Apparently this is what Republicans are concerneda about...

[Scheavo]

Democrats are mostly spineless sellouts, but the current Republicans in office are a disgrace to this country. In a time when we need important measures passed, at a time when our government is more corrupt then ever, the Republicans in the government are more concerned with religious matters than helping this country out.

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/2011/11/04/obama-administration-opposes-fdr-prayer-at-wwii-memorial/?cmpid=NL_FNTopHeadlines_20111104

Republican lawmakers and conservative activists are expressing outrage after the Obama administration announced its objection to adding President Franklin Roosevelt's D-Day prayer to the World War II Memorial in Washington, D.C.

"It is not a judgment as to the merit of this new commemoration, simply that altering the Memorial in this way, as proposed in HR 2070, will necessarily dilute this elegant memorial's central message and its ability to clearly convey that message to move, educate, and inspire its many visitors," Abbey said in written testimony.

"This is further evidence that the administration has created an environment that is hostile towards American history -- but in particular towards Christianity," Perkins told Fox News. "I hope America wakes up and realizes what this administration is doing to this country and how they want to radically and fundamentally change America."

"They want to erase every aspect of America's heritage," Perkins said of Obama's administration. "Any president, any official in history that has embraced Christianity, is no longer welcome in this administration. That's the environment they are creating."

Combine that with the recent reaffirmation of the motto "In God We Trust" and I'm truly embarrassed that these people are governmental officials.

[Perpetual Change]

I get what they're doing. Mitt Romney's Jesus-credentials are the lowest in the party probably since Dwight Eisenhower. So what better way to sell him to the consituents than paint Barack Obama as an atheist?

By the way, I have no doubt that the president is probably not a Christian. Where I differ from other Christians is I don't particularly care. 

[hefdaddy42]

I don't see the point in adding the prayer to the memorial.  And I believe that the President is Christian, and have no idea why anyone would doubt that.

[Scheavo]

Oh, I get their aim too, and it's a downright sickening aim. It's all about trying to score political points, nothing about running this country.

And the fact that religion plays a role at all is rather disheartening; the fact that elected officials are trying to use religion as a weapon is even worse. These people need to read the constitutions, and remember what this country stands for. Which is horribly ironic given the guy chastising Obama for "ignoring American history."

[rumborak]

I don't see how the question is relevant to the job he is doing. He seems to have *some* kind of moral compass, and whether that was decreed by Yahwe, Allah, Zuul or his own mind, the outcome is the same.

It would be cool if he had gotten it from Zuul though. Just sayin'.

rumborak

[kirksnosehair]

I really could not possibly care less if the president worships the Flying Spaghetti Monster.  And that goes for a president with (D) after his name or a president with (R) after his name.  As far as I'm concerned, it's none of my business what the president believes in.

As far as the Republicans on congress go, they're stalling and obstructing because it's good for their party right now.  They're refusing to allow up or down votes any any of Obama's proposals -especially large infrastructure projects that are typically used to help lift the country out of recession- because those projects generally end up being part of a President's legacy, and the Republicans have stated time and time again that they want this president to fail and they will do whatever it takes to ensure that he is a one-term president.

I really don't understand why any of this surprises anyone at this point.  Welcome to American Politics in the age of "that black dude with the funny name" in the white house.

[livehard]

I care insofar is it helps me get an idea of his ability to reason and get a sense of his moral philosophy.  His religion itself doesn't matter to me.  But I would like to see my president make rational choices conerning religion as it may indicate he'll make similar choices in other areas.

[Super Dude]

What I want to know is why is religion a prerequisite for a president's moral character? Might not a president who bases his life philosophy off the teachings of a secular thinker be better (i.e. Platonic political philosophy)?

[orcus116]

Especially since the ones who claim they are the most devote religious person usually end up having the most heinous skeletons in their closet when it comes to morals.

[73109]

Oh how I love the Christian right. If there was one group of people that are doing more to fuck up the country as a whole, it's them.

And why did I always think Scheavo was a foreigner?

[MasterShakezula]

Oh how I love the Christian right. If there was one group of people that are doing more to fuck up the country as a whole, it's them.

And why did I always think Scheavo was a foreigner?

I think you're talking about the vocal Christian right.

Those guys I don't care for; I'm okay with Christian right wingers who keep their religion out of their politics. 

[73109]

I have yet to meet/see/deal with a Christian right winger who does not mingle the two.

[Super Dude]

I mean I haven't either, but a close personal friend of mine considers herself religious right and is far from politically vocal.

[73109]

I don't care about being vocal. I have a problem with mixing religion and politics because it tends to turn out quite horribly. You don't need to be vocal to vote.

[livehard]

Politicians are such sleezballs in general doenst everyone take their cliams on their religious beleifs with a grain of salt? 

[MasterShakezula]

I do believe that a good part of the hardcore religious beliefs the right expresses are most likely for the sake of gaining support from the religious poor. 

[snapple]

I don't care about being vocal. I have a problem with mixing religion and politics because it tends to turn out quite horribly.

How so?

I'm willing to bet that 90% of the time it is people abusing religion for a political outcome. What Spanish conquistadors or what the Crusaders did, by in large, was lead by nut jobs who were abusing people being faithful.

And, if I choose to believe in what I do, wouldn't I want vote for the leaders who are going to see things the same way as I am?

[73109]

I could quote the many people that are anti-gay, anti-muslim, anti-jew, anti-woman, or anti-everyone and everything who is not a Christian, but it might take a while.

Let me put it like this, if you are against gay marriage because your God says a marriage is between a man and a woman, I have a serious problem.

[hefdaddy42]

Let me put it like this, if you are against gay marriage because your God says a marriage is between a man and a woman, I have a serious problem.

I don't have a problem with people who are PERSONALLY against gay marriage because they feel their God is against gay marriage.  Rather, my problem is with those who are against gay marriage (or whatever other topic we may be discussing) for EVERYONE for no other reason than that their God is against gay marriage.  If that is your only reason for or against something, then for me that is where separation of church and state come in.

[Super Dude]

Let me put it like this, if you are against gay marriage because your God says a marriage is between a man and a woman, I have a serious problem.

I don't have a problem with people who are PERSONALLY against gay marriage because they feel their God is against gay marriage.  Rather, my problem is with those who are against gay marriage (or whatever other topic we may be discussing) for EVERYONE for no other reason than that their God is against gay marriage.  If that is your only reason for or against something, then for me that is where separation of church and state come in.

I totally agree with this. In this country, religious affiliation was meant to be a voluntary association, not a component of one's political identity.

[73109]

Let me put it like this, if you are against gay marriage because your God says a marriage is between a man and a woman, I have a serious problem.

I don't have a problem with people who are PERSONALLY against gay marriage because they feel their God is against gay marriage.  Rather, my problem is with those who are against gay marriage (or whatever other topic we may be discussing) for EVERYONE for no other reason than that their God is against gay marriage.  If that is your only reason for or against something, then for me that is where separation of church and state come in.

I agree to an extent. While I would rather someone say, "I'm personally against gay marriage, but go ahead" than "I'm against gay marriage so no gays should be married" I still have a massive problem with the first.

[livehard]

Let me put it like this, if you are against gay marriage because your God says a marriage is between a man and a woman, I have a serious problem.

I don't have a problem with people who are PERSONALLY against gay marriage because they feel their God is against gay marriage.  Rather, my problem is with those who are against gay marriage (or whatever other topic we may be discussing) for EVERYONE for no other reason than that their God is against gay marriage.  If that is your only reason for or against something, then for me that is where separation of church and state come in.

I agree to an extent. While I would rather someone say, "I'm personally against gay marriage, but go ahead" than "I'm against gay marriage so no gays should be married" I still have a massive problem with the first.

Do you agree to the same when it comes to smoking crack, prostitution, not buying health insurance? It seems like a lot of left wingers object when right wingers poke their nose in other peoples gay marriage business, but are more than happy to do the same on a myriad of other issues.

[MasterShakezula]

I'm all for gays marrying, people using hard drugs, prostitution being carried out, and health insurance being voluntary.

It's not my business what other people do or don't do in their free time. 

[Scheavo]

Do you agree to the same when it comes to smoking crack, prostitution, not buying health insurance? It seems like a lot of left wingers object when right wingers poke their nose in other peoples gay marriage business, but are more than happy to do the same on a myriad of other issues.

I don't now which left wingers you're talking about, because most liberals I know are all for letting you smoke crack, hire a prostitute; not buying health insurance is a systemic problem, becuase if you end up using the health care system, the rest of us foot the bill, so it doesn't really apply as well.

[livehard]

Do you agree to the same when it comes to smoking crack, prostitution, not buying health insurance? It seems like a lot of left wingers object when right wingers poke their nose in other peoples gay marriage business, but are more than happy to do the same on a myriad of other issues.

I don't now which left wingers you're talking about, because most liberals I know are all for letting you smoke crack, hire a prostitute; not buying health insurance is a systemic problem, becuase if you end up using the health care system, the rest of us foot the bill, so it doesn't really apply as well.

well thats kind of a two wrongs dont make a right situation... but we can all think of situations in which left wingers are against people doing what they want as long as they dont inhibit the freedom of others.  For example, minimum wage.

[MasterShakezula]

Is the minimum wage what lead to American businesses outsourcing?

[livehard]

Id imagine it helped... What is a minimum wage to the benificary is a minimum cost to the producer.  That isn't going to induce him to stick around...

[rumborak]

Minimum wage didn't cause outsourcing, the combination of high cost of living in the US (when compared to India or China), plus the lack of the US economy producing higher-quality products instead, invariably caused outsourcing. You can never compete with third-world countries when it comes to low-quality work.

rumborak

[MasterShakezula]

What would be a US solution to outsourcing, then?

[Scheavo]

but we can all think of situations in which left wingers are against people doing what they want as long as they dont inhibit the freedom of others.  For example, minimum wage.

Eh, I could make an argument that minimum wage is something where someone else's freedom is inhibited.

What would be a US solution to outsourcing, then?

Tariffs.

[rumborak]

What would be a US solution to outsourcing, then?

What other industry nations do: Educate the populous and move on to producing high-quality items. That's the only way to stay ahead of the game and get the margin that allows the standard of living.

rumborak

[MasterShakezula]

What is currently preventing the US from doing so?

[Scheavo]

An uneducated populace, and a political system too corrupt to fix the educational system.

[rumborak]

For one, the lack of commitment to educating its populous. While the US has the best educational institutes in the world, they're essentially used to educate other countries' students, who then go back to their countries and raise *their* quality of products. My company has a gov't-mandated minimum number of US citizens it has to employ, and is struggling to do so because there are none. Shitloads of qualified foreigners though we could hire.

rumborak

[MasterShakezula]

Is this a result of other countries' populace taking advantage of the US education system, American citizens being lazy and unmotivated on average, or some combination of the two?

Or something completely different?