Question/discussion for Neal Morse and Spock's Beard fans

[KevShmev]

I thought this was a good time to do this poll, since Neal has now done six studio albums since leaving Spock's Beard.  For the sake of this poll, I am not including Neal's first two solo albums that he did before leaving Spock's or any of the worship CDs or cover albums or anything like that; just his six officially released studio albums. 

The Spock's CDs

The Light
Beware of Darkness
The Kindness of Strangers
Day for Night
V
Snow

Neal's solo CDs
Testimony
One
?
Sola Scriptura
Lifeline
Testimony Two

If I compared them all, it would go like this:

The Light vs. Testimony: Edge to The Light
Beware of Darkness vs. One: Too close to call
The Kindness of Strangers vs. ?: Edge to ?
Day for Night vs. Sola Scriptura: Edge to Sola Scriptura (but neither are among my favorites)
V vs. Lifeline: Edge to V by a landslide
Snow vs. Testimony Two: Edge to T2 by a bit

So, based on that, Neal's solo stuff gets the edge by a 3-2-1 count, but it is still pretty damn close.

And I ask that you only vote if you have heard all or almost all of these albums.

[Nick]

Gotta give a slight edge to the solo career.

[Jamesman42]

Major edge to solo

[SystematicThought]

Easily solo. It has the tracks that I love and can remember. Besides Snow The Beard era doesn't do much for me

[Bongasti]

Definitely Spock's era, though i haven't heard some of the solo albums and Kindness of Strangers.

[bosk1]

I've only heard a few Spock's songs here and there, so I'm not going to vote so as not to unfairly skew the results.  But while I like a lot of the Spock's stuff I've heard, I feel like Neal's writing on his solo work is slightly better because you can hear that he has matured more as a songwriter.  And as far as lyrical content, I give a big edge to his solo stuff.  That's my two cents.

[Dr. DTVT]

Spock's Beard.  I won't even listen to his religious albums.

[darkshade]

Ive always enjoyed his solo stuff much more than Spock's Beard. I don't know if it's the players themselves (since Neal wrote just about everything there too), but something just seems off. Even from Snow to Testimony there is a big difference in quality, and there was only a 1 year difference. Maybe it's the rhythm section...

[KevShmev]

I doubt it, since NDV is also a fantastic drummer and David Meros has always done a great job playing bass for Spock's (and the bass playing on Testimony is pretty average and not noteworthy at all; remember that Randy George didn't start recording on Neal's albums till One).  In fact, as much as I like a lot of Testimony, the lack of great guitar and bass playing really stands out on that, although Neal does spit out a few tasty electric guitar solos.  Neal's electric guitar playing still pales in comparison to his skills on the keys and acoustic, but he has improved a lot over the past 10 years.

[reneranucci]

Neal solo albums. I love every minute of his music. With SB, he is hit or miss for me, I actually consider most of SB material kinda sucky (except Snow which is a masterpiece, if only because it is very Neal-Morseish).

[darkshade]

I doubt it, since NDV is also a fantastic drummer and David Meros has always done a great job playing bass for Spock's (and the bass playing on Testimony is pretty average and not noteworthy at all; remember that Randy George didn't start recording on Neal's albums till One).  In fact, as much as I like a lot of Testimony, the lack of great guitar and bass playing really stands out on that, although Neal does spit out a few tasty electric guitar solos.  Neal's electric guitar playing still pales in comparison to his skills on the keys and acoustic, but he has improved a lot over the past 10 years.

I was more or less referring to Portnoy, and his energy level trumps NDV. I like Spock's, but I could never get into them like I have with Neal's solo albums, or even The Flower Kings, Transatlantic, Beardfish, The Tangent, etc...

[jingle.boy]

Can't vote, as I haven't heard his entire solo stuff - only the two Testimony albums (both of which are top notch).  Personally, the first three SB discs are inferior to the next three. 

Mason... give his solo stuff a go.  The religious stuff (from what I've heard) isn't too overbearing as long as you don't immerse yourself in it.  The music and vocals more than compensates for the lyrical content.

[ronnibran]

I voted solo, for the most part I like his solo stuff quite a bit more than the older Spock's stuff.

If I had to quick rate off the top of my head, favorite to least favorite:  Testimony 2, Testimony, Lifeline, One, Sola Scriptura, Snow, V, The Light, ? , Kindness of Strangers, Day For Night, Beware of Darkness.

With the exception of the question mark album, I like all the solo albums more than any of the Spocks stuff.   However, the Spocks stuff is all really excellent as well, it doesn't mean I don't like them.

[Nekov]

Spock's Beard era. I find his solo work to be great some times but at others I just can't dig it.

[The Letter M]

Went with Option 3 - Too close to call; both runs are great!

As a HUGE fan of Neal Morse's work, both with SB and in his post-SB Solo works, they each have their ups and downs.

*IF* I had to choose, I would give the edge to Neal's solo career, but they're so different from each other, despite being SO much Neal, that they're both great in their own right.

Also, Neal has released some pretty awesome music since SB, songs like "The Creation", "The Door", "So Many Roads", "Seeds Of Gold", "King Jesus", "Reunion", "God's Theme", "Author Of Confusion", and so many more. He's also had some pretty sweet guest artists on his albums over the years, and I think he tries to keep all his albums from sounding too much like each other. It helps that nearly all of them have been concept albums, so they lend themselves to being listened as a whole rather than apart.

-Marc.

[ColdFireYYZ]

Too close to call. I only have 3 solo albums (?, Sola Scriptura, Testimony 2) as well as the newest live album but I have all the Spock's Beard albums except Kindness. I love the 3 solo albums and I'd say that they're on the same level as the SB stuff.

[skydivingninja]

I don't have all six Neal's Beard albums, but I do have V, Snow, Day For Night, and The Light, which all have a bunch of really great songs between them.  I've only heard ? and Lifeline and I'm not too impressed.  So yeah, Spock's Beard it is.

[Ħ]

I've only heard ? and Lifeline and I'm not too impressed.  So yeah, Spock's Beard it is.

Probably because you listened to the two worst albums.

[pogoowner]

Spock's Beard, definitely. I think Neal has become kind of stale with his solo work.

[KevShmev]

On what planet is ? considered one of Neal's two worst post-SB solo albums?  Certainly not this one, as it consistently rates as his best or 2nd best solo album (RYM, prog archives, etc.).

[Jamesman42]

I've only heard ? and Lifeline and I'm not too impressed.  So yeah, Spock's Beard it is.

Probably because you listened to the two worst albums.

[skydivingninja]

Yeah, ? was my first Neal solo album because everyone praises it.  There are a few good parts but overall not as good as SB

[Jamesman42]

Yeah, ? was my first Neal solo album because everyone praises it.  There are a few good parts but overall not as good as SB

[KevShmev]

I think the biggest difference between SB and solo Neal is this: fun.  Neal's solo stuff probably does come off as a bit more mature, as bosk1 said earlier, but at the cost of fun.  So much of SB's music has that fun and quirkly vibe (in both the music AND the lyrics), which is one of the more appealing aspects of their music.  I think that is why I love T2 so much; some of the fun was brought back in songs like Time Changer, Time Has Come Today and Road Dog Blues.  Those songs definitely have a lot of that SB fun vibe going on. 

[ich bin besser]

Have to go with the SB era.

[bosk1]

On what planet is ? considered one of Neal's two worst post-SB solo albums?  Certainly not this one, as it consistently rates as his best or 2nd best solo album (RYM, prog archives, etc.).

I'm with H on that one.  But whatever.  Personal taste. 

Now that you mention it, I do see the SB influence on T2, which is pretty cool.  I still rank it in the bottom half of Neal's solo stuff, but I still do like it and it is still growing on me.

[Jamariquay]

I really like most of ? and a lot of Testimony. One has a ton of great songs, but I feel that it loses some steam after The Separated Man (though to be fair, how could it not?). Haven't heard anything else of Neal's solo stuff.

As for Spock's Beard.... The Light and Snow are fantastic. V is bookended by awesome, but I tend to gloss over the shorter tracks in the middle. I like a lot of Beware Of Darkness, but it has some clunkers. Day For Night and Kindness Of Strangers are both mixed bags of fun songs and filler.

(On a related note, I really enjoy Spock's Beard's self-titled album, but that's kind of missing the point of this thread)

I'll give the edge to Spock's Beard here. Philosophically, overtly religious material tends to annoy me, and while the NM-solo songs I enjoy aren't really bogged down by that, it's still enough of a concern to where I generally can't listen to entire albums of it too often. And, at the same time, Snow and The Light are two of the best albums I've ever heard, and The Great Nothing is perhaps the greatest song on any record that NM has been involved with (keep in mind, Transatlantic's first two albums make this supremely hard to choose).

So.... my two cents.

[ZeppelinDT]

I think the biggest difference between SB and solo Neal is this: fun.  Neal's solo stuff probably does come off as a bit more mature, as bosk1 said earlier, but at the cost of fun.  So much of SB's music has that fun and quirkly vibe (in both the music AND the lyrics), which is one of the more appealing aspects of their music.  I think that is why I love T2 so much; some of the fun was brought back in songs like Time Changer, Time Has Come Today and Road Dog Blues.  Those songs definitely have a lot of that SB fun vibe going on. 

This is an excellent point.  And is also part of the reason I voted for Neal-era SB.  I just found that music to be catchy and enjoyable.  A lot of his solo stuff is just.... TOO prog for my tastes.

[KevShmev]

Now that you mention it, I do see the SB influence on T2, which is pretty cool.

You've obviously not listened to Spock's Beard that much , since anyone who has can detect the massive SB influence in Time Changer instantly.  It practically beats you over the head.  And I am not talking just the multi-part harmonies near the end.  The bass line is all Spock's.

I really like most of ? and a lot of Testimony. One has a ton of great songs, but I feel that it loses some steam after The Separated Man (though to be fair, how could it not?). Haven't heard anything else of Neal's solo stuff.

As for Spock's Beard.... The Light and Snow are fantastic. V is bookended by awesome, but I tend to gloss over the shorter tracks in the middle. I like a lot of Beware Of Darkness, but it has some clunkers. Day For Night and Kindness Of Strangers are both mixed bags of fun songs and filler.

(On a related note, I really enjoy Spock's Beard's self-titled album, but that's kind of missing the point of this thread)

I'll give the edge to Spock's Beard here. Philosophically, overtly religious material tends to annoy me, and while the NM-solo songs I enjoy aren't really bogged down by that, it's still enough of a concern to where I generally can't listen to entire albums of it too often. And, at the same time, Snow and The Light are two of the best albums I've ever heard, and The Great Nothing is perhaps the greatest song on any record that NM has been involved with (keep in mind, Transatlantic's first two albums make this supremely hard to choose).

So.... my two cents.

Good thoughts.

Although I think The Light is still by far the best song Neal has ever written, sans Transatlantic.

  A lot of his solo stuff is just.... TOO prog for my tastes.

I get what you mean.  That was the beauty of most of those Spock's records: they had the epics, but also had the fun, quirky, shorter tunes to go with it.  That can be said for One, but like Jamariquay said, it kind of loses its steam after The Separated Man.  Don't get me wrong, on their own, the rest of those songs are all very good as well, especially Reunion (although the Spirit and the Flesh reprise being tacked on to Help Me was pointless and unncessary), but after two 17 minute plus songs and a near 10 minute song in the first four, I am exhausted and ready for something different.  In short, One is a difficult listen from start to finish despite there not really being any weak moments (aside from that S&tF reprise). 

And then Sola Scriptura is mostly three long epics (plus one cheeseball, forgettable christian ballad), with recurring melodies everywhere that makes having three songs that long seem fairly absurd.  Once I broke the two really long epics down into five or six separate tracks each, I was able to enjoy the album much more since some of the individual sections of those first two songs are really awesome, but as long songs, cohesive wholes mind you, they fall a bit flat.  Like you said, it is like, "Let's make these songs all really long by attaching different sections to one another for the hell of it."

Albums like T2 and ? work so well and so much better because they did the best of both worlds: they managed to be mostly great prog, but without sounding overdone and/or padded.

[Nick]

To me, Testimony and SS rank as Neal's bottom two solo works.

[bosk1]

Now that you mention it, I do see the SB influence on T2, which is pretty cool.

You've obviously not listened to Spock's Beard that much

Of course not.  I said as much in my first post in the thread, which is why I don't want to vote. 

[Bongasti]

Yep, I almost never feel like listening to SS because it's such a big package with overly long songs that are often a bit too prog for my taste. T2 was a great return to the Spock's-style: shorter, more accessible songs in the middle of longer epics.

[kirksnosehair]

No contest for me.  I've continued to support Neal's solo career, having purchased everything he's released since leaving Spock's Beard, but for my money the Spock's Beard material is vastly superior in just about every conceivable way.  I like the music better, I like the ambiguity of the lyrics much better.  There's a lot of spiritual stuff in there that can be interpreted comfortably by just about anyone, and now with his solo stuff it's pretty much an ecclesiastical bludgeoning with every album.  Two things bother me about this:  I definitely do not subscribe to the message, and it gets a little bit monotonous after a few albums in a row of what is essentially the same topic.  I think the lyrics Neal was writing back in the Spock's Beard days had a bit more variety to them.

And as someone else mentioned, the message now is full-on dead-serious, whereas before there was a lot more fun and mischief in the lyrics.  (I had mustard today, I can't eat it no more)

With all of that said, let me make something abundantly clear:  I think Neal is a musical genius.  I have a huge amount of admiration for his compositional skills and the man really knows how to both create and deliver some extremely emotional melodies.  And as far as his chops as a keyboardist and guitarist, well, he's excellent on both instruments.  I've also had the great pleasure of having spoken to Neal a few times and even worked with him on The Tsunami Projekt.  He's a great guy and a great musician and even though I'm not crazy about his lyrics these days I understand and respect that he's passionate and very genuine and honest about his beliefs and that does shine through in his music.  I can and do tune out his lyrics because I think his music is generally good enough that it's still worth listening to.

[KevShmev]

Now that you mention it, I do see the SB influence on T2, which is pretty cool.

You've obviously not listened to Spock's Beard that much

Of course not.  I said as much in my first post in the thread, which is why I don't want to vote. 

That still baffles me.  I don't get how someone who is such a big fan of Neal hasn't dove head first into checking out the band he was in before going solo, especially considering how similar the style and sound is, generally speaking (lyrics and fun factor notwithstanding ).

[Mladen]

It's quite the opposite for me. I love Spock's beard (and Transatlantic), but still didn't have the chance to check out Neal's solo career. Will do this year, hopefully...