The addictions thread

[TAC]

I have a question for those whom alcohol is the primary drug of choice - does it ever irk you how much alcohol is celebrated in society?   I mean, there is an entire swath of people who will gladly talk your ear off about toxins in our food...avoid seed oils!  sugar is the devil!  artificial colors will rot your brain!....and yet I'd wager 80% of these people have no problem throwing back a glass of wine or pint of beer.  Alcohol being a LITERAL toxin!  And it isn't just that.  Holidays?  Drink  Get together with friends or family?  Drink Tough day at work?  Drink  Need courage for a date?  Drink.  It is just so normalized, and I guess you could make the same argument for caffeine but caffeine doesn't kill hundreds of thousands each year.

So... I put down a few beers every night. And as Judge Kavanaugh said.."I like beer".

But..I have no issue if they outlawed it tomorrow. When I became a father I stopped smoking weed. i didn't smoke a lot, but I called it quits right then. But I do drink beer.

I take a major issue with the advertisements. It shows people partying it up, but at the end of the commercial, there's a brief "Please drink responsibly" mention. Like they fucking care about you drinking responsibly.

As far as normalization, I don't think it's any worse than when I was a kid. Open containers when driving was pretty common. Cops were a lot more lenient about drinking and driving.

[lonestar]

Did anyone catch the Matthew Perry interview with Diane Sawyer?  Holy shit, I guess I wasn't surprised that he had an addiction issue but it sounds like he did a damn good job covering it up and then literally nearly died from blowing a hole in his colon.  50+ Vicodin a day?  I mean, I only need to look at a codeine pill and can't shit for a week.  (Sorry TMI for a girl, lol)

I guess I'm just a dick.

Que?


I have a question for those whom alcohol is the primary drug of choice - does it ever irk you how much alcohol is celebrated in society?   I mean, there is an entire swath of people who will gladly talk your ear off about toxins in our food...avoid seed oils!  sugar is the devil!  artificial colors will rot your brain!....and yet I'd wager 80% of these people have no problem throwing back a glass of wine or pint of beer.  Alcohol being a LITERAL toxin!  And it isn't just that.  Holidays?  Drink  Get together with friends or family?  Drink Tough day at work?  Drink  Need courage for a date?  Drink.  It is just so normalized, and I guess you could make the same argument for caffeine but caffeine doesn't kill hundreds of thousands each year.

Someone I follow for training advice is in recovery and she posts a lot about the normalization of alcohol consumption.  I guess I never really thought about it before because I grew up with it all around me.  Literally every member of my family drank except for 1 (my mom).  And I don't think I'm outside of the norm here.

I'll give my two cents...I wouldn't say it irks me...but I do believe it doesn't help the rampant abuse of alcohol in our society one bit. We are taught from a very young age that alcohol is literally a solution to so many of life's problems and woes, not to mention any semblance of celebration has booze all over it. And that's just the millennia of the alcohol culture in action, add to that in the last hundred years the advent of marketing, having it plastered in every direction we turn, to choose a sober life is definitely choosing to be in the minority.

For me personally, in early recovery it was very tough, especially being in the industry I'm in. I get off at 11, nothing is open except bars, I literally had zero options for a social life until I developed a new culture of friends in recovery. Honestly, thank god for DTF, this was my go to place after work in those early days, chatting with Nem on the other side of the world saved my ass when I was struggling so hard just to get through that one day at a time. Now, 11 years into this gig, I have a very solid program, and a huge recovery family to be there for me in my daily life, so the omnipresence of the booze culture doesn't effect me...I think of it as an allergy...drinking just isn't an option for me, and I don't have regrets or hangups about it. I'm sick, I suffer from the disease of alcoholism, and the cure for me is to not drink, help other alcoholics, and keep a strong spiritual program at hand. Again, this is just my experience with it.

[TAC]

I'm sick, I suffer from the disease of alcoholism

Do you consider it a physiological disease or a mental disease?

[lonestar]

I'm sick, I suffer from the disease of alcoholism

Do you consider it a physiological disease or a mental disease?

I do believe it's considered both. I know it's listed as Substance Abuse Disorder in the DSM, but there are definitely physical aspects to it as well. The phenomenon of craving...the inability to stop once I start...I am literally powerless over those, and they've been well documented by the medical community. Once late stage sets in, once the real physical addiction sets in, no one in their right mind or body gets up in the middle of the night just to take a few pulls off the bottle, then go back to bed. No one wakes up, throws up, then hits the bottle to get the shakes under control. No one in their right mind puts down a 12 pack and a full bottle of Jager a day for over two years. That aspect of it is definitely physical, my body will crumble without it, and my withdrawal process literally almost killed me (I was strapped to a hospital bed for three days, going through constant gran mal seizures).


I'm sure Adami can give a much more clinical answer to your question.

[TAC]

Cool. Thank you for your answer.

[lonestar]

Cool. Thank you for your answer.

Actually, in AA we're taught that it's a 3 pronged disease...physical, mental, and spiritual. Physically, once we start, we can't stop..so the solution would seem to be that we just stop drinking, right? But, once we stop, we crave it, we obsess about it, we create whatever situation/excuse/reason to have a drink...just one...I can't even tell you how many times I said I'd only have one, just to end up 8 drinks in an hour later and wondering what the fuck happened to my resolve. So physically and mentally, we're fucked...that means the solution lies in the spiritual. By doing a thorough housecleaning, and maintaining a strong spiritual connection with whatever higher power we choose (as an atheist, this was a struggle for me, but as it turns out, the fellowship of AA itself serves as a tremendous HP), we heal the spiritual aspect of the disease, and that in solves the probems of the other two. It seems wonky, but I've seen it work miracles time after time after time in the last decade or so.

[TAC]

Cool. Thank you for your answer.

Actually, in AA we're taught that it's a 3 pronged disease...physical, mental, and spiritual. Physically, once we start, we can't stop..so the solution would seem to be that we just stop drinking, right? But, once we stop, we crave it, we obsess about it, we create whatever situation/excuse/reason to have a drink...just one...I can't even tell you how many times I said I'd only have one, just to end up 8 drinks in an hour later and wondering what the fuck happened to my resolve. So physically and mentally, we're fucked...that means the solution lies in the spiritual. By doing a thorough housecleaning, and maintaining a strong spiritual connection with whatever higher power we choose (as an atheist, this was a struggle for me, but as it turns out, the fellowship of AA itself serves as a tremendous HP), we heal the spiritual aspect of the disease, and that in solves the probems of the other two. It seems wonky, but I've seen it work miracles time after time after time in the last decade or so.

Without judgement of others, do you believe there are degrees of alcoholism?

And I'm trying to be tactful and inoffensive, but it seems like you endured a true battle, and still are. What do you think of the countless celebrities, like Matt Perry above, that have to come out and "tell their story". Do you ever look at someone and think....you're not really a true alcoholic?
My guess is that your answer will be along the lines of you're taught to be non judgemental.

To draw a parallel of what I'm trying to ask...I have Adult Onset Type 2 Diabetes. My pancreas has at this point basically stopped producing insulin. I'm not overweight and eat pretty well, but it's simply beyond my control, other than staying as healthy as I can as long as I can.
But then I hear people that stuff their bloodstreams with more sugar than their natural insulin can break down and they have the nerve to call themselves pre-diabetic or diabetic. Personally, I find that offensive.

[lonestar]

Cool. Thank you for your answer.

Actually, in AA we're taught that it's a 3 pronged disease...physical, mental, and spiritual. Physically, once we start, we can't stop..so the solution would seem to be that we just stop drinking, right? But, once we stop, we crave it, we obsess about it, we create whatever situation/excuse/reason to have a drink...just one...I can't even tell you how many times I said I'd only have one, just to end up 8 drinks in an hour later and wondering what the fuck happened to my resolve. So physically and mentally, we're fucked...that means the solution lies in the spiritual. By doing a thorough housecleaning, and maintaining a strong spiritual connection with whatever higher power we choose (as an atheist, this was a struggle for me, but as it turns out, the fellowship of AA itself serves as a tremendous HP), we heal the spiritual aspect of the disease, and that in solves the probems of the other two. It seems wonky, but I've seen it work miracles time after time after time in the last decade or so.

Without judgement of others, do you believe there are degrees of alcoholism?

And I'm trying to be tactful and inoffensive, but it seems like you endured a true battle, and still are. What do you think of the countless celebrities, like Matt Perry above, that have to come out and "tell their story". Do you ever look at someone and think....you're not really a true alcoholic?
My guess is that your answer will be along the lines of you're taught to be non judgemental.

To draw a parallel of what I'm trying to ask...I have Adult Onset Type 2 Diabetes. My pancreas has at this point basically stopped producing insulin. I'm not overweight and eat pretty well, but it's simply beyond my control, other than staying as healthy as I can as long as I can.
But then I hear people that stuff their bloodstreams with more sugar than their natural insulin can break down and they have the nerve to call themselves pre-diabetic or diabetic. Personally, I find that offensive.

Absolutely there are levels, our literature even has a section talking about the casual drinker, the heavy drinker, and the truly hopeless case, the key distinction being that most others, when you quit drinking life gets better, but for the truly hopeless case, it gets worse, because the only thing more unbearable than the alcoholic life is a life without alcohol. We're also taught not to mark anyone else as an alcoholic, as we say, to take someone else's inventory. We plant seeds, but mostly we talk about our own experiences in hopes that they will identify with our story and maybe see that our solution might work for them as well.

Off the AA record, I personally feel that nobody without a drinking problem ever wonders if they have a drinking problem, and most non-alcoholics don't question if they're an alcoholic or not. Also, I've seen it time and time again, this is a progressive disease, it only gets worse. Once you start down that alcoholic hill, the only directions are stop or keep rolling down.

[Harmony]

What do you think of the countless celebrities, like Matt Perry above, that have to come out and "tell their story".

Don't know if it matters or not, but he claims (while he is trying to sell a book, no doubt) that telling his story could help someone else who is keeping secrets about their addiction.  Personally I don't believe he became an addict in order to sell books or have a story to tell.  I think he should be dead and it is nothing short of miraculous that he isn't.  There is an argument to be made about celebrities calling attention to addiction being a spot light that might draw people towards using rather than against.  Glamorizing it, in a way.  But looking at Perry, there is no glamour there.  He obviously has some neurological impairments brought on by his disease and he will likely never be a successful television or movie star again.

Do you think he is faking?

To draw a parallel of what I'm trying to ask...I have Adult Onset Type 2 Diabetes. My pancreas has at this point basically stopped producing insulin. I'm not overweight and eat pretty well, but it's simply beyond my control, other than staying as healthy as I can as long as I can.
But then I hear people that stuff their bloodstreams with more sugar than their natural insulin can break down and they have the nerve to call themselves pre-diabetic or diabetic. Personally, I find that offensive.

OMG have you seen the uptick of people WITHOUT diabetes using glucose monitors to monitor their sugar intake?  It is like a new fad and it fucking pisses me off. 

[TAC]

RJ, thank you for your candor. I appreciate it.


Harmony, I definitely do not think Matthew Perry is faking it.

[Cool Chris]

I have a question for those whom alcohol is the primary drug of choice - does it ever irk you how much alcohol is celebrated in society? 

I think about it sometimes, but really only at gatherings, which I rarely partake in these days. I drank regularly and to excess in my 20s and early 30s. I caused some damage I try not to reflect on. I will occasionally have a shot of bourbon, but have been drunk once in the past 7-8 years, and that one time still bothers me. If I am at a gathering, people will offer me a drink, without knowing my history. That doesn't bother me at all. What just seems odd is when they are taken aback when I politely decline. Like I am the weird one.

[Harmony]

Off the AA record, I personally feel that nobody without a drinking problem ever wonders if they have a drinking problem, and most non-alcoholics don't question if they're an alcoholic or not. Also, I've seen it time and time again, this is a progressive disease, it only gets worse. Once you start down that alcoholic hill, the only directions are stop or keep rolling down.

Hmmm, this is interesting.  I have had times where I relied WAY too much on alcohol and wondered if I had a problem.  But I'm also one of those people who can fairly easily quit all together (both alcohol and nicotine) for months or even years and during those times, I never think about having a problem.  Maybe I'm just lucky.  Especially with my genetics risks.  I do see alcohol as a depressant and my mood goes to shit (along with my sleep) when I drink more than I should.  I think that part bothers me the most.  That and the extra calories.

[lonestar]

Off the AA record, I personally feel that nobody without a drinking problem ever wonders if they have a drinking problem, and most non-alcoholics don't question if they're an alcoholic or not. Also, I've seen it time and time again, this is a progressive disease, it only gets worse. Once you start down that alcoholic hill, the only directions are stop or keep rolling down.

Hmmm, this is interesting.  I have had times where I relied WAY too much on alcohol and wondered if I had a problem.  But I'm also one of those people who can fairly easily quit all together (both alcohol and nicotine) for months or even years and during those times, I never think about having a problem.  Maybe I'm just lucky.  Especially with my genetics risks.  I do see alcohol as a depressant and my mood goes to shit (along with my sleep) when I drink more than I should.  I think that part bothers me the most.  That and the extra calories.

No offense, but people who can do this really irk me.  

Honestly, there are those who can put it down and pick it up like you...but I'd say they're a minority in my experience. And dangerous to those of us who can't, cause it shows us that someone can if that makes any sense. There's a great quote from our literature... "The idea that somehow, someday he will control and enjoy his drinking is the great obsession of every abnormal drinker. The persistence of this illusion is astonishing. Many pursue it into the gates of insanity or death."

RJ, thank you for your candor. I appreciate it.

Of course...it's the one area in my life where I have to be open and honest to the fullest, cause it's not about me or maybe even you...it's about the third person silently reading this thread. I've had numerous people reach out to me in messages over the years about their own issues (two of which I'm still in contact with and have multiple years of sobriety), just as I did to another DTFer when I first had to get sober and he was open and honest as I am. We always need to leave the door open, cause we'll never know when someone will need that help.

[TAC]

Unrelated to my questioning, but I see a liver doctor on Thursday. My ALT and AST levels are through the roof. I had an ultrasound a few weeks ago, so fingers crossed. I don't want to give up my beer. 
I will if I have to though.

[lonestar]

Unrelated to my questioning, but I see a liver doctor on Thursday. My ALT and AST levels are through the roof. I had an ultrasound a few weeks ago, so fingers crossed. I don't want to give up my beer. 
I will if I have to though.

I'd gather it's tied more to your diabetes than your drinking, unless you're drinking a lot that is. Damn diabetes fucks with everything.

[Phoenix87x]

On the flipside of things, I just want to say who grateful I am to not feel the seduction of alcohol, as it runs in my family.

My grandfather and great grand father had severe alcohol problems and I am very grateful that I can just have a drink here and there and never really felt that urge to drink to the point of addiction.

[Harmony]

Off the AA record, I personally feel that nobody without a drinking problem ever wonders if they have a drinking problem, and most non-alcoholics don't question if they're an alcoholic or not. Also, I've seen it time and time again, this is a progressive disease, it only gets worse. Once you start down that alcoholic hill, the only directions are stop or keep rolling down.

Hmmm, this is interesting.  I have had times where I relied WAY too much on alcohol and wondered if I had a problem.  But I'm also one of those people who can fairly easily quit all together (both alcohol and nicotine) for months or even years and during those times, I never think about having a problem.  Maybe I'm just lucky.  Especially with my genetics risks.  I do see alcohol as a depressant and my mood goes to shit (along with my sleep) when I drink more than I should.  I think that part bothers me the most.  That and the extra calories.

No offense, but people who can do this really irk me.  

Honestly, there are those who can put it down and pick it up like you...but I'd say they're a minority in my experience. And dangerous to those of us who can't, cause it shows us that someone can if that makes any sense. There's a great quote from our literature... "The idea that somehow, someday he will control and enjoy his drinking is the great obsession of every abnormal drinker. The persistence of this illusion is astonishing. Many pursue it into the gates of insanity or death."

Sorry!  If it helps, I definitely have vices that I struggle with.  And I honestly consider myself a rarity in that I'm just lucky that I apparently have the genetics to be able to turn it off when it comes to alcohol and nicotine.  I understand this is not the norm.  AND I am careful not to flirt with disaster because I feel like I dance around the line and who knows if next time, I can't get back to the other side of it?

For example, food is an area that I'm currently working on.  And not just in the, "I need to lose weight" category but in the very unhealthy relationship I have with food and have had since my mom had me tag along with all of her various diets since middle school.  And I wasn't even overweight!  It's crazy....but I had a real "aha" moment this last summer and I am very much feeling a big change in my way of thinking and thus my behavior around food - and it seems to be working so far.  I don't have an eating disorder or anything - it is more around yoyo dieting and the harm it has done to my health over the years.  And food - much like alcohol - is a product that is literally shoved in our faces day in and day out and used as a coping strategy for stress.

So don't get too irk'd with me, I have issues too!   

[lonestar]

I have yet to come across a pleasurable experience that I don't get addicted to. 

[Harmony]

Fucking dopamine....

[Implode]

I hear you. I definitely feel addiction in certain things, and I'm working on them now. Whoever said weed wasn't addictive was lying. But that's honestly not as bad as many other things could be. Like I enjoy gambling. I don't do it often because I can't afford to. I'm good at not going into debt for things like that, but it still scares me because when I'm standing at that craps table, blackjack table, or any game really, I can feel it. I can feel that addiction taking hold. It's very unsettling.

[Lethean]

When I was in high school, my mom had a flavored coffee that I liked and I started drinking it with breakfast in the fall/winter.  One day I was in a hurry and didn't, and had the worst headache I'd ever had and it lasted the whole morning and into the afternoon.  When I mentioned it to my mom, she said it was probably because I'd skipped the coffee.  I remember saying "that sucks.  Why do *you* drink it?" and I remember her laughing.  I stopped drinking it from that day on because... that headache really really sucked.  Wasn't I going to have other day when I'd be in a hurry?  What about when it got warm and I just didn't feel like it?  That's really the only experience I've ever had and I don't think it's at all comparable to alcohol or drugs or gambling. 

So I have trouble relating, but I try to just consider myself lucky in that regard and be empathetic if I can.  Right now it's hard not to feel a little anger seeing what my mom and other family members are going through, even though I know she caused herself more pain over the years than she's caused them.

[Stadler]

What do you think of the countless celebrities, like Matt Perry above, that have to come out and "tell their story".

Don't know if it matters or not, but he claims (while he is trying to sell a book, no doubt) that telling his story could help someone else who is keeping secrets about their addiction.  Personally I don't believe he became an addict in order to sell books or have a story to tell.  I think he should be dead and it is nothing short of miraculous that he isn't.  There is an argument to be made about celebrities calling attention to addiction being a spot light that might draw people towards using rather than against.  Glamorizing it, in a way.  But looking at Perry, there is no glamour there.  He obviously has some neurological impairments brought on by his disease and he will likely never be a successful television or movie star again.

Do you think he is faking?

To draw a parallel of what I'm trying to ask...I have Adult Onset Type 2 Diabetes. My pancreas has at this point basically stopped producing insulin. I'm not overweight and eat pretty well, but it's simply beyond my control, other than staying as healthy as I can as long as I can.
But then I hear people that stuff their bloodstreams with more sugar than their natural insulin can break down and they have the nerve to call themselves pre-diabetic or diabetic. Personally, I find that offensive.

OMG have you seen the uptick of people WITHOUT diabetes using glucose monitors to monitor their sugar intake?  It is like a new fad and it fucking pisses me off. 

Can you say more about that? I kind of avoid the "celebrity tell-all"* and I didn't realize the long term impacts.  I'm not joking here: I kind of thought we didn't see him in a lot of things because his youthful snark didn't really age well.



* Call me a cynic but I'm not really on the "by telling my story I can help others" train as much as some are.  I know there are circumstances where that happens, and I get that "if even one person is saved!"is the standard, but I think the breakdown of the rationale for these things is far too much on the narcissistic side than the altruistic side, IMO.    But I imagine this is for another thread...

[Stadler]

Off the AA record, I personally feel that nobody without a drinking problem ever wonders if they have a drinking problem, and most non-alcoholics don't question if they're an alcoholic or not. Also, I've seen it time and time again, this is a progressive disease, it only gets worse. Once you start down that alcoholic hill, the only directions are stop or keep rolling down.

Hmmm, this is interesting.  I have had times where I relied WAY too much on alcohol and wondered if I had a problem.  But I'm also one of those people who can fairly easily quit all together (both alcohol and nicotine) for months or even years and during those times, I never think about having a problem.  Maybe I'm just lucky.  Especially with my genetics risks.  I do see alcohol as a depressant and my mood goes to shit (along with my sleep) when I drink more than I should.  I think that part bothers me the most.  That and the extra calories.

No offense, but people who can do this really irk me.  

Honestly, there are those who can put it down and pick it up like you...but I'd say they're a minority in my experience. And dangerous to those of us who can't, cause it shows us that someone can if that makes any sense. There's a great quote from our literature... "The idea that somehow, someday he will control and enjoy his drinking is the great obsession of every abnormal drinker. The persistence of this illusion is astonishing. Many pursue it into the gates of insanity or death."

Sorry!  If it helps, I definitely have vices that I struggle with.  And I honestly consider myself a rarity in that I'm just lucky that I apparently have the genetics to be able to turn it off when it comes to alcohol and nicotine.  I understand this is not the norm.  AND I am careful not to flirt with disaster because I feel like I dance around the line and who knows if next time, I can't get back to the other side of it?

For example, food is an area that I'm currently working on.  And not just in the, "I need to lose weight" category but in the very unhealthy relationship I have with food and have had since my mom had me tag along with all of her various diets since middle school.  And I wasn't even overweight!  It's crazy....but I had a real "aha" moment this last summer and I am very much feeling a big change in my way of thinking and thus my behavior around food - and it seems to be working so far.  I don't have an eating disorder or anything - it is more around yoyo dieting and the harm it has done to my health over the years.  And food - much like alcohol - is a product that is literally shoved in our faces day in and day out and used as a coping strategy for stress.

So don't get too irk'd with me, I have issues too!   

We're a fair amount alike in this regard.  I drink alcohol and coffee, I do not smoke (though I like it), and I don't do any hard drugs, but I come from a family of people that struggled with their addictions.  I can and have walked away from alcohol and caffeine for periods of time.  I have no cravings to smoke (my dad quit in the mid-1970's and craved cigarettes until the day he died) but food....  unlike you, Harmony, I suppose I do have a weight problem; I can hide it fairly well because of my build but I'm way heavier than I should be and it's something I just haven't been able to get the upper hand on.  Maybe it's because I haven't had any of the scares that others have had - I'm not diabetic, and I don't tend to eat a lot of sugars, at least not the overt kind. As I age, though, I feel like it's something I'm going to have to face or come to grips with.

[Harmony]

What do you think of the countless celebrities, like Matt Perry above, that have to come out and "tell their story".

Don't know if it matters or not, but he claims (while he is trying to sell a book, no doubt) that telling his story could help someone else who is keeping secrets about their addiction.  Personally I don't believe he became an addict in order to sell books or have a story to tell.  I think he should be dead and it is nothing short of miraculous that he isn't.  There is an argument to be made about celebrities calling attention to addiction being a spot light that might draw people towards using rather than against.  Glamorizing it, in a way.  But looking at Perry, there is no glamour there.  He obviously has some neurological impairments brought on by his disease and he will likely never be a successful television or movie star again.

Do you think he is faking?

To draw a parallel of what I'm trying to ask...I have Adult Onset Type 2 Diabetes. My pancreas has at this point basically stopped producing insulin. I'm not overweight and eat pretty well, but it's simply beyond my control, other than staying as healthy as I can as long as I can.
But then I hear people that stuff their bloodstreams with more sugar than their natural insulin can break down and they have the nerve to call themselves pre-diabetic or diabetic. Personally, I find that offensive.

OMG have you seen the uptick of people WITHOUT diabetes using glucose monitors to monitor their sugar intake?  It is like a new fad and it fucking pisses me off. 

Can you say more about that? I kind of avoid the "celebrity tell-all"* and I didn't realize the long term impacts.  I'm not joking here: I kind of thought we didn't see him in a lot of things because his youthful snark didn't really age well.



* Call me a cynic but I'm not really on the "by telling my story I can help others" train as much as some are.  I know there are circumstances where that happens, and I get that "if even one person is saved!"is the standard, but I think the breakdown of the rationale for these things is far too much on the narcissistic side than the altruistic side, IMO.    But I imagine this is for another thread...

More about alcohol (and drugs) being neurotoxic?  Sure....back in my early years, I worked on a detox unit.  Mostly acute detox but we also had our fair share of chronics.  There is a group of disorders that fall under what we used to call organicity (not sure if that is still the lingo) where folks who were heavy users functioned much in the same way as those who had suffered what we now call TBIs.  And there is a wide range of how this manifests in individuals as far as long lasting impairments goes.  Now I haven't evaluated Matt Perry, obvs, but from his interview with Diane Sawyer (did you see it? you can find it on Hulu IIRC) he indicated he had been sober about 18 months, so I suppose he could still be recovering neurologically from his substance abuse.  Depending on how long and how hard someone abuses alcohol/drugs the brain can take up to 2 years to fully recover.  But even in that subset of people there are going to be some who still show impairment, hence the organic brain syndrome.  Watching Perry in that interview, I was mentally transported to my days back on the detox unit.  He definitely has some oral motor issues with his speech and he kind of addressed that by saying he's had some major dental reconstruction but it seemed more than that to me.  He isn't tracking the conversation normally.  He uses his humor to cover some of that up (perhaps even some confabulation) but it is there.  And frankly just based on what he's admitting to (or what he can remember) the sheer amount he was using for the years that he did, I'd be very surprised if there weren't cognitive issues there.

And it is fine to be cynical but I doubt you are the target audience.   

I may read his book.  It would be interesting in that I find it unlikely that he has very clear memories from when he was using heavily.  I remember reading David Crosby's first biography and wondering how the hell he remembered any of those years before he detoxed in prison.  I'm fairly certain he had a co-writer who likely helped him piece it all together along with interviews from others who were there at the time.  I wonder if Perry's book is much the same but I don't recall seeing another writer listed for it.

[TAC]

I find books like this generally boring. I read a lot of music autobiographies and it's always the same thing. It's rare that I am moved when someone gets clean. I think Duff McKagen was the most eloquent and sensitive about it.

I'm reading Glenn Hughes' book, and well, there's a lot of drugs.

[Harmony]

Off the AA record, I personally feel that nobody without a drinking problem ever wonders if they have a drinking problem, and most non-alcoholics don't question if they're an alcoholic or not. Also, I've seen it time and time again, this is a progressive disease, it only gets worse. Once you start down that alcoholic hill, the only directions are stop or keep rolling down.

Hmmm, this is interesting.  I have had times where I relied WAY too much on alcohol and wondered if I had a problem.  But I'm also one of those people who can fairly easily quit all together (both alcohol and nicotine) for months or even years and during those times, I never think about having a problem.  Maybe I'm just lucky.  Especially with my genetics risks.  I do see alcohol as a depressant and my mood goes to shit (along with my sleep) when I drink more than I should.  I think that part bothers me the most.  That and the extra calories.

No offense, but people who can do this really irk me.  

Honestly, there are those who can put it down and pick it up like you...but I'd say they're a minority in my experience. And dangerous to those of us who can't, cause it shows us that someone can if that makes any sense. There's a great quote from our literature... "The idea that somehow, someday he will control and enjoy his drinking is the great obsession of every abnormal drinker. The persistence of this illusion is astonishing. Many pursue it into the gates of insanity or death."

Sorry!  If it helps, I definitely have vices that I struggle with.  And I honestly consider myself a rarity in that I'm just lucky that I apparently have the genetics to be able to turn it off when it comes to alcohol and nicotine.  I understand this is not the norm.  AND I am careful not to flirt with disaster because I feel like I dance around the line and who knows if next time, I can't get back to the other side of it?

For example, food is an area that I'm currently working on.  And not just in the, "I need to lose weight" category but in the very unhealthy relationship I have with food and have had since my mom had me tag along with all of her various diets since middle school.  And I wasn't even overweight!  It's crazy....but I had a real "aha" moment this last summer and I am very much feeling a big change in my way of thinking and thus my behavior around food - and it seems to be working so far.  I don't have an eating disorder or anything - it is more around yoyo dieting and the harm it has done to my health over the years.  And food - much like alcohol - is a product that is literally shoved in our faces day in and day out and used as a coping strategy for stress.

So don't get too irk'd with me, I have issues too!   

We're a fair amount alike in this regard.  I drink alcohol and coffee, I do not smoke (though I like it), and I don't do any hard drugs, but I come from a family of people that struggled with their addictions.  I can and have walked away from alcohol and caffeine for periods of time.  I have no cravings to smoke (my dad quit in the mid-1970's and craved cigarettes until the day he died) but food....  unlike you, Harmony, I suppose I do have a weight problem; I can hide it fairly well because of my build but I'm way heavier than I should be and it's something I just haven't been able to get the upper hand on.  Maybe it's because I haven't had any of the scares that others have had - I'm not diabetic, and I don't tend to eat a lot of sugars, at least not the overt kind. As I age, though, I feel like it's something I'm going to have to face or come to grips with.

Well, honestly it is best to get a grip on it now.  Aging makes everything harder.  And I definitely had a problem.  I put on about 30 pounds after my sister died (some of that was alcohol related) and I've gotten half of that back off now and am starting to feel like myself again.  The big change for me has been not putting time constraints around it, e.g., "I need to lose 20 pounds in 3 months."  I was struggling to get going when I knew I had to do something.  Somewhere I heard someone suggest that trying to do everything all at once in order to meet some time frame goal was a set up to fail and the light bulb went on over my head.  What if I focused on making small changes over time?  What I focused on slow weight loss and didn't wind up back with the yoyo-ing that is what has ALWAYS happened before (drop the weight, go back to bad habits and gain it all back and more)?  What if I became curious about the process more than desperate for the results?  What if it really is about making life style changes that are easy to live with forever instead of quick fixes?

I'm a helluva lot more happy with the results, I must say.  No more starving myself, no more cutting out foods I enjoy or entire food groups.  No more fad diets and unhealthy "diet culture" bullshit.  No more feeling deprived and setting myself up to binge on the weekends.  I mean....slow and steady seems to be winning the race at this point.  I still have a goal in mind but I don't have a time to reach it by.  It sure takes the pressure off and seeing progress in how I feel, how I sleep better, how I manage stress, and keep building on those successes without it being just about a number on a scale has been a huge change for me.  And if you had told me a year ago I'd be lifting weights I'd have laughed my ass off.  Now I'm actually enjoying physical activity again.  It really is a mental shift.  And if I can do it, anyone can.

[Phoenix87x]

Looks like a fentanyl vaccine is in the works.

https://mynbc15.com/news/local/fentanyl-vaccine-in-the-works

The article doesn't go into deep details, but apparently it will bind to any fentanyl that enters the body and prevent it from crossing the blood brain barrier and thus the person won't feel any high.

[wolfking]

I think I'm officially addicted to sugar.  I can't go a day without ice cream or chocolate or anything sweet, it's becoming bad.  Not sure what classifies though in relation to when an addiction actually becomes an addiction.

I'm not into resolutions and shit but I feel a New Years one coming on........

[TAC]

I think I'm officially addicted to sugar.  I can't go a day without ice cream or chocolate or anything sweet, it's becoming bad.  Not sure what classifies though in relation to when an addiction actually becomes an addiction.

[TAC]

One week without beer!!!!

[lonestar]

One week without beer!!!!

Are you taking a hiatus or quitting for good?



Also, 1/6 was 8 years smoke free for me.

[TAC]

One week without beer!!!!

Are you taking a hiatus or quitting for good?

Both!

I reserve the right to have an actual beer for special occasions but it's because my liver isn't right. I have pretty bad NASH, pretty much due to my diabetes. Showing early signs of cirrhosis, actually. But it's not alcohol related, but for my health, I have to stop.
Trying to find some NA beer that I can live with. 

[lonestar]

Oh.. Well shit never knew that was a thing. Been hanging around too many alcoholics to come across a case of fatty liver disease that wasn't alcohol related. Good luck man.



I remember Clausthaler being alright, except for the whole not getting you drunk thing.

[TAC]

Oh.. Well shit never knew that was a thing. Been hanging around too many alcoholics to come across a case of fatty liver disease that wasn't alcohol related. Good luck man.



I remember Clausthaler being alright, except for the whole not getting you drunk thing.

Thank you.

When I got out of college and moved back home, I tried some NA's. I do remember Clausthaler being pretty good.
I actually like the Odoul's Amber. I prefer an English/Irish style ale.

These beers just have no body to them.

[lonestar]

I don't touch them... Don't want to tease my memory in any way, shape or form.