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Official Queensryche thread: Kickstart the next album

Started by AndyDT, April 29, 2009, 02:02:19 PM

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NunoTenniscourt

Quote from: Samsara on October 26, 2022, 01:36:58 PM
Quote from: Kwyjibo on October 26, 2022, 01:32:55 PM
And they still have to hit it. If the note is flat, the sustain doesn't help.

Of course. Like I said, most of the time, they get there, or get close. If it's flat, that sucks, but that's live music. Shit happens.

I just saw Extreme this summer, and Gary Cherone, who is always awesome, was flat a bit. Again, shit happens.

The effort, man. That goes a long way. As long as the notes are close, personally, I can live with it.

Hey, not everyone can be as great as Vince Neil. They can try, but their efforts will prove to be futile.

bosk1

Quote from: NunoTenniscourt on October 26, 2022, 09:31:50 PM
Quote from: Samsara on October 26, 2022, 01:36:58 PM
Quote from: Kwyjibo on October 26, 2022, 01:32:55 PM
And they still have to hit it. If the note is flat, the sustain doesn't help.

Of course. Like I said, most of the time, they get there, or get close. If it's flat, that sucks, but that's live music. Shit happens.

I just saw Extreme this summer, and Gary Cherone, who is always awesome, was flat a bit. Again, shit happens.

The effort, man. That goes a long way. As long as the notes are close, personally, I can live with it.

Hey, not everyone can be as great as Vince Neil. They can try, but their efforts will prove to be futile.



Samsara

So Geoff Tate has announced what I am sure everyone expected - a 35th anniversary tour of Operation: Mindcrime.

Ugh.

I mean, obviously Mindcrime is a cash cow, so I get WHY he's doing it. But I really wish he'd put that album to bed. I never got the chance to see the Empire/Rage tour unfortunately (had tickets but couldn't make it). But I saw he was doing stuff in Europe for both EP/Warning/Rage and then Promised Land. I wish he'd bring that to the states. I have no desire to see Operation: Mindcrime performed again. And while promoters want it, I just wish Tate made enough doing other stuff to stop trotting this record out. His band is okay, but they don't replicate that record overly well (I saw Tate's solo band do it in 2018 on the 30th).

A friend (who was another old school QR fan) and I talked about seeing a couple Tate shows in 2023/2024 (we live on opposite coasts but are from the same hometown). But I won't go see Operation: Mindcrime again.

T-ski

I just want to see O:M made into a movie. Is that too much to ask?

Samsara

Quote from: T-ski on November 10, 2022, 11:55:58 AM
I just want to see O:M made into a movie. Is that too much to ask?

Be careful what you wish for. My feeling on that is if it is ever done (and the legalities of who owns the rights to Mindcrime are a question), it will be done cheaply, and I don't want to see that.

Besides, I think the presentation of Operation: LIVEcrime as a concert was all that's needed. That release is still legendary and definitive IMO.

bosk1

Quote from: Samsara on November 10, 2022, 12:10:17 PM
Quote from: T-ski on November 10, 2022, 11:55:58 AM
I just want to see O:M made into a movie. Is that too much to ask?

Be careful what you wish for. My feeling on that is if it is ever done (and the legalities of who owns the rights to Mindcrime are a question), it will be done cheaply, and I don't want to see that.

Besides, I think the presentation of Operation: LIVEcrime as a concert was all that's needed. That release is still legendary and definitive IMO.

I agree with all of that. 

Samsara

Quote from: bosk1 on November 10, 2022, 12:24:19 PM
Quote from: Samsara on November 10, 2022, 12:10:17 PM
Quote from: T-ski on November 10, 2022, 11:55:58 AM
I just want to see O:M made into a movie. Is that too much to ask?

Be careful what you wish for. My feeling on that is if it is ever done (and the legalities of who owns the rights to Mindcrime are a question), it will be done cheaply, and I don't want to see that.

Besides, I think the presentation of Operation: LIVEcrime as a concert was all that's needed. That release is still legendary and definitive IMO.

I agree with all of that.

Of course you do.  :biggrin:

TAC


King Postwhore

Queensryche was announced to play on Cruise to the Edge.
"I don't like country music, but I don't mean to denigrate those who do. And for the people who like country music, denigrate means 'put down'." - Bon Newhart.

Setlist Scotty

Quote from: TAC on November 10, 2022, 12:46:33 PM
Quote from: T-ski on November 10, 2022, 11:55:58 AM
I just want to see O:M made into a movie.

No you don't.
Agreed. If you saw the O:MII tour and how cheesy and cheap that was, can you imagine how poorly a movie would be done?  :omg:

Samsara

Wilton did a new interview with Classic Rock - https://www.loudersound.com/features/queensryche-were-always-being-sued-about-something-thats-part-of-the-business

Now, because of how he answers things, some may think Michael isn't as much of a thinker as say DeGarmo and Tate are. But don't be fooled, Wilton is really sharp. He just is a bit more careful in what he says. I found these parts of the Q&A to be interesting:

QuoteCR: Would you be surprised to hear that in an interview for his most recent European tour Geoff Tate told Classic Rock: "I've been open to talking about a reunion with the guys for a couple of years, but honestly, it doesn't seem likely. I do wish them luck because they're going through a tumultuous time, as probably all of us are, getting things started again. I wish them well in that."

MW: That's respectable and the feeling is mutual, but we're on a roll with this version of Queensrÿche. It would be silly to stop our momentum. I wish the best for him, and that's all I can really say.

I had to re-read that twice. So Tate has reached out about reuniting, and it hasn't gone anywhere as the band feels it is in a good place and doesn't need another change that would interrupt what they are currently doing. This doesn't surprise me at all, frankly. But it was really nice to read in print that they are on...at least decent terms. I wish it would proceed further to the point where maybe Tate isn't with the band, but doing some legacy projects (re-releasing The Warning being tops on my list, perhaps a live album celebrating Promised Land using footage and audio from 1994-1995) could be done together, with Tate spearheading it a little bit.

I mean, I totally understand Wilton's point - the band is creating records that they enjoy that harken back a bit to the band's metal years. And as he and Eddie, like Tate, are in their 60s, there are more years behind than ahead, so why make an "unnecessary" shift now? I get it. Then again, on the flip side, it COULD (I don't know the numbers) make good sense, if they are all headed toward wrapping up their touring careers (I assume they won't tour into their 70s), to get it all back together while people are still playing/singing decently. I don't expect DeGarmo, but Stone is back in, and I mean, I am sure that Rockenfield and his lawsuit would easily be dismissed if there was some sort of windfall from a reunion of sorts.

I don't know.

Musically, I think the best post-Tate record is The Verdict, although DNA is good. But then that leads me to question this statement by Wilton:

QuoteCR - Digital Noise Alliance is Queensrÿche's fourth album with singer Todd La Torre. A decade after the exit of Geoff Tate, how well do you think the slump of those last few Tate-fronted records has been reversed?

MW - The whole rebuilding process is progressing well. For the most part it's about giving the fans what they want: the [signature] Queensrÿche sound. That's something we've done over countless tours and several albums. It's a work in progress, but right now everything feels very strong.

I totally understand what Wilton is saying here. But that said, I think the interviewer doesn't understand what Queensryche was in its original form. Queensryche's "signature" wasn't a "sound" per se, like when you hear Tony Iommi. I mean, Wilton's guitar is the one remaining sonic thread of that "sound" that is immediately recognizable (with apologies to Ed). his guitar tone and style are very distinct. But that isn't what made QR, as a band, distinct. One of those distinctions was doing exactly what the current version of QR ISN'T doing - making sure each record is its own, independent, different-sounding journey. Post-Tate QR is, as good as the songs are, very similar from record to record. Whereas, even those last few albums with Tate, as much as Dedicated to Chaos was NOT good to my ears, all three of those Tateryche records sounded, stylistically, all different from one another. Which was one of the original band's hallmarks. Did Tate go too far? Absolutely. Not involving the band (particularly Wilton) enough led to straying too far away from one of QR's strengths, and using outside writers to make what Tate's vision was, was a mistake (with all apologies to my good friend, the late Jason Slater, who would totally agree with what I said). Queensryche is Queensryche, not a band like Whitesnake that is led by one vision (Coverdale's). But, those albums DID continue to do what Queensryche always was - a band that changed its sound from record to record.

Queensryche was very much a sum of its parts. Moreso than most of their contemporaries. That's why as they lost DeGarmo, Tate, and Rockenfield, they've sounded less and less like "Queensryche." Yes, the band sounds more metal, but THAT isn't the signature Queensryche thing. That's ONE part of it. Just because these recent QR records are more metal, doesn't mean it's the "Queensryche sound." Frankly, I think QR sounds these days more like the spawn from an early Fates Warning record than Queensryche. And I love Fates Warning. But that's not Queensryche.

Anyway, I'm not being negative. If everyone in current QR loves what they are doing, then absolutely all power to them. The new music by Queensryche is very good. And I'm glad people are digging it. But I think it's a bit short-sighted to assume what's being produced now by the band is "Queensryche's signature sound." It's far from it. Wilton's guitar tone and style of lead playing is honestly the only thing that brings echoes of what the band used to be.


bosk1

@Samsara:  For the second 3-paragraph point, I would say: yes and no. 

First off, I think the band has always, since day 1, considered a certain type of metal to be what they wanted to have be a big part of the "signature Queensryche sound."  It is a thread that has existed through every album, with possibly the exception of Q2K and D2C, which are probably regarded as their most experimental albums.  I think if you asked any of the original members, they would likely agree, even if they might have slightly different perspectives about what that meant (which is understandable and isn't exclusive to QR).  Yes, experimentation and change ("evolution," if you want to call it that) are also important facets.  But those aren't mutually exclusive.  I just think that, with Mike and Ed being the only original members left, we are getting primarily Mike's version of that.  And Todd I think feeds and amplifies that.  I guess one thing I am trying to say here is that I don't feel that the band's constant change, at least in those early years, at all takes away from them having a core metal sound that, in essence, is "the signature Queensryche sound."  And I think that sound was always there, even if it sounded different and was expressed differently on the EP and The Warning than on Rage, which was different than Mindcrime, which was different than Empire, which was different than Promised Land, etc.

Second, I think Tate did the same thing during his time in Queensryche when he took over.  To me, the two biggest curve balls in Queensryche's sound were Q2K and D2C.  By the time D2C rolled around, I think Tate was just going to do whatever Tate wanted to do, come what may, and that manifested in an album that sounded nothing like the Queensryche we all knew and loved, as well as lots of other things, like the Cabaret tour, for example.  Whether or not it was consistent with what Queensryche had done in the past, he felt like he was the only one in charge and was going to steer the ship where he wanted.  So let's take that album out of the equation for a second and just chalk it up to being a complete "wildcard."  Now let's go back and look at the period after DeGarmo exited.  I don't think Tate or anyone else necessarily intended Q2K to be such a departure.  There are a number of factors contributing to that album sounding the way it did, not least among them the fact that they were writing with a different person for the first time ever and they were feeling lost without DeGarmo in a lot of ways.  But I think what is more important and more telling as far as this discussion is concerned is what happened next.  The pendulum swung back.  First time that ever happened.  And it's understandable, for a lot of reasons.  For one thing, DeGarmo was back.  But even the songs where he didn't have writing credit sound a whole lot more like "classic Queensryche" than Q2K did.  Yes, Tribe had an early 2000s vibe and sound, just as a lot of their earlier albums incorporated sounds that were contemporary to their development and releases.  But it had a LOT more in common with pre-Q2K albums than it did with Q2K.  It wasn't a continuation of the Q2K sound.  It was a "return to form."  Mindcrime II and American Soldier, despite also containing some unique elements, also sounded like an intentional return to an older Queensryche sound.  And I think Tate's chief writing partner, Slater, would have agreed.  To paraphrase what I believe he said the mindset was during that period, it was along the lines of his job being to take Tate's ideas, as well as anything Slater could bring to the table on his own, and make them sound like Queensryche.  So I think even Tate had a vision of what the "classic Queensryche sound" is, and it isn't drastically different from what the interviewer above and Wilton are suggesting.

In that regard, taking D2C out of the equation as the obvious wildcard aberration that it was, I don't think that the Todd era of the band is really doing anything different than what the post-DeGarmo Tate era was doing after Q2K.  It's just that the influences are different, with Tate being the primary expression of that influence during his reign of terror, and Michael and Todd being the primary expression of that influence now.  Although change and experimentation were a hallmark of the classic lineup years, I think that ship sailed long before the Todd era.

Lethean

I understand what you're saying Samsara, but I wonder if Queensryche isn't just doing the best that they can do.  Maybe DeGarmo (at his songwriting peak) and Tate and Wilton were needed to make back to back to back albums that all sounded different but were all excellent.  Then one or more of them lost something in the writing department with HITNF (imo) and the downward spiral began.  So maybe the only choice now with the members who are left are: a.) good songs that try (and generally succeed I think) in capturing a Queensryche vibe but the albums aren't very different or b.) Really different sounding albums but with less than good songs.

And if that's the case I don't blame them for choosing a.

Deathless

It's nice to see that they are on (somewhat) good terms. I recall 3-4 years ago Tate was performing with Avantasia at a festival and was on the side stage while Queensryche performed. Todd even posted a picture with him and was very appreciate of being able to meet him.

Tate also mentioned "good offers" to reunite the original lineup, though I wonder what they would even draw (unless it was overseas). Currently QR and Tate play the same clubs and small theaters. Maybe they could get a bump into larger theaters/venues? I don't know. I do think a one-off in a few years would be neat, especially if they can get Chris to perform.

Samsara

#5930
Quote from: bosk1 on November 16, 2022, 02:13:30 PM
@Samsara:  For the second 3-paragraph point, I would say: yes and no. 

First off, I think the band has always, since day 1, considered a certain type of metal to be what they wanted to have be a big part of the "signature Queensryche sound."  It is a thread that has existed through every album, with possibly the exception of Q2K and D2C, which are probably regarded as their most experimental albums.  I think if you asked any of the original members, they would likely agree, even if they might have slightly different perspectives about what that meant (which is understandable and isn't exclusive to QR).  Yes, experimentation and change ("evolution," if you want to call it that) are also important facets.  But those aren't mutually exclusive. 

Nothing I said can be construed as those facets being mutually exclusive. I agree with you.

EDIT - BUT, in re-reading what you wrote, I don't think the band "considered a certain type of metal to be what they wanted" as their sound. I think they just write and played and were influenced, early on, by Priest, Maiden, etc. It just so happened that way. I think their core was something we mocked Tate for a lot during the split: "No Limits." That phrase came up a lot during the research for the book. That indeed was something that they discussed. They WEREN'T just a metal band. And as the band evolved, they got away from that early  metal style into something more melodic. So no, I wouldn't say since "Day 1" that they knew what kind of metal to be in their sound would be. I think that evolved over time.

QuoteI just think that, with Mike and Ed being the only original members left, we are getting primarily Mike's version of that.  And Todd I think feeds and amplifies that.

Exactly. That's exactly what I am saying, bosk. But I'm also saying that particular...not sure of the right word..."brand" of metal is definitive of what the QR sound is. It is PART of it.

QuoteI guess one thing I am trying to say here is that I don't feel that the band's constant change, at least in those early years, at all takes away from them having a core metal sound that, in essence, is "the signature Queensryche sound."  And I think that sound was always there, even if it sounded different and was expressed differently on the EP and The Warning than on Rage, which was different than Mindcrime, which was different than Empire, which was different than Promised Land, etc.

We aren't disagreeing. But that metal "sound" WAS always there. The way Wilton makes it sound, it sounds like it wasn't present, even on American Soldier, MC II, Tribe, etc. It certainly WAS. But my...point, is that having a metal sound isn't distinctive of what comprised the entirety of what Queensryche sounded like.

QuoteSecond, I think Tate did the same thing during his time in Queensryche when he took over.  To me, the two biggest curve balls in Queensryche's sound were Q2K and D2C.  By the time D2C rolled around, I think Tate was just going to do whatever Tate wanted to do, come what may, and that manifested in an album that sounded nothing like the Queensryche we all knew and loved, as well as lots of other things, like the Cabaret tour, for example.  Whether or not it was consistent with what Queensryche had done in the past, he felt like he was the only one in charge and was going to steer the ship where he wanted.  So let's take that album out of the equation for a second and just chalk it up to being a complete "wildcard."  Now let's go back and look at the period after DeGarmo exited.  I don't think Tate or anyone else necessarily intended Q2K to be such a departure. There are a number of factors contributing to that album sounding the way it did, not least among them the fact that they were writing with a different person for the first time ever and they were feeling lost without DeGarmo in a lot of ways.

Well, around that time, they were just all in a room and letting Kelly Gray sort of flesh out ideas and contribute. It was a departure in so much that they let someone other than Chris DeGarmo have a large hand in arrangements. And with a new member, it was naturally a departure. Again, not disagreeing that "intent to depart" was a conscious thing. It just was, sure.

QuoteBut I think what is more important and more telling as far as this discussion is concerned is what happened next.  The pendulum swung back.  First time that ever happened.  And it's understandable, for a lot of reasons.  For one thing, DeGarmo was back.  But even the songs where he didn't have writing credit sound a whole lot more like "classic Queensryche" than Q2K did.  Yes, Tribe had an early 2000s vibe and sound, just as a lot of their earlier albums incorporated sounds that were contemporary to their development and releases.  But it had a LOT more in common with pre-Q2K albums than it did with Q2K.  It wasn't a continuation of the Q2K sound.  It was a "return to form."

I wouldn't at all say the pendulum swung back. I think the style of Tribe was a continued evolution from where Hear in the Now Frontier left off. The mix and production is larger and more reminiscent of older QR records. But the songs take what they learned from HITNF and they went another direction. I see both HITNF and Tribe being very distinct, song-wise. "Sound a whole lot more like 'classic Queensryche'" is not really an objective statement. To me, the stuff with DeGarmo followed a very natural evolution. I see your point, but I think the whole "return to form" thing is something fueled by the fact DeGarmo was there. Of course it's going to sound more familiar. But you could be right, too. I just don't see it as black and white as you painted it.

QuoteMindcrime II and American Soldier, despite also containing some unique elements, also sounded like an intentional return to an older Queensryche sound.  And I think Tate's chief writing partner, Slater, would have agreed.  To paraphrase what I believe he said the mindset was during that period, it was along the lines of his job being to take Tate's ideas, as well as anything Slater could bring to the table on his own, and make them sound like Queensryche.  So I think even Tate had a vision of what the "classic Queensryche sound" is, and it isn't drastically different from what the interviewer above and Wilton are suggesting.

Well, Slater isn't here to speak for himself. But I was one of the man's best friends and I can definitively say that your memory is CORRECT, but it wasn't as cut and dry as that. Slater wrote all of Mindcrime II's MUSIC (other than Hostage, which was a leftover from Tribe), giving Stone co-credit since Stone was with him (Stone brought in one song, One Foot in Hell, which Slater re-wrote, as it was a blues thing initially). Slater tried to write things that a Queensryche audience would like, and he did say that. He listened to what folks on The Breakdown Room were saying, and tried to write songs that would 1) connect with Tate, 2) serve the story, and 3) bring back ELEMENTS of older Queensryche. But once it was done, at the end of the day, it sounded very little like the band, since Wilton and Rockenfield weren't on it (much). American Soldier SOUNDED more like the band, because the band actually PLAYED.

QuoteIn that regard, taking D2C out of the equation as the obvious wildcard aberration that it was, I don't think that the Todd era of the band is really doing anything different than what the post-DeGarmo Tate era was doing after Q2K.  It's just that the influences are different, with Tate being the primary expression of that influence during his reign of terror, and Michael and Todd being the primary expression of that influence now.  Although change and experimentation were a hallmark of the classic lineup years, I think that ship sailed long before the Todd era.

i don't disagree with any of that. I'll grant you that the post-DeGarmo years (MC II-D2C) were more contrived (perhaps "contrived change?"). But you summed up my point: change and experimentation were a hallmark of the classic lineup years. What the current version of Queensryche is doing is not that, nor is the sound "classic Queensryche" because the lack of evolution and the difference in players/writers.

It's not bad at all, and I like current Queensryche. I just don't think it sounds like the "classic Queensryche sound" because Wilton, from a writing and playing perspective, is the only remaining main songwriter from those classic years. And while Rockenfield wasn't a big writer, his drumming style and nuance was way more influential on that whole sound as well. (Again, apologies to Ed, his bass playing is always killer, but not sure I'd call it a distinctive part of their overall signature sound.)

And I'll also point out that their producer, Zeuss, made it a point to show how they were using all of Wilton's old gear (with the settings marked so they knew how to get the right tones) to make things "sound like" what QR did in the years of the original band. But is a "signature sound" the equipment or the players? It's an age-old argument for sure.

Quote from: Lethean on November 16, 2022, 02:13:39 PM
I understand what you're saying Samsara, but I wonder if Queensryche isn't just doing the best that they can do.  Maybe DeGarmo (at his songwriting peak) and Tate and Wilton were needed to make back to back to back albums that all sounded different but were all excellent.  Then one or more of them lost something in the writing department with HITNF (imo) and the downward spiral began.  So maybe the only choice now with the members who are left are: a.) good songs that try (and generally succeed I think) in capturing a Queensryche vibe but the albums aren't very different or b.) Really different sounding albums but with less than good songs.

And if that's the case I don't blame them for choosing a.

Absolutely. And I direct you to what I said in my initial post - I'M NOT BEING NEGATIVE. I think they are doing what they do, and are having a good time doing it, and it sounds good. I guess my question is - is Wilton's style of writing and playing the epitome of "Queensryche's classic sound?" I don't think it is. I think it is one part of it. And the only remaining distinctive part of what that sound truly was.

The four albums with TLT singing, and the last two with different drummers are really good records. But they don't SOUND like the classic Queensryche years to me, except for Wilton. Nor should they. They are all different people. That's why I always shake my head a bit when statements from the band like "classic Queensryche sound" come up. They can't produce that. That sound was very much a product of the writers and players in that original band. I think it's silly to keep saying it, unless they are saying it for marketing purposes. Which, is probably why they are saying that.

Trust me, I'm all for this version of Queensryche. I'd rather them go out and play an hour of the TLT-era material and then a 20-minute encore of classic QR. They are their own unique and distinct era of the band. And I want them to celebrate what they are NOW. Because to me, they are very unlike what the first version of the band was.


bosk1

Ultimately, I don't think we're that far apart.  We basically agree on the facts.  We just have somewhat different perspectives on what those facts mean.

Lethean

Quote from: Samsara on November 16, 2022, 03:13:28 PM
Quote from: Lethean on November 16, 2022, 02:13:39 PM
I understand what you're saying Samsara, but I wonder if Queensryche isn't just doing the best that they can do.  Maybe DeGarmo (at his songwriting peak) and Tate and Wilton were needed to make back to back to back albums that all sounded different but were all excellent.  Then one or more of them lost something in the writing department with HITNF (imo) and the downward spiral began.  So maybe the only choice now with the members who are left are: a.) good songs that try (and generally succeed I think) in capturing a Queensryche vibe but the albums aren't very different or b.) Really different sounding albums but with less than good songs.

And if that's the case I don't blame them for choosing a.

Absolutely. And I direct you to what I said in my initial post - I'M NOT BEING NEGATIVE. I think they are doing what they do, and are having a good time doing it, and it sounds good. I guess my question is - is Wilton's style of writing and playing the epitome of "Queensryche's classic sound?" I don't think it is. I think it is one part of it. And the only remaining distinctive part of what that sound truly was.

The four albums with TLT singing, and the last two with different drummers are really good records. But they don't SOUND like the classic Queensryche years to me, except for Wilton. Nor should they. They are all different people. That's why I always shake my head a bit when statements from the band like "classic Queensryche sound" come up. They can't produce that. That sound was very much a product of the writers and players in that original band. I think it's silly to keep saying it, unless they are saying it for marketing purposes. Which, is probably why they are saying that.

Trust me, I'm all for this version of Queensryche. I'd rather them go out and play an hour of the TLT-era material and then a 20-minute encore of classic QR. They are their own unique and distinct era of the band. And I want them to celebrate what they are NOW. Because to me, they are very unlike what the first version of the band was.

I don't think you're being negative.  But I do think they're trying, and sometimes manage to capture, a sound that feels like "classic" Queensryche. Maybe they don't meet all of the criteria for that, but at the same time I don't think it's wholly inaccurate for them to reference "classic" Queensryche because they're working towards it.

Grappler

I don't know if I need a Queensryche reunion.  I have come around to the Verdict and I really like the new album.  I'd love to see them go into an even heavier direction, almost like Todd's solo album.

What I do think would be cool is if the band could do something like Fates Warning did.  Celebrate albums (or their anniversaries) with one-off or certain festival performances with Geoff.  Play the album in full or do a special set and release it as a live record.  Stress that it's not a reunion, but a celebration and that albums and tours with Todd are still the band's focus. 

Deathless

Quote from: Grappler on November 17, 2022, 08:40:25 AM
I don't know if I need a Queensryche reunion.  I have come around to the Verdict and I really like the new album.  I'd love to see them go into an even heavier direction, almost like Todd's solo album.

What I do think would be cool is if the band could do something like Fates Warning did.  Celebrate albums (or their anniversaries) with one-off or certain festival performances with Geoff.  Play the album in full or do a special set and release it as a live record.  Stress that it's not a reunion, but a celebration and that albums and tours with Todd are still the band's focus.

I'm with you on this, but I don't see it happening for two reasons:
1. I don't think the band will ever have a relationship with Scott again. He's definitely a different dude, but I feel like whatever transpired ($$) and the subsequent lawsuit will probably rule that out.
2. They won't do it because of their relationship with Todd (which is totally fair and respectable). Especially with his position in the band now.

It's a bummer because a one-off or celebration with the original 5 would be really neat. Even though many of them are into their 60's they could probably perform at a really high level based on everything we've seen. I know Chris is is mostly doing acoustic-driven stuff but I'm sure his old electric guitars still work. :)

Samsara

Death & Grapp,

Yeah, I don't see it happening either, because of all the reasons Death stated, plus...I just think Chris has moved on. He's not at Vito Bratta level of moving on, I don't think, but the situation would, in my opinion, have to be one where "Queensryche" needs to be the original five, and done for the right reasons - new music. And I just don't think the other four remaining members of the original band want that. I think they're financially driven. I don't think Chris is.

But that's why I suggested it'd be cool if QR and Tate are on at least decent terms, to partner and do some of those projects. Even though they are on the outs now, a number of years back Steve Perry ended up spearheading a lot of legacy material projects for Journey, while not in the band. He produced the Escape: Live in Houston release and a couple of other things on behalf of the band. It'd be nice if the same could happen with QR's legacy material. Not the retread album re-releases in new packaging, but things fans have been asking for, for a long time - compiling all that Promised Land tour footage and doing something with it, remixing and resequencing The Warning, perhaps doing something like taking Rage for Order and giving it the high fidelity treatment with Neil Kernon, etc.

Those things take someone in the band to champion them, and I just don't think Eddie and Michael really will. They never really have.

As this band nears its exit in the next decade, I'd just like to see the legacy stuff that is still outstanding be done right. Hell, me and a couple of friends may even look into licensing Hear in the Now Frontier and putting it on vinyl through their label. Stuff like that. Now's the time.

TAC

Brian, are Tate and QR on "good terms" because I didn't necessarily get that from Wilton's comments.
And Wilton's "the time isn't right" comment or whatever he said simply said to me that the offer wasn't good enough.

Samsara

Quote from: TAC on November 17, 2022, 04:05:48 PM
Brian, are Tate and QR on "good terms" because I didn't necessarily get that from Wilton's comments.
And Wilton's "the time isn't right" comment or whatever he said simply said to me that the offer wasn't good enough.

Tim,

I thought I said "decent" terms. Quotes like this:

QuoteMW: That's respectable and the feeling is mutual, but we're on a roll with this version of Queensrÿche. It would be silly to stop our momentum. I wish the best for him, and that's all I can really say.

Have been more forthcoming the last few years. They've obviously been in contact. From multiple comments over the years, that's what it seems like - they are all on speaking terms. And obviously, the offers have been presented, and knowing how they communicate, I'm sure they've exchanged emails. You gotta remember, these guys have known one another and worked hand-in-hand since they were late-teens, early-twenties. Yeah, what happened was terrible and there was fault on both sides. But after so many years, and it seems a bit of healing on both sides, compliments for each other have happened over the years, as comments such as Wilton's illustrate.

TAC

Ok. My memory...  :lol
I meant to respond the other day when you first mentioned it.

Ben_Jamin

I think the band has finally found a sound I like by them again. And this for me, is due to Casey finally being on a recording. His drums add a lot to their sound and I have come to realize that is what was missing from their previous reunion albums.

The trio of Realms, Hold On, and Tormentum remind me of the classic Queensryche a lot and this is what I was hoping to hear from them again.

TAC


emtee

Agree with the drumming but for me, SO much more. Rhythm guitar is excellent throughout. And for the first time in a very, very long time, I wanted to learn the lyrics so I could sing along. Every song begs me to sing along. Really, truly loving this album. Every song is fantastic.

bosk1

Enjoying this one.  Got to listen to it at decent volume in the earbuds on a 20-mile bike ride Thanksgiving morning, and was really digging it.  It's a great workout album.  Probably not my favorite Todd-era album, but it's better than anything in the Tate era that came after HITNF, so I'm VERY satisfied.

WardySI

Meanwhile I was doing a little EOY writeup last night and I felt Ed's bass was the consistent factor carrying the songs throughout DNA LOL...

Anyway sidenote I do still find Hold On terribly disjointed and by far the weakest track on offer but aside from that agree the highlights here are some of the best nods to classic Ryche from this lineup yet. 

My trio would still be Lost In Sorrow, Chapters and Tormentum, yet Realms would be close \m/

ZirconBlue

Quote from: Ben_Jamin on November 27, 2022, 02:27:22 PM
I think the band has finally found a sound I like by them again. And this for me, is due to Casey finally being on a recording. His drums add a lot to their sound and I have come to realize that is what was missing from their previous reunion albums.

The trio of Realms, Hold On, and Tormentum remind me of the classic Queensryche a lot and this is what I was hoping to hear from them again.


I didn't really expect to notice the difference in drumming, but it's pretty pronounced.  I immediately noticed his prominent use of cymbals on first listen.  I'm not sure if that's in the composition or the recording/mixing, but it really jumps out at me.

NunoTenniscourt



As someone who had nothing but the utmost admiration and respect for Tate during prime Queensryche era, I am completely over him not being in the band anymore. I have no desire to see him return either. I'd be more excited about DeGarmo returning, actually.

They've got a good thing going now, and Todd is singing at a level Tate is just not capable of anymore, and he's doing it enthusiastically.

Animal

Quote from: NunoTenniscourt on December 05, 2022, 04:54:47 PM


As someone who had nothing but the utmost admiration and respect for Tate during prime Queensryche era, I am completely over him not being in the band anymore. I have no desire to see him return either. I'd be more excited about DeGarmo returning, actually.

They've got a good thing going now, and Todd is singing at a level Tate is just not capable of anymore, and he's doing it enthusiastically.

I guess almost anyone would  take DeGarmo's returning over Tate's in a second. While Tate in his prime was one of the best rock/metal singers ever, he didn't seem to bring much to the table in terms of creativity and songwriting (yeah, he wrote most of the lyrics, but the lyrics were never a reason why Quennsryche were successful). And since he can't sing at that level anymore, he would really have nothing to contribute to make the band any better. The opposite - making the band worse -  would be much more likely as his "problematic personality" would emerge to sour the atmosphere sooner or later.

WilliamMunny

Quote from: Animal on December 06, 2022, 05:53:42 AM
Quote from: NunoTenniscourt on December 05, 2022, 04:54:47 PM


As someone who had nothing but the utmost admiration and respect for Tate during prime Queensryche era, I am completely over him not being in the band anymore. I have no desire to see him return either. I'd be more excited about DeGarmo returning, actually.

They've got a good thing going now, and Todd is singing at a level Tate is just not capable of anymore, and he's doing it enthusiastically.

I guess almost anyone would  take DeGarmo's returning over Tate's in a second. While Tate in his prime was one of the best rock/metal singers ever, he didn't seem to bring much to the table in terms of creativity and songwriting (yeah, he wrote most of the lyrics, but the lyrics were never a reason why Quennsryche were successful). And since he can't sing at that level anymore, he would really have nothing to contribute to make the band any better. The opposite - making the band worse -  would be much more likely as his "problematic personality" would emerge to sour the atmosphere sooner or later.

Respectfully, I think you are massively downplaying Tate's impact on the writing dynamic—lyrics aside (and I'd argue they play heavily into the band's success), Operation Mindcrime simply doesn't exist without Tate. He may not have 'written' the riffs, but he certainly shaped the entire record, from arranging to the story to the, well, everything. A similar argument can be made for any of those classic albums.

QR was a 'sum of its parts' sort of deal, and the magic existed in the combination between DeGarmo, Tate, and Wilton.

Adding DeGarmo back does not automatically guarantee anything of interest as far as I'm concerned.

jammindude

I've said it before, but it bears repeating here.

Original QR was about the three M's working in unison.

Wilton was the Metal
DeGarmo was the Melody
Tate was the Madness

I'm one of the biggest "hate for Tate" guys here, but even I recognize that he brought QRs signature "off-kilter...creepy...I think I'm going mad in a Pink Floyd kinda way" quality to the table that has never quite been recaptured.

TAC

I don't know why DeGarmo coming back would add anything. He left how long ago, and hasn't done jack shit since. The last album he made with them was 25 years ago, and it sucked.

Time to move on, people.