Official Queensryche thread: Kickstart the next album

[Samsara]

Wow.  This long a wait.  For 10 songs.

To be fair, the album still could be 50+ minutes, which is usually what they do. My guess is they have a couple of longer tracks on there. (Long for them.)

[bosk1]

Yeah, that's too short.  This isn't 1980.

[jammindude]

Seems to me like the more common trend these days is one hour or less. DT is a bit of an exception to the rule these days.

[NoseofNicko]

What is wrong with the album having 10 songs? Most metal albums with more than 10 songs usually have a couple fillers. 10 songs is pretty much the standard for metal albums.

[IDontNotDoThings]

I don't think albums over an hour have ever been the "trend" in music. Prog is one of the few genres that do.

& I really don't understand the disappointment over 10 songs. All things considered, that's pretty average. QR only have 4 albums with 12+ songs (not counting interludes), 3 of which are considered the dark age of their discography & other one is HITNF.

I mean, if it's as short as QR12 or Tribe I'd be disappointed, but I don't a reason to assume it will be (at least not yet).

[IDontNotDoThings]

Yeah, that's too short.  This isn't 1980.

Also, what? Since when is 50+ minutes too short?


Another statistic: the only QR albums over an hour are Empire and American Soldier.

[jammindude]

I don't think albums over an hour have ever been the "trend" in music. Prog is one of the few genres that do.

& I really don't understand the disappointment over 10 songs. All things considered, that's pretty average. QR only have 4 albums with 12+ songs (not counting interludes), 3 of which are considered the dark age of their discography & other one is HITNF.

I mean, if it's as short as QR12 or Tribe I'd be disappointed, but I don't a reason to assume it will be (at least not yet).

When CD's first got to be the #1 way music was listened to, there were A LOT of 70 min albums.  A lot of bands felt the need to fill the space that a CD allowed.   But it soon became evident that if you were a blues based hair metal band, your sound became "fatigued" after a certain point.   Then bands started backing off to the 50-60 minute mark.    That seemed to be the happy medium. 

But more recently, albums have gotten even shorter.   I remember when Riverside first released ADHD, they said there was an intentional thought of keeping it to the length of a classic album that might fit on a record (40-50 min) and I've seen many bands follow suit.

[gzarruk]

I think it's always better to have quality over quantity on an album, but a 40 min "full lenght album" just feels lazy.

[pfillion]

Btw the new single is on Spotify

https://open.spotify.com/album/52395IUFQXHluX4mvqg7Yb?si=P7ielGgVTBiq1GQ-zsgTrg

[bl5150]

Btw the new single is on Spotify

https://open.spotify.com/album/52395IUFQXHluX4mvqg7Yb?si=P7ielGgVTBiq1GQ-zsgTrg

Nice - that's about the closest they've got to classic QR with TLT in the band I reckon.   Like many post DeGarmo era songs I seem to have a moment here and there where I think Whip has not quite got it right with how certain notes/rhythms resolve (hard to explain but it's just something NQR for me in a number of Wilton's songs - just a few seconds here and there).

The drums do sound a bit vanilla for Queensryche which is no surprise but overall I like what that song might say about the direction they've taken.

[IDontNotDoThings]

Yeah, I'm not really feeling this one 

[Grappler]

Here it is:

Man the Machine:  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9ky7t8DV1xI

[bosk1]

What is wrong with the album having 10 songs?

If the band fills the space with longer songs, that's fine.  I'm good with DT12 only having 9 songs because they give you so much music that it is worthwhile.  For a band that can't figure out how to write a song past 4 minutes, a 10-song album isn't worth the money.  As it stands now, if I don't hear something that really impresses me, I'm done with this band's underachieving.  They can keep putting out 40 minute albums and touring with Poison, or whatever they want.  But I'm not paying them for it.

[Samsara]

Impressions after first listen:

The guitars sound like Queensryche. Specifically, they sound like Michael. The third rhythm part (the clean strum) underneath the beginning harkens back to the Mindcrime album. And the guitars sound good. But that's the only thing that makes the song remotely sound like Queensryche.

That's OK though, because to be honest, three albums in, this IS a different band. They are Queensryche in name, and for some people, that's all that matters. I think the song is decent, and I am sure people will love it. But that thread tying it back to classic original lineup Queensryche is getting thinner and thinner these days. If Wilton's distinct guitar wasn't there, it would sound like any other generic metal band. That's not a shot at them, just an observation that they've just created their own vibe.

Fans of this era of Queensryche should be ecstatic.

One question though, that "Broken, Broken" part is the chorus, right? Do they even say the song title anywhere in the song?

[Samsara]

A buddy of mine said that QR also just announced no Scott Rockenfield on the first leg of the tour. I haven't bothered to verify, but I am assuming it was posted on social media or something.

They keep putting it off, and putting it off, and putting it off.

The drums sound nothing like how Scott would play. It's obvious its not him. They are just concerned if they actually tell fans the truth, it'll impact the album's chart debut and initial sales. 

[devieira73]

2cd edition, tracklist and song lenghts:
https://www.emp.de/p/the-verdict/392723.html#q=Queensryche&srule=release-date&sz=60&start=1

Blood of the Levant (3:27)
Man The Machine (3:50)
Light-years (4:09)
Inside Out (4:31)
Propaganda Fashion (3:36)
Dark Reverie (4:23)
Bent (5:59)
Inner Unrest (3:50)
Launder the Conscience (5:15)
Portrait (5:16)

Tracklist der Bonus-CD:
I Dream in Infrared (Acoustic) (3:59) - exclusive studio track recorded in 2018
Open Road (Acoustic) (3:39) - exclusive studio track recorded in 2018
46° North (3:33) - never released on CD, studio track recorded during "Condition Hüman" sessions
Mercury Rising (3:55) - never released on CD, studio track recorded during "Condition Hüman" sessions
Espiritu Muerto (3:40) - studio track recorded during "Condition Hüman" sessions
Queen of the Reich (Live 2012) (4:34)
En Force (Live 2012) (4:21)
Prophecy (Live 2012) (4:09)
Eyes Of A Stranger (Live 2012) (6:55) - previously only released in Japan

[devieira73]

In case you're wondering, 44 minutes of new music. Yes, I would like more music from them, but it is what it is. The bonus CD is cool

[bosk1]

Hmm. Depends on how much it will cost.  If it is not much more than a regular CD, the additional tracks are a nice addition that partly makes up for the short running time.  But three of them were released on the s/t (the 2012 live tracks), to it is really only 3 new tracks, 2 acoustic, and 1 live.  Most, if not all of that, could have been put on a single disc and released as a standard edition for the same cost.  I'll pay 15 or 16 bucks, but any more than that, and as I said above, I'll feel like the band is ripping off the fans.  Full price for 45 minutes of new music on the standard edition is unacceptable for a band 3 albums into this lineup.  If they can't come up with more than that, they don't deserve my money.

[Mladen]

That's still better than 35 minutes of the self titled album.

[bosk1]

Yeah, but that shouldn't be the standard.  It was a b.s. move then, but a lot of people (myself included) gave them a pass on such a short album because over everything that was going on, and this being their first without Geoff (or writers hired by him) doing the lion's share of the writing.  Condition Human wasn't really all that long either, but I'm not going to complain about 12 songs (or 11 with an interlude, if you want to count it that way), especially when the writing quality was there.  I'm just running out of patience with them.  It's one bit of laziness and shortsightedness after the other.  It has become par for the course.

[Nick]

I have no problem with a short album as long as it's pretty spectacular. I'd rather have a rock solid short album than a so-so longer album.

What bothered me specifically with the Queensryche self-titled (2nd time, I will die on my hill of how stupid this was), was that they came away from the legal issues talking about how they had been ignored, how they were brimming with ideas, and yet the triumphant return after all that talk was... 35 minutes? Like... the fuck?

[Grappler]

They were racing to put a product out to compete with Geoff's QR's Frequency Unknown album.  It was dumb, but from a consumer's viewpoint, they needed something out for sale since Geoff had his own version of a QR album out.  It was all about posturing from both bands, who were each trying to represent themselves as Queensryche to the fans and to the industry. 

The best thing they could have done then is let Geoff's disc fall flat (as it did) and take their time to come out with all guns blazing and a ripping metal album, rather than rushing something out.  Typical short-sightedness of the band.

As for the new song, had this come out in 2012, I would have loved it.  But now, with all of the competition from so many great bands releasing albums, it just seems very pedestrian and "traditional metal-by-the-numbers".  It's like their nostalgia driven focus of the last 6 years is starting to dry up, so now they're finally going to try some full-on metal and a big headline tour. It could also be indicative of Scott not being around, which gives Todd more creative input and allowing him to push his style of music into the band, rather than something more classic QR sounding.  Too little, to late for me though. 

[bosk1]

I have no problem with a short album as long as it's pretty spectacular. I'd rather have a rock solid short album than a so-so longer album.

And I'm sorry to call you out, Nick.  But I'll say what I say every time this argument comes up:  It is just a stupid, stupid argument.  Long and good are not mutually exclusive.  You don't have to get "so-so" at the expense of length.  Give us 3-4 more songs to make the purchase worthwhile, even if those songs are B songs rather than A+ songs.  Or take the time to add a bit of dimension to the songs to stretch them out and make them more interesting than verse/chorus/verse/chorus/solo/chorus.  Sure the "godfathers of prog metal" (who are honestly no more prog than Warrant) could do that.  But, no, 35 or 45 minutes of music, even if most of it is pretty good, just doesn't cut it unless you are selling the album as an EP and it is priced as such.

Anyway, that's enough from me on that.  As for the new song, after one listen, I can say that I like it.  It doesn't wow me.  But then again, neither did Redemption or Arrow of Time at first.  And Arrow of Time ended up being part of one of the band's strongest 4-song run in their discography.  So my verdict thus far is:  undecided, and fine with that.

[As I Am]

The new single "Man The Machine" is 

https://bravewords.com/news/queensryche-premiers-lyric-video-for-new-song-man-the-machine

[Grappler]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lcDYVKfjg7Q

Official Lyric Video.  All I have to say is "hail to deathmocracy?"   

[Nick]

I have no problem with a short album as long as it's pretty spectacular. I'd rather have a rock solid short album than a so-so longer album.

And I'm sorry to call you out, Nick.  But I'll say what I say every time this argument comes up:  It is just a stupid, stupid argument.  Long and good are not mutually exclusive.  You don't have to get "so-so" at the expense of length.  Give us 3-4 more songs to make the purchase worthwhile, even if those songs are B songs rather than A+ songs.  Or take the time to add a bit of dimension to the songs to stretch them out and make them more interesting than verse/chorus/verse/chorus/solo/chorus.  Sure the "godfathers of prog metal" (who are honestly no more prog than Warrant) could do that.  But, no, 35 or 45 minutes of music, even if most of it is pretty good, just doesn't cut it unless you are selling the album as an EP and it is priced as such.

I mean, obviously I'd prefer 70 minutes of amazing music to 35 minutes of amazing music, but that's not always the choice. If a band only puts out a 35 minute album then I'd like to believe it's because they fully developed all the ideas they've had in a satisfying manner and don't feel they have anything strong to push beyond that. If that's the case then I'd rather they stop there than develop or add material that they knowingly don't think is as good as what they already have.

If your preference is to knowingly have B material (which itself may be generous on many longer albums) as well as A+ material to get an album longer that's fine, but it's not mine. I'd rather have something shorter where the overall album is stellar. Again, if you can do a fuller album or double album and still be stellar, fantastic, but not every person or band has that in them.

[KevShmev]

Well said, Nick.

[Peter Mc]

It’s only YouTube so will wait but sounds very muddy to me. Sounds like an unused demo outtake from Operation Mindcrime. Fairly uninspired and one of Todd’s weakest vocals in my opinion. Don’t usually say this about drummers either but Rockenfield’s drumming style is sadly missed here, sounds like zero thought went into the drum parts.

Will need to hear more than this before shelling out for the album and I’m someone who likes the first two Toddryche albums quite a bit.

[bosk1]

If a band only puts out a 35 minute album then I'd like to believe it's because they fully developed all the ideas they've had in a satisfying manner and don't feel they have anything strong to push beyond that.

...or it means the band was lazy and didn't put in the effort.  Or that they "don't feel they have anything strong to push beyond that" because they didn't put in the effort to do more.  Given the track record from these guys, I'm not giving them a pass.  They don't get the benefit of the doubt that they worked as hard as they could, and that the 45 minutes they came up with was fully satisfying and complete, and felt like the only material that was good enough for release.  If 45 minutes worth is all they could come up with, they just aren't trying hard enough.

[TAC]

In theory, I don't have a problem with a band making a 45 min CD.

BUT, this band is clearly doing the minimum.

[bosk1]

In theory, I don't have a problem with a band making a 45 min CD.

BUT, this band is clearly doing the minimum.

Same, in SOME circumstances.  As I said, I gave them a pass for an even shorter album on the first one.  The circumstances made it understandable.  And they made an effort to include some bonus live tracks to make it more palatable.  This time?  My patience has run out.

[TAC]

My patience ran out in 1997.

[FreezingPoint]

Is there anyone else who isn't a big fan of Todd's voice? I tried listening to Condition Human the other day and I just couldn't make it through the entire record. I'm not sure whether it is the delivery or what, but there is just something about it that I don't like. An example would be the word "crucified" at 0:43 of the new song. It's not crisp and clear, and just sounds overdone.

I also notice that when I am in the mood for some QR, I never even consider the new releases. The material just doesn't grab me and stick with me. I think a part of it is the generic nature of the material, as others have commented on. I don't find the songs as dynamic or as intriguing, and that's what separated early QR from the rest in my opinion. If you're writing an album filled with mostly ~4:00 metal songs these days, there has to be something there that makes those songs stand out, whether it be crafting the instruments into a melodic shape that supports the vocal melody, a chorus that grabs the listener, or a song structure that takes you on a different path. I guess the issue is that early QR set the bar so darn high in my eyes. How can they live up to that now? They found themselves in a position after the Geoff debacle of having to "go back to the roots" to reassure the fanbase that the wuss-rock was out and there was an edge to their sound again, but also modernize their sound, and in my opinion, in trying to do both they didn't do either one completely well. And then they go out and tour so very little of the new material - so why even bother trying to be more modern?

What summarizes modern QR for me? Confusion and lack of direction. They could prove me totally wrong with this next album. In fact, I hope they do because it means we would be listening to a stellar album. I'll give it a listen, but my expectations are low.

[T-ski]

um, ya....

just change the name already.  there is nothing Queensryche about this.

[Peter Mc]

To me it is unmistakably Queensrÿche, it’s just not very good. Sounds like a band trying to recapture old glories but not quite having the inspiration to reach those heights. Hopefully there is better material to come.