Official Queensryche thread: Kickstart the next album

[Stadler]

I'm going to see Geoff tomorrow night, if the fates agree (I'm traveling in the morning).  It's a small place, and I'm going in full skeptical mode, as I did when I saw Last In Line in a bar with 100 other people. 

[ShadowWalker]

John 5 brings a different crowd and has an energetic performance.  It's no doubt that the crowd is a bit more into it for him than an older mid paced prog metal band.  Having said that, Todd sounded just fine at my show last weekend.  Can't really say anything bad about his performance other than he's no comedian (He said so himself when there was a technical difficulty)  I do think the crowd was less into the Verdict songs than the others, but that's a given for almost any band performing new material. 

I don't know. I have been seeing Queensryche regularly since 1988. The one thing I always appreciated about the band was how much new material they always had in their set. 5-7 songs at least from whatever new album they were promoting (twice full albums got aired - Promised Land and O:MII). I think the only tour this didn't happen for was Dedicated to Chaos, and given the turmoil in the band and how poorly received that album truly was, that made sense. But all the TLT albums have been given their props, yet it feels like the band has completely lost confidence in its newer material. The 2013 S/T was short enough that on that tour the whole album could have, and in all reality should have, been played to make a real statement that the band is all about who they are now and not some nostalgia act. The shows should have a lot more emphasis on TLT-era material and much of it is quality enough and the history the band has I think gives them the room to play 5-7 new songs in addition to a set of classics. I do appreciate that the first leg of the Verdict tour had a good selection of newer material and am disappointed that this leg has reduced that number. If you extend the show, you can easily make a third to a half of it consisting of newer material and the rest some standards and then a few deep cuts to keep the show fresh. They have a great catalog and the new material stands up well. It is a shame they don't have the kind of confidence in their new material the way the band consistently had in the past.

Or maybe Queensryche should start doing something like what Iron Maiden or Coheed and Cambria have been doing:  Album > tour for that album with an emphasis on new and recent material > throwback tour > rinse and repeat. I would be a lot more interested in a Queensryche show dominated by TLT-era material than another set of retreads (though I do give them some props for dusting off No Sanctuary and Resistance this time around as well, the former being the only reason I bought at ticket to Thursday's show to check it off the list, especially since it could be left out when they play M3 later this year).

They could cure that by announcing that they"will be playing their Latorre releases in full, the last 2 albums, with an encore of the old hits".  I think many go to the Latorre QR not even knowing there has been such change in direction, Id even say 20% still think Tates in the band when they go to the show.  its not like this band is "known" anymore or any of their new material is played on the radio,  etc.  that way one can find out who really is supporting this latorre band. Tate is touring under the Geoff Tate so the crowds he gets are his , he doesnt even get the pull of the QR name.
John 5's music I dont think many knew but his music just transcends and is so good you embrace it like many bands live  .Ive seen so many bands and didnt know their new stuff or new from old songs but they still got me going, Im NOT seeing that all with the Latorre QR, plus IMO QR with Latorre is a not a very entertaining show, no matter how many screens they have,  Tate knows how to entertain and the band has lost that element, and now with no SRock its mighty thin of stellar talent IMO

What TLT-era shows have you actually been to?

None ,..  I see zero reason to go  , I did see QR in 1982 and many many many many times... the last QR show I saw was AS tour

So how can you comment on how well the new material is being received live if you haven't been to a show where new material has been played to gauge the audience reaction to it? That is something being in the moment at the show gives you knowledge that a YouTube video cannot really capture. Just curious what exactly you are basing your opinion on.

[ShadowWalker]

I'm going to see Geoff tomorrow night, if the fates agree (I'm traveling in the morning).  It's a small place, and I'm going in full skeptical mode, as I did when I saw Last In Line in a bar with 100 other people.

I'll be seeing Geoff next Friday...

[cramx3]

what I saw recently of Latorre QR was IMO  NOT GOOD. and it appears that John 5 wiped them out as far as the crowds enjoyment .

What TLT-era shows have you actually been to?

None ,..  I see zero reason to go  , I did see QR in 1982 and many many many many times... the last QR show I saw was AS tour

 

Not going to lie Epic, you come off as a hater.  Go to a show and see for yourself if you are going to act like you have any idea what they are like live or to read the room.

[EPICVIEW]

what I saw recently of Latorre QR was IMO  NOT GOOD. and it appears that John 5 wiped them out as far as the crowds enjoyment .

What TLT-era shows have you actually been to?

None ,..  I see zero reason to go  , I did see QR in 1982 and many many many many times... the last QR show I saw was AS tour

 

Not going to lie Epic, you come off as a hater.  Go to a show and see for yourself if you are going to act like you have any idea what they are like live or to read the room.

again   the show is so bland IMO and there is NO STAR i want to see in the QR of today.  No Tate, No Chris, No SRock, Not even Mike Stone who was kind unique, even Kelly had more QR pedigree ( Myth etc)current Latorre QR (who was no star)  their music does not move me or give the emotional chill of classic QR and the shows are not the rock operas that Tate gave , Tate is and was a performer with one the greatest voices in Rock,  whats left today ( Jackson and Wilton) are of no interest to see to me. I go to shows today to see Stars period, if not Ill just listen to the music.  Thats MY OPINION AND VIEW ONLY.  Im glad you enjoyed it !!! different strokes for different folks,  Id always rather see the original singer or band even if they cant do it like they used to, then to see "replacements do it note for note"   again just my opinion. I enjoyed the elegance of Tate and the softer songs even live , Latorre singing Tate leaves me flat, IMO the whole band is dull watch, The John 5 pairing really illustrated that IMO, I apologize if you perceive that as "hate" to me its just a fun discussion and this band tends to have a lot of "discussion and opinions" LOL

[cramx3]

You can have your reasons to not want to go, that's fine.  But just don't act like you've been there and experienced it yourself. 

[EPICVIEW]

You can have your reasons to not want to go, that's fine.  But just don't act like you've been there and experienced it yourself.

 
again I see no "experience" other than blaring multi media screens, I dont find any of them that good actually if were are being honest, John 5 Id see as he is crazy talented , a true star who has worked with so many great rockers and his show is loose and great.  I was blessed enough to have seen the real QR on many epic tours .

[bosk1]

What TLT-era shows have you actually been to?

None ,..  I see zero reason to go  , I did see QR in 1982 and many many many many times... the last QR show I saw was AS tour

In other words, you have no idea what you are even talking about when you say things like:

what I saw recently of Latorre QR was IMO  NOT GOOD. and it appears that John 5 wiped them out as far as the crowds enjoyment .  The new songs are not crowd pleasers and the crowd seemed to not be into their set at all compared to the fun and enjoyment they had during the joy filled John 5 set of crowd pleasing riffs and visuals.

[EPICVIEW]

John 5 brings a different crowd and has an energetic performance.  It's no doubt that the crowd is a bit more into it for him than an older mid paced prog metal band.  Having said that, Todd sounded just fine at my show last weekend.  Can't really say anything bad about his performance other than he's no comedian (He said so himself when there was a technical difficulty)  I do think the crowd was less into the Verdict songs than the others, but that's a given for almost any band performing new material. 

I don't know. I have been seeing Queensryche regularly since 1988. The one thing I always appreciated about the band was how much new material they always had in their set. 5-7 songs at least from whatever new album they were promoting (twice full albums got aired - Promised Land and O:MII). I think the only tour this didn't happen for was Dedicated to Chaos, and given the turmoil in the band and how poorly received that album truly was, that made sense. But all the TLT albums have been given their props, yet it feels like the band has completely lost confidence in its newer material. The 2013 S/T was short enough that on that tour the whole album could have, and in all reality should have, been played to make a real statement that the band is all about who they are now and not some nostalgia act. The shows should have a lot more emphasis on TLT-era material and much of it is quality enough and the history the band has I think gives them the room to play 5-7 new songs in addition to a set of classics. I do appreciate that the first leg of the Verdict tour had a good selection of newer material and am disappointed that this leg has reduced that number. If you extend the show, you can easily make a third to a half of it consisting of newer material and the rest some standards and then a few deep cuts to keep the show fresh. They have a great catalog and the new material stands up well. It is a shame they don't have the kind of confidence in their new material the way the band consistently had in the past.

Or maybe Queensryche should start doing something like what Iron Maiden or Coheed and Cambria have been doing:  Album > tour for that album with an emphasis on new and recent material > throwback tour > rinse and repeat. I would be a lot more interested in a Queensryche show dominated by TLT-era material than another set of retreads (though I do give them some props for dusting off No Sanctuary and Resistance this time around as well, the former being the only reason I bought at ticket to Thursday's show to check it off the list, especially since it could be left out when they play M3 later this year).

They could cure that by announcing that they"will be playing their Latorre releases in full, the last 2 albums, with an encore of the old hits".  I think many go to the Latorre QR not even knowing there has been such change in direction, Id even say 20% still think Tates in the band when they go to the show.  its not like this band is "known" anymore or any of their new material is played on the radio,  etc.  that way one can find out who really is supporting this latorre band. Tate is touring under the Geoff Tate so the crowds he gets are his , he doesnt even get the pull of the QR name.
John 5's music I dont think many knew but his music just transcends and is so good you embrace it like many bands live  .Ive seen so many bands and didnt know their new stuff or new from old songs but they still got me going, Im NOT seeing that all with the Latorre QR, plus IMO QR with Latorre is a not a very entertaining show, no matter how many screens they have,  Tate knows how to entertain and the band has lost that element, and now with no SRock its mighty thin of stellar talent IMO

What TLT-era shows have you actually been to?

None ,..  I see zero reason to go  , I did see QR in 1982 and many many many many times... the last QR show I saw was AS tour

So how can you comment on how well the new material is being received live if you haven't been to a show where new material has been played to gauge the audience reaction to it? That is something being in the moment at the show gives you knowledge that a YouTube video cannot really capture. Just curious what exactly you are basing your opinion on.

You want me to really tell you? because they are not very good, and a horrible live show IMO,  LOL, their new songs are meaningless to me, and they ere a "cover band" to some extent. again MY OPINION, but you asked LOL, I care less if Latorre hits some "note"  and thats what so many seem to be stuck on,  Im older now and it takes a lot to get me to go to a show and like I said QR has no star power, without the QR name I dont think they could draw what Tate draws period, but again MY OPINION and I love the debate and discussion

[EPICVIEW]

What TLT-era shows have you actually been to?

None ,..  I see zero reason to go  , I did see QR in 1982 and many many many many times... the last QR show I saw was AS tour

In other words, you have no idea what you are even talking about when you say things like:

what I saw recently of Latorre QR was IMO  NOT GOOD. and it appears that John 5 wiped them out as far as the crowds enjoyment .  The new songs are not crowd pleasers and the crowd seemed to not be into their set at all compared to the fun and enjoyment they had during the joy filled John 5 set of crowd pleasing riffs and visuals.

I have to go to the show to form an opinion? I can see the show is quite dull, I see the fans not really caring , I also saw the John 5 show was not dull and he sounded amazing.  again long time fan since 1982.  Ive watched many TLT QR shows and to me they are getting worse IMO, the original excitement has long faded it appears and the new songs are not embraced it appears

[TAC]

@EPICVIEW....Tate's band is more of a cover band, don't you think? What new material is he playing?

Obviously current QR isn't really QR at all, but brother....let it go, man. Let the people who are enjoying them..enjoy them. Nobody is being fooled here. It is what it is.

[ShadowWalker]

You can have your reasons to not want to go, that's fine.  But just don't act like you've been there and experienced it yourself.

 
again I see no "experience" other than blaring multi media screens, I dont find any of them that good actually if were are being honest, John 5 Id see as he is crazy talented , a true star who has worked with so many great rockers and his show is loose and great.  I was blessed enough to have seen the real QR on many epic tours .

Sometimes the music IS the experience. I recall the Return To Forever IV concert I went to. Four (sometimes five, depending on the song) guys on stage, no one really moving from their spots, all instrumental, nothing special in terms of the overall production of the concert, and it is hands down one of the best shows I have seen because the music is the experience. I fully appreciate you not wanting to go because the TLT-era of the band does not connect with you and for other reasons you state, but when you make statements like "the show is so bland" without actually having seen it, even once, your opinion really carries no weight in a conversation about how good or bad the show is on its own merits or in comparison to other Ryche performances. You really can't make a comparison from watching a YouTube (YouTube) video. That is not an experience. I can watch Queen at Live Aid and see a crowd hanging on Freddie's every movement and every note, captivated like no other has ever held an audience in the palm of their hand, but I really can't speak authoritatively about the "experience" because I was not in Wembley that day. Watching it on TV or DVD doesn't give me any basis of comparison because it is a completely different experience watching a video versus being there in the moment. TV has captured it and there is a lot to be said for that, but can I really speak about the experience by not being there? Not really.

Why you don't want to go, I get. You criticizing something you have never experienced for yourself, therefor having zero context for an opinion you are trying to express about the experience is pure conjecture on your part. You think the show will be bland, so you argue that it is, even though for many, the show is far from that because they are actually there to judge it for themselves, not simply project an extension of why they don't like the current state of the band and simply assume for themselves the show is bland.

[EPICVIEW]

@EPICVIEW....Tate's band is more of a cover band, don't you think? What new material is he playing?

Obviously current QR isn't really QR at all, but brother....let it go, man. Let the people who are enjoying them..enjoy them. Nobody is being fooled here. It is what it is.

I hear you bro , You can make that argument but Tates like Coverdale he is QR like Coverdale is WS,
I like the discussion actually as its fun subject and everyone can have an opinion.  to be honest I dont even want the to reunite anymore.  TBH this band should have retired 15 year ago IMO as they are ruining the legacy

[bosk1]

I can see the show is quite dull, I see the fans not really caring

Yeah, you're right--we shouldn't let ourselves be fooled by all that cheering, headbanging, and the positive reviews from fans who were actually there.    The guy who has never seen a show clearly knows better.

[EPICVIEW]

You can have your reasons to not want to go, that's fine.  But just don't act like you've been there and experienced it yourself.

 
again I see no "experience" other than blaring multi media screens, I dont find any of them that good actually if were are being honest, John 5 Id see as he is crazy talented , a true star who has worked with so many great rockers and his show is loose and great.  I was blessed enough to have seen the real QR on many epic tours .

Sometimes the music IS the experience. I recall the Return To Forever IV concert I went to. Four (sometimes five, depending on the song) guys on stage, no one really moving from their spots, all instrumental, nothing special in terms of the overall production of the concert, and it is hands down one of the best shows I have seen because the music is the experience. I fully appreciate you not wanting to go because the TLT-era of the band does not connect with you and for other reasons you state, but when you make statements like "the show is so bland" without actually having seen it, even once, your opinion really carries no weight in a conversation about how good or bad the show is on its own merits or in comparison to other Ryche performances. You really can't make a comparison from watching a YouTube (YouTube) video. That is not an experience. I can watch Queen at Live Aid and see a crowd hanging on Freddie's every movement and every note, captivated like no other has ever held an audience in the palm of their hand, but I really can't speak authoritatively about the "experience" because I was not in Wembley that day. Watching it on TV or DVD doesn't give me any basis of comparison because it is a completely different experience watching a video versus being there in the moment. TV has captured it and there is a lot to be said for that, but can I really speak about the experience by not being there? Not really.

Why you don't want to go, I get. You criticizing something you have never experienced for yourself, therefor having zero context for an opinion you are trying to express about the experience is pure conjecture on your part. You think the show will be bland, so you argue that it is, even though for many, the show is far from that because they are actually there to judge it for themselves, not simply project an extension of why they don't like the current state of the band and simply assume for themselves the show is bland.

Thats cool bro and I get your point, ive seen so many bands your right many just stand there and do their thing. I get it I do and you are as correct as I am.  Im older and dont have the time and again Id go see Ozzy try to sing and Im wanting to see Judas again as they are ICONS and Rob is the metal God and I pray for Glenn  but QR just has no draw at all to me, its a shame I really have tried but but the Verdict ( I own it) is meh  and the show is not for me. 
Thank you for the fun talk and Im glad you enjoy it

[EPICVIEW]

I can see the show is quite dull, I see the fans not really caring

Yeah, you're right--we shouldn't let ourselves be fooled by all that cheering, headbanging, and the positive reviews from fans who were actually there.    The guy who has never seen a show clearly knows better.

again just my opinion Boss.  reviews of shows I dont even read TBH.  ive probably been to 80 - 100 metal shows , who knows actually. 

[cramx3]

I saw Geoff Tate's Operation Mindcrime last June at the same venue I just saw QR.  I'm actually watching my video of it to refresh my memory.

The entire side curatin was down for GT's show, only partially down to block one of the two side bars for QR.  I definitely think this was helped by having a support act like John 5 to bring in more people.  So not totally fair to compare QR to GT but at the same time, QR was pretty packed and was noted a couple times by Todd. 

Geoff is a better entertainer than Todd.  Geoff is much more animated and active in his performance.  I think Todd however sounds better, not by enough to say I'd rather him in the band over the original singer though.  But Todd sounds good and the music they are making with him is solid.  It's not a cover band if they are writing and performing original music.  It's also not the original QR.  However, if Geoff and QR are not able to make it work together, having them both do their own thing is probably the best of both worlds.  The QR band sounded much better than GT's band as a whole as well.

Also the comparison of John 5 to QR is a bit unfair.  Not really similar music.  QR is not bringing an active crowd.  The GT show wasn't anymore active.  The John 5 crowd wasn't terribly active either until he did the cover medley which brought out familiar riffs (and John 5 himself was animated, calling everyone MoFos  ).   There was a not a lot of overlap between fan bases either.  If people aren't really engaging during the QR set, it's probably because they don't know the songs.  I honestly was in this catagory for all of John 5 and about 5 or so QR songs. 

Also, you can't see it... but GT did walk by and give me a fist bump coming off stage https://youtu.be/uSUuazGpcWg?t=1920 other than Casey, none of the QR guys interacted with people after the show that I saw (I could have missed it).  Defintiely adds to my opinion that GT is a better entertainer, his shows much more emotion.

[EPICVIEW]

I saw Geoff Tate's Operation Mindcrime last June at the same venue I just saw QR.  I'm actually watching my video of it to refresh my memory.

The entire side curatin was down for GT's show, only partially down to block one of the two side bars for QR.  I definitely think this was helped by having a support act like John 5 to bring in more people.  So not totally fair to compare QR to GT but at the same time, QR was pretty packed and was noted a couple times by Todd. 

Geoff is a better entertainer than Todd.  Geoff is much more animated and active in his performance.  I think Todd however sounds better, not by enough to say I'd rather him in the band over the original singer though.  But Todd sounds good and the music they are making with him is solid.  It's not a cover band if they are writing and performing original music.  It's also not the original QR.  However, if Geoff and QR are not able to make it work together, having them both do their own thing is probably the best of both worlds.  The QR band sounded much better than GT's band as a whole as well.

Also the comparison of John 5 to QR is a bit unfair.  Not really similar music.  QR is not bringing an active crowd.  The GT show wasn't anymore active.  The John 5 crowd wasn't terribly active either until he did the cover medley which brought out familiar riffs (and John 5 himself was animated, calling everyone MoFos  ).   There was a not a lot of overlap between fan bases either.  If people aren't really engaging during the QR set, it's probably because they don't know the songs.  I honestly was in this catagory for all of John 5 and about 5 or so QR songs. 

Also, you can't see it... but GT did walk by and give me a fist bump coming off stage https://youtu.be/uSUuazGpcWg?t=1920 other than Casey, none of the QR guys interacted with people after the show that I saw (I could have missed it).  Defintiely adds to my opinion that GT is a better entertainer, his shows much more emotion.

Thats cool bro , Im glad you enjoyed all of them!!!  thats nice GT gave ya a fist bump!!!

[cramx3]

I also thought Geoff was pretty good with Avantasia.  I definitely enjoyed the QR show overall more (but I think John 5 was the difference, if you put him before GT, I'd probably follow because a good opener adds a lot to a show), but they both offer something and you don't need to like both or either.

[Samsara]

This both/either/neither thing brings to mind a blog I recently wrote on that very topic:

Bring Up the Lights: The Need for Unity and a Queensryche Fan's Confession - http://anybodylistening.net/bringupthelights.html

It's a little personal, but I think given some of the back and forth here, folks might get something out of it.

B

[bosk1]

That kind of approach is a breath of fresh air, and I wish there was more of it

[cramx3]

praise on that last paragraph

and it's not limited to QR.  The whole metal community is like this for way too many bands and it definitely hurts the genre as a whole.  QR is one of many examples.

[jjrock88]

This both/either/neither thing brings to mind a blog I recently wrote on that very topic:

Bring Up the Lights: The Need for Unity and a Queensryche Fan's Confession - http://anybodylistening.net/bringupthelights.html

It's a little personal, but I think given some of the back and forth here, folks might get something out of it.

B

 

[EPICVIEW]

I also thought Geoff was pretty good with Avantasia.  I definitely enjoyed the QR show overall more (but I think John 5 was the difference, if you put him before GT, I'd probably follow because a good opener adds a lot to a show), but they both offer something and you don't need to like both or either.

I agree.  Its great that you saw and enjoyed them all. ... you rock!

[EPICVIEW]

I'm going to see Geoff tomorrow night, if the fates agree (I'm traveling in the morning).  It's a small place, and I'm going in full skeptical mode, as I did when I saw Last In Line in a bar with 100 other people.

Very interested in your thoughts, review.
enjoy!

[Stadler]

Unfortunately bailed at the last minute; I was flying in from Atlanta, and my friend had a client dinner that he had to attend.  We were going to meet up after and go to the show.  Alas, schedules and fate were not in our favor.  The flight was late, the dinner was late, and at about 9:00 or so we pulled the plug.  I'm bummed, but I'm not.   I was looking forward to it, though if I'm being honest, I was looking forward to it in a skeptical way.  That's probably not a good way to go into a show. 

Anyway, I have front row to Squeeze tomorrow night, so there's that to look forward to.

[TAC]

You have to squeeze into the front row??

[Stadler]

You have to squeeze into the front row??

You know it; I never did lose that holiday weight. 

[Samsara]

You have to squeeze into the front row??

You know it; I never did lose that holiday weight. 

Looking back from pictures when I first saw Queensryche to now, I'd say each year, we never lose that holiday weight my friend. 

Bummer you didn't get to see the show. But they tour so much, if you ever feel like going, it probably won't be a big deal to get a ticket to something eventually.

[KevShmev]

 

Anyway, I have front row to Squeeze tomorrow night, so there's that to look forward to.

My older brother would be very envious right now; he is a big Squeeze fan (I am a lukewarm fan).

[sfam2112]

Good show last night. Had a great time. Enjoyed Eve To Adam. John 5 wasn't really my thing, but for what he does, it was alright. Loved Queensryche. First time getting to see them with Todd (as well as Parker and, of course Casey). Being a musician and a lifelong Queensryche fan, I was definitely paying attention. Not that I was expecting note-for-note. Just hoping for something close/as good. I wasn't disappointed. Parker nailed one of my favorite DeGarmo solos (second solo in "Mindcrime"). Todd did really well. He did struggle a little bit but, overall, really good performance.
Took a few not so great pics and some sorta decent video. Mostly solo sections (being a guitar player) and "Light Years", my favorite from the new record. 

[Cruithne]

but QR just has no draw at all to me

We know. You don't have to keep sharing your opinion every time there's a bit of activity on this thread to get that point across 

[EPICVIEW]

but QR just has no draw at all to me

We know. You don't have to keep sharing your opinion every time there's a bit of activity on this thread to get that point across 

Its what we do   we share our opinions..  The Philly show looked like a complete disaster,
 what is your opinion?  I was fan of this band since 1982 when I saw them for the first time

[Samsara]

Good show last night. Had a great time. Enjoyed Eve To Adam. John 5 wasn't really my thing, but for what he does, it was alright. Loved Queensryche. First time getting to see them with Todd (as well as Parker and, of course Casey). Being a musician and a lifelong Queensryche fan, I was definitely paying attention. Not that I was expecting note-for-note. Just hoping for something close/as good. I wasn't disappointed. Parker nailed one of my favorite DeGarmo solos (second solo in "Mindcrime"). Todd did really well. He did struggle a little bit but, overall, really good performance.
Took a few not so great pics and some sorta decent video. Mostly solo sections (being a guitar player) and "Light Years", my favorite from the new record. 

To Parker's credit, out of the three people who have taken on DeGarmo's position in the band, he's the one that I feel has most respected it. I mean, Kelly Gray and Mike Stone may have been told to make it their own, and they did that. But Parker went out of his way to really learn all of Chris' stuff, and do it all justice, with a bit of his own personality and style injected into it. I noticed that back in 2009 on the American Soldier tour. Wilton did most of Chris's single solos (and still does), but when they did a trade off one, you could tell that Parker did his homework and tried to be as faithful as he could without seeming like a clone. And I've always really respected that.

Glad you had a good time at the gig. Light Years is a great tune. The whole Verdict record is a solid slab of proggy metal.

[cramx3]

The Philly show looked like a complete disaster

And judging by last week's discussion, you likely weren't there and are basing this on your own preconceived notions that these shows aren't going over well.  Can you expand on why last week's Philly show was a complete disaster?