Author Topic: Election 2012  (Read 231754 times)

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Offline jsem

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Re: Election 2012
« Reply #875 on: January 20, 2012, 11:21:03 AM »
I think Paul did VERY well last night. Gingrich as well. I expect Gingrich to narrowly beat Romney, and Paul ending up at about 19% at third. Santorum last at maybe 15-16%.

Offline rumborak

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Re: Election 2012
« Reply #876 on: January 20, 2012, 11:45:39 AM »
It absolutely blows my mind that SC Republicans would choose a guy with a marital history that gives US Magazine a hard-on, over a guy whose main fault is being Mormon.

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Offline chknptpie

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Re: Election 2012
« Reply #877 on: January 20, 2012, 11:49:44 AM »
Obama sings Al Green and Biden congratulates Giants for making it to the Superbowl, in a conference in San Fransisco.

Offline jsem

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Re: Election 2012
« Reply #878 on: January 20, 2012, 11:51:18 AM »
It absolutely blows my mind that SC Republicans would choose a guy with a marital history that gives US Magazine a hard-on, over a guy whose main fault is being Mormon.

rumborak

Do you really thing that is the primary thing against Romney?

Offline kirksnosehair

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Re: Election 2012
« Reply #879 on: January 20, 2012, 12:08:40 PM »
It absolutely blows my mind that SC Republicans would choose a guy with a marital history that gives US Magazine a hard-on, over a guy whose main fault is being Mormon.

rumborak

Do you really thing that is the primary thing against Romney?

In South Carolina?  His Mormonism is at or near the top of the list of reasons they don't like him.  Most Evangelicals consider Mormonism to be a cult.

Offline jsem

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Re: Election 2012
« Reply #880 on: January 20, 2012, 12:37:46 PM »
Is that really factual though? Is it that view really that wide spread among Evangelicals?

Offline Scheavo

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Re: Election 2012
« Reply #881 on: January 20, 2012, 12:45:38 PM »
When Romney calls 375k a little bit of money, he's showing just how unfamiliar he is with the things actual Americans go through.

In the grand scheme of a federal budget or our debt, 375k is very little money though.

Yeah, that's only about 12 hours of operations in Afghanistan.

And this means what? That collectively we all have more money than individually? You're simply starting a truism. We're talking about personal income here, and him saying that 375k is not that much, which for him is not. Even though 375k a year is enough to make you the top 1% of Americans, Romney thinks it's "just a little." That's because he's extremely rich and extremely out of touch with the American experience.

Offline Super Dude

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Re: Election 2012
« Reply #882 on: January 20, 2012, 12:51:43 PM »
When Romney calls 375k a little bit of money, he's showing just how unfamiliar he is with the things actual Americans go through.

In the grand scheme of a federal budget or our debt, 375k is very little money though.

Yeah, that's only about 12 hours of operations in Afghanistan.

And this means what? That collectively we all have more money than individually? You're simply starting a truism. We're talking about personal income here, and him saying that 375k is not that much, which for him is not. Even though 375k a year is enough to make you the top 1% of Americans, Romney thinks it's "just a little." That's because he's extremely rich and extremely out of touch with the American experience.

Ah, that's what I thought. My family is considered part of the 1%, and yet we make only a fraction of that, which should say a lot about Mitt's "out-of-touchness" with his base and the rest of the American populace.
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Offline chknptpie

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Re: Election 2012
« Reply #883 on: January 20, 2012, 12:54:45 PM »
I guess I just don't care what a politician's income is. The fact that they are a politician to me means they are probably out of touch, not because of their level of income. Someone who has knowledge and experience on large amounts of money would probably know how to budget and fight the deficit better than someone in my economic level.

Offline kirksnosehair

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Re: Election 2012
« Reply #884 on: January 20, 2012, 01:14:12 PM »
Is that really factual though? Is it that view really that wide spread among Evangelicals?

Synopsis here


A more technical dissertation on Wikipedia

Basically, Mormon theology is just not compatible Evangelical theology at all.

Offline Scheavo

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Re: Election 2012
« Reply #885 on: January 20, 2012, 01:24:33 PM »
I guess I just don't care what a politician's income is. The fact that they are a politician to me means they are probably out of touch, not because of their level of income. Someone who has knowledge and experience on large amounts of money would probably know how to budget and fight the deficit better than someone in my economic level.

Well, it's not just about income, it's about their life experience, and other factors in the income. Someone as rich as Romney has never had to seriously "budget" in his life. What he made his career doing what basically sure money, something anyone could do if they had the resources. Buy out a company, leverage it out, take money, earn money no matter what happens to the company you bought out. Seems to me a person who as at least been poor in their lifetime is going to be better at it (and knowing most people who lived through the Great Depression is testament to that). They're going to have a lot of experience budgeting, and getting rid of things that are personally important for the necessity of reducing the budget. Seeing as how the real issue with the American deficit is the Bush Tax Cuts, and our Wars in Afghanistan, Romney policies would drive us off the roof . At this point, I'd almost like this to happen, just so people can finally get over the delusion of the Republican message.

Which is entirely besides the point, because neither Obama or Romney as President has any real control over the budget. True control is in the House, everyone else just adds to the debate, and has political power to pressure people.

Offline jsem

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Re: Election 2012
« Reply #886 on: January 20, 2012, 02:10:18 PM »
It said that 1/3 don't consider LDS as being Christians. Wow.

But to say that most evangelicals consider Romney a cultist goes beyond that. I don't really think that can be the case.

Offline kirksnosehair

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Re: Election 2012
« Reply #887 on: January 20, 2012, 02:23:35 PM »
It said that 1/3 don't consider LDS as being Christians. Wow.

But to say that most evangelicals consider Romney a cultist goes beyond that. I don't really think that can be the case.

Read between the lines.....


Quote
  National polls taken in recent months show how far anti-black prejudice has subsided compared to anti-Mormon prejudice. In a Gallup survey, 5 percent of adults said they wouldn’t vote for their party’s presidential nominee if he were black. Six percent said they wouldn’t vote for a woman, 7 percent said they wouldn’t vote for a Catholic, 9 percent said they wouldn’t vote for a Jew, and 10 percent said they wouldn’t vote for a Hispanic. But 22 percent said they wouldn’t vote for a Mormon. Gallup reported:
     The stability in U.S. bias against voting for a Mormon presidential candidate contrasts markedly with steep declines in similar views toward several other groups over the past half-century, including blacks, women, Catholics, and Jews. The last time as many as 22% of Americans said they would not vote for any of these groups (the same level opposed to voting for a Mormon today) was 1959 for Catholics, 1961 for Jews, 1971 for blacks, and 1975 for women. As noted, opposition to voting for each of these has since tapered off to single digits.
     In a Pew survey, 7 percent of adults said they’d be more likely to support a presidential candidate if he were black. Only 3 percent said they’d be less likely. (Among whites, 3 percent said more likely; 4 percent said less likely.) But while 5 percent said they’d be more likely to support a presidential candidate if he were Mormon, 25 percent said they’d be less likely. In the four years since Pew’s last survey on this topic, taken in August 2007, the percentage of respondents who said they’d be less likely to support a black, Hispanic, or female candidate shrank. But the percentage who said they’d be less likely to support a Mormon didn’t change.
Maybe "most" is too strong of a word, I don't know, I only say that because most of the evangelicals I know (probably 15 or 20 people give or take a few) have told me they believe Mormonism is a cult.  Combine that with all of these fairly high-profile pastors coming out and saying it's a cult, and you've got a pretty wide swath of these folks that simply won't vote for the guy based on his religion.  Which, to me, personally, is kind of silly.  But then I also think not voting for a guy because he's rich is silly too.



 

Offline kirksnosehair

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Re: Election 2012
« Reply #888 on: January 20, 2012, 02:24:53 PM »
Here's another poll where almost 1/3 said Mormonism is a cult.

Quote
Thirty-one percent of Republicans said Mormonism is a cult, as did 25% of Democrats and 25% of independents.


Offline rumborak

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Re: Election 2012
« Reply #889 on: January 20, 2012, 02:49:41 PM »
Then again, I wonder what the percentage of Protestants is who think Catholicism is a cult. It's almost a defining feature of a religion to fight tooth and nail amongst each other.

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Offline jsem

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Re: Election 2012
« Reply #890 on: January 20, 2012, 02:51:31 PM »
Wow. As a LDS myself, I don't know whether to laugh or cry at that stat. There are many other reasons to not support Romney's bid for presidency :lol

And those polls you showed earlier shows the obscenity of US politics. Especially that anti-black sentiment. What is wrong with people?

Offline Dark Castle

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Re: Election 2012
« Reply #891 on: January 20, 2012, 02:53:15 PM »
Wow. As a LDS myself, I don't know whether to laugh or cry at that stat. There are many other reasons to not support Romney's bid for presidency :lol

And those polls you showed earlier shows the obscenity of US politics. Especially that anti-black sentiment. What is wrong with people?
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Offline chknptpie

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Re: Election 2012
« Reply #892 on: January 20, 2012, 03:09:58 PM »
I guess I just don't care what a politician's income is. The fact that they are a politician to me means they are probably out of touch, not because of their level of income. Someone who has knowledge and experience on large amounts of money would probably know how to budget and fight the deficit better than someone in my economic level.

Well, it's not just about income, it's about their life experience, and other factors in the income. Someone as rich as Romney has never had to seriously "budget" in his life. What he made his career doing what basically sure money, something anyone could do if they had the resources. Buy out a company, leverage it out, take money, earn money no matter what happens to the company you bought out. Seems to me a person who as at least been poor in their lifetime is going to be better at it (and knowing most people who lived through the Great Depression is testament to that). They're going to have a lot of experience budgeting, and getting rid of things that are personally important for the necessity of reducing the budget. Seeing as how the real issue with the American deficit is the Bush Tax Cuts, and our Wars in Afghanistan, Romney policies would drive us off the roof . At this point, I'd almost like this to happen, just so people can finally get over the delusion of the Republican message.

Which is entirely besides the point, because neither Obama or Romney as President has any real control over the budget. True control is in the House, everyone else just adds to the debate, and has political power to pressure people.

I wasn't really focusing on Romney. I don't care what any politicians income is was my point and I think you agree with it? It has to do with their background and knowledge. That is what should be discussed, not the dollar amount.

Offline Super Dude

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Re: Election 2012
« Reply #893 on: January 20, 2012, 04:10:43 PM »
No, but as Scheavo was trying to explain, that income disparity is part and parcel to their personal background. Someone who's never known want will never truly be able to sympathize with the plight of average Americans, and it will reflect in his/her platform and policies.
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Online hefdaddy42

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Re: Election 2012
« Reply #894 on: January 20, 2012, 04:15:21 PM »
Someone who's never known want will never truly be able to sympathize with the plight of average Americans, and it will reflect in his/her platform and policies.
This.  I don't care if someone has built themselves into a success and now makes a zillion dollars a year.  But someone who has never bought his own groceries or fretted over making a mortgage payment simply won't be able to empathize with the vast majority of Americans.

I realize that exceptions are possible.  I also believe those exceptional people wouldn't bother with trying to run for President.
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Offline Scheavo

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Re: Election 2012
« Reply #895 on: January 20, 2012, 07:30:17 PM »
https://campaign2012.washingtonexaminer.com/blogs/beltway-confidential/america-hates-newt-gingrich/326161

Quote
Fox News, 1/12-1/14:
Obama, fav/unfav, 51%/46%, +5
Romney, fav/unfav, 45%/38%, +7
Gingrich, fav/unfav, 27%/56%, -29

CBS/NYT, 1/12-1/17:
Obama, fav/unfav, 38%/45%, -7
Romney, fav/unfav, 21%/35%, -14
Gingrich, fav/unfav, 17%/49%, -32

PPP, 1/13-1/17:
Obama, app/dis, 47%/50%, -3
Romney, fav/unfav, 35%/53%, -18
Gingrich, fav/unfav, 26%/60%, -34

Yikes.


Offline Super Dude

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Re: Election 2012
« Reply #896 on: January 20, 2012, 07:42:42 PM »
Obama is polling surprisingly well, particularly from Faux News.
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Offline Progmetty

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Re: Election 2012
« Reply #897 on: January 21, 2012, 12:18:35 AM »
This is playing out like a DTF Images & Words survivor. NG is Metropolis, MR is LTL, RP is TTT & RS is PMU. You know that LTL is probably gonna win but sometimes Metropolis is a serious threat to it while some would really hope TTT wins and PMU is admired but remains behind.
I think it's really unfair that a big part of how you're judged is how good you do on debates, RS was fast and articulate on that CNN debate while's the shittiest one of stage. NG is witty and that gave him some advantage on MR in the debate but only in the debate. How is being a clever talking or having a faster and tighter command of the English language making you better than the rest when you obviously have the same ideology with minor differences? Just an unfiltered thought.
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Offline jsem

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Re: Election 2012
« Reply #898 on: January 21, 2012, 02:07:24 AM »
Lol, look at Gingrich's favorability numbers.

Offline chknptpie

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Re: Election 2012
« Reply #899 on: January 21, 2012, 12:31:28 PM »
How is Obama polling so well from Fox News? Are they trying to scare people into action?  :lol

Offline emindead

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Re: Election 2012
« Reply #900 on: January 21, 2012, 12:36:01 PM »
Could be a strategy. "Listen, Republican folks! If we don't get our shit together and choose Romney this BLACK GUY is going to WIN AGAIN and finish leading us to HELL! Let's choose him QUICK!"

It adds up.

Offline jsem

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Re: Election 2012
« Reply #901 on: January 21, 2012, 12:38:27 PM »
Fox hasn't been that kind to Romney. They don't like him that much.

Offline Super Dude

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Re: Election 2012
« Reply #902 on: January 21, 2012, 01:25:04 PM »
Mostly for the Mormon thing, it seems, which is a foolish reason to tear him down but hey.
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Offline Scheavo

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Re: Election 2012
« Reply #903 on: January 21, 2012, 01:35:04 PM »
Lol, look at Gingrich's favorability numbers.

Apparently his response:

Quote
But the presidency is not about likeability. The presidency is about are you capable of doing the job?

Which just begs the question: what about the President's diplomatic job? There, he certainty must be likeable.

Offline kirksnosehair

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Re: Election 2012
« Reply #904 on: January 21, 2012, 03:34:40 PM »
Wow. As a LDS myself, I don't know whether to laugh or cry at that stat. There are many other reasons to not support Romney's bid for presidency :lol

And those polls you showed earlier shows the obscenity of US politics. Especially that anti-black sentiment. What is wrong with people?


I wish I knew what these people think.  I really do.  It's baffling to me. 

Offline Scheavo

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Re: Election 2012
« Reply #905 on: January 21, 2012, 07:29:27 PM »
Wow... interseting results. Gingrich dominates, Paul comes in 4th. This party does not seem like it's coalescing at all, this next election is going to be a complete mess.

Delegate count:

https://www.cbsnews.com/primary-election-results-2012/scorecard.shtml?party=R


Online hefdaddy42

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Re: Election 2012
« Reply #906 on: January 21, 2012, 07:43:44 PM »
Herman Cain apparently got around 9% of the vote.  Way to go, Colbert!
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Offline rumborak

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Re: Election 2012
« Reply #907 on: January 21, 2012, 09:02:09 PM »
Hah, interesting result tonight. Romney got his work cut out, momentum is everything. I guess Santorum is still somewhat in the game, whereas RP is slowly falling by the wayside. He'd been struggling to break the 20% barrier, and now he can't even get close to that one anymore.

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Offline jsem

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Re: Election 2012
« Reply #908 on: January 22, 2012, 02:31:01 AM »
Brokered convention is going to happen. But, Paul 4th, what is wrong with SC.

Offline wasteland

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Re: Election 2012
« Reply #909 on: January 22, 2012, 03:13:18 AM »
What happens if two or more candidates make it to the convention with roughly the same number of delegates?
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