Author Topic: A conversation with Syn Gates about MP...  (Read 3858 times)

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Offline Marion Crane

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A conversation with Syn Gates about MP...
« on: November 30, 2011, 11:21:20 AM »
I'm not trying to start anything here....I just think this is a good story.  Last Friday night, I went to see A7X here in Jacksonville.  I had the opportunity through my work to get full access backstage passes.  After the show, I had about a 20 minute conversation with Syn Gates.  He was incredibly kind and very forthcoming.  We talked about the show, gear, touring etc....

When we were talking tattoos, I showed him Majesty symbol on my back and he instantly brought up Mike Portnoy.  Without getting into too many details, we talked about his time with the band, the details of his departure, life on the road with Mike and other things.  All I'll say is that Syn was incredibly complimentary of Mike as a performer and as a person.  There was no bad mouthing whatsoever.  He pretty much confirmed some of the things that were already said from their side, and Mike's as well.  Nothing but good things to say.  I just thought it was really cool of him.  It was almost like he knew I was a huge fan, probably had opinions of my own about Mike, and wanted to make sure he set the record straight for Mike.  It was really cool getting to meet someone you admire greatly and have them be so nice.  Anyways....food for thought......

Offline skydivingninja

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Re: A conversation with Syn Gates about MP...
« Reply #1 on: November 30, 2011, 11:27:59 AM »
I am amazed at how little A7X is apparently approached about the whole Portnoy thing.  They are incredibly complimentary towards him, obviously are indebted to him for Nightmare and the tour, and gave a good, concise reason why they felt they needed to go on without him.  Since then it seems that they've all been class acts.  Good for them.

Offline TAC

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Re: A conversation with Syn Gates about MP...
« Reply #2 on: November 30, 2011, 11:53:45 AM »
I am amazed at how little A7X is apparently approached about the whole Portnoy thing. 

It's because of this:

  They are incredibly complimentary towards him, obviously are indebted to him for Nightmare and the tour, and gave a good, concise reason why they felt they needed to go on without him.  Since then it seems that they've all been class acts.  Good for them.
would have thought the same thing but seeing the OP was TAC i immediately thought Maiden or DT related
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Offline Sir GuitarCozmo

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Re: A conversation with Syn Gates about MP...
« Reply #3 on: November 30, 2011, 11:58:51 AM »
If Mike HAD joined A7X would he have had to get a stage name, like the rest of the A7X guys?

Because that would make their liner notes ridiculous:

M. Dragonslayer - Vocals
Zippie Evilpants - Guitar
Syntax Darkness - Lead Guitar
Johnny HocusPocus - Bass
Mark Portnoy - Drums

Offline bosk1

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Re: A conversation with Syn Gates about MP...
« Reply #4 on: November 30, 2011, 11:59:34 AM »
All I'll say is that Syn was incredibly complimentary of Mike as a performer and as a person.  There was no bad mouthing whatsoever.

That doesn't surprise me in the least.  I mean, they had initially agreed that Mike would go out on the road with them for the first part of the tour only.  The way things played out for Mike, I'm sure he would have loved to have stayed on longer.  But from day one, that wasn't the band's plan, so there really isn't anything controversial I can see about them moving forward with their plan to bring in someone new at the end of 2010/2011.
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Offline kirksnosehair

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Re: A conversation with Syn Gates about MP...
« Reply #5 on: November 30, 2011, 12:18:58 PM »
All I'll say is that Syn was incredibly complimentary of Mike as a performer and as a person.  There was no bad mouthing whatsoever.

That doesn't surprise me in the least.  I mean, they had initially agreed that Mike would go out on the road with them for the first part of the tour only.  The way things played out for Mike, I'm sure he would have loved to have stayed on longer.  But from day one, that wasn't the band's plan, so there really isn't anything controversial I can see about them moving forward with their plan to bring in someone new at the end of 2010/2011.

Word.  I've never understood why his departure from A7X was considered controversial by some people.  There was never any intention of him staying on long term.

Offline emtee

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Re: A conversation with Syn Gates about MP...
« Reply #6 on: November 30, 2011, 12:32:28 PM »
It may have been the plan but it seemed to me like Mike felt gut punched when he found out he was outside
lookin' in. I mean he was really down and that's when he started saying things like 'you can only trust your family'
I always got the feeling that he 'thought' he would be asked to continue.


Offline rumborak

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Re: A conversation with Syn Gates about MP...
« Reply #7 on: November 30, 2011, 02:51:47 PM »
That doesn't surprise me in the least.  I mean, they had initially agreed that Mike would go out on the road with them for the first part of the tour only.  The way things played out for Mike, I'm sure he would have loved to have stayed on longer.  But from day one, that wasn't the band's plan, so there really isn't anything controversial I can see about them moving forward with their plan to bring in someone new at the end of 2010/2011.

Word.  I've never understood why his departure from A7X was considered controversial by some people.  There was never any intention of him staying on long term.

Not long term, but most certainly for the rest of the tour. A7X found themselves in the position of bringing a new drummer up to speed in the middle of their tour. While MP's contract with them might have only been for the first half of the tour, I am pretty damn certain that it was with the expectation that it would be extended for the rest of the tour if all goes well.
So, in the same token as your comment, I never understand the people who want to whitewash this thing either.

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Offline bosk1

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Re: A conversation with Syn Gates about MP...
« Reply #8 on: November 30, 2011, 03:03:09 PM »
...I am pretty damn certain that it was with the expectation that it would be extended for the rest of the tour if all goes well.

I highly doubt it.
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Offline TheOutlawXanadu

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Re: A conversation with Syn Gates about MP...
« Reply #9 on: November 30, 2011, 03:08:24 PM »
I think Mike expected it, but A7X didn't.
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Offline rumborak

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Re: A conversation with Syn Gates about MP...
« Reply #10 on: November 30, 2011, 03:53:30 PM »
...I am pretty damn certain that it was with the expectation that it would be extended for the rest of the tour if all goes well.

I highly doubt it.

What band gets a drummer for a tour, only to replace him halfway in? Also, otherwise I would like to hear another explanation for MP's outburst on Twitter. Besides, A7X even intimated that the main reason they parted ways was because MP was drawing too much attention to himself. There would have been no reason for such a statement if his gig was always planned to be for just that short stint.

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Offline Miyazaki74

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Re: A conversation with Syn Gates about MP...
« Reply #11 on: November 30, 2011, 04:40:15 PM »
It may have been the plan but it seemed to me like Mike felt gut punched when he found out he was outside
lookin' in. I mean he was really down and that's when he started saying things like 'you can only trust your family'
I always got the feeling that he 'thought' he would be asked to continue.



I think that quote was directed at DT for not taking him back when he asked to return to the band, not Avenged Sevenfold. Mike has never been negative towards Avenged Sevenfold.

Offline Perpetual Change

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Re: A conversation with Syn Gates about MP...
« Reply #12 on: November 30, 2011, 05:02:42 PM »
Yeah, I never saw not renewing Mike's contract as anything personal on A7X's side, just them continuing on with what their managers had planned for them to do, as is the usual for the band. Mike's the one who seemed to have gotten his hopes up about it. He did seemed to be a bit bummed when the romance ended, but it does not look like there is any bad blood between him and the A7X guys.

Offline bosk1

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Re: A conversation with Syn Gates about MP...
« Reply #13 on: November 30, 2011, 05:09:37 PM »
What band gets a drummer for a tour, only to replace him halfway in?

A7X does.  Mike even said before the tour even began that he was signed on only for the first leg that was to go through the end of the year.  So, first of all, that's exactly what Mike said before the tour even started (and what A7X and, if I remember correctly, Mike also said afterwards). 

Second, Rumby, you know as well as anyone that Mike finds it extremely difficult to restrain himself from publicly saying exactly what's on his mind at any given moment.  If there was actually an agreement for him to stay on longer, don't you think he would have said so by now?

The explanation for Mike's Twitter outbursts is, as Miyazaki74 pointed out, likely a reaction to the fact that that was the time he had asked to be back in DT and was told no.  Now maybe he also just assumed that A7X would keep him on longer than the previously agreed time period, but (1) we don't know that, and (2) if so, that's just a bad assumption on his part.  And, again, if it were more than an assumption, do you really think Mike would have kept quiet about that this whole time?
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Offline rumborak

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Re: A conversation with Syn Gates about MP...
« Reply #14 on: November 30, 2011, 09:59:54 PM »
BTW, I am not disputing the plain fact that his contract had him down for the first leg. But, I view that as a kind of "contractor" agreement, where you stick around for longer if things go well.
I'm also not saying that things went particularly sour between MP and A7X. All I'm saying is that I think MP was hoping/counting on the second leg, and because of the drama surrounding him that didn't materialize.
And yes, this is one of those things that MP would be able to hold back, because all it would do is make him look bad. Most of his controversial statements come in an attempt to make himself look good.

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Offline Marion Crane

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Re: A conversation with Syn Gates about MP...
« Reply #15 on: December 01, 2011, 12:49:30 AM »
I agree with him hoping yeah.

Offline Metabog

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Re: A conversation with Syn Gates about MP...
« Reply #16 on: December 01, 2011, 09:10:14 AM »
If Mike HAD joined A7X would he have had to get a stage name, like the rest of the A7X guys?

Because that would make their liner notes ridiculous:

M. Dragonslayer - Vocals
Zippie Evilpants - Guitar
Syntax Darkness - Lead Guitar
Johnny HocusPocus - Bass
Mark Portnoy - Drums

He obviously would have changed his name to Mike Mangini.

Offline TheLordOfTheStrings

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Re: A conversation with Syn Gates about MP...
« Reply #17 on: December 01, 2011, 11:12:12 AM »

Second, Rumby, you know as well as anyone that Mike finds it extremely difficult to restrain himself from publicly saying exactly what's on his mind at any given moment.  If there was actually an agreement for him to stay on longer, don't you think he would have said so by now?

The explanation for Mike's Twitter outbursts is, as Miyazaki74 pointed out, likely a reaction to the fact that that was the time he had asked to be back in DT and was told no.  Now maybe he also just assumed that A7X would keep him on longer than the previously agreed time period, but (1) we don't know that, and (2) if so, that's just a bad assumption on his part.  And, again, if it were more than an assumption, do you really think Mike would have kept quiet about that this whole time?

I swear I remember him tweeting something about how he was excited that he was gonna stay with A7X throughout 2011.

Maybe I'm wrong though... anyone else recall this?
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Offline Miyazaki74

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Re: A conversation with Syn Gates about MP...
« Reply #18 on: December 01, 2011, 02:37:32 PM »

Second, Rumby, you know as well as anyone that Mike finds it extremely difficult to restrain himself from publicly saying exactly what's on his mind at any given moment.  If there was actually an agreement for him to stay on longer, don't you think he would have said so by now?

The explanation for Mike's Twitter outbursts is, as Miyazaki74 pointed out, likely a reaction to the fact that that was the time he had asked to be back in DT and was told no.  Now maybe he also just assumed that A7X would keep him on longer than the previously agreed time period, but (1) we don't know that, and (2) if so, that's just a bad assumption on his part.  And, again, if it were more than an assumption, do you really think Mike would have kept quiet about that this whole time?

I swear I remember him tweeting something about how he was excited that he was gonna stay with A7X throughout 2011.

Maybe I'm wrong though... anyone else recall this?


You know now that you mention it, I think he did say something like that on an interview. Something about playing with them onto 2011. Maybe they did ask him to play with them untill 2011 and then changed their minds once they realized all the DT drama MP would bring along with him.  So even though I still think that tweet about only trusting your family was directed at DT, it might also have been a little jab at A7X as well. Ofcourse I'm just speculating. 

Offline Samsara

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Re: A conversation with Syn Gates about MP...
« Reply #19 on: December 01, 2011, 03:52:01 PM »
*snip* Mike finds it extremely difficult to restrain himself from publicly saying exactly what's on his mind at any given moment.

Here is the key point. If you re-read (and I'm too lazy to find it), A7X's statement, it alluded to this, in a roundabout way, as to why they moved on from MP.

Sure, MP was there for a certain time, he might have assumed he would continue, and he might have. But I think A7X in a very classy way (if memory serves), by saying MP is (paraphrase) a legendary, great drummer with his own personal reputation, is also saying (below is all my words):

"Mike's loose cannon mouth is not how we do things here, and since he left Dream Theater, the drama is going to be high, and he's going to have to bring attention to himself and the situation and we don't want to be a part of that."

>>>IMO, that's exactly why Mike didn't continue with A7X. Sure, they had a contract, sure, it was probably at its end. But if Mike and the guys got along great and the chemistry was there, to me, there's no other reason except Mike's mouth cost him the gig.
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Offline Marion Crane

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Re: A conversation with Syn Gates about MP...
« Reply #20 on: December 01, 2011, 04:01:03 PM »
I think he originally told them that he could tour until the end of 2010 because DT was already scheduled to go back in the studio in January.  I think he fell in love with playing with A7X and part of that might have fueled him leaving DT, even though he already had thoughts of leaving for a while, the A7X tour probably solidified it for him.  It was young, new and fresh for him.  He got his hopes up thinking "Hey guys, no more DT.....I'm all yours" so to speak.  And they weren't having it, honoring the original agreement and preventing any further drama. 

Just my opinion....purely speculative and paraphrasing the events.

Offline bosk1

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Re: A conversation with Syn Gates about MP...
« Reply #21 on: December 01, 2011, 05:58:35 PM »
*snip*

That is certainly one way to interpret what was said.  But the comment that Shadows made was in the context of [paraphrase] "why did you pick a no-name to fill on on drums?"  And the response was [paraphrase] "Mike is a legendary, great drummer with his own huge personal reputation, and we aren't looking to be 'Avenged Sevenfold + [insert big name musician here]--we're just Avenged Sevenfold."  In context, another likely interpretation of the comment is simply, [paraphrase] "We don't want to bring in somebody big as a permanent member because we want to be judged as the existing band, not the existing band plus somebody else, and any big name musician brings their own perceived status that gets in the way of the band just being the band."  I could be wrong, but that seemed to be all he was saying.  I think a lot of us just assumed more than that because Mike was in fact being way too personal and way to public about things, and we just assumed that carried over into his relationship with A7X.  But how they treated him is perfectly consistent with how they are treating the guy that jumped in after.  They have said he seems like a great fit, but they don't want to rush and make him a member of the band because, in the end, it's about the band, not any individual.  Why be so cautious if he seems like such a great fit?  Because that's just how they do things.

And, again, if it were anything different than them going forward with exactly what they and Mike said was the original plan, why wouldn't Mike have been more direct and said, "I was lied to" or "I was misled into thinking ___?"  He hasn't exactly held back those kinds of thoughts in recent history.  I see no reason why he wouldn't come out and say so if he thought they had promised him something more than the original agreement and then changed course.  I think he just assumed that since he was now (after leaving DT) available longer than what was originally agreed to, that everyone would scuttle the agreement and keep him on.  But I think that was simply a mistake on his part.  Likely, by the time Mike made the decision to leave DT, A7X had already reached out to the next guy and had him learning the songs.  Remember, this is what Mike himself said in May 2010:  "Although I wish I could stay on board with A7X in a more permanent capacity, the reality is that I am committed to Dream Theater as my main priority and I will need to resume work with DT to start a new album at some point in 2011.....However, I will be able to join my brothers in Avenged Sevenfold for at least the duration of their touring throughout 2010.....You can look at me like the band's "rebound drummer" to buy them some time until they are comfortable and ready to make a commitment to somebody new for full-time relationship in their future!"  In September, he leaves DT.  His last date with them is 12/11, I believe.  And they had a whole string of new dates set to start in January.  Of course they would have had to have someone ready to jump in.  Given their HEAVY tour schedule the last 4 months of 2010, I'm sure they had auditioned someone for the transition long before they got on the road and that he was already working on the material. 

I could be wrong, but the timing of everything just seems to fit better that way than assuming it was anything more.
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Offline Mat JB

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Re: A conversation with Syn Gates about MP...
« Reply #22 on: December 08, 2011, 05:30:21 PM »
Mike Portnoy did a damn good job on that album and tour. For a while, many fans (admittedly including myself) seemed to have gotten lost in negativity, often to the point of forgetting how good a drummer MP actually is. A lot of that has died down now that time has passed. It's good to be able to listen to Mike's achievements in Dream Theater again without thinking about the split.

Dream Theater returned will with A Dramatic Turn of Events, and I think that Mike will come back strongly with Flying Colours. The presence of Steve Morse on any album automatically renders it exciting to me, as I've been listening to his SMB and Dregs music heavily for years, and I can't wait to hear MP playing with him.

Also, Dave LaRue is a ridiculously good musician in his own right.

Offline TheLordOfTheStrings

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Re: A conversation with Syn Gates about MP...
« Reply #23 on: December 08, 2011, 06:11:15 PM »
Poor Mike. It must have been embarrassing when he didn't get the full time gig with Avenged.
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Offline XB0BX

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Re: A conversation with Syn Gates about MP...
« Reply #24 on: December 08, 2011, 09:53:40 PM »
Guitar: Zeus FireBreather
Guitar: Phantom Lord 2000
Bass: The Demon of the 12th Dimension
Vocals: Cookie Monster McSatan
Drums: Mike Portnoy

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