Author Topic: RIP Christopher Hitchens  (Read 4553 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline El JoNNo

  • Posts: 1779
  • Gender: Male
  • EMOTRUCCI
RIP Christopher Hitchens
« on: December 16, 2011, 05:16:28 AM »
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-16212418

Quote
Christopher Hitchens dies after battle with cancer
COMMENTS (365)

Vanity Fair's editor said those who read him felt they knew him
Continue reading the main story
Related Stories

Blair v Hitchens: Religion debate
British-born author, literary critic and journalist Christopher Hitchens has died at the age of 62.

He died from pneumonia, a complication of the oesophageal cancer he was suffering from, at a Texas hospital.

Vanity Fair magazine, which announced his death, said there would "never be another like Christopher".

He is survived by his wife, Carol Blue, and their daughter, Antonia, and his children from a previous marriage, Alexander and Sophia.

Vanity Fair editor Graydon Carter described the writer as someone "of ferocious intellect, who was as vibrant on the page as he was at the bar".

"Those who read him felt they knew him, and those who knew him were profoundly fortunate souls."

Hitchens was born in Portsmouth in 1949 and graduated from Oxford in 1970.

He began his career as a journalist in Britain in the 1970s and later moved to New York, becoming contributing editor to Vanity Fair in November 1992.

'Cynical contrarian'
He was diagnosed with cancer in June 2010, and documented his declining health in his Vanity Fair column.

In an August 2010 essay for the magazine he wrote: "I love the imagery of struggle.

"I sometimes wish I were suffering in a good cause, or risking my life for the good of others, instead of just being a gravely endangered patient."

Speaking on the BBC's Newsnight programme, in November that year, he reflected on a life that he knew would be cut short: "It does concentrate the mind, of course, to realise that your life is more rationed than you thought it was."


"Prospect of death makes me sober, objective"
Radicalised by the 1960s, Hitchens was often arrested at political rallies and was kicked out of the Labour Party over his opposition to the Vietnam War.

He became a correspondent for the Socialist Workers Party's International Socialism magazine.

In later life he moved away from the left. Following the September 11 attacks he argued with Noam Chomsky and others who suggested that US foreign policy had helped cause the tragedy.

He supported the Iraq War and backed George W Bush for re-election in 2004.

It led to him being accused of betrayal: one former friend called him "a lying, opportunistic, cynical contrarian", another "a drink-sodden ex-Trotskyist popinjay".

But he could dish out scathing critiques himself. Bill Clinton he called "a cynical, self-seeking ambitious thug", Henry Kissinger a war criminal and Mother Teresa a fraudulent fanatic.

'A great voice'
He also famously fell out with his brother, the Mail On Sunday journalist Peter Hitchens, though the pair were later reconciled.

Continue reading the main story

Start Quote

He could throw words up into the sky, they fell down in a marvellous pattern”

Denis McShane MP
Hitchens could also be a loyal friend. He stood by the author Salman Rushdie during the furore that followed the publication of his novel The Satanic Verses.

Writing on Twitter after the announcement of Hitchens' death, Mr Rushdie said: "Goodbye, my beloved friend. A great voice falls silent. A great heart stops."

The MP Denis McShane was a student at Oxford with Hitchens.

He said: "Christopher just swam against every tide. He was a supporter of the Polish and Czech resistance of the 1970s, he supported Mrs Thatcher because he thought getting rid of the Argentinian fascist junta was a good idea.

"He was a cross between Voltaire and Orwell. He loved words.

"He would drink a bottle of whisky when I would manage two glasses of wine and then be up in the morning writing 1,000 perfect words.

"He could throw words up into the sky, they fell down in a marvellous pattern."

Prolific writer
The publication of his 2007 book God Is Not Great made him a major celebrity in his adopted homeland of the United States, and he happily took on the role of the country's best-known atheist.

He maintained his devout atheism after being diagnosed with cancer in 2010, telling one interviewer: "No evidence or argument has yet been presented which would change my mind. But I like surprises."

The author and prominent atheist Richard Dawkins described him as the "finest orator of our time" and a "valiant fighter against all tyrants including God".

He said Hitchens had been a "wonderful mentor in a way".

"He encouraged me and I shall miss him terribly and so will everybody who values the life of the intellect, of rationality of reason," said Mr Dawkins.

Deputy Prime Minister Nick Clegg, who once worked as an intern for Hitchens, said: "Christopher Hitchens was everything a great essayist should be: infuriating, brilliant, highly provocative and yet intensely serious.

"My job was to fact check his articles. Since he had a photographic memory and an encyclopaedic mind it was the easiest job I've ever done.

"He will be massively missed by everyone who values strong opinions and great writing."

Hitchens wrote for numerous publications including The Times Literary Supplement, the Daily Express, the London Evening Standard, Newsday and The Atlantic.

He was the author of 17 books, including The Trial of Henry Kissinger, How Religion Poisons Everything and a memoir, Hitch-22.

A collection of his essays, Arguably, was released this year.

I am quite sadden by this to be honest. He was an excellent writer and I enjoyed everything he wrote that I read.

Offline Phoenix87x

  • From the ashes
  • Posts: 8388
  • The Phoenix shall rise
Re: RIP Christopher Hitchens
« Reply #1 on: December 16, 2011, 06:11:28 AM »
This is a sad day. :'(

Christopher Hitchens had been a profound influence on me over the past few years, and it wasn't just God is not Great. We shared the same views about Orwell, Jefferson and Thomas Paine as well. Such a shame to lose such a great mind.

Offline ReaperKK

  • Sweeter After Difficulty
  • DTF.org Alumni
  • ****
  • Posts: 17840
  • Gender: Male
Re: RIP Christopher Hitchens
« Reply #2 on: December 16, 2011, 06:19:46 AM »
RIP, great writer and one of the most interesting people to watch debate.

Offline Riceball

  • It's the economy, stupid.
  • Posts: 969
  • Gender: Male
Re: RIP Christopher Hitchens
« Reply #3 on: December 16, 2011, 07:26:15 AM »
He was quite well known and liked in Australia, qlthough I am ashamed to say I haven't read any of his work. The ABC played an interview of him from a few months ago. It was so touching, not nearly because what he said was particularly sad or anything like that, but because his words were so precise and incisive that you couldn't help but be drawn in. Certainly one of the world's great thinkers, and the world will be poorer in his absence.
I punch those numbers into my calculator and they make a happy face.

A $500 Musical Odyssey: Now accepting nominations

Offline Omega

  • Posts: 805
  • Gender: Male
Re: RIP Christopher Hitchens
« Reply #4 on: December 16, 2011, 08:43:39 AM »
While I sternly object to atheism and the arguments that him and the so-called New Atheists formulated against theism, I always found Christopher to be a likable, witty, humorous and serious individual. I must say he particularly disappointed in a debate with William Lane Craig on the Existence of God, however, and my opinion of him as an atheist worsened because of this.

Poor guy though. He didn't deserve to die like this.

His political commentaries and opinions were always engaging to read and interpret, too. 

Rest in Peace.
ΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩΩ

Offline emindead

  • DTF.org Alumni
  • ****
  • Posts: 11053
Re: RIP Christopher Hitchens
« Reply #5 on: December 16, 2011, 12:14:59 PM »
Saw him once. What a fucking idiot. Seriously.

Offline El JoNNo

  • Posts: 1779
  • Gender: Male
  • EMOTRUCCI
Re: RIP Christopher Hitchens
« Reply #6 on: December 16, 2011, 12:30:29 PM »
Saw him once. What a fucking idiot. Seriously.

Hitchens can be called and is many things but an idiot is not one of them. Guess he said something that made you butthurt.

Offline antigoon

  • Not Elvis
  • DT.net Veteran
  • ****
  • Posts: 10293
  • Gender: Male
  • This was a triumph.
Re: RIP Christopher Hitchens
« Reply #7 on: December 16, 2011, 12:40:24 PM »
he said bad things about ayn rand once i think

Offline emindead

  • DTF.org Alumni
  • ****
  • Posts: 11053
Re: RIP Christopher Hitchens
« Reply #8 on: December 16, 2011, 12:51:02 PM »
Saw him once. What a fucking idiot. Seriously.

Hitchens can be called and is many things but an idiot is not one of them. Guess he said something that made you butthurt.
hahahahaha No. He changed his mind on so many things. For fucks sake, he help to reelect GWB. I mean, what an asshole!!! ("Oh, yeah, then I didn't know better, Bush is stupid now.") Let me sugarcoat it for you: Christopher Hitchens was a CUNT. C-U-N-T.

he said bad things about ayn rand once i think
Why do you have to be so mean?!

Offline Sigz

  • BLOOD FOR THE BLOOD GOD
  • DTF.org Member
  • *
  • Posts: 13537
  • Gender: Male
  • THRONES FOR THE THRONE SKULL
Re: RIP Christopher Hitchens
« Reply #9 on: December 16, 2011, 12:57:55 PM »
He changed his mind on so many things.

What a fucking idiot. Seriously.

Smart people aren't allowed to change their minds?
Quote
The world is a stage, but the play is badly cast.

Offline Gadough

  • DTF.org Alumni
  • ****
  • Posts: 8842
  • Gender: Male
Re: RIP Christopher Hitchens
« Reply #10 on: December 16, 2011, 12:58:31 PM »
Wow, Emindead. Never seen you so pissed off before.
Gadough isn't Hitler. He's much, much worse.

Offline antigoon

  • Not Elvis
  • DT.net Veteran
  • ****
  • Posts: 10293
  • Gender: Male
  • This was a triumph.
Re: RIP Christopher Hitchens
« Reply #11 on: December 16, 2011, 01:11:29 PM »
:lol I was serious about the ayn rand thing!

Offline emindead

  • DTF.org Alumni
  • ****
  • Posts: 11053
Re: RIP Christopher Hitchens
« Reply #12 on: December 16, 2011, 01:16:04 PM »
He changed his mind on so many things.

What a fucking idiot. Seriously.

Smart people aren't allowed to change their minds?

Absolutely. (Hey, even my current president proclaimed in the middle of a presidential debate that "only idiots never change their mind" it's a shoe fits-all answer.) Vehemently defending one's position that promotes war and retaliation and not seeing the consequences on such proposals is naïve. I really cannot believe him nor feel genuine concern on his intellectual side. As "intelligent," savvy or witty as he proclaimed himself, he never, ever, doubted for one second that Bush was actually wrong... until, of course, the damage was already done. Often changing postures, being completely ambivalent on your postures clearly states that you don't have one fucking solid conviction in life. (I must clarify that I'm attacking him solely on what I digress the most with him, his political attitude.)

Wow, Emindead. Never seen you so pissed off before.
The dude covered the whole political spectrum on reasons why to (REALLY) dislike him. Oh, and I forgot, the time I saw him he almost never had a good answer to the questions raised to him. He did, however, had excellent insults (shamefully I did laugh at one of them, he was quick on that part) that deviated the whole point; instead of intelligent rebuttal, insults. You see how annoying is to just insult one guy non-stop? Well, that's how it was when he talked.

:lol I was serious about the ayn rand thing!
:lol me too! Nah, but it is moot. When I used to read him and see him in action it was before I even knew Rand existed.
« Last Edit: December 16, 2011, 08:36:08 PM by emindead »

Offline kirksnosehair

  • DTF.org Alumni
  • ****
  • Posts: 8521
  • Gender: Male
  • Bryce & Kylie's Grandpa
Re: RIP Christopher Hitchens
« Reply #13 on: December 16, 2011, 01:58:47 PM »
Saw him once. What a fucking idiot. Seriously.

 :facepalm:

Offline 73109

  • DTF.org Member
  • *
  • Posts: 4999
  • Gender: Male
Re: RIP Christopher Hitchens
« Reply #14 on: December 16, 2011, 02:46:33 PM »
RIP. I find it incredibly creepy that I changed my avatar to Hitchens last night, probably around the time he died. This was the first time someone who has had a profound effect on my life in a literary or artistic sense as died. I've been seriously affected all day, as crazy as that sounds. We disagreed on some things, but agreed on many more. He was eloquent, witty, erudite, and everything in between. His lost will be felt in all those that read his work and saw him speak. He was my favorite of the new atheists and the world lost a great individual last night.

Saw him once. What a fucking idiot. Seriously.

Didn't we go over that you should not be a dick to a dude who just died? Somewhat apropos here.

Offline integralbirth

  • Posts: 4
Re: RIP Christopher Hitchens
« Reply #15 on: December 16, 2011, 04:55:58 PM »
RIP.

Even if you leave aside his opinions, simply the quality of writing and debate he produced is enough to make him a great man in my eyes.

Offline El JoNNo

  • Posts: 1779
  • Gender: Male
  • EMOTRUCCI
Re: RIP Christopher Hitchens
« Reply #16 on: December 16, 2011, 06:54:14 PM »
“Beware the irrational, however seductive. Shun the 'transcendent' and all who invite you to subordinate or annihilate yourself. Distrust compassion; prefer dignity for yourself and others. Don't be afraid to be thought arrogant or selfish. Picture all experts as if they were mammals. Never be a spectator of unfairness or stupidity. Seek out argument and disputation for their own sake; the grave will supply plenty of time for silence. Suspect your own motives, and all excuses. Do not live for others any more than you would expect others to live for you.”
- Christopher Hitchens

Offline Dimitrius

  • DT.net Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 18218
  • Gender: Male
  • Fuckin' magnets, how do they work?
Re: RIP Christopher Hitchens
« Reply #17 on: December 16, 2011, 07:11:57 PM »
Saw him once. What a fucking idiot. Seriously.
Seriously? :facepalm:
Joe and I in the same squad is basically the virtual equivalent of us plowing a rape van through an elementary school playground at recess.

Offline emindead

  • DTF.org Alumni
  • ****
  • Posts: 11053
Re: RIP Christopher Hitchens
« Reply #18 on: December 16, 2011, 07:14:07 PM »
Yeah, guys! Ignore what I wrote afterwards! It's fun!

Offline antigoon

  • Not Elvis
  • DT.net Veteran
  • ****
  • Posts: 10293
  • Gender: Male
  • This was a triumph.
Re: RIP Christopher Hitchens
« Reply #19 on: December 16, 2011, 07:29:53 PM »
Can I just say something? Yeah? Ok?

I think it would be beneficial for this community as a whole

to stop feigning moral outrage at silly things.

think about it

Offline hefdaddy42

  • Et in Arcadia Ego
  • Global Moderator
  • *****
  • Posts: 53218
  • Gender: Male
  • Postwhore Emeritus
Re: RIP Christopher Hitchens
« Reply #20 on: December 17, 2011, 04:12:21 AM »
emindead WTF cut it out.
Hef is right on all things. Except for when I disagree with him. In which case he's probably still right.

Offline Vivace

  • Posts: 664
  • Gender: Male
Re: RIP Christopher Hitchens
« Reply #21 on: December 17, 2011, 11:07:35 AM »
“Beware the irrational, however seductive. Shun the 'transcendent' and all who invite you to subordinate or annihilate yourself. Distrust compassion; prefer dignity for yourself and others. Don't be afraid to be thought arrogant or selfish. Picture all experts as if they were mammals. Never be a spectator of unfairness or stupidity. Seek out argument and disputation for their own sake; the grave will supply plenty of time for silence. Suspect your own motives, and all excuses. Do not live for others any more than you would expect others to live for you.”
- Christopher Hitchens

I'm glad this quote came out because it pretty much defines the reason why I'm not a fan. Not a single person should nor can doubt his literary talent and his ability to debate, but unfortunately he failed on many many levels to conduct his debates and books in an academic way. But for a person who believes that an argument and disputation is to be done for its own sake, and not to further knowledge and that all things must be suspect doesn't allow a lot of room to be academic, only critical. His views on religion and religious people were borderline accusatory and most of time said without basis of fact and done purely out of some kind of hidden malice. I'm not quite too sure why we was an atheist since his book God is Not Great doesn't provide an academic reason, only a personal opinion. But this is pretty much the condition of neo-atheism today, that is their inability to produce an argument on any academic level. Almost every single argument can be refuted by simply pointing to an apologist and reading the book. Whether you agree or not is irrelevant, to dismiss these authors is completely inexcusable. In my opinion I think he just liked to argue, as he stated, for the sake of arguing.

"What kind of Jedis are these? Guardians of peace and justice my ass!"

"Ha ha! You fool! My Kung Fu is also big for have been trained in your Jedi arts why not!"

Offline 73109

  • DTF.org Member
  • *
  • Posts: 4999
  • Gender: Male
Re: RIP Christopher Hitchens
« Reply #22 on: December 17, 2011, 11:11:58 AM »
I'd just like to point out that God is Not Great was not meant to disprove the existence of God. Hitchens had Dawkins and Stengor for that. The full title of the book was God is Not Great: How Religion Poisons Everything, and that was the thesis of his argument. His book was not meant to provide an academic reason for why there is no God, but to provide examples of why religion, as a whole, sucked. This is all his opinion of course.

Offline antigoon

  • Not Elvis
  • DT.net Veteran
  • ****
  • Posts: 10293
  • Gender: Male
  • This was a triumph.
Re: RIP Christopher Hitchens
« Reply #23 on: December 17, 2011, 12:14:44 PM »
his incessant, unapologetic warmongering made him a big enough cock sucker without any of that god stuff.

always sad to see an esteemed writer go, though. Smart guy. No need to reaganize him, he'd probably hate it if he found out.

Offline El JoNNo

  • Posts: 1779
  • Gender: Male
  • EMOTRUCCI
Re: RIP Christopher Hitchens
« Reply #24 on: December 17, 2011, 01:24:01 PM »
Vivace since I'd rather not turn this thread in a debate thread, I'll merely point out where I disagree.

I'm glad this quote came out because it pretty much defines the reason why I'm not a fan. Not a single person should nor can doubt his literary talent and his ability to debate, but unfortunately he failed on many many levels to conduct his debates and books in an academic way.
I sincerely don't think you've read any of his books. I don't think with honest this can be said of Hitchens.

But for a person who believes that an argument and disputation is to be done for its own sake, and not to further knowledge and that all things must be suspect doesn't allow a lot of room to be academic, only critical.

Argument and disputation often brings about furthering ones knowledge. I for one do seek both these. If both parties are serious about debate, you will bring logic and what you hold as true to the table. Sometimes you agree or disagree but it is almost always a good conversation. If you agree with the person there is no debate and no argument. I for one love it. There was a girl I used to work with, I used to debate her all the time. Many times taking a position I did not hold just for the sake of it. It sharpens your mind. 

His views on religion and religious people were borderline accusatory and most of time said without basis of fact and done purely out of some kind of hidden malice.

Accusatory, yes, of course. Malice, perhaps and why not? Malice for something like religion is nothing but justified in my opinion.

I'm not quite too sure why we was an atheist since his book God is Not Great doesn't provide an academic reason, only a personal opinion.

73109 already pointed out the nature of the book. As for being an atheist, merely not believing in a god doesn't require academic reasons. God is not a default.

But this is pretty much the condition of neo-atheism today, that is their inability to produce an argument on any academic level.

You are ignorant of the opposing opinion to say this. It also seems to me you've never set foot in P/R although I have seen you there and have debated with you. I don't think you actually mean this statement.

Almost every single argument can be refuted by simply pointing to an apologist and reading the book. Whether you agree or not is irrelevant, to dismiss these authors is completely inexcusable. In my opinion I think he just liked to argue, as he stated, for the sake of arguing.

I think he did like to argue and maybe he was right a lot and maybe he wasn't. What he was not was uninformed and nonacademic. I don't know what authors you are referring.

Offline El JoNNo

  • Posts: 1779
  • Gender: Male
  • EMOTRUCCI

Offline LieLowTheWantedMan

  • DTF.org Member
  • *
  • Posts: 7783
  • Gender: Male
Re: RIP Christopher Hitchens
« Reply #26 on: December 17, 2011, 01:56:29 PM »
what is it, be a douche to dead people month?

Offline 73109

  • DTF.org Member
  • *
  • Posts: 4999
  • Gender: Male
Re: RIP Christopher Hitchens
« Reply #27 on: December 17, 2011, 05:23:37 PM »
This is going to head to P/R and I won't be able to participate. Oddly enough, I got my ass booted out of P/R for calling religion mysogynistic. I think Hitch would be proud.

As for Hitch not being an academic, that is far from the truth. Of the 4 new atheists along with Stengor and possibly Hawking, and despite the fact that Dennett has his PhD and is currently teaching at Tufts, Hitch was more erudite and academic than all the others...possibly combined.

Offline 73109

  • DTF.org Member
  • *
  • Posts: 4999
  • Gender: Male
Re: RIP Christopher Hitchens
« Reply #28 on: April 18, 2012, 07:53:02 PM »
I know it's been a while since this thread has been posted in, but I feel like this is a decent enough place to put this. The Global Atheist Conference was held recently in Melbourne Australia, and it was marked as the first time the "Four Horsemen" would get together at a convention. Obviously, this couldn't happen, but what they did have was an amazing tribute to an amazing man, and I thought I'd leave it here.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iR0GyYaeI-k

Offline bosk1

  • King of Misdirection
  • Administrator
  • *****
  • Posts: 12827
  • Bow down to Boskaryus
Re: RIP Christopher Hitchens
« Reply #29 on: April 18, 2012, 08:21:24 PM »
Oh, wow.  Somehow, I missed this thread the first time around.  Any day someone loses a battle with cancer, it is a sad day.  :(  I don't wish that on anybody.
"The Supreme Court of the United States has descended from the disciplined legal reasoning of John Marshall and Joseph Story to the mystical aphorisms of the fortune cookie."

Offline chrisbDTM

  • DT.net Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 3841
Re: RIP Christopher Hitchens
« Reply #30 on: April 18, 2012, 08:53:40 PM »
insult win on that tribute video

Offline njdtfan

  • Posts: 592
  • Gender: Male
Re: RIP Christopher Hitchens
« Reply #31 on: April 18, 2012, 08:55:27 PM »
Oh, wow.  Somehow, I missed this thread the first time around.  Any day someone loses a battle with cancer, it is a sad day.  :(  I don't wish that on anybody.
Regadles if you liked him or not, like Bosk said,
Life's biggest battles
Often are fought alone
My spirit brings me home