The Official Iced Earth Thread v. "Tastes Like Treason!"

[Zook]

There isn't a PA sticker as far as I know. Dystopia had a secret outro too. This new one is just Russell Allen screwing around. You know what I did? I left it off my phone.

How old are you Mr. Change? You seem very crotchety.

[Perpetual Change]

There isn't a PA sticker as far as I know. Dystopia had a secret outro too. This new one is just Russell Allen screwing around.

Oh man, that's him? Geez. He really rubs me the wrong way these days.

I'm not really looking for things to criticize about this album. Honestly, I haven't considered myself an Iced Earth fan for quite some time, and normally I'd be way to wrapped up in other releases to bother with this, but "Plagues of Babylon" has the unique distinction of being one of the very few albums on my radar to be released right now, given how new album releases are pretty sparse in Dec-Jan. I'm surprised that I enjoy it at all, but there are just a number of little things which strike me as odd and take me way out of the element, even once you get past the obvious Barlow imitation vocals.

[Zook]

The biggest gripe for me probably is Stulow McIsingwithfoodinmymouth, but for once in a long time the music is engaging with a drummer who sounds like a drummer and not a robot. If an album doesn't have any "what the fuck is this shit" moments on it, it's a good album. Dystopia has a few of those moments.

I made a playlist mixing the Plagues songs with the other Something Wicked songs to try and fill in the gaps, and make like a metal opera deal. I think I got the time line right, but was missing some songs on my phone. If Barlow's performance on The Clouding wasn't so phoned in, I'd splice in with the original to make a cool duet version.

[Perpetual Change]

I agree that Cthulhu is the best song on the album, by the way. But it makes the album worse, because once you listen to it you realize how Iced Earth could sound with Stu singing naturally.

[wolfking]

The biggest gripe for me probably is Stulow McIsingwithfoodinmymouth, but for once in a long time the music is engaging with a drummer who sounds like a drummer and not a robot. If an album doesn't have any "what the fuck is this shit" moments on it, it's a good album. Dystopia has a few of those moments.

I made a playlist mixing the Plagues songs with the other Something Wicked songs to try and fill in the gaps, and make like a metal opera deal. I think I got the time line right, but was missing some songs on my phone. If Barlow's performance on The Clouding wasn't so phoned in, I'd splice in with the original to make a cool duet version.

Interesting analogy.

Also, is this new album another continuation of Something Wicked?  Hasn't that been done to death already.  Hell, I don't even have any idea on the storyline.

I agree that Cthulhu is the best song on the album, by the way. But it makes the album worse, because once you listen to it you realize how Iced Earth could sound with Stu singing naturally.

It's the same with Dystopia.  Dystopia wasn't great, but could have been a pretty good album if it wasn't for Stu and his performance.

[Zook]

The biggest gripe for me probably is Stulow McIsingwithfoodinmymouth, but for once in a long time the music is engaging with a drummer who sounds like a drummer and not a robot. If an album doesn't have any "what the fuck is this shit" moments on it, it's a good album. Dystopia has a few of those moments.

I made a playlist mixing the Plagues songs with the other Something Wicked songs to try and fill in the gaps, and make like a metal opera deal. I think I got the time line right, but was missing some songs on my phone. If Barlow's performance on The Clouding wasn't so phoned in, I'd splice in with the original to make a cool duet version.

Interesting analogy.

Also, is this new album another continuation of Something Wicked?  Hasn't that been done to death already.  Hell, I don't even have any idea on the storyline.

Just the first 6 songs. I believe it takes place before The Clouding. And from what I can make out of the lyrics, the songs are back and forth between the humans and the Setians. Also, I looked up what Culling means, and it's to select a large group of something, so I'm assuming that that's before The Domino Decree maybe, when the 10,000 Setians take the roles of worlds leaders. Maybe not.

[wolfking]

Man, I gotta try and get into the story a bit, I have no clue what happens over any of it. 

[Jaq]

Story made sense to me when it was just the Something Wicked Trilogy: previous form of life on Earth is threatened by the rise of Man, takes steps to give birth to a leader in the future that will allow them to take over the world.

Then it got into the albums and the Setians became inhabitants of another planet who were invaded by technologically advanced humans and the Setians managed to erase their memory of who they used to be and at that point I really, really lose track of the story. And I am starting to think Schaffer did too. 

[Zook]

Here's the cliffnotes:

Framing Amrageddon:
1. Elder gets prophecy of Setian demise by invaders.
2. Humans come to earth and slaughter all by ten thousand Setains
3. 10000 Setians go into hiding
4. The Clouding spell wipes out all of human memory
5. Humans be like "huh?" and go their separate ways
6. Setians infiltrate human life assuming the roles of leaders to sabotage the rest of human existence.
7. Set Abominae is born

The Crucible of Man:
1. Set is born... Still.
2. Set grows up
3. Set learns he's the messiah to the Setians, and the devil to mankind
4. Set isn't sure if he's evil
5. Set is evil
6. Set is still evil
7. Set is alone, and evil
8. Set visits Jesus at the Crucifixion, which is part of the Domino Decree (Jesus was a fabrication by the Setians)
9. Set will destroy mankind because he's evil
10. Set bumps his head and forgets he's evil

[bl5150]

Haha.

Set bumps his head    - maybe even he's over it.

I don't always listen to Iced Earth but when I do



it's usually Horror Show.

[wolfking]

So FA isn't a continuation of the SW trilogy, it's just an expanded version?

[Zook]

Oh, and just a guess on the Plagues of Babylon songs:

1. The Clouding is super effective
2. Setians discuss whether they should release the plagues
3. they release the plagues
4. The Culling I guess only refers to the Babylonian plagues now that I think about it
5. Zombies?
6. Humans start remembering?
7. Set starts remembering?

So FA isn't a continuation of the SW trilogy, it's just an expanded version?

Yep.

[wolfking]

Sweet, I'm up to date.  Seems like it could possibly keep going by your Babylon descriptions.

I'm actually quite keen to check this album out now.  I will buy it, so I will wait to listen to it.

Also, we now have pieces of the story told by 3 different singers! lol

[Zook]

Also, we now have pieces of the story told by 3 different singers! lol

That's where I got the idea for the rock opera. It's just putting the song in the right spot...

[wolfking]

Cool shit.

Post the final tracklist once you're done.

[Madman Shepherd]

Here's the cliffnotes:

Framing Amrageddon:
1. Elder gets prophecy of Setian demise by invaders.
2. Humans come to earth and slaughter all by ten thousand Setains
3. 10000 Setians go into hiding
4. The Clouding spell wipes out all of human memory
5. Humans be like "huh?" and go their separate ways
6. Setians infiltrate human life assuming the roles of leaders to sabotage the rest of human existence.
7. Set Abominae is born

The Crucible of Man:
1. Set is born... Still.
2. Set grows up
3. Set learns he's the messiah to the Setians, and the devil to mankind
4. Set isn't sure if he's evil
5. Set is evil
6. Set is still evil
7. Set is alone, and evil
8. Set visits Jesus at the Crucifixion, which is part of the Domino Decree (Jesus was a fabrication by the Setians)
9. Set will destroy mankind because he's evil
10. Set bumps his head and forgets he's evil

Oh, and just a guess on the Plagues of Babylon songs:

1. The Clouding is super effective
2. Setians discuss whether they should release the plagues
3. they release the plagues
4. The Culling I guess only refers to the Babylonian plagues now that I think about it
5. Zombies?
6. Humans start remembering?
7. Set starts remembering?

So FA isn't a continuation of the SW trilogy, it's just an expanded version?

Yep.

Dude. this. is. AWESOME.

I never cared  to figure out the story but for the first time in years I actually want to listen to those albums now that I know what they're about.  I mean, I probably won't listen to it but the fact that at this moment I kind of want to is a feat unto itself. 

[wolfking]

Here's the cliffnotes:

Framing Amrageddon:
1. Elder gets prophecy of Setian demise by invaders.
2. Humans come to earth and slaughter all by ten thousand Setains
3. 10000 Setians go into hiding
4. The Clouding spell wipes out all of human memory
5. Humans be like "huh?" and go their separate ways
6. Setians infiltrate human life assuming the roles of leaders to sabotage the rest of human existence.
7. Set Abominae is born

The Crucible of Man:
1. Set is born... Still.
2. Set grows up
3. Set learns he's the messiah to the Setians, and the devil to mankind
4. Set isn't sure if he's evil
5. Set is evil
6. Set is still evil
7. Set is alone, and evil
8. Set visits Jesus at the Crucifixion, which is part of the Domino Decree (Jesus was a fabrication by the Setians)
9. Set will destroy mankind because he's evil
10. Set bumps his head and forgets he's evil

Oh, and just a guess on the Plagues of Babylon songs:

1. The Clouding is super effective
2. Setians discuss whether they should release the plagues
3. they release the plagues
4. The Culling I guess only refers to the Babylonian plagues now that I think about it
5. Zombies?
6. Humans start remembering?
7. Set starts remembering?

So FA isn't a continuation of the SW trilogy, it's just an expanded version?

Yep.

Dude. this. is. AWESOME.

I never cared  to figure out the story but for the first time in years I actually want to listen to those albums now that I know what they're about.  I mean, I probably won't listen to it but the fact that at this moment I kind of want to is a feat unto itself.

 

[Zook]

They aren't that bad. Ripper owns the first album.


Well, he probably doesn't own the first album. I'm sure he got rid of his Iced Earth collection after being fired.

[wolfking]

Schaffer probably charged him for a copy.

[Zook]

[Zydar]

Schaffer probably charged him for a copy.

It wasn't a charge to keep, then

[wolfking]

Schaffer probably charged him for a copy.

It wasn't a charge to keep, then

 

Man, this Something Wicked talk and Zook you've actually made me interested in this new album quite a bit.  I want to go back to Crucible too and see if I can find more in it than I have previously.

[Zook]

Crucible's not that bad. It just feels rushed and unfinished. Some songs are kind of boring, but there are some gems in there. The Revealing should have definitely been expanded, cause it's pretty badass, but instead it just plods along with pointless rhythm guitar for 2 minutes at the end.

Also, an update to the Plagues Cliffnotes:

Oh, and just a guess on the Plagues of Babylon songs:

1. The Clouding is super effective
2. Setians discuss whether they should release the plagues
3. they release the plagues
4. The Culling I guess only refers to the Babylonian plagues now that I think about it
5. Oops we created zombies!
6. Humans start remembering?
7. Set starts remembering?

[wolfking]

You really seem to be enjoying this new album Zook.

I'm actually listening to the two official released tracks again.  Among the Living Dead is still not doing much for me, but I actually didn't mind the title track, it was okay.  I'm actually looking forward to buying this and trying to really get into it.  My local stores aren't releasing it until the 17th though.

[Zook]

Yeah man, I was disappointed on my first listen. It sounded like a continuation of Dystopia, and while Dystopia wasn't that bad, it still wasn't the greatest. One awful track, three extremely mediocre ones, and subject matter I really didn't care about at all. Plus, The Crucible of Man was a major step down from Framing Armageddon. I feared I really did lose my first favorite Metal band like I lost my first favorite Rock band, The Offspring. They aren't coming back. But I tried, so I gave it a few more spins, and the songs started forming their own identity, and the album as a whole started coming around. Peacemaker is certainly different, and Parasite sounds like a Disturbed song. Highwayman isn't that bad, but that Volbeat guy has a silly voice. It's like Matt Barlow trying to do a James Hetfield impression. Russell Allen sounded great, but also sounded weird, like he recorded his part with crappy equipment or something. The Sons of Liberty song really isn't that bad. I guess if it had to be one of those songs, I'm glad it was this one.

There are no Days of Rage tracks on this album, no plodding endlessly for no reason. Stu still sounds like Barlow, but he's really trying to do his own thing with it I think. Still sounds like he's singing with food in his mouth though. Schaffer sounds really inspired here, and I wish he would just stick to fantasy, cause that's when he shines. Crucible of Man needed the relentless thrashing that the Plague songs have. The album isn't perfect though. Schaffer really needs to come up with new chord progressions for his ballads. Also, I really like that drum beat Raphael keeps doing in a lot of the songs, but it also makes him sound uncreative. I don't know if Jon wrote the drums parts, but considering how natural the drums sound, I'm guessing he let Raph do his own thing. He did say he gave a lot more creative freedom this time around. Troy is Troy. He's a decent guitarist, but still lacks in the solo department. Jon played all the rhythm anyway.

I'm really glad this album didn't suck. I was worried. I guess some albums just take a few listens. I haven't encountered many instant clickers. I don't think Stu is going anywhere so there's still my gripe of him butchering older songs, but I don't see them live very often so as long as Jon can churn out a few more non-disappointments I'll be a happy camper.

I guess this could be my review. I planned something longer, but I really hate essays.

[jjrock88]

Iced Earth has left a bad taste in my mouth a bit since 2007, when Jon threw Ripper to the wolves and fired him via email.  Then I found Crucible underwhelming and didn't think too much of Dystopia.  I'm curious for this release based on Zooks early reviews, but it would have to be a blockbuster and a homerun release for them to turn it around for me.

[NotePad]

Writing an album of individual songs based on popular dystopian movies comes of as being very uninspired. I felt this way about Horror Show, despite having a few songs I really like.

I'm no longer a fan of Iced Earth. They should call it quits. John Schaffer needs to take some time off. Maybe a year or two. Or take time off and only start writing music again when he feels really inspired and excited about some new ideas. He needs to think outside of the box he's in musically.

Hey here's an idea i just had: John Schaffer should join Nevermore as Jeff Loomis' replacement. That would definitely be interesting and would for sure result in change's to Nevermore's sound. (I'm just kidding. I don't think that'd be a good idea. It would not work. Plus i have a feeling Loomis will go back at some time in the future, and Nevermore will do another record).

[FiberglassMoon]

After Crucible and Dystopia, I was really wasn't expecting much out of this offering.  It's certainly not IE's greatest effort, but I was pleasantly surprised.  The first listen was quite unremarkable, but it definitely grew on me after a few more spins.  Stu has definitely improved on this album, but there are still a lot of spots where it seemed forced or strained.  I wish Jon would just let Stu be Stu and work with what comes naturally for him.

I agree with the sentiment that Cthulhu is definitely the best song on the album...it was the only one that instantly grabbed me on the first listen.

Overall, really a solid effort...color me surprised after their last two releases.  And I'm glad Jon's showed some life...Iced Earth used to be one of my favorite bands.

[Zook]

Oh yeah, I didn't even mention Cthulhu in my mini review. It's my favorite song as well.

[wolfking]

This is exciting I must say.  I also thought the band was done for.  I'm looking forward to this and gonna go in with a real open mind.  I still don't have any real expectations, but that's a good thing.

[rickhawk80]

After Crucible and Dystopia, I was really wasn't expecting much out of this offering.  It's certainly not IE's greatest effort, but I was pleasantly surprised.  The first listen was quite unremarkable, but it definitely grew on me after a few more spins.  Stu has definitely improved on this album, but there are still a lot of spots where it seemed forced or strained.  I wish Jon would just let Stu be Stu and work with what comes naturally for him.

I agree with the sentiment that Cthulhu is definitely the best song on the album...it was the only one that instantly grabbed me on the first listen.

Overall, really a solid effort...color me surprised after their last two releases.  And I'm glad Jon's showed some life...Iced Earth used to be one of my favorite bands.

My thoughts exactly!!

[Madman Shepherd]

They aren't that bad. Ripper owns the first album.

True.  I didn't listen to those at first and think, "Man this is horrible."  I loved Glorious Burden so much that I was psyched for anything that was Iced Earth.  I listened to it several times because it was the new Iced Earth album.  Then he fired Ripper and like others I got a bad taste in my mouth.  But hey, Barlow was back and so I was psyched for the new album.  Then I heard it and realized I don't really care for Iced Earth anymore. Then Barlow left, and it reaffirmed why I didn't like the band.  then he got a new singer and I just didn't care. 

[rickhawk80]

You left out:  and then Shaffer went all wacky right wing conspiracy lunatic on us claiming banks were taking over the world and wanting to start a political revolution with his "Sons of Liberty" project....

[Zook]

This is exciting I must say.  I also thought the band was done for.  I'm looking forward to this and gonna go in with a real open mind.  I still don't have any real expectations, but that's a good thing.

Well sorry if I've over hyped it for you, but considering you probably still haven't opened Imaginaerum, I'm sure you wouldn't mind one more CD?

[Zook]

Damn, Jon is getting ambitious:



Only a partial setlist.