The Official Iced Earth Thread v. "Tastes Like Treason!"

[Zook]

That law office is 23 miles from me.

[Madman Shepherd]

So with Jon going to prison, would my Iced Earth collection increase or decrease in value?

What about my signed Glorious Burden special edition CD not only signed by the first person to plead guilty in the capitol insurrection case, but also signed by Ralph Santolla (RIP), James MacDonough who hasnt been heard from since leaving Megadeth, Ripper Owens that had a shitty movie called Rock Star oh so loosely based on a few events of his life, and Richard Christy who I'm told is a pretty important member of the Howard Stern show?

[Zook]

Ok I get it, my collection ain't worth shit.

[MirrorMask]

So with Jon going to prison, would my Iced Earth collection increase or decrease in value?

What about my signed Glorious Burden special edition CD not only signed by the first person to plead guilty in the capitol insurrection case, but also signed by Ralph Santolla (RIP), James MacDonough who hasnt been heard from since leaving Megadeth, Ripper Owens that had a shitty movie called Rock Star oh so loosely based on a few events of his life, and Richard Christy who I'm told is a pretty important member of the Howard Stern show?

I have the Horror Show booklet signed by the lineup ictured there (Schaffer, Barlow, Christy, Tarnowski), and I have a picture with Jon taken in 2002.

To date, it's the only photo I have with a terrorist (domestic or otherwise).

[TAC]

To date, it's the only photo I have with a terrorist (domestic or otherwise).

 

[Zook]

I got my copy of the 30th Anniversary debut today. The lazy bastard at Amazon couldn't even put it by my front door, not even at the end of the steps, but another ten feet away at the corner of my house. This isn't even the first time they've done this.

Anyway, it may be the last Iced Earth CD I ever buy. Who knows if anymore retailers are gonna stop selling anything from the band. I guess rappers go to prison all the time and still have their shit sold everywhere, so maybe it was just the label. Still, I want it for my collection as it's a reminder of better days, and a damn good remix. His involvement in the insurrection didn't impact me as bad as others, but I'm still a bit iffy on supporting him going forward. I guess it depends on if he does his time and realizes what a colossal asshat he was. I doubt it. Iced Earth is probably done. Maybe in a 10 years we'll get the other remixes, or he'll find a way to get them out there sooner. Did the Zeus guy cut ties as well?

Am I being selfish for wanting these remixes?

I don't know what it is about this band. Dream Theater currently holds the number 1 spot, but I don't have a mini ZeppelinDT collection of their output. Iced Earth is the only band where I own multiple copies of the same albums. Having different artwork and track lists plays a big part in that, but still. The Jon Schaffer Band is very special to me. Jon has written his fair share of stinkers, but the music just resonates with me. When I discovered the band in 2004, things weren't going so well in my life, so Jon's music helped me escape. It's also nice to have a favorite band that still puts out enjoyable music for the most part unlike another band I used to love. *cough*theoffspring*cough* their last decent album was 18 fucking years ago.

Yeah, Iced Earth was just a mediocre band with a laughable amount of line up changes and a batshit crazy asshole guitarist/founder/bear spray enthusiast, but that asshole entertained me for close to 20 years, so i thank him for that.

There's a 19 year old thread on the Ultimate Metal Forum simply called Nevermore vs Iced Earth. Nevermore may be more talented, but Iced Earth still wins. I like some Nevermore, but they are mostly boring, and Warrel Dane never 100% clicked with me. Tolerable, but I couldn't listen to him for a long period of time.

Anyway, that's all I got for today.

Go away now!

[TAC]

I don't know what it is about this band. Dream Theater currently holds the number 1 spot, but I don't have a mini ZeppelinDT collection of their output. Iced Earth is the only band where I own multiple copies of the same albums. Having different artwork and track lists plays a big part in that, but still. The Jon Schaffer Band is very special to me. Jon has written his fair share of stinkers, but the music just resonates with me. When I discovered the band in 2004, things weren't going so well in my life, so Jon's music helped me escape. It's also nice to have a favorite band that still puts out enjoyable music for the most part

You keep enjoying the music that means so much to you. All good, brother.

[Zook]

I don't know what it is about this band. Dream Theater currently holds the number 1 spot, but I don't have a mini ZeppelinDT collection of their output. Iced Earth is the only band where I own multiple copies of the same albums. Having different artwork and track lists plays a big part in that, but still. The Jon Schaffer Band is very special to me. Jon has written his fair share of stinkers, but the music just resonates with me. When I discovered the band in 2004, things weren't going so well in my life, so Jon's music helped me escape. It's also nice to have a favorite band that still puts out enjoyable music for the most part

You keep enjoying the music that means so much to you. All good, brother.

[Madman Shepherd]

I got my copy of the 30th Anniversary debut today. The lazy bastard at Amazon couldn't even put it by my front door, not even at the end of the steps, but another ten feet away at the corner of my house. This isn't even the first time they've done this.

Anyway, it may be the last Iced Earth CD I ever buy. Who knows if anymore retailers are gonna stop selling anything from the band. I guess rappers go to prison all the time and still have their shit sold everywhere, so maybe it was just the label. Still, I want it for my collection as it's a reminder of better days, and a damn good remix. His involvement in the insurrection didn't impact me as bad as others, but I'm still a bit iffy on supporting him going forward. I guess it depends on if he does his time and realizes what a colossal asshat he was. I doubt it. Iced Earth is probably done. Maybe in a 10 years we'll get the other remixes, or he'll find a way to get them out there sooner. Did the Zeus guy cut ties as well?

Am I being selfish for wanting these remixes?

I don't know what it is about this band. Dream Theater currently holds the number 1 spot, but I don't have a mini ZeppelinDT collection of their output. Iced Earth is the only band where I own multiple copies of the same albums. Having different artwork and track lists plays a big part in that, but still. The Jon Schaffer Band is very special to me. Jon has written his fair share of stinkers, but the music just resonates with me. When I discovered the band in 2004, things weren't going so well in my life, so Jon's music helped me escape. It's also nice to have a favorite band that still puts out enjoyable music for the most part unlike another band I used to love. *cough*theoffspring*cough* their last decent album was 18 fucking years ago.

Yeah, Iced Earth was just a mediocre band with a laughable amount of line up changes and a batshit crazy asshole guitarist/founder/bear spray enthusiast, but that asshole entertained me for close to 20 years, so i thank him for that.

There's a 19 year old thread on the Ultimate Metal Forum simply called Nevermore vs Iced Earth. Nevermore may be more talented, but Iced Earth still wins. I like some Nevermore, but they are mostly boring, and Warrel Dane never 100% clicked with me. Tolerable, but I couldn't listen to him for a long period of time.

Anyway, that's all I got for today.

Go away now!

Don't let this shit make you lose your love for Iced Earth. Separate the artists from the art. I still love Ozzy's output even though he is an objectively bad person whose wife is objectively worse. I won't spend anymore money on him which is made an easier decision by the fact that he hasn't put out anything good since 1995, I guess with the exception of 13 which I resisted buying for two years and even then bought from a used seller.

I did a little experiment myself. After the capitol crap I tracked down a copy of Incorruptible which I never bothered to buy since Schaffer annoyed the shit out of me. I used to love the band but even disregarding his politics I got so sick of him not only claiming whatever the current lineup was was the best, he would go out of his way to disparage past lineups. I'm thinking, "Wow, you're a pretty poor judge if you used to say that lineup was awesome and now you're actively saying they were crap." It's one thing to say, "This is the best lineup yet! We keep getting better and better," to contradicting yourself in order to talk shit about people you don't like. Anyway, I was curious to see if I would like Incorruptible and....I did. It was actually pretty awesome.

We all have to decide where we draw our line in the sand. I'm fine with anyone drawing it wherever they want. I just want it to be consistent. There are lots of bad people in the music business. I'm not going to throw out all their albums or even apologize for liking them.

[Zook]

I got my copy of the 30th Anniversary debut today. The lazy bastard at Amazon couldn't even put it by my front door, not even at the end of the steps, but another ten feet away at the corner of my house. This isn't even the first time they've done this.

Anyway, it may be the last Iced Earth CD I ever buy. Who knows if anymore retailers are gonna stop selling anything from the band. I guess rappers go to prison all the time and still have their shit sold everywhere, so maybe it was just the label. Still, I want it for my collection as it's a reminder of better days, and a damn good remix. His involvement in the insurrection didn't impact me as bad as others, but I'm still a bit iffy on supporting him going forward. I guess it depends on if he does his time and realizes what a colossal asshat he was. I doubt it. Iced Earth is probably done. Maybe in a 10 years we'll get the other remixes, or he'll find a way to get them out there sooner. Did the Zeus guy cut ties as well?

Am I being selfish for wanting these remixes?

I don't know what it is about this band. Dream Theater currently holds the number 1 spot, but I don't have a mini ZeppelinDT collection of their output. Iced Earth is the only band where I own multiple copies of the same albums. Having different artwork and track lists plays a big part in that, but still. The Jon Schaffer Band is very special to me. Jon has written his fair share of stinkers, but the music just resonates with me. When I discovered the band in 2004, things weren't going so well in my life, so Jon's music helped me escape. It's also nice to have a favorite band that still puts out enjoyable music for the most part unlike another band I used to love. *cough*theoffspring*cough* their last decent album was 18 fucking years ago.

Yeah, Iced Earth was just a mediocre band with a laughable amount of line up changes and a batshit crazy asshole guitarist/founder/bear spray enthusiast, but that asshole entertained me for close to 20 years, so i thank him for that.

There's a 19 year old thread on the Ultimate Metal Forum simply called Nevermore vs Iced Earth. Nevermore may be more talented, but Iced Earth still wins. I like some Nevermore, but they are mostly boring, and Warrel Dane never 100% clicked with me. Tolerable, but I couldn't listen to him for a long period of time.

Anyway, that's all I got for today.

Go away now!

Don't let this shit make you lose your love for Iced Earth. Separate the artists from the art. I still love Ozzy's output even though he is an objectively bad person whose wife is objectively worse. I won't spend anymore money on him which is made an easier decision by the fact that he hasn't put out anything good since 1995, I guess with the exception of 13 which I resisted buying for two years and even then bought from a used seller.

I did a little experiment myself. After the capitol crap I tracked down a copy of Incorruptible which I never bothered to buy since Schaffer annoyed the shit out of me. I used to love the band but even disregarding his politics I got so sick of him not only claiming whatever the current lineup was was the best, he would go out of his way to disparage past lineups. I'm thinking, "Wow, you're a pretty poor judge if you used to say that lineup was awesome and now you're actively saying they were crap." It's one thing to say, "This is the best lineup yet! We keep getting better and better," to contradicting yourself in order to talk shit about people you don't like. Anyway, I was curious to see if I would like Incorruptible and....I did. It was actually pretty awesome.

We all have to decide where we draw our line in the sand. I'm fine with anyone drawing it wherever they want. I just want it to be consistent. There are lots of bad people in the music business. I'm not going to throw out all their albums or even apologize for liking them.

Yeah, it would take a lot more for me to get rid of my IE CDs. He hasn't done anything as heinous as the Lost Prophets guy. He's just a misinformed and misguided dumbass.

In related news:
https://ultimateclassicrock.com/dee-snider-jon-schaffer/

[TAC]

Wow!

[Ben_Jamin]

You disobey my rules, you don't care at all
You don't give a damn about protocol
You don't belong here, get out of our lives

 

[Zook]

You disobey my rules, you don't care at all
You don't give a damn about protocol
You don't belong here, get out of our lives

 

That was cheesy, but not bad.

[Grappler]

I'm over the shock of Jon's situation.  I'm just more angry that his actions caused the band to break up and certainly brought his career to a halt for the time being.

I haven't listened to Iced Earth for three months.  I have the itch to, but it's more like a contest now - how long can I go without playing the music?  I haven't gone 3 months without listening to them in the entire 23 years that I've been a fan.  Reading the Wicked Words book reminded me how much I love Jon's music and Iced Earth, despite the entire book being one giant ego stroke for Jon.

I'm sure I'll listen to them again sometime. I just needed to come to terms with this whole thing.

[Zook]

I'm over the shock of Jon's situation.  I'm just more angry that his actions caused the band to break up and certainly brought his career to a halt for the time being.

I haven't listened to Iced Earth for three months.  I have the itch to, but it's more like a contest now - how long can I go without playing the music?  I haven't gone 3 months without listening to them in the entire 23 years that I've been a fan.  Reading the Wicked Words book reminded me how much I love Jon's music and Iced Earth, despite the entire book being one giant ego stroke for Jon.

I'm sure I'll listen to them again sometime. I just needed to come to terms with this whole thing.

I went a long stretch (over 2 years apparently) without listening to Disturbed after I got in a little argument with David Draiman on Twitter. Which, by the way only happened because he mistook a sarcastic comment I made as serious, which was a reply to a sarcastic comment he made. I was also attacked by some fans. He eventually blocked me after giving me 3 strikes.

Joking aside, I think Mike Wengren is an excellent drummer, and is wasting his potential with Disturbed and his new project, Fight or Flight.

Oh, and David blocked me on Twitter, but I provoked it after he was being a condescending douchebag. Basically, he posted an article and put "wow, mother of the year". A lot of his followers are idiots, and as a joke mocking those who always take him too seriously, I put "mother of the year? That's awful, David. You should be ashamed! " To which he replied, "it's sarcasm, genius, don't you get it? i was merely testing him as I knew he wouldn't get that I too was being sarcastic. I even had the damn emoticon at the end.

Oh then he said I was being "butthurt" (I hate that fucking word) because I tried being a smartass and he called me out on my bullshit. It may have been in bad taste, but I think he was the only one upset that he couldn't tell I was joking with him, even with that damn smiley. The guy is a tool, and it's not the first time he snapped at me. Telling me to butt out of a conversation on fucking twitter. Last time I checked, Twitter wasn't a private messaging service. And I was trying to joke with him that time too.

I don't remember the conversation I was told to butt out of unfortunately, but I know with absolute certainty that I wasn't the only one who commented on it. I completely forgot that happened until I found this post.

[wolfking]

I'm over the shock of Jon's situation.  I'm just more angry that his actions caused the band to break up and certainly brought his career to a halt for the time being.

I haven't listened to Iced Earth for three months.  I have the itch to, but it's more like a contest now - how long can I go without playing the music?  I haven't gone 3 months without listening to them in the entire 23 years that I've been a fan.  Reading the Wicked Words book reminded me how much I love Jon's music and Iced Earth, despite the entire book being one giant ego stroke for Jon.

I'm sure I'll listen to them again sometime. I just needed to come to terms with this whole thing.

Yeah, I'll still listen and enjoy the music.  I don't really care about this whole thing, but being over here in Oz probably makes it less personal.  Just hope he learns from it and I kind of hope he avoids jail time truthfully.  Again though it's not a personal matter for me so he very well may deserve jail time. 

[Zook]

I'm over the shock of Jon's situation.  I'm just more angry that his actions caused the band to break up and certainly brought his career to a halt for the time being.

I haven't listened to Iced Earth for three months.  I have the itch to, but it's more like a contest now - how long can I go without playing the music?  I haven't gone 3 months without listening to them in the entire 23 years that I've been a fan.  Reading the Wicked Words book reminded me how much I love Jon's music and Iced Earth, despite the entire book being one giant ego stroke for Jon.

I'm sure I'll listen to them again sometime. I just needed to come to terms with this whole thing.

Yeah, I'll still listen and enjoy the music.  I don't really care about this whole thing, but being over here in Oz probably makes it less personal.  Just hope he learns from it and I kind of hope he avoids jail time truthfully.  Again though it's not a personal matter for me so he very well may deserve jail time. 

Honestly, I think he does deserve jail time. 30 years is way too extreme, but maybe so is 5. He did break the law though, and probably did spray people with bear mace, which I'm told is like 100 times worse than regular mace for obvious reasons, so he needs to be held accountable. What would he have done had he made it further inside? What would any of them had done? They wanted to "stop the steal" but what does that mean exactly? How were they going to "stop the steal"? Did they even know? Mob mentality is a dangerous thing.

[wolfking]

All true.  Lucky he didn't kill anyone really.

[MirrorMask]

I'm over the shock of Jon's situation.  I'm just more angry that his actions caused the band to break up and certainly brought his career to a halt for the time being.

I haven't listened to Iced Earth for three months.  I have the itch to, but it's more like a contest now - how long can I go without playing the music?  I haven't gone 3 months without listening to them in the entire 23 years that I've been a fan.  Reading the Wicked Words book reminded me how much I love Jon's music and Iced Earth, despite the entire book being one giant ego stroke for Jon.

I'm sure I'll listen to them again sometime. I just needed to come to terms with this whole thing.

Yeah, I'll still listen and enjoy the music.  I don't really care about this whole thing, but being over here in Oz probably makes it less personal.  Just hope he learns from it and I kind of hope he avoids jail time truthfully.  Again though it's not a personal matter for me so he very well may deserve jail time. 

Honestly, I think he does deserve jail time. 30 years is way too extreme, but maybe so is 5. He did break the law though, and probably did spray people with bear mace, which I'm told is like 100 times worse than regular mace for obvious reasons, so he needs to be held accountable. What would he have done had he made it further inside? What would any of them had done? They wanted to "stop the steal" but what does that mean exactly? How were they going to "stop the steal"? Did they even know? Mob mentality is a dangerous thing.

Do you remember the joke / comment "The Flat Earth Society has members all around the globe" with the super voted comment saying "read that again, but slowly"? this is one of those situations, we have a P/R forum so I won't make it long but this is definitively one of those cases when the more you spell out the plan and the expectations about the outcome, the more it sounds stupid.

[lonestar]

So I heard on Maddow that part of his plea deal may involve witness protection...now that would be the end of the band for sure. Granted I didn't care for the band before it was cool not to.

[Grappler]

So I heard on Maddow that part of his plea deal may involve witness protection...now that would be the end of the band for sure. Granted I didn't care for the band before it was cool not to.

It's at Jon's discretion and choosing.  If he feels that he needs to enter witness protection, the government will help him do that.  I don't see him doing that - he looked rather confident walking out of jail.

[Zook]

So I heard on Maddow that part of his plea deal may involve witness protection...now that would be the end of the band for sure. Granted I didn't care for the band before it was cool not to.

It's at Jon's discretion and choosing.  If he feels that he needs to enter witness protection, the government will help him do that.  I don't see him doing that - he looked rather confident walking out of jail.

There's footage of him leaving jail?

[Grappler]

Jon leaving jail, presumably with his girlfriend(?):  https://www.facebook.com/JoeKhalilpage/videos/476861176798418/

[Zook]

So after asking the first question and being clearly ignored, why does that parasite continue asking questions?

[WilliamMunny]

So after asking the first question and being clearly ignored, why does that parasite continue asking questions?

I had the same exact thought. I mean, I guess everyone's gotta make a living, but that dude totally just disrupted an incredibly emotional moment. I dunno, I realize that this is the culture we live in, but a simple headline or still photo showing his release would have more than satisfied me. Making a living trying to goad someone into having a public meltdown for financial gain seems like the type of job you couldn't pay enough to do.

[Madman Shepherd]

I would generally agree but it's all worth it just to get some footage of him showing the "diaper" on his face that he swore he would never wear because it infringed on his precious freedom. 

[Grappler]

I haven't listened to Iced Earth for three months.  I have the itch to, but it's more like a contest now - how long can I go without playing the music?

The answer is 10 and a half months.  I listened to a song here or there over the summer from Iced Earth or Demons & Wizards, but I just wasn't feeling it.  The other day, I felt like listening to some Iced Earth - I put it on and the riffs just blasted me in the face.   

After the January 6th stuff, I needed a break to reconcile my love of the music with all of the news and drama. 

[TAC]

In the last couple of months, I've buzzed through Something Wicked, Horror Show, and The Glorious Burden.

[MirrorMask]

This is something that people online found funny enough to repost it, so I will share it here as well.... when a music FB page posted a song from Horror Show, I reminesced about those glorious three hours concerts they did - at least in Europe - for the tour, and that it would soon be the 20th anniversary since those shows happened in 2002, imagine someone traveling back in time to that era and talking with an ecstatic fan after one of those shows, in a time when it seemed that Iced Eearth were on the contast rise and nothing would stop them....

"So, how was the show?"
"Incredible! amazing!!! what a powerhouse band!!! Matt Barlow is a god walking the earth!!!"
"Yeah, pity that next year he will leave the band..."
"WHAT???"
"He will, but don't worry, he will come back in a few years..."
"Ah, ok, at least we're getting him back..."
"Yeah, but then he will leave again, and this time for good"
"WHAT???"
"At least they will find a suitable replacement and the band will carry on, they will do overall good albums"
"Ok then, at least we'll have another version of the band to enjoy..."
"Yeah, but it's all gonna end when Jon Schaffer will assault the Capitol in the aftermath of Donald Trump losing the re-election"
"WHAT - THE - F"

[Mladen]

That's a good sketch right there. 

[Grappler]

https://www.washingtonpost.com/national-security/racine-jan-6-lawsuit/2021/12/14/4e581d00-5c51-11ec-bda6-25c1f558dd09_story.html

Jon Schaffer was named as an individual defendant in a new civil lawsuit filed by the DC attorney general. This is the first lawsuit to hold individual members of the Proud Boys and Oathkeepers liable for the attack on the US capitol.

Collectively, the "individual defendants" are alleged to have planned the attack, including Jon.  The lawsuit doesn't share much of his involvement, other than grouping him with the other defendants. 


In other news, the Iced Earth merch store has been reopened for the first time since Jon's arrest.   Coincidence?   

[svisser]

As I Lay Dying seems to be doing alright after Tim went nuts, so I have hope for Iced Earth.

Jon's gotta spend some time in jail though.

It sucks that this all went down after Jon decided to rerecord their earlier stuff. Would love to have heard Burnt Offerings rerecorded.

[Corlis]

It sucks that this all went down after Jon decided to rerecord their earlier stuff. Would love to have heard Burnt Offerings rerecorded.

I never understood why the band (or the fans) are never satisfied with that album's production. There are already 3 versions of it. The original album with good, meaty guitar tone and great, rocky-sounding drums. Then the "reworked" versions which appeared on Days of Purgatory. And lastly the Remixed & Remastered versions where they butchered the artwork but nailed the guitar tone. They're not gonna get a nicer guitar & bass tone than this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WfajZs_RW34

[Zook]

It sucks that this all went down after Jon decided to rerecord their earlier stuff. Would love to have heard Burnt Offerings rerecorded.

I never understood why the band (or the fans) are never satisfied with that album's production. There are already 3 versions of it. The original album with good, meaty guitar tone and great, rocky-sounding drums. Then the "reworked" versions which appeared on Days of Purgatory. And lastly the Remixed & Remastered versions where they butchered the artwork but nailed the guitar tone. They're not gonna get a nicer guitar & bass tone than this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WfajZs_RW34

The remix is probably the best it's going to get, and much improved over the horrible original. The drums kinda ruin the original release. The drummer for Burnt Offerings was certainly better than the drummer from the debut, but still sloppy as all hell. I was curious to hear what the re-recorded albums would have sounded like, but they wouldn't come close to the originals, and Stu, as great as a singer he is, would have likely further hurt the songs. Plus, we have further proof in Dante's Inferno 2011 and Overture of The Wicked that completely rerecording old songs is bad and Jon should feel bad.

I know that DI 2011 was rushed to get the click for the keyboard tracks on tour, and they'd have likely done it more justice, but I doubt it would have been much better. And Stu just can't hold a candle to Matt. Stu has incredible range, but lacks the presence and bombast of Matt.

If Jon ever does remix the original BO for the anniversary, he'd still have to do some trickery with the drums if he wants it to sound good. The debut drummer was very limited, but as far as I can tell listening all these years, no work was ever done to the drums. There's a chance the drums on BO were completely rerecorded for the remix. That's how bad they were.

[MirrorMask]

If I remember correctly from who knows which interview, Jon said that "it took every engineering trick in the book to make the drums work on Burnt Offerings", implying - or flat out saying? - that they were recorded in a sloppy way and that they had to do the equivalent of autotune for the voice all over the drummer's performance to make it acceptable.