Osama Bin Laden dead.

[ThroughHerEyesDude6]

I want to believe.

[sneakyblueberry]

Why would you want to believe that?

[jsem]

Nick is correct in this thread.

[tjanuranus]

I want to believe.

[tjanuranus]

As for Islam, there is always fighting over whether it is a religion of peace or a religion of war. Much like everything else the answer is neither that simple or extreme. I've read the Koran and I've read the bible, and both are similar in that you can make you case for peace and war with scriptural support.

True. Christianity is responsible For more deaths throughout history than any other religion. People in this country love to forget about that and act like Islam is the only violent religion.

[ThroughHerEyesDude6]

I want to believe.

...that Osama is dead.

[Riceball]

True. Christianity is responsible For more deaths throughout history than any other religion. People in this country love to forget about that and act like Islam is the only violently-persued religion.

FTFY

In other news, has anyone seen that screen grab from Fox News 40? IDK how to do images on here, but they put up "Obama Bin Laden" is dead...last time I looked B and S aren't that close together; except when it comes to Fox News coverage of partisan politics.

[tjanuranus]

True. Christianity is responsible For more deaths throughout history than any other religion. People in this country love to forget about that and act like Islam is the only violently-persued religion.

FTFY

In other news, has anyone seen that screen grab from Fox News 40? IDK how to do images on here, but they put up "Obama Bin Laden" is dead...last time I looked B and S aren't that close together; except when it comes to Fox News coverage of partisan politics.

yeah Geraldo also said Obama was dead.

[jsem]

lolgeraldorivera

[tjanuranus]

https://www.southparkstudios.com/full-episodes/s05e09-osama-bin-laden-has-farty-pants

[tjanuranus]

i think this song is appropriate for tonight..

https://youtu.be/IhnUgAaea4M

[Riceball]

EDIT: Never mind...I'll leave it for the State-side crowd tomorrow

[Implode]

Not only should his death be celebrated but his corpse should be violated on national tv by people of all religions and races.

Not sure if serious, but this just doesn't sit right with me. Celebrating the victory and situation In the lack of a terrorist leader is fine, but celebrating the physical death along with wishing death, torture, or other horrible things on a person for a cold and vengeful satisfaction makes me worry for the human race.

[Perpetual Change]

Yeah, I agree with Implode. The way some people are reacting to this news is really sad. I suddenly remember why, after 9/11, we were so easily talked-in to doing whatever the Bush administration said was right for us to do.

[tjanuranus]

Not only should his death be celebrated but his corpse should be violated on national tv by people of all religions and races.

Not sure if serious, but this just doesn't sit right with me. Celebrating the victory and situation In the lack of a terrorist leader is fine, but celebrating the physical death along with wishing death, torture, or other horrible things on a person for a cold and vengeful satisfaction makes me worry for the human race.

it's simple really. If you kill hundreds, thousands, or millions of innocent people you are no longer human, you have become a monster and monsters should be killed and celebrated when dead. Not very complicated at all to me.

[tjanuranus]

Yeah, I agree with Implode. The way some people are reacting to this news is really sad. I suddenly remember why, after 9/11, we were so easily talked-in to doing whatever the Bush administration said was right for us to do.

not the same AT ALL. I am Anti war in most cases. But if a mass murderer gets brought to a little bit of justice that's a good thing. My statement about corpse violation was a silly way of saying killing him isn't enough. MORE needs to be done but he's already dead so what can we do? Only logical solution.  

[Perpetual Change]

Not only should his death be celebrated but his corpse should be violated on national tv by people of all religions and races.

Not sure if serious, but this just doesn't sit right with me. Celebrating the victory and situation In the lack of a terrorist leader is fine, but celebrating the physical death along with wishing death, torture, or other horrible things on a person for a cold and vengeful satisfaction makes me worry for the human race.

it's simple really. If you kill hundreds, thousands, or millions of innocent people you are no longer human, you have become a monster and monsters should be killed and celebrated when dead. Not very complicated at all to me.

Anyone "celebrating" now has no idea that this isn't anywhere near over.

[hefdaddy42]

Two: Obama went to huge lengths to claim ownership of the issue, I watched his speech live at work and he was very definitive that he authorised the operation, he gave the go ahead etc.

I noticed this, seemed pretty lame especially because it was so painfully obvious what he was doing.

Just curious, how else could he have described it?  He IS the one that authorized it, mainly because he is the only one who COULD have authorized.

BTW, before 10:30, when no one knew what was going on, before moron congressional staffers started leaking the news - I called it.

[Sigz]

[AcidLameLTE]

 

I heard he got caught because he recently registered on PSN

[MetalMike06]

Jingoism is now running full throttle again.

[eric42434224]

Not only should his death be celebrated but his corpse should be violated on national tv by people of all religions and races.

Not sure if serious, but this just doesn't sit right with me. Celebrating the victory and situation In the lack of a terrorist leader is fine, but celebrating the physical death along with wishing death, torture, or other horrible things on a person for a cold and vengeful satisfaction makes me worry for the human race.

it's simple really. If you kill hundreds, thousands, or millions of innocent people you are no longer human, you have become a monster and monsters should be killed and celebrated when dead. Not very complicated at all to me.

Anyone "celebrating" now has no idea that this isn't anywhere near over.

People arent celebrating anything being over...surely not terrorism....they are just celebrating some well deserved revenge.

[Super Dude]

Not only should his death be celebrated but his corpse should be violated on national tv by people of all religions and races.

Not sure if serious, but this just doesn't sit right with me. Celebrating the victory and situation In the lack of a terrorist leader is fine, but celebrating the physical death along with wishing death, torture, or other horrible things on a person for a cold and vengeful satisfaction makes me worry for the human race.

it's simple really. If you kill hundreds, thousands, or millions of innocent people you are no longer human, you have become a monster and monsters should be killed and celebrated when dead. Not very complicated at all to me.

Anyone "celebrating" now has no idea that this isn't anywhere near over.

People arent celebrating anything being over...surely not terrorism....they are just celebrating some well deserved revenge.

As horrible as 9/11 was, if it's well-deserved revenge then I echo Implode's statement.

[Super Dude]

I thought this article (the first half of it, anyway) was kinda interesting and relevant to discussion.  I think in some sense it explains why to a lot of members apparently this isn't a big deal anymore (with some patriotism sprinkled in, but if you get around that there is a point to be made nevertheless).

https://www.nytimes.com/2011/05/02/opinion/02douthat.html?hp

[millahh]

What Bin Laden's Death Means: Seven Observations
by Jeffrey Goldberg

1) This is a great moment in American history. There is justice in the world. But where is Ayman al-Zawahiri? Capturing the al Qaeda number-two would close this chapter almost entirely.

2) Pakistan has a great deal of explaining to do -- how could Bin Laden have been living near Islamabad, in a city, Abbotttabad, that is in some ways a military cantonment? This operation will only confirm for many people that Pakistan's intelligence service, the ISI, knew more about the al Qaeda presence in its country then it shared with the U.S..

3) President Obama has laid to rest, at least for everyone not named Donald Trump, the notion that he is some sort of soft-on-terror, Manchurian-candidate stealth-Muslim.

4) American deterrent power is partially restored. The lesson for terrorists: If you commit an act of violence against America, this country will hunt you down until you are dead or in chains.

5) Islamist terrorism is not over. Bin Laden was not an operator, nor was he seemingly in control of operators. Cells may be activated in the coming days, individuals with jihadist goals might take action. This is a dangerous moment. An inevitable moment, but a dangerous one.

6) Al Qaeda is a diminished force, as a terrorist entity. But its ideas will remain potent among a small minority of Muslims, disaffected males in European countries among them.

7) If President Obama is seeking a quicker exit strategy from Afghanistan, he now has one. 

[emindead]

Does anyone actually think america is at war with Islam? Wtf

Of course they are not. But... have you been paying attention to the last ten years?

[Super Dude]

Does anyone actually think america is at war with Islam? Wtf

Of course they are not. But... have you been paying attention to the last ten years?

This.  Actions speak louder than words, and Bush's war at least was a war on Islam, no matter what lip service he or Obama paid the 00s administration.

[Sir GuitarCozmo]

Two: Obama went to huge lengths to claim ownership of the issue, I watched his speech live at work and he was very definitive that he authorised the operation, he gave the go ahead etc.

I noticed this, seemed pretty lame especially because it was so painfully obvious what he was doing.

Just curious, how else could he have described it?  He IS the one that authorized it, mainly because he is the only one who COULD have authorized.

BTW, before 10:30, when no one knew what was going on, before moron congressional staffers started leaking the news - I called it.

Aww come on, hef, you know how it goes in P/R.  Obama has been, is, and always will be good for nothing.  Allowing him to take credit for anything (much less outright giving him credit) is completely 100% unacceptable.  Hell, I'm surprised nobody has come in here beating the f*cking birth certificate drum.  The statements in here that he really had nothing to do with it and that he shouldn't take credit for it, when he's the one who gave the orders to act on the intelligence that they received, are completely ridiculous, but nothing that surprises me.  Some people are just always going to refuse to believe that our President is capable of doing anything worthwhile.

[Tick]

Not only should his death be celebrated but his corpse should be violated on national tv by people of all religions and races.

Not sure if serious, but this just doesn't sit right with me. Celebrating the victory and situation In the lack of a terrorist leader is fine, but celebrating the physical death along with wishing death, torture, or other horrible things on a person for a cold and vengeful satisfaction makes me worry for the human race.

it's simple really. If you kill hundreds, thousands, or millions of innocent people you are no longer human, you have become a monster and monsters should be killed and celebrated when dead. Not very complicated at all to me.

Anyone "celebrating" now has no idea that this isn't anywhere near over.

People arent celebrating anything being over...surely not terrorism....they are just celebrating some well deserved revenge.

The reality of the celebration for many is this. Those who lost loved ones and many others were starting to believe Bin Laden would eventually die of his Kidney ailment or whatever, getting the last laugh right down to his last gasp. It is satisfying to many that, that will not be the case and he didn't get that satisfaction. and that makes this as joyous a reason to celebrate as any.

[Sir GuitarCozmo]

Exactly.  Celebrating the capture and execution of one mass murderer is a lot different than celebrating the slaughter of thousands of innocent civilians.  I doubt anybody that's "celebrating" has any sort of mistaken belief that this is all over now.

[Perpetual Change]

Oh, I'm not saying I'm not happy about all of this. I'm happy we finally got him. But is nationally publicized corpse violation going to help anyone get over the loss of loved ones? Personally, I feel like that would be giving Osama the last laugh; it'd be giving him one more chance to rob the humanity from a couple thousand more people.

[King Postwhore]

Oh, I'm not saying I'm not happy about all of this. I'm happy we finally got him. But is nationally publicized corpse violation going to help anyone get over the loss of loved ones?

For the 3000 or so family members who lost loved ones.....yes.

[Perpetual Change]

Oh, I'm not saying I'm not happy about all of this. I'm happy we finally got him. But is nationally publicized corpse violation going to help anyone get over the loss of loved ones?

For the 3000 or so family members who lost loved ones.....yes.

Eh, like I said: I'm glad we got him, but I'm also glad people won't have the chance to take part in that kind of behavior. It's dehumanizing-- not to Osama (he's got no humanity to dehumanize) but everyone else on the other side. That's my opinion, anyway.

[antigoon]

...


Anyway, here's an article that sums up my thoughts pretty well

https://www.salon.com/news/osama_bin_laden/index.html?story=/politics/war_room/2011/05/02/osama_and_chants_of_usa

There is ample reason to feel relief that Osama bin Laden is no longer a threat to the world, and I say that not just because I was among the many congressional staffers told to flee the U.S. Capitol on 9/11. I say that because he was clearly an evil person who celebrated violence against all who he deemed "enemies" -- and the world needs less of such zealotry, not more.

However, somber relief was not the dominant emotion presented to America when bin Laden’s death was announced. Instead, the Washington press corps -- helped by a wild-eyed throng outside the White House -- insisted that unbridled euphoria is the appropriate response. And in this we see bin Laden’s more enduring victory -- a victory that will unfortunately last far beyond his passing.

For decades, we have held in contempt those who actively celebrate death. When we’ve seen video footage of foreigners cheering terrorist attacks against America, we have ignored their insistence that they are celebrating merely because we have occupied their nations and killed their people. Instead, we have been rightly disgusted -- not only because they are lauding the death of our innocents, but because, more fundamentally, they are celebrating death itself. That latter part had been anathema to a nation built on the presumption that life is an "unalienable right."
But in the years since 9/11, we have begun vaguely mimicking those we say we despise, sometimes celebrating bloodshed against those we see as Bad Guys just as vigorously as our enemies celebrate bloodshed against innocent Americans they (wrongly) deem as Bad Guys. Indeed, an America that once carefully refrained from flaunting gruesome pictures of our victims for fear of engaging in ugly death euphoria now ogles pictures of Uday and Qusay’s corpses, rejoices over images of Saddam Hussein’s hanging and throws a party at news that bin Laden was shot in the head.

This is bin Laden’s lamentable victory -- he has changed America’s psyche from one that saw violence as a regrettable-if-sometimes-necessary act into one that finds orgasmic euphoria in news of bloodshed. In other words, he’s helped drag us down into his sick nihilism by making us like too many other bellicose societies in history -- the ones that aggressively cheer on killing, as long as it is the Bad Guy that is being killed.

Again, this isn’t in any way to equate Americans who cheer on bin Laden’s death with, say, those who cheered after 9/11. Bin Laden was a mass murderer who had punishment coming to him, while the 9/11 victims were innocent civilians whose deaths are an unspeakable tragedy. Likewise, this isn’t to say hat we should feel nothing at bin Laden’s neutralization, or that the announcement last night isn't cause for any positive feeling at all -- it most certainly is.

But it is to say that our reaction to the news last night should be the kind often exhibited by victims’ families at a perpetrator’s lethal injection -- a reaction typically marked by both muted relief but also by sadness over the fact that the perpetrators’ innocent victims are gone forever, the fact that the perpetrator's death cannot change the past, and the fact that our world continues to produce such monstrous perpetrators in the first place.

When we lose the sadness part -- when all we do is happily scream "USA! USA! USA!” at news of yet more killing in a now unending back-and-forth war -- it’s a sign we may be inadvertently letting the monsters win.

[Super Dude]

...


Anyway, here's an article that sums up my thoughts pretty well

https://www.salon.com/news/osama_bin_laden/index.html?story=/politics/war_room/2011/05/02/osama_and_chants_of_usa

There is ample reason to feel relief that Osama bin Laden is no longer a threat to the world, and I say that not just because I was among the many congressional staffers told to flee the U.S. Capitol on 9/11. I say that because he was clearly an evil person who celebrated violence against all who he deemed "enemies" -- and the world needs less of such zealotry, not more.

However, somber relief was not the dominant emotion presented to America when bin Laden’s death was announced. Instead, the Washington press corps -- helped by a wild-eyed throng outside the White House -- insisted that unbridled euphoria is the appropriate response. And in this we see bin Laden’s more enduring victory -- a victory that will unfortunately last far beyond his passing.

For decades, we have held in contempt those who actively celebrate death. When we’ve seen video footage of foreigners cheering terrorist attacks against America, we have ignored their insistence that they are celebrating merely because we have occupied their nations and killed their people. Instead, we have been rightly disgusted -- not only because they are lauding the death of our innocents, but because, more fundamentally, they are celebrating death itself. That latter part had been anathema to a nation built on the presumption that life is an "unalienable right."
But in the years since 9/11, we have begun vaguely mimicking those we say we despise, sometimes celebrating bloodshed against those we see as Bad Guys just as vigorously as our enemies celebrate bloodshed against innocent Americans they (wrongly) deem as Bad Guys. Indeed, an America that once carefully refrained from flaunting gruesome pictures of our victims for fear of engaging in ugly death euphoria now ogles pictures of Uday and Qusay’s corpses, rejoices over images of Saddam Hussein’s hanging and throws a party at news that bin Laden was shot in the head.

This is bin Laden’s lamentable victory -- he has changed America’s psyche from one that saw violence as a regrettable-if-sometimes-necessary act into one that finds orgasmic euphoria in news of bloodshed. In other words, he’s helped drag us down into his sick nihilism by making us like too many other bellicose societies in history -- the ones that aggressively cheer on killing, as long as it is the Bad Guy that is being killed.

Again, this isn’t in any way to equate Americans who cheer on bin Laden’s death with, say, those who cheered after 9/11. Bin Laden was a mass murderer who had punishment coming to him, while the 9/11 victims were innocent civilians whose deaths are an unspeakable tragedy. Likewise, this isn’t to say hat we should feel nothing at bin Laden’s neutralization, or that the announcement last night isn't cause for any positive feeling at all -- it most certainly is.

But it is to say that our reaction to the news last night should be the kind often exhibited by victims’ families at a perpetrator’s lethal injection -- a reaction typically marked by both muted relief but also by sadness over the fact that the perpetrators’ innocent victims are gone forever, the fact that the perpetrator's death cannot change the past, and the fact that our world continues to produce such monstrous perpetrators in the first place.

When we lose the sadness part -- when all we do is happily scream "USA! USA! USA!” at news of yet more killing in a now unending back-and-forth war -- it’s a sign we may be inadvertently letting the monsters win.

Yeah pretty much that, which is why I think PC is spot-on.