Will KevMo make an appearance with DT now that MP is gone?

[Edan the Man]

So he seems open

That's not what I heard.

[Lowdz]

I can understand how he didn't want to be in  DT anymore, that he didn't feel the music. Maybe there is friction with others in the band, who knows?

But as a musician trying to make a living, why one Earth would you want to alienate a potential fanbase and earning-stream in the way he has? Surely his agent should have been telling him to use his relationship with DT, to take some of these offers that were put to him. Maybe then he wouldn't have to resort to getting fans to pay for his albums to be made.

[rumborak]

I can't say he's done badly in terms of publicity. Among DT fans he's a legend, and he successfully separated himself from his former musical past and completely reinvented himself.

rumborak

[Mebert78]

I can understand how he didn't want to be in  DT anymore, that he didn't feel the music. Maybe there is friction with others in the band, who knows?

I just reread the press release from when Kevin left the band.  In it, he wrote about creative differences causing a rift: "Musically, I think my approach to writing has changed a lot in the past several years.  It came to a point where my views were so different from the rest of the band that we were having trouble relating to each other's ideas.  At the same time, I was finding a great deal of fulfillment writing and recording my own material.  Eventually, this became more important to me than anything else.  I came to the decision that I needed to concentrate on my own creative identity and that a split with the band would be the best thing for both the band and myself.  I truly believe that Dream Theater have a lot more to offer the music world and I have a deep respect for them as people and musicians.  I wish them all the best."

[Global Laziness]

I have only heard a few post DT KM material and I thought it was shit; the SDV sequel was just wrong. Given the type of music he plays now, he may not have the chops anymore. I could be wrong though.

I just listened to it and really enjoyed it. But what exactly makes it a Space-Dye Vest sequel?

[El JoNNo]

I have only heard a few post DT KM material and I thought it was shit; the SDV sequel was just wrong. Given the type of music he plays now, he may not have the chops anymore. I could be wrong though.

I just listened to it and really enjoyed it. But what exactly makes it a Space-Dye Vest sequel?

It's the lyrics; "On the page" is a throw back to SDV. KM wrote SDV  after a  bad break up. He was reading through a magazine (feeling down) and saw a model in which he became infatuated for a moment. Have a read you can see it. I wish I could post a source for my claims but we discussed it many years ago on the MP forums.


Falling through pages of Martens on angels
Feeling my heart pull west
I saw the future dressed as a stranger
love in a space-dye vest

Love is an act of blood and I'm bleeding
a pool in the shape of a heart
Beauty projection in the reflection
Always the worst way to start

"But he's the sort who can't know
anyone intimately, least of all a
woman. He doesn't know what a woman
is. He wants you for a possession,
something to look at like a painting or an ivory box.
Something to own and to display. He doesn't want you to be real,
or to think or to live. He doesn't love you, but I love you.
I want you to have your own thoughts and ideas and feelings, even when
I hold you in my arms. It's our last chance... It's our last chance..."

Now that you're gone I'm trying to take it
Learning to swallow the rage
Found a new girl I think we can make it
as long as she stays on the page

This is not how I want it to end
And I'll never be open again

"...I was gonna move out...ummm...get,
get a job, get my own place, ummm,
but... I go into the mall where I
want to work and they tell me, I'm,
I was too young..."

"Some people, gave advice before,
about facing the facts, about
facing reality. And this is, this
without a doubt, is his biggest
challenge ever. He's going to have to face it.
You're gonna have to try, he's gonna to have to try and,
uh, and, and, and get some help here. I mean no one can
say they know how he feels."

"That, so they say that, in ya know
like, Houston or something, you'd
say it's a hundred and eighty degrees,
but it's a dry heat
. In Houston they say that?
Oh, maybe not. I'm all mixed up.
Dry until they hit the swimming pool."

"...I get up with the sun... Listen.
You have your own room to sleep in,
I don't care what you do. I don't
care when. That door gets locked,
that door gets locked at night by nine o'clock.
If you're not in this house by nine o'clock, then you'd better find some
place to sleep. Because you're not going to be a bum in this house.
Supper is ready..."

There's no one to take my blame
if they wanted to
There's nothing to keep me sane
and it's all the same to you
There's nowhere to set my aim
so I'm everywhere
Never come near me again
do you really think I need you

I'll never be open again, I could never be open again.
I'll never be open again, I could never be open again.

And I'll smile and I'll learn to pretend
And I'll never be open again
And I'll have no more dreams to defend
And I'll never be open again

[Global Laziness]

Yeah, I know what Space-Dye Vest is about, it's the other one that I was wondering about. I didn't pay the closest attention to the lyrics of On the Page and just a title similarity doesn't necessarily mean much.

[El JoNNo]

Like I said I have no evidence just what i remember from conversations at MP forums years ago. I believe KM talked about it in an interview or something.

[ZirconBlue]

I looked at Kevin's song listing for his first Chroma Key album. I think the song is "On the Page".

Just listened to it. Not bad actually, not as beautiful or anything as SDV, but not bad minus so terrible lyrics.

Really?  I love the song, and love the lyrics. 

I don't see what it has to do with SDV, though.

[robwebster]

I can't say he's done badly in terms of publicity. Among DT fans he's a legend, and he successfully separated himself from his former musical past and completely reinvented himself.

rumborak

DT fans and... who else?

[bosk1]

Two things:

1.  As far as whether or not he will make an appearance with DT in the future, it wouldn't surprise me.  Yes, he has avoided anything having to do with the DT name.  But he has also demonstrated that he has a very mercurial personality, and I could see him suddenly changing his mind at some point in the future.  Much as I pointed out when the hypothetical was raised a year and a half ago about whether Mike Portnoy could ever leave DT, despite what people have said and done in the past, it is entirely possible and shouldn't really come as a shock to anyone if and when it happens.

2.  I don't think Mike Portnoy being gone will have much to do with the decision one way or the other--at least not directly.  As pointed out above by Mebert and others, both Mike and JP worked with Kevin after he left DT.  He didn't leave because of Mike, or at least if he has, NOBODY has suggested that that was the reason.  And JP has had some tough things to say about Kevin since he left as well, so Mike is definitely not the only one.  Now indirectly, if Mike being the most vocal in the band about dictating the musical direction of the band had something to do with it, that's entirely possible.  But still, the musical direction of the band isn't really likely to change, so again, I don't think Mike being gone will be much of a factor at all.

[Global Laziness]

As pointed out above by Mebert and others, both Mike and JP worked with Kevin after he left DT.

What did he do with JP? Why haven't I heard of this?

[bosk1]

Didn't JP guest on one of the OSI albums?  (I'm going off memory, which may be faulty--I don't have either album)

[hefdaddy42]

Didn't JP guest on one of the OSI albums?  (I'm going off memory, which may be faulty--I don't have either album)

No.

[bosk1]

Oh, okay then.  My mistake on that part of the post.

[TL]

I've always gotten the impression that his refusal to play with DT or get involved in anything DT related is simply because he doesn't want to just be "ex-Dream Theater member Kevin Moore". That if he kept taking part in DT related things, it would steal some thunder from anything else he tried to do. When he appears on stage with another band, like Fates Warning, there isn't that obstacle because he was never a member of FW.

I don't think it was ever because of any animosity between himself and the guys.

Never say never and all that, but I doubt we'll see it happen.

[dbrooks22]

Not sure if it means anything, but i just noticed that MP follows KM on twitter.

[ACID_FOX]

On The Page...

ON THE PAGE

Fuck, I never noticed that...

[ReaPsTA]

Good question.  I was actually thinking about this today.  I think it's safe to assume that Kevin and Portnoy were the ones that had friction as opposed to Kevin and the other guys in DT.  The OSI chapter of the "Lifting Shadows" book says it all on that topic regarding their time in the studio making OSI1 in 2002.  Meanwhile, JLB heaped praise on Kevin at Jordan's Tarrytown show in January and called him "extremely talented."  So with MP's negativity toward Kevin now gone from DT, we're left with the kind words of JLB and the others.  So Kevin might be inclined to warm up to DT again.  Plus, Kevin has done one-off guest appearance for Fates Warning (see the 2004 Live in Athens DVD).  So he seems open to doing one-off guest spots if a good opportunity arises.

Without stepping on the book too much, what specifically happened beyond creative differences and intense personal clashing?

[lordxizor]

Sometimes I think if KM came to DTF and saw the amount of time spent here discussing him, he'd say "damn guys... it's been like 17 years since I left the band. Get over it."

[ACID_FOX]

Sometimes I think if KM came to DTF and saw the amount of time spent here discussing him, he'd say "damn guys... it's been like 17 years since I left the band. Get over it."

No you.

[lordxizor]

Sometimes I think if KM came to DTF and saw the amount of time spent here discussing him, he'd say "damn guys... it's been like 17 years since I left the band. Get over it."

No you.

[El JoNNo]

IMO JR > KM and I do not wish for KM to ever come back. Sure the stuff he did write I have enjoyed thoroughly, I just like JR more.

[Global Laziness]

IMO JR > KM and I do not wish for KM to ever come back. Sure the stuff he did write I have enjoyed thoroughly, I just like JR more.

He doesn't mean to replace JR, I think he just means at a reunion show or something.

[hefdaddy42]

Sometimes I think if KM came to DTF and saw the amount of time spent here discussing him, he'd say "damn guys... it's been like 17 years since I left the band. Get over it."

This.

[contest_sanity]

Good question.  I was actually thinking about this today.  I think it's safe to assume that Kevin and Portnoy were the ones that had friction as opposed to Kevin and the other guys in DT.  The OSI chapter of the "Lifting Shadows" book says it all on that topic regarding their time in the studio making OSI1 in 2002.  

Without stepping on the book too much, what specifically happened beyond creative differences and intense personal clashing?

IIRC, OSI 1 was supposed to be more of a straight-up prog-metal affair; they were even going to have Daniel Gildenlöw do some (or perhaps all) of the vocals.  However, once KM came on board, he did some of his own vocals and also added a lot of changes musically to Jim Matheos' original demos, taking them in a new direction.  Turns out, Matheos liked this new direction, as well as KM's vocals, and so the album ended up being something completely different than what was perhaps originally envisioned.  It's possible that Portnoy did not like this turn of events.

For OSI 2, he had to be convinced to come in and add drum parts as essentially just a session guy.  While he stated that he tried to go in with an open mind about KM, things turned out to be the same as they had been previously.  MP described KM as very difficult to work with and also said that he took all the fun out of making music.  And he said that they knew his feelings on the band, so much so that they didn't even attempt to recruit him for OSI 3.

I do wonder why, though, KM has no trouble working with Matheos if he is so "difficult?"  I guess he and MP really just clash.  I don't know...

[reneranucci]

I also remember reading that KM changed many of MP's parts for OSI 2, because he wanted a more simple approach. He replaced the complex parts with loops of the more simple beats MP played in the songs.

[ZirconBlue]

I do wonder why, though, KM has no trouble working with Matheos if he is so "difficult?"  I guess he and MP really just clash.  I don't know...

I think he's only "difficult" in terms of having a very different musical vision from MP's.  And MP doesn't like not being in control.

[Raziel666]

And MP doesn't like not being in control.

True dat. Last time he found himself not being in control, he abandoned his own baby (to use his words).

Gavin Harrison didn't complain for taking part in OSI 3 and he clearly liked it, since he will be playing in OSI 4. So yeah, it comes down to KM + MP not being able to coexist musically.