Author Topic: Election 2012  (Read 231824 times)

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Offline jsem

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Re: Election 2012
« Reply #700 on: January 04, 2012, 04:00:46 AM »
Nah, it's all proportionate.

Online lordxizor

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Re: Election 2012
« Reply #701 on: January 04, 2012, 06:25:50 AM »
It's non-binding as well I believe, so delegates aren't forced to vote for a certain candidate.

RP will end @ about 20% in NH too
I wouldn't be surprised if RP did pretty well in NH. Romney will get the first spot, but I'd predict Paul will get #2. We have a lot of anti-government people in NH. But the more populated areas are very close to Mass. and many of them commute to work in Mass., so I think Romney will have little problem winning.

Offline emindead

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Re: Election 2012
« Reply #702 on: January 04, 2012, 06:28:58 AM »
Just freaking 8 votes of difference. Wow.

Offline jsem

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Re: Election 2012
« Reply #703 on: January 04, 2012, 06:45:33 AM »
NH is the Live Free or Die state.

Also home to the Free State project.

Paul is going to do very well.


Offline Perpetual Change

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Re: Election 2012
« Reply #704 on: January 04, 2012, 07:10:24 AM »
I don't get why NH is such a big primary state. Isn't it going to go liberal, anyway?

Offline PlaysLikeMyung

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Re: Election 2012
« Reply #705 on: January 04, 2012, 07:35:52 AM »
I fear for this country if Ron Paul is even CLOSE to getting the nomination.

Offline Blackfield

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Re: Election 2012
« Reply #706 on: January 04, 2012, 07:49:14 AM »
Why?

Offline snapple

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Re: Election 2012
« Reply #707 on: January 04, 2012, 07:55:06 AM »
Why?

While, idealistically, he's very attractive for voters, the fact is that he probably wouldn't beat Obama. Even if he did, he wouldn't get anything passed that he wants to do. No one in Congress would ever vote in favor of some of his ideas, and we'd have a stagnant office and a wasted 4 years.

Offline Super Dude

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Re: Election 2012
« Reply #708 on: January 04, 2012, 08:02:34 AM »
That's not true at all; Paul loves the idea of cutting spending and government, and so does the Republican establishment. The reason they dislike him is because he's not an establishment Republican.
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Re: Election 2012
« Reply #709 on: January 04, 2012, 08:20:50 AM »
I think Paul would do alright in a general election.  I don't think anybody they pick is really going to energize the base,  and RP certainly won't.  The difference is that RP can get a ton of independent support that Romney or Santorum can't.  There are plenty of people like me who would generally support the democrat but think that Obama is a worthless pile of dog-doo.  While I wouldn't vote for an establishment Republican,  I would vote for one with an independent streak like Paul.  I'm starting to think the votes gained from independents might be greater than the votes lost by apathetic republicans should Paul get the nomination. 
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Online lordxizor

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Re: Election 2012
« Reply #710 on: January 04, 2012, 08:52:34 AM »
I don't get why NH is such a big primary state. Isn't it going to go liberal, anyway?
Not necessarily. They don't seem to vote consistently one party or the other. But they're only 4 electoral votes anyway, which is pretty much negligible. NH is a big primary state because they're the second primary, that's it. There's really no significance to the state otherwise. I'm sure they have an early primary just so they matter for a while.

Offline snapple

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Re: Election 2012
« Reply #711 on: January 04, 2012, 09:10:17 AM »
That's not true at all; Paul loves the idea of cutting spending and government, and so does the Republican establishment. The reason they dislike him is because he's not an establishment Republican.

Eh, it's plenty true. Someone has to pay for their re-elections. Those people like government money or money created by government programs/regulations etc.

Offline wasteland

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Re: Election 2012
« Reply #712 on: January 04, 2012, 09:21:58 AM »
I can't undestand how anyone would wish to support a politician who thinks of admitting the existence of evolution or not denying the global warming as a reproachful act.
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Offline kirksnosehair

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Re: Election 2012
« Reply #713 on: January 04, 2012, 09:35:27 AM »
Well, Santorum made it closer than I thought, but as I suspected Romney wins.  I think Romney will do even better in NH, but not a LOT better.  Ron Paul will probably be gone by or right after Super Tuesday.    The only question that remains is will he mount a disgruntled independent challenge, effectively ensuring an Obama victory in the General Election or will he simply take his ball and go home? 

Bachmann will probably announce that she's out this week.  Maybe even today.

Huntsman is the wild card in NH.  Did his strategy pay off? 

None of this matters much anyway, since it's Romney's turn.  He'll be the nominee.  And the general election will be one of the closest in history.

Obama's problem is obvious.  The highly motivated youth vote that propelled him to victory in 2008 are all pretty much disgusted with him.  Voter apathy on the Democrat side is going to make this election very close.  I still say 50/50 shot -at best- for Obama....the only way that improves between now and November is if we get some fairly dramatic GOOD NEWS about the economy between now and then.  With home prices still going down, that seems unlikely.



Offline antigoon

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Re: Election 2012
« Reply #714 on: January 04, 2012, 09:56:21 AM »
I can't undestand how anyone would wish to support a politician who thinks of admitting the existence of evolution or not denying the global warming as a reproachful act.
I can't understand how anyone would wish to support a politician who's secret drone wars kill innocent men, women, and children - Someone who supports the assassination of American citizens abroad and has codified into law the ability of the government to indefinitely detain US citizens. 

It's easy to play this game; I could go on for days. I don't mean to trivialize very reasonable and logical concerns with someone like Paul's positions, but frankly, I'd like for the rule of law to be somewhat re-established before addressing that stuff.


Offline Super Dude

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Re: Election 2012
« Reply #715 on: January 04, 2012, 10:09:26 AM »
That's not true at all; Paul loves the idea of cutting spending and government, and so does the Republican establishment. The reason they dislike him is because he's not an establishment Republican.

Eh, it's plenty true. Someone has to pay for their re-elections. Those people like government money or money created by government programs/regulations etc.

What government money? Donors are primarily corporate or private.

I can't undestand how anyone would wish to support a politician who thinks of admitting the existence of evolution or not denying the global warming as a reproachful act.
I can't understand how anyone would wish to support a politician who's secret drone wars kill innocent men, women, and children - Someone who supports the assassination of American citizens abroad and has codified into law the ability of the government to indefinitely detain US citizens. 

It's easy to play this game; I could go on for days. I don't mean to trivialize very reasonable and logical concerns with someone like Paul's positions, but frankly, I'd like for the rule of law to be somewhat re-established before addressing that stuff.



I hate to say it, but problems like global warming are a much more time sensitive issue. Social and political justice is a ticking time bomb only in the sense that the failure to secure either *may* spark violent backlash, and the effects of that will be very localized.

I know I sound like I'm trivializing the very important issue of justice, but we should probably try to prevent millions from dying from cataclysmic environmental reactions and potential extinction of life on Earth first, and deal with questions like those later.
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Offline antigoon

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Re: Election 2012
« Reply #716 on: January 04, 2012, 10:18:25 AM »
I know you're just piggybacking on sensationalist posts, but do you really think things will be THAT much worse on the climate change front with four years of Paul? From what I gather things aren't so great right now anyway.

Offline Super Dude

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Re: Election 2012
« Reply #717 on: January 04, 2012, 10:23:44 AM »
Obama may not be taking us forward, but the Republican agenda so far has been going backward. End the EPA and all that nonsense.

Anyway, sorry about that tirade. I wrote it fresh out of editing a policy paper. It may be more accurate to say that the longer we wait, the harder it will be to make the necessary changes to avoid both a human and economic catastrophe, here as well as abroad. The point is climate change mitigation is a much more time-critical issue, in that there is such a thing as 'too late.'
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Offline snapple

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Re: Election 2012
« Reply #718 on: January 04, 2012, 10:25:21 AM »
That's not true at all; Paul loves the idea of cutting spending and government, and so does the Republican establishment. The reason they dislike him is because he's not an establishment Republican.

Eh, it's plenty true. Someone has to pay for their re-elections. Those people like government money or money created by government programs/regulations etc.

What government money? Donors are primarily corporate or private.


I'm pretty sure BP backs candidates that are going to make oil regulations less rigid allowing BP to make more money. Things of that nature.


/imnotsayingallpoliticiansareboughtoffbutthereareenoughwhoaretomakeadifference

Offline Super Dude

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Re: Election 2012
« Reply #719 on: January 04, 2012, 10:26:20 AM »
Well yeah, that's what I was saying. Republicans don't need government money, they get plenty in corporate funds (not to say Democrats don't as well, but that's why Republicans don't sweat the smaller government thing).
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Offline snapple

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Re: Election 2012
« Reply #720 on: January 04, 2012, 01:07:00 PM »
Well yeah, that's what I was saying. Republicans don't need government money, they get plenty in corporate funds (not to say Democrats don't as well, but that's why Republicans don't sweat the smaller government thing).

Democrats are just as bad.

Offline Super Dude

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Re: Election 2012
« Reply #721 on: January 04, 2012, 01:14:54 PM »
Well yeah, that's what I was saying. Republicans don't need government money, they get plenty in corporate funds (not to say Democrats don't as well, but that's why Republicans don't sweat the smaller government thing).

Democrats are just as bad.

Well yeah, that's what I was saying. Republicans don't need government money, they get plenty in corporate funds (not to say Democrats don't as well, but that's why Republicans don't sweat the smaller government thing).
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Offline rumborak

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Re: Election 2012
« Reply #722 on: January 04, 2012, 01:51:56 PM »
Ron Paul will probably be gone by or right after Super Tuesday.    The only question that remains is will he mount a disgruntled independent challenge, effectively ensuring an Obama victory in the General Election or will he simply take his ball and go home?

Yeah, it'll be interesting. A lot of disillusioned teenagers will be the result.

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Bachmann will probably announce that she's out this week.  Maybe even today.

Yup, she's out. Even though she still said yesterday she'd stay in the race.

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Offline snapple

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Re: Election 2012
« Reply #723 on: January 04, 2012, 02:01:02 PM »
Yup, she's out. Even though she still said yesterday she'd stay in the race.

rumborak


As a conservative, this is how I feel about her dropping out :


Offline chknptpie

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Re: Election 2012
« Reply #724 on: January 04, 2012, 02:02:02 PM »
As a liberal, this is how I feel about her dropping out :



Offline rumborak

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Re: Election 2012
« Reply #725 on: January 04, 2012, 02:02:50 PM »
As a human being, this is how I feel about her dropping out :


"I liked when Myung looked like a women's figure skating champion."

Offline kirksnosehair

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Re: Election 2012
« Reply #726 on: January 04, 2012, 02:06:08 PM »
I'm all fucking warm and fuzzy right now  :lol

Offline snapple

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Re: Election 2012
« Reply #727 on: January 04, 2012, 02:10:24 PM »
Whenever she started talking during the debates  this is what would happen in my house:

I'd start drinking my beer (you need 2-3 for the debates regardless of Bachman) and looking at my phone
My mom would hit mute and look at her phone and glance up to see if she's shut up yet
My dad would start reading his book


Every time.

Offline kirksnosehair

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Re: Election 2012
« Reply #728 on: January 04, 2012, 02:18:31 PM »
That would be due to the fact that she's dumber than a bag full of hammers  :lol

And the worst part is, EVERYONE - I think even the people who elected her - know it!  :lol

And it's got NOTHING to do with her ideology.  She's just an idiot.


Offline snapple

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Re: Election 2012
« Reply #729 on: January 04, 2012, 02:22:19 PM »
And it's got NOTHING to do with her ideology.  She's just an idiot.

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Offline rumborak

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Re: Election 2012
« Reply #730 on: January 04, 2012, 03:38:32 PM »
I am still stunned that there were 2 counties in which Perry won. WTF. It's also interesting to see how Romney allured to the city folks, whereas Santorum was more popular in rural areas.

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Offline jsem

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Re: Election 2012
« Reply #731 on: January 04, 2012, 04:14:40 PM »
According to AP, Romney gets 13 delegates, Santorum gets 12, the rest get 0.

Apparently, Paul supporters didn't win the delegate process in any of the congressional districts or something.

Just a projection though, not official yet.

Offline Scheavo

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Re: Election 2012
« Reply #732 on: January 04, 2012, 10:36:25 PM »
I think Paul would do alright in a general election.  I don't think anybody they pick is really going to energize the base,  and RP certainly won't.  The difference is that RP can get a ton of independent support that Romney or Santorum can't.  There are plenty of people like me who would generally support the democrat but think that Obama is a worthless pile of dog-doo.  While I wouldn't vote for an establishment Republican,  I would vote for one with an independent streak like Paul.  I'm starting to think the votes gained from independents might be greater than the votes lost by apathetic republicans should Paul get the nomination.

If the prospect of a Ron Paul and a Democratic Congress was possible, then I think more might get done than with any other options. Our foreign policy would at least change, and I sorta wonder if he would just stop enforcing the drug war. I mean, he could pardon every drug offender in the country. Democrats wouldn't do away with the welfare aspects, but I honestly think if the President pushed for this, they wouldn't really push back too much.

Offline jsem

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Re: Election 2012
« Reply #733 on: January 05, 2012, 06:31:17 AM »
A lot of laws have been written with executive orders too. If he disagrees with them, he'll just repeal them with another executive order.

He wants laws to be passed by the legislative branch, so he'd undo a LOT of what many previous administrations have done.

Offline Scheavo

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Re: Election 2012
« Reply #734 on: January 05, 2012, 05:17:26 PM »
Btw, just to clear things up, the last "this" of my last post was meant to refer to the Wars and the Drug War, not welfare, as it would imply.

He wants laws to be passed by the legislative branch, so he'd undo a LOT of what many previous administrations have done.

Well, it'd be lot trickier than simply undoing them.