Author Topic: Lord of the Rings  (Read 13751 times)

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Offline MrBoom_shack-a-lack

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Re: Lord of the Rings
« Reply #210 on: September 20, 2022, 04:52:31 AM »
Man the visuals are just stunning both Moria and Nķmenor looks incredible. Overall I enjoyed every episode altough it took sometime to get into the world and the characters.

I will say though that hearing the Haarfots and dwarfs speak irish feels so watered down, i'm not a Tolkien expert so I can't say if it's in the lore or if there's a reason for it but i'm just saying it's kinda generic especially hearing dwarfs speak it.

Having said that I just thought to myself would it be weird hearing them speak a diffrent accent and the answer would probably yes so yea...  :laugh:
« Last Edit: September 20, 2022, 05:20:33 AM by MrBoom_shack-a-lack »
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Offline MirrorMask

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Re: Lord of the Rings
« Reply #211 on: September 20, 2022, 05:01:20 AM »
I agree that the show seems to be aimless. It should be able to please everyone - give a coherent story for casual fans, and a sense of purpouse for those who know the lore.

For example, in the Moria scenes, you see discussions about Mithril (cool easter egg) and the dwarves digging the mines - the seeds are planted for them to eventually run into the Balrog. I'd like to see more hints and a general sense of direction to let me think "ok, just forget about the minor discrepancies and enjoy the ride, you know where this is going".
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Offline ariich

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Re: Lord of the Rings
« Reply #212 on: September 20, 2022, 06:19:13 AM »
I will say though that hearing the Haarfots and dwarfs speak irish feels so watered down, i'm not a Tolkien expert so I can't say if it's in the lore or if there's a reason for it but i'm just saying it's kinda generic especially hearing dwarfs speak it.

Having said that I just thought to myself would it be weird hearing them speak a diffrent accent and the answer would probably yes so yea...  :laugh:
The dwarves have Scottish accents, as they did in the Peter Jackson films (same as the elves having posh English accents, the orcs being cockney and the humans having a range of different regional English accents).

In the films, the hobbits have west country (Bristol, Gloucestershire, etc) English accents. I guess for the harfoots, being their ancestors, they could have simply gone with the same, but I imagine they wanted to make them sufficiently distinct while still retaining a similar rural community vibe, hence the Irish accents.

Offline hefdaddy42

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Re: Lord of the Rings
« Reply #213 on: September 20, 2022, 06:59:48 AM »
If the episodes were 35-40 minutes long and focused on just two subplots at a time or something, they could have stretched them out over 12 episodes or something. 8 one hour episodes is just cramming a lot in for my attention span.
No offense, but how did you get through the 3+ hour movies?

Given that the films were as long as they were, episodes much shorter than an hour would feel weird and unsubstantial.
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Re: Lord of the Rings
« Reply #214 on: September 20, 2022, 02:44:50 PM »
If the episodes were 35-40 minutes long and focused on just two subplots at a time or something, they could have stretched them out over 12 episodes or something. 8 one hour episodes is just cramming a lot in for my attention span.
No offense, but how did you get through the 3+ hour movies?

Given that the films were as long as they were, episodes much shorter than an hour would feel weird and unsubstantial.

I struggle with movies in general, so I did not do well with the LOTR movies. Iím pretty sure I fell asleep during a midnight showing of Return of the King when it first came out (and that was 20 years ago when I was still young and vigorous!).

If each episode was more of a self contained story arc, then an hour+ would make more sense. But so far they have just been various plots stitched together with none of them resolving within an hour. I donít see any reason why they couldnít break those up into shorter episodes. Though I could also just watch in more than one sitting I suppose!
« Last Edit: September 20, 2022, 03:04:51 PM by HOF »

Offline jammindude

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Re: Lord of the Rings
« Reply #215 on: September 20, 2022, 05:01:38 PM »
Try to think of it as more of a mini series than episodic television.
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Offline hefdaddy42

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Re: Lord of the Rings
« Reply #216 on: September 21, 2022, 09:21:39 AM »
If the episodes were 35-40 minutes long and focused on just two subplots at a time or something, they could have stretched them out over 12 episodes or something. 8 one hour episodes is just cramming a lot in for my attention span.
No offense, but how did you get through the 3+ hour movies?

Given that the films were as long as they were, episodes much shorter than an hour would feel weird and unsubstantial.

I struggle with movies in general, so I did not do well with the LOTR movies. Iím pretty sure I fell asleep during a midnight showing of Return of the King when it first came out (and that was 20 years ago when I was still young and vigorous!).

If each episode was more of a self contained story arc, then an hour+ would make more sense. But so far they have just been various plots stitched together with none of them resolving within an hour. I donít see any reason why they couldnít break those up into shorter episodes. Though I could also just watch in more than one sitting I suppose!
I don't know, man.  Virtually none of what you said makes any sense to me.

If each episode was more of a self contained story, it would be a regular TV show, not a prestige show, and it could have been on CBS right there beside of NCIS or something.  Nothing is supposed to resolve within the hour.  Each episode is a chapter in the larger story, and for that matter, the entire season is part one of five that will tell the whole thing.
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Re: Lord of the Rings
« Reply #217 on: September 22, 2022, 10:27:07 PM »
If the episodes were 35-40 minutes long and focused on just two subplots at a time or something, they could have stretched them out over 12 episodes or something. 8 one hour episodes is just cramming a lot in for my attention span.
No offense, but how did you get through the 3+ hour movies?

Given that the films were as long as they were, episodes much shorter than an hour would feel weird and unsubstantial.

I struggle with movies in general, so I did not do well with the LOTR movies. Iím pretty sure I fell asleep during a midnight showing of Return of the King when it first came out (and that was 20 years ago when I was still young and vigorous!).

If each episode was more of a self contained story arc, then an hour+ would make more sense. But so far they have just been various plots stitched together with none of them resolving within an hour. I donít see any reason why they couldnít break those up into shorter episodes. Though I could also just watch in more than one sitting I suppose!
I don't know, man.  Virtually none of what you said makes any sense to me.

If each episode was more of a self contained story, it would be a regular TV show, not a prestige show, and it could have been on CBS right there beside of NCIS or something.  Nothing is supposed to resolve within the hour.  Each episode is a chapter in the larger story, and for that matter, the entire season is part one of five that will tell the whole thing.

Iím just saying I donít see why the individual episodes need to be an hour long. Iím not saying they should be self-contained stories. But I fully admit I am not typical of the average consumer of this sort of TV.

Offline jammindude

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Re: Lord of the Rings
« Reply #218 on: September 22, 2022, 11:17:06 PM »
Just watched episode four and five tonight. Man, Iím loving the show more and more. I think itís absolutely brilliant! If Peter Jackson couldíve done at least this well with the hobbit series that wouldíve been wonderful. But itís nice to see this series return the stories to their former glory.
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Offline ariich

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Re: Lord of the Rings
« Reply #219 on: September 24, 2022, 02:18:29 AM »
Episode 5 was fantastic. Really just such an immersive show. They're doing a great job sticking with pretty traditional Tolkien-esque storytelling.

Offline MrBoom_shack-a-lack

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Re: Lord of the Rings
« Reply #220 on: September 24, 2022, 05:55:15 AM »
Yea this show is just getting better and better. Bear McCreary is putting his soul into this score. The song at beginning was straight out of a musical and I absolutely loved it. In fact some aspects of this show feels kinda theater like.

I'm a noob so I didn't know but this connection is kinda emotional:
Quote
Gandalf writes a letter to Frodo that includes a poem to help confirm (which it does) anyone calling themselves Strider is really Aragorn. That passage opens with these two lines, later repeated by Bilbo during the Council of Elrond: ďAll that is gold does not glitter/Not all those who wander are lost.Ē

That second line also appears in the final verse of Poppyís walking song.

At last comes their answer
Through cold and through frost
That not all who wonder or wander are lost
No matter the sorrow
No matter the cost
That not all who wonder or wander are lost


That connection adds an even greater layer of meaning to a song already rife with it. But it might very well soon prove to be even more important. If the Stranger really is an early incarnation of Gandalf, that means thousand of years before he wrote that line of poetry for Frodo, Gandalf initially heard the Hobbitís ancestors sing it. The words that helped Frodo trust Strider, an act that ultimately saved the world, came not from the wizard. They came from Frodoís own kind, the very people who first showed Gandalf the worth of small folk.


On another note is it just a coincidence that Largo Brandyfoot and Merry Brandybuck looks so much alike? I can't find any connection between them.
« Last Edit: September 24, 2022, 06:20:34 AM by MrBoom_shack-a-lack »
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Offline MirrorMask

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Re: Lord of the Rings
« Reply #221 on: September 24, 2022, 04:08:55 PM »
Yeah, that song put a big smile on my face. Excellent lovely tune!
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Offline adastra

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Re: Lord of the Rings
« Reply #222 on: September 25, 2022, 12:13:14 AM »
Got thru the first 4,5 episodes before quitting. Not my Cup of tea.
I guess I had too big expectations.
The show looks nice and the score is good, but the writing is poor.

3/10. Would't recommend this to Tolkien fanatics, casual viewers nor anyone in the middle

I hope that The rest of the show delivers to everyone who likes it!
Enjoy  :corn
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Re: Lord of the Rings
« Reply #223 on: September 25, 2022, 12:50:49 AM »
Got thru the first 4,5 episodes before quitting. Not my Cup of tea.
I guess I had too big expectations.
The show looks nice and the score is good, but the writing is poor.

3/10. Would't recommend this to Tolkien fanatics, casual viewers nor anyone in the middle

I hope that The rest of the show delivers to everyone who likes it!
Enjoy  :corn

This just blows my mind.

The Hobbit trilogy had poor writing. It was extremely difficult to accept it even came from the same people who gave us the original.

But this show has brought my imagination back to what made the original LOTR trilogy so fantastic.
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Offline adastra

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Re: Lord of the Rings
« Reply #224 on: September 25, 2022, 01:57:23 AM »

This just blows my mind.

The Hobbit trilogy had poor writing. It was extremely difficult to accept it even came from the same people who gave us the original.

But this show has brought my imagination back to what made the original LOTR trilogy so fantastic.

Wow, haha!  ;D  Itīs great how opinions can differ!
I really didnīt like The Hobbit Trilogy either,  but this is on completely different level.

I dont consider myself as a "lore guy" and think that the biggest problem is not that this is Fan-Fiction.
I Just find that the writing is poor;  The characters arenīt interesting and so much is happening off-camera (even though, at least for some of the plotlines, the advancement is so slow.)

There are some things that make this for me so off-putting, but iīm not gonna bore you with them.
Iīm not trying to take away anyones joy in watching this.  :natalieportman:
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Offline Puppies_On_Acid

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Re: Lord of the Rings
« Reply #225 on: September 25, 2022, 09:22:17 PM »

This just blows my mind.

The Hobbit trilogy had poor writing. It was extremely difficult to accept it even came from the same people who gave us the original.

But this show has brought my imagination back to what made the original LOTR trilogy so fantastic.

Wow, haha!  ;D  Itīs great how opinions can differ!
I really didnīt like The Hobbit Trilogy either,  but this is on completely different level.

I dont consider myself as a "lore guy" and think that the biggest problem is not that this is Fan-Fiction.
I Just find that the writing is poor;  The characters arenīt interesting and so much is happening off-camera (even though, at least for some of the plotlines, the advancement is so slow.)

There are some things that make this for me so off-putting, but iīm not gonna bore you with them.
Iīm not trying to take away anyones joy in watching this.  :natalieportman:
Yeah, I don't know. I could nit-pick, but I'm enjoying the show too much. I'm definitely liking this more than Amazon's adaptation of The Wheel of Time.
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Re: Lord of the Rings
« Reply #226 on: September 30, 2022, 08:15:02 AM »
I was surprised at how gory today's episode was at times. Much more blood than the LOTR movies.

I hadn't connected that the southlands is the area that eventually becomes Mordor. That eruption at the end was essentially the formation of Mt. Doom.
« Last Edit: September 30, 2022, 09:13:20 AM by lordxizor »

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Re: Lord of the Rings
« Reply #227 on: September 30, 2022, 07:41:04 PM »
Oh. My. Fucking. God.


Talk about an epic payoff episode...absolutely fantastic!!!

I was surprised at how gory today's episode was at times. Much more blood than the LOTR movies.

I hadn't connected that the southlands is the area that eventually becomes Mordor. That eruption at the end was essentially the formation of Mt. Doom.

Yeah, the moment I saw the lava, and then they fade to the Fuji like mountain, I instantly shouted "OH SHIT..."... just fucking love how they're spinning this tale. Fuck the haters, such an amazing production.

Offline MrBoom_shack-a-lack

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Re: Lord of the Rings
« Reply #228 on: October 01, 2022, 02:06:55 AM »
Yea that was an awesome episode.
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Offline Polarbear

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Re: Lord of the Rings
« Reply #229 on: October 01, 2022, 06:19:47 AM »
I have to say, that I'm also enjoying this a lot so far! Last episode was great IMO.

Obviously this takes a lot of liberties from the works of JRR, but I'm enjoying this as it's own thing. Although I hope they introduce Galadriel's husband Celeborn at some point, and write her closer to the source material in the following seasons!

Some Tolkien scholars on the interwebs seem to be pissed, but you can't please everybody. At the end of the day, this has to a show for the masses, and not to the small community of Tolkien scholars...

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Re: Lord of the Rings
« Reply #230 on: October 01, 2022, 06:22:42 AM »
I have to say, that I'm also enjoying this a lot so far! Last episode was great IMO.

Obviously this takes a lot of liberties from the works of JRR, but I'm enjoying this as it's own thing. Although I hope they introduce Galadriel's husband Celeborn at some point, and write her closer to the source material in the following seasons!

Some Tolkien scholars on the interwebs seem to be pissed, but you can't please everybody. At the end of the day, this has to a show for the masses, and not to the small community of Tolkien scholars...
Tolkien scholars can have the books. Let's face it, Tolkien's works are dry as hell and can't really be adapted directly without a good deal of artistic liberty. This show is great. They don't have to watch if they don't like it.

Offline MrBoom_shack-a-lack

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Re: Lord of the Rings
« Reply #231 on: October 01, 2022, 07:01:06 AM »
I have to say, that I'm also enjoying this a lot so far! Last episode was great IMO.

Obviously this takes a lot of liberties from the works of JRR, but I'm enjoying this as it's own thing. Although I hope they introduce Galadriel's husband Celeborn at some point, and write her closer to the source material in the following seasons!

Some Tolkien scholars on the interwebs seem to be pissed, but you can't please everybody. At the end of the day, this has to a show for the masses, and not to the small community of Tolkien scholars...
Tolkien scholars can have the books. Let's face it, Tolkien's works are dry as hell and can't really be adapted directly without a good deal of artistic liberty. This show is great. They don't have to watch if they don't like it.
It's funny because I avoided any reviews of the show before jumping in other than hearing that people where unhappy about something but I didn't know what. Some days ago I stumbled upon a review video that had a negative title so I watched that and read the comments and holy shit how angry alot of people were of the show. I didn't know it was so divided.

I'm kinda glad i'm not a Tolkien purist because it seems to be more fun having no preconceived notions about the show other than being entertaining. However atleast to me it seems to capture what I consider being that Tolkien magic atleast from what I got from the movies.
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Re: Lord of the Rings
« Reply #232 on: October 01, 2022, 07:09:14 AM »
Iím still pretty bored with it. Nice payoff at the end of that episode, but seriously why does a mechanism exist in the Elven watchtower to turn that mountain into mount doom?

I do think itís an interesting idea to explore how Mordor became Mordor, as thatís not something thatís really explored in any of Tolkiens works that I recall. I also did like how they explained that evil elf was the orc father (I do recall Tolkien writing about that somewhere). But I kind of hope they donít turn this into a ďis it wrong to wipe out the orcsĒ storyline.
« Last Edit: October 01, 2022, 07:14:19 AM by HOF »

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Re: Lord of the Rings
« Reply #233 on: October 01, 2022, 09:11:35 AM »
I'm kinda glad i'm not a Tolkien purist because it seems to be more fun having no preconceived notions about the show other than being entertaining. However atleast to me it seems to capture what I consider being that Tolkien magic atleast from what I got from the movies.

This is me. Iím enjoying the heck out of the show and I think itís because I donít have that Ďhistoryí with Tolkien or expectation. Just appreciating the beauty and production of the show and watching the story unfold.
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Re: Lord of the Rings
« Reply #234 on: October 01, 2022, 09:52:02 AM »
I'm kinda glad i'm not a Tolkien purist because it seems to be more fun having no preconceived notions about the show other than being entertaining. However atleast to me it seems to capture what I consider being that Tolkien magic atleast from what I got from the movies.

This is me. Iím enjoying the heck out of the show and I think itís because I donít have that Ďhistoryí with Tolkien or expectation. Just appreciating the beauty and production of the show and watching the story unfold.

I've actually been researching the storyline through Youtube vids, seeing how and where it touches on Tolkien's work. They definitely take liberties...I just don't turn into a butthurt man-baby over it. Also, the more it diverges, the more I think the Stranger is Gandalf.

Iím still pretty bored with it. Nice payoff at the end of that episode, but seriously why does a mechanism exist in the Elven watchtower to turn that mountain into mount doom?

I do think itís an interesting idea to explore how Mordor became Mordor, as thatís not something thatís really explored in any of Tolkiens works that I recall. I also did like how they explained that evil elf was the orc father (I do recall Tolkien writing about that somewhere). But I kind of hope they donít turn this into a ďis it wrong to wipe out the orcsĒ storyline.

Yeah, Tolkien does touch on orcs originally being tortured elves, I definitely remember that. As to Mt Doom, maybe the watchtower was originally built to protect the mechanism from exactly this scenario. Just guessing.

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Re: Lord of the Rings
« Reply #235 on: October 02, 2022, 06:11:32 AM »
As to Mt Doom, maybe the watchtower was originally built to protect the mechanism from exactly this scenario. Just guessing.

That was my impression. The monument behind the mechanism showing the blade (morgul blade) was a ruin from the Elven war against Morgoth, or so I thought. The fortress around it was built by the elves to keep the humans away from it...since men were the puppets of Morgoth in ancient times.

I wonder if that monument/pass is where Cirith Ungol will be built in future centuries?
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Re: Lord of the Rings
« Reply #236 on: October 02, 2022, 10:49:22 AM »
I'm kinda glad i'm not a Tolkien purist because it seems to be more fun having no preconceived notions about the show other than being entertaining. However atleast to me it seems to capture what I consider being that Tolkien magic atleast from what I got from the movies.

This is me. Iím enjoying the heck out of the show and I think itís because I donít have that Ďhistoryí with Tolkien or expectation. Just appreciating the beauty and production of the show and watching the story unfold.

I always prefer movies/shows to stick more closely to the books than the usually do.  But even though I know the books really well, I want to be able to enjoy seeing it on the screen too.  After being able to enjoy the Hobbit movies despite all kind of ridiculous stuff they added, I'm good with whatever for the series. 

And so far I'm really enjoying it.  I'm very glad we get a full hour for the show, and don't feel that I need to know where all of the story lines are going.  I'll find out as it unfolds.

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Re: Lord of the Rings
« Reply #237 on: October 02, 2022, 03:10:17 PM »
Obviously this takes a lot of liberties from the works of JRR, but I'm enjoying this as it's own thing. Although I hope they introduce Galadriel's husband Celeborn at some point, and write her closer to the source material in the following seasons!

They'll eventually have a daughter who will marry Elrond.

Don't know if they're eventually gonna tie their friendship into that, or they're just gonna skip that part alltogether. You'll need a time jump to allow for Galadriel's daughter to eventually come of age....
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Offline hefdaddy42

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Re: Lord of the Rings
« Reply #238 on: October 03, 2022, 02:08:10 PM »
I really love the writings of Tolkein, but I don't have any problems with the show, or liberties that are ever taken with film/TV adaptations.

They don't "ruin" the books.  The books are still the books.

This most recent episode was, in my opinion, the best one yet.
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Re: Lord of the Rings
« Reply #239 on: October 04, 2022, 08:20:17 AM »
I believe they only have the rights to whatever is in the appendix of The Return of the King, so they don't really have a story to go off of. But it's clear at this point that they are basically rebooting the history of the second age. The names and characters are the same, but the history is totally different. And I'm ok with that, really, since it's not like they are re-writing The Lord of the Rings or The Hobbit.

My issues with the show are mostly about how tedious most of the dialogue is. I don't know, maybe it's just that the story of middle earth is more interesting in the abstract, or on a macro level, then on a micro level.