't do it.

Just do what you are comfortable with. But don't judge people that don't get as uncomfortable as you do.

[rumborak]

There's always the Burkini.

Other than that, I say flop away!!

rumborak

[slycordinator]

he was saying that physical nakedness should be part of spiritual nakedness in marriage and only part of marriage

If you're swimming then I can understand it's not really practical to cover up, but in martial arts is it appropriate to train with women both for semi-nakedness reasons and the physical contact aspect?

I doubt that he meant that to be taken as "Christians should only walk around covered from head-to-toe with people they aren't married to."

[rumborak]

Given that the gospels make no mention of Jesus' public flop (or lack thereof), you'll probably have to figure this one out the hard way, Andy, by asking yourself "what am I comfortable with?".

rumborak

[King Postwhore]

There's always the Burkini.

Other than that, I say flop away!!

rumborak

Jesus, where the hell did you find that pick?!


Also Jerry, my boys....they need their support!!

[Sir GuitarCozmo]

WWADTD?

[Phantasmatron]

What about around other men? In the changing rooms there's often men standing naked in front of each other. In an extreme case I saw (for two seconds until I walked away) a married guy flapping his penis around with moisturiser in front of another guy who was making no effort at modesty when talking to him.

Did you subsequently have sex with either of these men?  If not, then you're probably fine. 

Because it was a locker room, and people tend to be naked in locker rooms.  And partially naked when they're working out or swimming or whatever.  Just don't bang anything that moves and don't freak out about it, and you should have no problems.

[Nel]

There's always the Burkini.

Other than that, I say flop away!!

rumborak

Just don't copy my floppy and we'll be fine. That's patented.

[hefdaddy42]

I've got a good body, thanks be to God, but I don't think it's right to be exposing it any more than necessary to men or women.

I do martial arts and you get lots of guys walking around with their gi unfastened. Also we have to train with women and the top can get loose. I was listening to a seminar from a prominent American protestant minister and he was saying that physical nakedness should be part of spiritual nakedness in marriage and only part of marriage

If you're swimming then I can understand it's not really practical to cover up, but in martial arts is it appropriate to train with women both for semi-nakedness reasons and the physical contact aspect?

What about around other men? In the changing rooms there's often men standing naked in front of each other. In an extreme case I saw (for two seconds until I walked away) a married guy flapping his penis around with moisturiser in front of another guy who was making no effort at modesty when talking to him.

Really?

[kári]

I don't mind seeing other people naked, I don't mind other people seeing me naked and I don't mind what you call God thinks of that.

[hefdaddy42]

I don't think God cares very much about this.

[AndyDT]

I agree with Rumborak's post saying its a personal judgement call ultimately but I think Paul in the bible talks about modesty in dress. So there is a Christian basis for appropriate behaviour here. I just wondered what other people think.
I'm not comfortable with parading around topless around mainly women because of inequality and immodesty.

[lordxizor]

There's nothing wrong with non-sexual nudity around others.

[AndyDT]

I've just done a quick search and most of the modesty instructions from Paul or Peter or the OT writers seem to be directed at women. Whether it's non-sexual though is in the eye of the beholder surely. Men may be more affected by sight than women but to claim women aren't affected at all seems disingenuous. And that's what I notice at MA class - how do these guys know the women aren't going to be affected by their partial nakedness? Either they want that or they haven't considered it. So I make the decision to try to avoid semi-nakedness around non-girlfriends etc.

[Chino]

I can always tell an Andy post by the thread title

[rumborak]

I've just done a quick search and most of the modesty instructions from Paul or Peter or the OT writers seem to be directed at women.

Back in those days things were rather misogynist tbh. I don't think you want to use Peter or Paul as guiding principles.

rumborak

[lordxizor]

how do these guys know the women aren't going to be affected by their partial nakedness?

If you're "partially naked" in an area that it's acceptable to be, such as the pool, beach, playing football in the park, or whatever, if the women have a problem with it, it's their responsibility to leave, not yours to cover up.

[kirksnosehair]

[Ravenheart]

I usually wave my member around in public to shame everyone and inspire awe. Sexually.

[lateralus88]

I have been spending the last 5 minutes trying to think of a way to respond to this thread. Andy, you've done it. You've made a topic that I just have no fucking clue where I can make myself out to be a facetious prick. Congrats.

[chknptpie]

I play co-ed ice hockey. It's just a rec league, nothing fancy. One time I went for a pick up game, this guy had serious issue of me changing in the same locker room. It was the first time I ever had the issue come up. I come already dressed for hockey - just need to put on my pads. So it wasn't the fact that I might show skin, it was the fact that he didn't want me to see him. I don't gawk at dudes, especially this one as he was 50-60 age range. I'll admit, the college boys are nice to catch a glimpse of... back to the topic on hand, he dressed in the same locker room - I went to the restroom while he was changing. However, after hockey, he grabbed his stuff and changed somewhere else. If that's what he has to do to feel comfortable, I see no problem. My problem was when he vocalized "She isn't changing in here is she?" like I couldn't hear him.

[lonestar]

I actually feel that a more open minded view of public nudity would lead to a more relaxed attitude about sex, at least in the States.  People are still so fucking puritan around here, and I live in the most liberal area in the states.

[Orbert]

I play co-ed ice hockey. It's just a rec league, nothing fancy. One time I went for a pick up game, this guy had serious issue of me changing in the same locker room. It was the first time I ever had the issue come up. I come already dressed for hockey - just need to put on my pads. So it wasn't the fact that I might show skin, it was the fact that he didn't want me to see him. I don't gawk at dudes, especially this one as he was 50-60 age range. I'll admit, the college boys are nice to catch a glimpse of... back to the topic on hand, he dressed in the same locker room - I went to the restroom while he was changing. However, after hockey, he grabbed his stuff and changed somewhere else. If that's what he has to do to feel comfortable, I see no problem. My problem was when he vocalized "She isn't changing in here is she?" like I couldn't hear him.

In that case, I'd say he had a legitimate gripe.  You may have arrived already dressed, but after the game, there's no telling what's gonna happen.  Are you gonna just gonna take the pads off and leave pretty how much you came in, are you gonna strip down and hit the showers with the guys, or what?

And even if you're completely comfortable with that, you must realize that it's still against social norms (at least in this country) and most guys aren't gonna be okay with it.  Most guys would probably joke about how much they'd love it if they could shower with girls, but I betcha if the situation actually arose (heh heh) there would be more than a few who weren't as okay with it as they claimed.  And really, just changing clothes with a girl right there would bother a lot of guys.

how do these guys know the women aren't going to be affected by their partial nakedness?

If you're "partially naked" in an area that it's acceptable to be, such as the pool, beach, playing football in the park, or whatever, if the women have a problem with it, it's their responsibility to leave, not yours to cover up.

What in the hell is "partial nakedness"?  Naked means you're not wearing clothes.  If you're wearing clothes, you're not naked.  If you're wearing a short-sleeved shirt, your arms are exposed.  If you're wearing shorts, your legs are exposed.

  Holy shit!  Bare skin!  Partial nakedness!

Oddly enough, this ties into Tricia's post a bit.  There are cultural and societal norms, and they vary depending on where you are.  But follow them, and all is well.  In the western world, right or wrong, it's okay for guys to be topless and not okay for women.  In a locker room, where it's a given that there will be various stages of undress, it's okay for member of the same gender to see you, because (again, no moral judgement here, just the facts) most people are heterosexual and it's not an issue.  If you're shy or self-conscious anyway, then you are.  Okay, it's a problem, but it's yours and shouldn't be anyone elses.  But as others have suggested, you may be making a bigger deal out of this than it really is.

[hefdaddy42]

If Bruce Lee could do martial arts bare-chested, so can you Andy.

[chknptpie]

I play co-ed ice hockey. It's just a rec league, nothing fancy. One time I went for a pick up game, this guy had serious issue of me changing in the same locker room. It was the first time I ever had the issue come up. I come already dressed for hockey - just need to put on my pads. So it wasn't the fact that I might show skin, it was the fact that he didn't want me to see him. I don't gawk at dudes, especially this one as he was 50-60 age range. I'll admit, the college boys are nice to catch a glimpse of... back to the topic on hand, he dressed in the same locker room - I went to the restroom while he was changing. However, after hockey, he grabbed his stuff and changed somewhere else. If that's what he has to do to feel comfortable, I see no problem. My problem was when he vocalized "She isn't changing in here is she?" like I couldn't hear him.

In that case, I'd say he had a legitimate gripe.  You may have arrived already dressed, but after the game, there's no telling what's gonna happen.  Are you gonna just gonna take the pads off and leave pretty how much you came in, are you gonna strip down and hit the showers with the guys, or what?

And even if you're completely comfortable with that, you must realize that it's still against social norms (at least in this country) and most guys aren't gonna be okay with it.  Most guys would probably joke about how much they'd love it if they could shower with girls, but I betcha if the situation actually arose (heh heh) there would be more than a few who weren't as okay with it as they claimed.  And really, just changing clothes with a girl right there would bother a lot of guys.

I leave the same way I came, just more smelly. I take off my pads and leave - shower at home. I know it can make some guys unconformable, so I don't even go near the showers. I really believe it isn't against hockey social norms for men and women to change in the same room. Almost all leagues are co-ed and there are no special locker rooms for me to use. Should I have to go change in the bathroom or the ref locker room? I've been playing for a year and this is the first time someone has had an issue with it.

[Chino]

I have no problem with seeing people naked, or being seen naked. It's the human body, for hundreds of thousands of years (and even today in many areas) the naked body is just there. It's nothing to be ashamed of, we all have one. The only time I don't like it is if I'm at the gym and the guy next to be is packing a 9+ incher, then I feel embarrassed or self conscious. I know I shouldn't, but society and porn have engrained that idea in my skull.

[Orbert]

I leave the same way I came, just more smelly. I take off my pads and leave - shower at home. I know it can make some guys unconformable, so I don't even go near the showers. I really believe it isn't against hockey social norms for men and women to change in the same room. Almost all leagues are co-ed and there are no special locker rooms for me to use. Should I have to go change in the bathroom or the ref locker room? I've been playing for a year and this is the first time someone has had an issue with it.

Well, that's was part of my point.  If you're just going to take the pads off and go, then I don't see a problem.  But the guy asked if you were going to change there.  "Changing" sounds to me like clothes coming off and others going, with partial or even full nakedness in between.  I don't play sports and don't know the norms, so if you say that co-ed changing rooms are pretty common, then I believe you, but again, you do understand that not everyone is comfortable with that.  It is weird that after all this time, no one has said anything before.  To be blunt, anyone who himself might have been a bit shy was probably willing to deal with it in hopes of catching a glimpse of the girl changing her clothes.  But most don't really care about that, and somebody who didn't finally said something.

I'm not saying you're wrong.  It seems to me that we've created situations where the cultural norms are getting compromised in favor of practicality and convenience.  Co-ed sports are still a relatively new thing, and places will not have two separate locker rooms for each team.  So while you may still be completely within the rules, as defined by the league, the league itself has put some people into an uncomfortable position.  Some people just are not going to like changing in the presence of the opposite sex.

[chknptpie]

Well, that's was part of my point.  If you're just going to take the pads off and go, then I don't see a problem.  But the guy asked if you were going to change there.  "Changing" sounds to me like clothes coming off and others going, with partial or even full nakedness in between.  I don't play sports and don't know the norms, so if you say that co-ed changing rooms are pretty common, then I believe you, but again, you do understand that not everyone is comfortable with that.  It is weird that after all this time, no one has said anything before.  To be blunt, anyone who himself might have been a bit shy was probably willing to deal with it in hopes of catching a glimpse of the girl changing her clothes.  But most don't really care about that, and somebody who didn't finally said something.

I'm not saying you're wrong.  It seems to me that we've created situations where the cultural norms are getting compromised in favor of practicality and convenience.  Co-ed sports are still a relatively new thing, and places will not have two separate locker rooms for each team.  So while you may still be completely within the rules, as defined by the league, the league itself has put some people into an uncomfortable position.  Some people just are not going to like changing in the presence of the opposite sex.

While I get what your saying, I think my main issue was the way he acted. He asked the room, not me, "She's changing in here?". To which no one replied. I don't think it would have bothered me if he had directed his question at me. We then could have a discussion and I could find out his actual issue.