The Official Iced Earth Thread v. "Tastes Like Treason!"

[Grappler]

And Luke as well.

Jon was on a libertarian podcast last fall and said only 2 of the five guys would want the COVID vaccine.  I guess we just found out which two he was referring to.   

Sadly, I expected some of the guys in the band to leave. 

[MirrorMask]

I'm barely aware of how prisons work in Italy and how much contact is allowed between inmates and the outside world, so I definitively don't know how prisons work in the USA.

How much of this is Jon currently aware of? does the fact that he is a musician and a "famous" person makes any difference whatsoever in how he's being dealt with? beside family, is he allowed business contacts? does he truly know that Hansi and Stu publicly turned their backs on him? and most of all, but this is a rethorical question.... did he realize that he committed carrer suicide? oh, how I would like to know if he thinks of himself as a martyr for the cause, a slave in the evil system that one day will be torn down and we'll get rid of our oppressors blah blah blah, or if he had the post-nut, ehm, post-arrest clarity of having killed his own carrer and tarnished his legacy.

[Zook]

Hey All,

  Well, there are times and events when you have to take stock and re evaluate your life, work, and trajectory for the future. That being said I have informed Jon and his current management that I must announce my resignation from Iced Earth with immediate effect.

 Before I made any personal decision I needed the last few weeks to process the situation as well as respect others in our camp processing the situation. I thank you all very much for respecting this. It’s the best decision  in many ways for my personal/ professional growth going forward. Time to move on, heal and prosper.

Much love and respect to you all. Don’t fret! Stay tuned for some exciting things to come! Time to embark upon a new chapter. Be good to each other.

Stu Block ✌️❤️ 🤘😻

Somehow he spoke to Jon. Maybe he made bail? Maybe he's too embarrassed to make a statement yet, or can't.

[MirrorMask]

I would be VERY surprised if we'd hear any statement from Jon himself. Again, I don't know how the law works there, but I can't imagine his lawyers allowing him to speak online, or release a statement in his place ("our client wishes to inform his fans that....").

Furthermore, what's there to say anyway? until he will be formally condemned / acquitted the whole thing is in a limbo, and if you take away all the stuff you obviously cannot say, you'd have a statement so neutered that it would be hardly interesting to read.

[Grappler]

I'm sure messages may be passed through Jon's mangement lawyer, since prisons can't restrict legal visits.

Jon is smart enough to not make any public statement that can be used against him in court.  Admitting to his involvement or explaining his actions would harm him legally.

[Ben_Jamin]

I'm barely aware of how prisons work in Italy and how much contact is allowed between inmates and the outside world, so I definitively don't know how prisons work in the USA.

How much of this is Jon currently aware of? does the fact that he is a musician and a "famous" person makes any difference whatsoever in how he's being dealt with? beside family, is he allowed business contacts? does he truly know that Hansi and Stu publicly turned their backs on him? and most of all, but this is a rethorical question.... did he realize that he committed carrer suicide? oh, how I would like to know if he thinks of himself as a martyr for the cause, a slave in the evil system that one day will be torn down and we'll get rid of our oppressors blah blah blah, or if he had the post-nut, ehm, post-arrest clarity of having killed his own carrer and tarnished his legacy.

You'd be amazed at what lengths people will go through for their beliefs.

Jon felt his belief (whatever that is, I don't know) was worth dying for when he went out to that capital building. I am sure they were well aware of that choice and consequence. If not then they're just plain retarded, stupid, foolish, whatever word you choose to use.

There's songs saying this very thing of "Fight for what you believe in?", That's the entire point of Illumination Theory in Live, Die, Kill. And in The Pursuit of Truth, it's showing what cause they will lay down their life for. "Mothers for their students...a junkie for the high....Rebels for their freedom.... tyrant for the praise."

"Consider this question, open your eyes, examine your own reflection, what are you willing to die for?"

And we won't know Jon's belief and why he chose to risk his career unless someone actually ask him this question.

[Zook]

"It's been a killer 30 years, but it is with a heavy heart that I must retire Iced Earth. The world is changing, and we can change with it or bury our feet in the mud and stay true to ourselves. Stay safe and stay killer.

Yours killerest,
Jon"

[Ben_Jamin]

I would be VERY surprised if we'd hear any statement from Jon himself. Again, I don't know how the law works there, but I can't imagine his lawyers allowing him to speak online, or release a statement in his place ("our client wishes to inform his fans that....").

Furthermore, what's there to say anyway? until he will be formally condemned / acquitted the whole thing is in a limbo, and if you take away all the stuff you obviously cannot say, you'd have a statement so neutered that it would be hardly interesting to read.

And that's likely why Stu and the others left. Not because Jon did what he did. Stu said himself, he and the others had to spend weeks reflecting on the situation. And that is reflecting on everything. I actually don't envy them and feel sorry for them to be in this situation, but I am sure they knew of Jon's beliefs and views on things. It'd be hard to ignore, knowing that Jon actually went, shows me that he likely talked about it a lot and mentioned these things to them during their down times.

The best, wisest thing to do is leave and end that contract. So you can still live out your career. Now, you also won't say anything else related to Jon, until that case is finalized and we know his punishment (if he is found guilty), because you don't want to be labelled you associate with the belief that Jon does as well.

[Max Kuehnau]

I would be VERY surprised if we'd hear any statement from Jon himself. Again, I don't know how the law works there, but I can't imagine his lawyers allowing him to speak online, or release a statement in his place ("our client wishes to inform his fans that....").

Furthermore, what's there to say anyway? until he will be formally condemned / acquitted the whole thing is in a limbo, and if you take away all the stuff you obviously cannot say, you'd have a statement so neutered that it would be hardly interesting to read.

And that's likely why Stu and the others left. Not because Jon did what he did. Stu said himself, he and the others had to spend weeks reflecting on the situation. And that is reflecting on everything. I actually don't envy them and feel sorry for them to be in this situation, but I am sure they knew of Jon's beliefs and views on things. It'd be hard to ignore, knowing that Jon actually went, shows me that he likely talked about it a lot and mentioned these things to them during their down times.

The best, wisest thing to do is leave and end that contract. So you can still live out your career. Now, you also won't say anything else related to Jon, until that case is finalized and we know his punishment (if he is found guilty), because you don't want to be labelled you associate with the belief that Jon does as well.

why wouldn't he be found guilty?

[Max Kuehnau]

"It's been a killer 30 years, but it is with a heavy heart that I must retire Iced Earth. The world is changing, and we can change with it or bury our feet in the mud and stay true to ourselves. Stay safe and stay killer.

Yours killerest,
Jon"

is that an actual statement or just a bit of comedy?

[Ben_Jamin]

I would be VERY surprised if we'd hear any statement from Jon himself. Again, I don't know how the law works there, but I can't imagine his lawyers allowing him to speak online, or release a statement in his place ("our client wishes to inform his fans that....").

Furthermore, what's there to say anyway? until he will be formally condemned / acquitted the whole thing is in a limbo, and if you take away all the stuff you obviously cannot say, you'd have a statement so neutered that it would be hardly interesting to read.

And that's likely why Stu and the others left. Not because Jon did what he did. Stu said himself, he and the others had to spend weeks reflecting on the situation. And that is reflecting on everything. I actually don't envy them and feel sorry for them to be in this situation, but I am sure they knew of Jon's beliefs and views on things. It'd be hard to ignore, knowing that Jon actually went, shows me that he likely talked about it a lot and mentioned these things to them during their down times.

The best, wisest thing to do is leave and end that contract. So you can still live out your career. Now, you also won't say anything else related to Jon, until that case is finalized and we know his punishment (if he is found guilty), because you don't want to be labelled you associate with the belief that Jon does as well.

why wouldn't he be found guilty?

I don't know. I am not saying, I think he isn't guilty. I think he is and should be held accountable for it. Which is what I am saying, I also feel he knows darn well what he was doing and what those consequences are.

Each person involved is being questioned individually or charged for their role, and what their intent was for going inside that building. Who knows what Jon's intent and role was, that's what they're doing for everyone they caught.

[MirrorMask]

Some weird musings about unindented ironies about Schaffer's "last words" in music....

The last song on an Iced Earth albun so far, and very possibly the last IE song ever, is Clear the Way, about a 1862 battle with the decisive help of an irish brigade, whose chorus goes:

Intrepid sons with heads held high
Go where glory awaits you
Your absolution under fire
If the lord above takes you

Fight, stand tall, prevail
Your brothers surround you
Fight, stand tall, prevail
Your courage defines you

I wonder if Jon thought of the song while he was committing an act of domestic terrorism, and thought of himself in the situation descibed in the lyrics, courageous brothers standing tall and "prevailing"  I mean, the meaning of the song is obvious and it's an historical song, but for whatever reason I picture Jon singing it to himself to get some courage in the action.

Now, on to Demons & Wizards, the last song on the third and last D&W album is Children of Cain, which has this stanza towards the end:

This deed we must condemn
For you delete all innocence
No earthly punishment
You’re banned from heaven’s shore

How could you deceive?
These rites of old
Your father’s law
Can’t control it, you can’t control it

Dismiss the illusion
All mercy’s denied
The mark’s set upon you
You’re no son of mine

I am falling, oh, I am falling
We’re living a lie, a lie
I am calling
Grace, I’m falling

A precious moment so bright
But it’s now out of sight
Father, oh father
There’s no redemption
For what I have done

With a little bit of fantasy and maybe changing some key words here and there, we could adapt it to Jon's situation upon realizing he killed his musical carrer, and Hansi turning his back on him, "you're no brother of mine".

I know, wacky thoughts  but hey, these are the last words Schaffer left us in music, and I find it a bit ironic that one set of lyrics could be seen as a completely distorted meaning of going into battle, while the other one is about condemnation and realization of guilt.

[wolfking]

"It's been a killer 30 years, but it is with a heavy heart that I must retire Iced Earth. The world is changing, and we can change with it or bury our feet in the mud and stay true to ourselves. Stay safe and stay killer.

Yours killerest,
Jon"

is that an actual statement or just a bit of comedy?

I think the word killerest gives it away.

[Mister Gold]

And Luke as well.

Jon was on a libertarian podcast last fall and said only 2 of the five guys would want the COVID vaccine.  I guess we just found out which two he was referring to.   

Sadly, I expected some of the guys in the band to leave.

I don't know if we can be sure that the two who wanted the vaccine were definitely Stu and Luke. Jake's saying he was employed by Iced Earth "from 2016 to 2018." So he's basically out too.

So basically it's just Jon and Brent. The band's done.

[Zook]

Brent just started a band not too long ago, and he's always been in and out of Iced Earth. Jon was hinting at retiring the band in the near future anyway, but if he did try for one more album, I wonder who he could find for a singer... John Greely is just as crazy as he is. Maybe we could see a return?

The Relic Part 1 will be the biggest tease in music history.

[Adami]

I'm glad Stu quit. Hopefully he can do something better. The rest of the guys honestly just don't matter.

If Jon doesn't spend significant time in jail, and if he wants to keep doing IE, he can do it with no issues.

All he has to do is look for red neck metal heads who can learn his songs. I feel like he won't be in short supply. Will any of us like it? No idea, but he can find new members whenever he wants. Hell, he probably has dozens of guys trying to send in audition tapes just because they admire what he did on the Capital Hill.

[Madman Shepherd]

I'm glad Stu quit. Hopefully he can do something better. The rest of the guys honestly just don't matter.

If Jon doesn't spend significant time in jail, and if he wants to keep doing IE, he can do it with no issues.

All he has to do is look for red neck metal heads who can learn his songs. I feel like he won't be in short supply. Will any of us like it? No idea, but he can find new members whenever he wants. Hell, he probably has dozens of guys trying to send in audition tapes just because they admire what he did on the Capital Hill.

But will that and the remaining fans be enough to actually support the band? Trapt says "not really" so...

[Adami]

I'm glad Stu quit. Hopefully he can do something better. The rest of the guys honestly just don't matter.

If Jon doesn't spend significant time in jail, and if he wants to keep doing IE, he can do it with no issues.

All he has to do is look for red neck metal heads who can learn his songs. I feel like he won't be in short supply. Will any of us like it? No idea, but he can find new members whenever he wants. Hell, he probably has dozens of guys trying to send in audition tapes just because they admire what he did on the Capital Hill.

But will that and the remaining fans be enough to actually support the band? Trapt says "not really" so...

Oh definitely not.

[MirrorMask]

Also, which label and which promoter will want to associate themselves with a domestic terrorist? granted, if Burzum can still have a carrer after having BURNT CHURCHES AND KILLED A MAN, so can Jon, but black metal is a very niche market anyway, Iced Earth were relatively "mainstream" in the world of metal.

[Mladen]

Lets ressurect the thread in 2031 when Jon gets out of prison, gathers up a whole new line up and releases the first new Iced Earth album in 15 years. 

[Max Kuehnau]

The third member in a row has now left too. (only two people left in the band now, I don't think they will continue)

[MirrorMask]

From the Blabbermouth article about the lead guitarist leaving, which answers some previous questions:

"Schaffer must prove to the federal magistrate that he is not a threat to himself or the public before being released on bail. Others who have been charged for insurrection at the Capitol have been given bail but ordered to surrender their firearms, avoid contact with other alleged Capitol rioters and stay away from all state capitol buildings. Some other alleged rioters have been prohibited from using social media and participating in any political rallies."

It's gonna be a looooong time before we hear anything coming from Jon, or even in his place by his lawyers I assume.

[Madman Shepherd]

The third member in a row has now left too. (only two people left in the band now, I don't think they will continue)

Yeah. His statement was humorously vague. It basically said, "hey I was hired to play leads until 2018 and now I'm just going to focus on my own band."

So in other words he retroactively quit effective 3 years ago.

[Grappler]

Jake selectively ignored that he was hired again to work for Jon in 2019 for Demons & Wizards and then hired Jon himself in 2020 to produce the new Witherfall after his contract in Iced Earth was up.   

He wisely stuck to explaining only his role in Iced Earth, which as a band was inactive after 2018. 

[0u81234]

Yeah, Schaffer produced the new Witherfall record. Also when CM dropped D&W and Hansi cut ties it probably put an end to the fact of the rumored Wacken live album. So Jake was probably pissed. I can’t even find a statement though it’s just a quote from TMZ out of all places.

[wolfking]

The band would be pissed that Schaffer produced their album too I reckon.  That would leave a sour taste releasing new material.

[ProfessorPeart]

Oh, this is funny. I run a Plex server at home for music and video. I was doing some tweaking to my music library and for some reason I clicked on Iced Earth and took a look at the options for artist cover photos. Someone added the now infamous photo of Jon pointing during the run on the capital as an option for the bands photo. Gave me a real good laugh.

[NoFred]

Oh, this is funny. I run a Plex server at home for music and video. I was doing some tweaking to my music library and for some reason I clicked on Iced Earth and took a look at the options for artist cover photos. Someone added the now infamous photo of Jon pointing during the run on the capital as an option for the bands photo. Gave me a real good laugh.

Haha the internet always wins, that’s unfortunately hilarious.

Good on Jake to clearly set his limited role and exit. Witherfall has a future I don’t want to see caught up here.

[Evermind]

Oh, this is funny. I run a Plex server at home for music and video. I was doing some tweaking to my music library and for some reason I clicked on Iced Earth and took a look at the options for artist cover photos. Someone added the now infamous photo of Jon pointing during the run on the capital as an option for the bands photo. Gave me a real good laugh.

[ProfessorPeart]

New band, Flattened Earth!

Flattened Earth is the world’s first historic reenactment band. It is NOT a tribute. We were inspired by the story of Jon Schaffer, confederate flag guitar enthusiast and leader of mid-to-low tier metal band Iced Earth. Now that his band and the events at the capitol are history, this is our musical conception of his experience.

https://youtu.be/7oS4th3nTQ0

[TAC]

That's funny. Musically and vocally it's dead on.

[MirrorMask]

That's fantastic 

[Ben_Jamin]

Perfect...Now Shaffer's name lives on in parody. 

[Adami]

Felt a little Dragonforce at the beginning but those were some great Stu vocals.

[Madman Shepherd]

BEAR SPRAY!