Game of Thrones (TV, fantasy) Thread

Started by GuineaPig, April 12, 2011, 05:07:42 PM

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The Walrus

Someone on Reddit pointed out a very cool nugget... the Night King was created by a small girl who put a knife into his chest under a Weirwood tree. He was killed by a small girl who put a knife into his (lower) chest under a Weirwood tree. With the dagger that was intended to kill Bran, given to her by Bran.

Arya's name sounds like 'aria.' The definition of an aria:
"a long accompanied song for a solo voice, typically one in an opera or oratorio."

Arya's arc is one long, lonely story accompanied by a few passing characters, in a much larger story. Intentional or not I think that's a cool connection...

Adami

Quote from: Kattelox on April 29, 2019, 02:07:24 PM
Someone on Reddit pointed out a very cool nugget... the Night King was created by a small girl who put a knife into his chest under a Weirwood tree. He was killed by a small girl who put a knife into his (lower) chest under a Weirwood tree. With the dagger that was intended to kill Bran, given to her by Bran.

Arya's name sounds like 'aria.' The definition of an aria:
"a long accompanied song for a solo voice, typically one in an opera or oratorio."

Arya's arc is one long, lonely story accompanied by a few passing characters, in a much larger story. Intentional or not I think that's a cool connection...

Actually a pretty cool point.






So sorry to get back on the hate train, but the more I think about this episode, the more meh I think it is. I think it has 2 things going for it and 1 thing working against it.

Going for it...1) The acting....whatever these characters do, dumb or not, the actors are all doing a FANTASTIC job. I was thoroughly impressed by all of them I think. 2) The director. This was such a COOL episode, almost entirely because of how masterfully it was directed. So props to those two things.

Against it........the writing. I know people disagree, but I think more and more of this episode falls into lazy writing for me. They seemed sooooo focused on what looks cool and what is cool that they didn't care about much else. Yes, this episode is VERY cool, but also amazingly shallow. Scenes appear to be designed around what looks awesome and what will make the audience the most tense, as opposed to making much sense or being well-crafted. It's a shame since the show used to be all about the writing, and now the writing seems to be the weakest part of the show.

Hoping the last 3 episodes are an improvement, but not counting on it.
www. fanticide.bandcamp . com

KevShmev

I may have overlooked any post mentioning it, but they did a terrific job with the music. The score that played during the final sequence when the Night King was approaching Bran was absolutely fantastic.

Adami

Quote from: KevShmev on April 29, 2019, 05:06:07 PM
I may have overlooked any post mentioning it, but they did a terrific job with the music. The score that played during the final sequence when the Night King was approaching Bran was absolutely fantastic.

Ugh, the music was sooo horrible. I didn't hear ANY arpeggios, or odd time signatures. DO THEY EVEN POLY RHYTHM BRO?!?
www. fanticide.bandcamp . com

cramx3

 :lol

they've been really good with the music  :metal

faizoff

The music for the show has always been fitting and very complimentary of the scenes, since season 3 I feel they have been extraordinary and each season has some very memorable tracks. Last night's episode was no exception. The end scene theme is a derivation of the 'Light of the Seven' track.

gmillerdrake

Quote from: Adami on April 29, 2019, 03:19:23 PM
Quote from: Kattelox on April 29, 2019, 02:07:24 PM
Someone on Reddit pointed out a very cool nugget... the Night King was created by a small girl who put a knife into his chest under a Weirwood tree. He was killed by a small girl who put a knife into his (lower) chest under a Weirwood tree. With the dagger that was intended to kill Bran, given to her by Bran.

Arya's name sounds like 'aria.' The definition of an aria:
"a long accompanied song for a solo voice, typically one in an opera or oratorio."

Arya's arc is one long, lonely story accompanied by a few passing characters, in a much larger story. Intentional or not I think that's a cool connection...

Actually a pretty cool point.






So sorry to get back on the hate train, but the more I think about this episode, the more meh I think it is. I think it has 2 things going for it and 1 thing working against it.

Going for it...1) The acting....whatever these characters do, dumb or not, the actors are all doing a FANTASTIC job. I was thoroughly impressed by all of them I think. 2) The director. This was such a COOL episode, almost entirely because of how masterfully it was directed. So props to those two things.

Against it........the writing. I know people disagree, but I think more and more of this episode falls into lazy writing for me. They seemed sooooo focused on what looks cool and what is cool that they didn't care about much else. Yes, this episode is VERY cool, but also amazingly shallow. Scenes appear to be designed around what looks awesome and what will make the audience the most tense, as opposed to making much sense or being well-crafted. It's a shame since the show used to be all about the writing, and now the writing seems to be the weakest part of the show.

Hoping the last 3 episodes are an improvement, but not counting on it.

Totally get your point Adami but this is not new or a surprise. Once the source material dried up and they didn't have that to draw from the writing dropped a notch.

But it hasn't ruined the show.

KevShmev

Emilia Clarke walks around Times Square dressed like Jon Snow:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=acqxeL8mQvw

This is so hilarious.

Volante99

#6553
Majorly disappointed in that last episode.

Arya's battle has always been against those who betrayed her father and the Stark family. Vengeance is what drives her. She's not "no one". She's Arya f-ing STARK, as she proclaims. This is what makes her story compelling, narratively. Her time to shine was King's Landing.

Having her be the catalyst to end the war and kill the NK, while "badass", feels like either fan service  or subversion for its own sake. It doesn't really hold any weight to it. They've built the whole series around prophecy, mysticism, clever plot twists, and they end that whole arc with Arya jumping out of nowhere like a monkey and stabbing the NK. Not compelling, to me, at all. Hell, even Theon killing the Night King would have been more profound.

Bran continues to be useless, as do the Dragons, and Jon's arc was basically neutered as well. Now that humanity is safe does it even really matter who has the Throne?


MirrorMask

#6554
Joining in as well. Lots of interesting discussions in the last pages, I agree with most of the point Chino made.

This was the darkest episode of the series. And I mean it literally because you couldn't see a damn thing  :lol

I have to think a lot about it and maybe rewatch it. So far, I'm in the "not like it" camp.

Many things were quite cool however:

- Melisandre shows up calmly, "need fire bitches?", lights up all the swords and the Dothraki charge against the wights. Hurray! badass moments! and then all the lights go out one by one and people in Winterfell are all "Well, fffffuuuuuuu" and the few survivors run back in full "Nope nope nope nope" mode. What a brilliant way to set the tone for the battle.

- Lyanna Mormont going out like the badass she is. Best death scene of the episode.

- The music in the final moments was surpassed only by Light of the Seven, which I think it will go down as the most beautiful piece of music of the entire series. But still, awesome score.

- As previously reported, I find totally belieavable both the Hound being scared by fire, and Arya ninjng her way out of the rooms.

- Totally predictable, and I actually said it out loud, but Arya telling Sansa to "stick them with the pointy end" was awesome.

- People overanalyzed every absurd detail of the book and of the show.... but I bet no one figured out what Melisandre actually meant in early season about Arya closing "brown, green and BLUE eyes". Well done, very very well done.

- The ever unpenetrable and inscrutable Night King gets roasted by Dany, does not die and.... smiles. What a wicked, eerie smile. Also Jon running desperately for him and the Night King raising the dead like "piss off and leave me alone bro". Chilling.

And now, for the complaints....

- Plot Armor. Plot armor everywhere. It's a battle - some will survive, some will die. But I expect the survivor to kick ass and fight, not to repeatedly not-die over and over. Jaimie, Brienne and Sam spent the whole episode being surrounded by wights and not dying. Seriously, why wimpy, scared, fat Sam is still alive? ok, people came to rescue him more than once but come on. And also Dany is about to get killed and OF COURSE she's saved at the last second, and OF COURSE it's Jorah.

- Maybe it's me not following everything but... is Tormund alive? is Pod alive? is Rhaegal alive? couldn't figure out shit.

- The final showdown... this is it? Ninja Arya comes out jumping of fucking nowhere and kills the Night King and the entire existential menace is over? that's it?

Look, I appreciate Arya having the skills and the determination to do the unthinkable, but there's a thin line between kickass hero action, and "Screw the plot and the logic because the hero has to do something awesome".

Think of these scenes from other movies:

- X Men 2 I believe. The one with the battle on Alcatraz. Wolverine is facing Magneto but it was just a distraction to allow the blue hairy dude to surprise him from behind and stab him with the anti mutant gene or whatever it was. The hero renounces the "big kill" to do teamwork.

- Lord of the Rings, Pippin stabbing the Witchking. He was right there with Eowyn while the Nazgul attacked them. He was loyal to her friend and he was small and unnoticed, while the Nazgul was concentrated on Eowyn. He was right there, and his small size helped him.

These are both logical situations. Arya jumping out of fucking nowhere is not. Where did she jump from? how did she slip past the White Walkers, which were after all between her and the Night King so it's not like she was hidden in the trees behind Bran?

Also, they were clever enough to surround Winterfell with trenches of fire, but their plan for defending Bran, who was a 1000% sure target of the Night King, was "let Reek and 20 sea rapists defend him"? you know there's a chance the most dangerous creature in the whole of Westeros will go after a specific person in a specific, enclosed space and you don't booby trap the place? just, dunno, hide archers with dragonglass arrows in the trees and ambush the White Walkers, they could have had that, with some White Walkers being killed, the Night King being distracted but still kicking ass and killing people, and Arya being the wild card like Pippin was in Lord of the Rings, and doing her fatal kill.

Now, onto the "the battle for the Iron Throne was always the final issue" - I agree with Jon Snow and those who point out that the overarching theme of the entire saga is that people's squabbles don't mean anything in front of a bigger threat. With this resolution, they proved Cersei right - she was right in letting the undead and the North battle each other, now the existential threat of the White Walkers is over, and Dany has a very weakened army. Cersei was right and Jaimie was a stupid idealistic fool in wanting to fight, congratulations on making the big bad of the show being the only one who knew what to do I guess.

And about how it could have gone... well, the details should be thought out, but in broad terms: Winterfell is lost and the survivors escape. The Night King conquers Westeros and reaches King's Landing. Everyone realizes that they should have bonded together to save Westeros. Through mayhem and destruction, the Night King is eventually defeated, and then the fight for the Iron Throne is resolved, only after Westeros has gone through an existential threat.

I've read comments about the Night King having white eyes instead of blue in the end - I hope we overlooked some weird warging shit and that this is not the last of him and that we'll all congratulating the authors for a wicked twist. But for now I accept that they threw out all the subtetly for Holllywood blockbuster action and that the ending will be predictable and boring.


Mladen

Quote from: Chino on April 29, 2019, 04:57:03 AM
- Where the hell did Arya come from? The Night King was in the middle of the courtyard and she somehow made it over his posse to deliver the final blow? Was she hiding in the tree or something? Speaking of Arya, that stealth scene in the library or whatever it was felt kind of out of place for some reason. Was there a point to that other than to show off her ninja skills?

- So. Much. Plot. Armor. Holy shit. I'm almost disappointed with how few characters died. Not necessarily because they didn't die, but because of the set ups. I swear I saw BoT die on like 3 different occasions. Same with Grey Worm. Jaime, Brienne, and Pod all made it out alive after being pinned against a wall for like 20 minutes, yet the Dothroki got smothered in seconds? Jon somehow making it out when surrounded by like 1000 walkers. Dany not being able to get her dragon off the ground despite Jon's being able to brawl with the NK mid-flight? Sam spent half the episode on the ground and he still managed to make it out. Thousands of people died and somehow like 85% of the main characters got out with all their limbs. I'm sorry, but that's more fan fiction and Hollywood than what I've come to expect from this show.

- What was the point of Season 7 now? So much of that season was spent on going beyond the wall to get a dead guy to convince Cersei to fight with the North because they wouldn't win the battle otherwise. Yet here we are. 
This pretty much perfectly sums up the issues I have with the episode. Some of it was just too easy. What happened to the good old days when a TRULY major character would drop dead in split of the second? Main characters fighting for their lives and being on the verge of death for minutes, yet miraculously getting out alive, doesn't feel quite Game of Thrones to me.

Otherwise, it was a fun watch with some great moments. But I still prefer the second episode of the season.

MoraWintersoul

#6556
Quote from: Volante99 on April 29, 2019, 08:46:55 PM
Having her be the catalyst to end the war and kill the NK, while "badass", feels like either fan service  or subversion for its own sake. It doesn't really hold any weight to it. They've built the whole series around prophecy, mysticism, clever plot twists, and they end that whole arc with Arya jumping out of nowhere like a monkey and stabbing the NK. Not compelling, to me, at all. Hell, even Theon killing the Night King would have been more profound.
I super agree with Theon killing the Night King being more unexpected. If your ending was a shitpost on forums ("lol at this point Arya is just going to steal someone's face, sneak into NK's camp and kill him" was a common complaint the first few times they forgot to nerf her), it's not unexpected.

Having the prophecy be unimportant is fine, but then you can't make it look like you're ignoring the prophecy and hoping the viewers won't notice, or that they won't watch Inside the Episode and see that you did it because it looks cool. If Melisandre offhandedly mentioned that she is sure Snow is Azor Ahai who brought many swords together, it's just a question of which sword will be his Lightbringer, it would be a nice subversion because most casual viewers wouldn't be looking out for the person wielding a dagger - and if they did, they would feel smart for figuring it out. Or even not that. There's an interesting theory about two years ago about Arya being important for the endgame, so even in the books there is some setup for what they wanted. But they wanted it to be shocking...

I feel super stupid for brainstorming ways to make this better because I'm just a viewer of average intelligence. It's really bad when a show makes even a grounded viewer say "I'm pretty sure even I could have whipped up something better than that."

People say now that the 3ER has been a villain all along and I agree that would be interesting (the CotF didn't really like humans after all, and seeing the history of the world will make you root for the downfall of humanity), and the thought has run through my head, but honestly theorizing about that makes me feel like one of those HERE IS HOW BERNIE CAN STILL WIN folks.

Chino

#6557
I watched the episode again last night and have changed my tune a bit.


- I watched in a different location, on a different screen, and through a different service. The stream seemed much better. We jacked the brightness up and I actually saw a lot more through the darkness this time around. So much so, it entirely changed some scenes. One of those being the initial Dothraki charge. On my first watch, I couldn't tell what happened upon first contact. On my television it looked as if they ran straight into the staging undead army. Upon my second watch, it was clear the undead were already hauling ass like a tidal wave toward Winterfell. It completely changed the scene for me. The dragon flight scenes were also much clearer and discernible, as were a lot of the general fighting sequences. 

- Having already seen the episode and having zero expectations of any kind, I kind of enjoyed it more. The episode was wonderfully done in terms of timing and pacing and actually showing the slow, chronological takeover of Winterfell. 

- The library scene didn't bother me as much this time around. Upon first watch, I must have been distracted or something because I didn't realize Arya fled into the open window as a last ditch effort to escape a small horde. On my original watch it seemed like they just threw that in for shits, but it made more sense this time.

- Some things still really bug me. Again, the Holywood-ness was still off putting. So many times we see a main character literally getting buried in undead, screaming for their life, only for the camera to cut away and get back to them 10 minutes later somehow still fighting. It still bugs me that so many main characters got away unscathed, but what makes it even worse for me is the fact that they seem to be some of the only ones, literally, outside of those in the crypts. At the end of the episode, we saw next to nobody still standing other than the core 7 or so characters.

- While watching the Night King kill scene again, I started thinking about the time Arya was sword fighting with Brienne in Winterfell and looked up the video. We've seen similar knife work before - 2:46 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1mWKRXV7gFk

- Looking at this map or Winterfell, I guess it's at least plausible that Arya was able to get from the library to Godswood undetected.


- I originally rated this episode a 6/10, but I think I'd give it a solid 8/10 now. Being able to see the entire time honestly made a world of difference.   


Also, I take back my prediction of the Knight King not being dead.

MirrorMask

I have no issues with Arya being able to reach the Godswood. It was the "jumping from above out of nowhere" thing that bugs me.

Beric was supposed to protect Arya. Why Jon was brought back? he didn't do anything majorly important. Was he brought back to screw up the Battle of the Bastards? to screw up the expedition beyond the wall? to randomly fly a dragon in a battle? maybe he should have gotten a chance to fight the Night King after all, with still Arya delivering the killing blow. They could have teamed up to fight him, Arya could have been tossed aside with a fist as an insolent girl, not even worth the time it would take to kill her so that the Night King could concentrate on kicking Jon's ass. Arya could have been tossed on a pile of dead, hence the excuse for her to jump from an higher point at the Night King.

The Walrus

My understanding was that Melisandre revived Jon because she thought he was Azor Ahai after mistakenly following Stannis for so long... That doesn't mean his resurrection HAD to have a purpose though. Part of the message of the show is that prophecy is more often than not bullshit. Jon got revived because of a mistaken belief in a prophecy, nothing more - not unlike how Shireen was burned for the sake of a prophecy that turned out to be bunk.

hefdaddy42

Quote from: Volante99 on April 29, 2019, 08:46:55 PM
Arya's battle has always been against those who betrayed her father and the Stark family. Vengeance is what drives her. She's not "no one". She's Arya f-ing STARK, as she proclaims. This is what makes her story compelling, narratively. Her time to shine was King's Landing.

Having her be the catalyst to end the war and kill the NK, while "badass", feels like either fan service  or subversion for its own sake. It doesn't really hold any weight to it.
I don't know, man.  She's the only trained assassin in the bunch.

She is the only one that I would have sent against the one guy we need to kill.  Makes perfect sense to me.
Quote from: BlobVanDam on December 11, 2014, 08:19:46 PMHef is right on all things. Except for when I disagree with him. In which case he's probably still right.

MirrorMask

Quote from: Kattelox on April 30, 2019, 06:05:20 AM
My understanding was that Melisandre revived Jon because she thought he was Azor Ahai after mistakenly following Stannis for so long... That doesn't mean his resurrection HAD to have a purpose though. Part of the message of the show is that prophecy is more often than not bullshit. Jon got revived because of a mistaken belief in a prophecy, nothing more - not unlike how Shireen was burned for the sake of a prophecy that turned out to be bunk.

I could get behind the "prophecies are bullshit" thing, and it's been stated that Melisandre sees legit visions in the flame, but as much as the show authors with what little information they get from GRRM, she makes shit up trying to do her best guessing what is right, hence the fuckups.

But still, the lord of light, or something that is mistaken for the lord of light, is "real". Stannis and Sandor Clegane DID see something in the flames. Thoros and Melisandre both have powers of resurrection. Melisandre stated that she didn't resurrect Jon - she was allowed to do so bt the lord of light. Beric was allowed to return, it was not a drunkass priest bringing him back. Hence why the resurrected people are supposed to serve a purpouse, even if the reasons are unknown and people interpreting possible signs are wrong about it.

So we are to believe that Thoros and Melisandre both had resurrection powers all along? that they could inspire other people to see stuff in the flames? the prophecies are bullshit and so is the lord of light but yet a priestess and a random drunk have resurrecting powers of their own? feels inconsistent to me...

The Walrus

Quote from: Volante99 on April 29, 2019, 08:46:55 PM
Arya's battle has always been against those who betrayed her father and the Stark family. Vengeance is what drives her. She's not "no one". She's Arya f-ing STARK, as she proclaims. This is what makes her story compelling, narratively. Her time to shine was King's Landing.

I know that I look like the defender of the realm episode but there are some takes in this post I want to push back on  :smiley:

This is simply projection of your wishes for the story onto what actually happened. You say that, but what about the Valonqar prophecy? Tyrion or Jaime and their 'time to shine?' Why does Arya take priority over them, why can't the only trained assassin in the North sneak up on the bad guy with really quick reflexes?

Quote from: Volante99 on April 29, 2019, 08:46:55 PM
Having her be the catalyst to end the war and kill the NK, while "badass", feels like either fan service  or subversion for its own sake. It doesn't really hold any weight to it. They've built the whole series around prophecy, mysticism, clever plot twists, and they end that whole arc with Arya jumping out of nowhere like a monkey and stabbing the NK. Not compelling, to me, at all. Hell, even Theon killing the Night King would have been more profound.

They may have built the series around prophecy and mysticism but we've already seen prophecy and mysticism to be horseshit fairly often. There's an argument to be made that having Arya sneak into the Godswood and upon the Night King is a clever plot twist (girl creates Night King by shoving dagger into man's chest under Weirwood; girl kills Night King by shoving dagger into Night King's chest under Weirwood, with the dagger meant to kill Bran, given to her by Bran). It's also a Stark defending another Stark, at Winterfell. How would Theon killing the Night King make more sense than Arya? Genuinely curious on that, because I don't have the answer.

QuoteBran continues to be useless, as do the Dragons, and Jon's arc was basically neutered as well. Now that humanity is safe does it even really matter who has the Throne?

Bran literally lured the Night King into the Godswood. How is that useless? Jon's "arc" isn't neutered, he was never confirmed to be a prophetic warrior of the Lord of Light, if anything his arc has gotten better since he and Dany are aware of his Targaryen heritage.

And does it matter who has the throne... dude! YES! Have you not been watching this show? Daenerys is inching closer to becoming a typical Targaryen ruler and talks of breaking the wheel, but ruling the Seven Kingdoms is not breaking the wheel; Jon could be a good ruler but is reluctant to be one; Cersei wants to dominate the land and thinks only of those closest to her, and it looks like Euron is proposing to her next episode. This absolutely matters.

The Walrus

Quote from: MirrorMask on April 30, 2019, 06:17:22 AM
Quote from: Kattelox on April 30, 2019, 06:05:20 AM
My understanding was that Melisandre revived Jon because she thought he was Azor Ahai after mistakenly following Stannis for so long... That doesn't mean his resurrection HAD to have a purpose though. Part of the message of the show is that prophecy is more often than not bullshit. Jon got revived because of a mistaken belief in a prophecy, nothing more - not unlike how Shireen was burned for the sake of a prophecy that turned out to be bunk.

I could get behind the "prophecies are bullshit" thing, and it's been stated that Melisandre sees legit visions in the flame, but as much as the show authors with what little information they get from GRRM, she makes shit up trying to do her best guessing what is right, hence the fuckups.

But still, the lord of light, or something that is mistaken for the lord of light, is "real". Stannis and Sandor Clegane DID see something in the flames. Thoros and Melisandre both have powers of resurrection. Melisandre stated that she didn't resurrect Jon - she was allowed to do so bt the lord of light. Beric was allowed to return, it was not a drunkass priest bringing him back. Hence why the resurrected people are supposed to serve a purpouse, even if the reasons are unknown and people interpreting possible signs are wrong about it.

So we are to believe that Thoros and Melisandre both had resurrection powers all along? that they could inspire other people to see stuff in the flames? the prophecies are bullshit and so is the lord of light but yet a priestess and a random drunk have resurrecting powers of their own? feels inconsistent to me...

Real question: are you expecting answers on the subjective behaviors of an allegedly real deity? Because I can't answer why the Lord of Light acts in the ways he does. You're trying to apply logic to a god, brother, and that's gonna give you headaches. Sometimes, God fucks you, and sometimes, even the most faithful misplace their faith. Thoros isn't a random drunk, either. He's a red priest that happens to be a drunk.

MirrorMask

Yeah, sure, we can't expect logic from a god not even his actual priests understand, I was just pointing out how something true had to be there.

The show presents these facts:
- Some priests of the lord of light resurrect people
- Said priests can get people to watch visions in the flame

I completely accept that they misunderstand everything and they don't even know what they're doing, but it's been told that they manage to do what they do because they are allowed to do it. Melisandre mistakenly believing Stannis is a demigod is fine with me.... Melisandre resurrecting someone who doesn't mean shit in the great scheme of things is a bit weird. I guess we'll have to accept "the lord of light is a trolling asshole who allows useless resurrections just because a priest asks nicely following the correct formula" as explanation.

The Walrus

I don't even think it's that. I think it's just that Melisandre was wrong in interpreting the prophecies. Resurrections are possible, but not always because there's a divine purpose behind it. She was correct when she looked at Arya, but the Azor Ahai nonsense? She was played for a fool by her own faith - and I think that's a strong theme of the show.

cramx3

Quote from: MirrorMask on April 30, 2019, 01:32:55 AM
I've read comments about the Night King having white eyes instead of blue in the end - I hope we overlooked some weird warging shit and that this is not the last of him and that we'll all congratulating the authors for a wicked twist. But for now I accept that they threw out all the subtetly for Holllywood blockbuster action and that the ending will be predictable and boring.

I was listening to Alt Shift X's live Q&A after the episode (Apparently if I leave the video open after the episode, I can still watch it the next day) and he was pretty strongly against all this Arya and Night King stuff just because it seems to go far off from the books and prophecies.  I've tried to keep my complaints about the show separate from the issue of not following the books (because well, the books don't exist for this) but he kept going on saying he strongly believes the Night King isn't dead.  I'm thinking if that is true, that there's still more to this story then my own complaints may not be valid before the story is over.  However, like you, as much as I hope they have some good storytelling to do here still, I am guessing this ending will be hollywood 101.

as for Melisandre, the LoL also seemed to let her know she would die in Westeros and that Arya would kill the Night King.  She also wasn't even human or not a normal human with that necklace.  I feel like there is a lot of mystery around her that we won't learn about.

faizoff

Regarding the Night King not being dead theory, I don't think with 3 episodes left, that is a story they will make a focus on again. If he does have some power left he may resurrect in some weak form and that might be it. That's my take. I think they will focus back to the politics for the remaining episodes and I think that's where the real carnage will happen.

gmillerdrake

Quote from: hefdaddy42 on April 30, 2019, 06:07:48 AM
Quote from: Volante99 on April 29, 2019, 08:46:55 PM
Arya's battle has always been against those who betrayed her father and the Stark family. Vengeance is what drives her. She's not "no one". She's Arya f-ing STARK, as she proclaims. This is what makes her story compelling, narratively. Her time to shine was King's Landing.

Having her be the catalyst to end the war and kill the NK, while "badass", feels like either fan service  or subversion for its own sake. It doesn't really hold any weight to it.
I don't know, man.  She's the only trained assassin in the bunch.

She is the only one that I would have sent against the one guy we need to kill.  Makes perfect sense to me.

Exactly. Like she's supposed to ignore the fight or Noght King to make sure she gets to kill Cersi?

Seems to me Joaquin knew from early on how important she'd be.....probably knew about the Night King and all that as well and trained her then allowed her to leave.

Chino


gmillerdrake


Adami

"I'm gonna tell you the same thing I told Gendry....use the pointy end"
www. fanticide.bandcamp . com

MirrorMask

Quote from: Adami on April 30, 2019, 05:26:17 PM
"I'm gonna tell you the same thing I told Gendry....use the pointy end"

:lol

Can't find the image right now but I saw one of the Patrick Stewart meme, the one in "WTF" pose with the hand streched out, that was like:

SEASON 1: "How come the protagonist is dead???"
SEASON 8: "How come the protagonists are still alive???"

:lol

Speaking of alive protagonists - what Jamie's gonna do now? "Ok guys, it has been a pleasure to defend the realm of the living, guess now I'll go back to Cersei and help her destroying you..."? I'm not sure he thought it through, thinking beyond the possible victory against the White Walkers...

Also, who's gonna get Cersei? Arya already got the big kill, it's unlikely she's gonna kill Cersei as well, and the show left out, in the first scene of Season 5, the part of the prophecy to young Cersei which referred to the "little brother" killing her... maybe it's gonna be Dany or Jon, by now I expect her demise to be the most blockbusterish of 'em all.

Chino

#6573
Sansa is going to take down Cersei with the pointy end, possibly defending Tyrion after Bronn fails to kill him. It'd be sweet revenge for what Joffrey did to both of them. Sansa and Tyrion will end up ruling because Dany's going to die and Jon's going to be like "I'm going to rebuild and be king of the North instead". Speaking of, maybe Bronn actually kills Jaime? He did have that line "Listen to me, cunt. Till I get what I'm owed, a dragon doesn't get to kill you. You don't get to kill you. Only I get to kill you.".   



cramx3

Quote from: Chino on May 01, 2019, 04:56:04 AM
Sansa is going to take down Cersei with the pointy end, possibly defending Tyrion after Bronn fails to kill him. It'd be sweet revenge for what Joffrey did to both of them. Sansa and Tyrion will end up ruling because Dany's going to die and Jon's going to be like "I'm going to rebuild and be king of the North instead". Speaking of, maybe Bronn actually kills Jaime? He did have that line "Listen to me, cunt. Till I get what I'm owed, a dragon doesn't get to kill you. You don't get to kill you. Only I get to kill you.".

The only reason I could see Bronn turning on Jamie/Tyrion is if they say they can't pay him what Cersei is paying them.  He's said all along he goes to the highest bidder and it seems like there's nothing left in the North so I can't see how they could pay him.  I have a real hard time believing Bronn turns, but it is within his character to do so I think.

KevShmev

Quote from: KevShmev on April 29, 2019, 06:31:57 PM
Emilia Clarke walks around Times Square dressed like Jon Snow:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=acqxeL8mQvw

This is so hilarious.

Nobody watched this??  ??? ??? :( :(

Chino

Quote from: KevShmev on May 01, 2019, 06:30:23 AM
Quote from: KevShmev on April 29, 2019, 06:31:57 PM
Emilia Clarke walks around Times Square dressed like Jon Snow:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=acqxeL8mQvw

This is so hilarious.

Nobody watched this??  ??? ??? :( :(

I did. I wish it was more of her interacting with people in disguise and less advertising for whatever it was.

TheOutlawXanadu

I was speaking with some friends at work, and while we are all enjoying Season 8, we are pretty nervous that the season is going to end with everything feeling super rushed. I really wish they did ten episodes in Season 7 and ten episodes this year. Even something as simple as splitting the Battle of Winterfell between several episodes and maybe even having two battles with the Night King instead of one would have been more satisfying, at least in my opinion.

gmillerdrake

I think when the Seasons done and you can look at it as a whole it'll be fine.

Honestly, the only 'issue' I've seen is since there hasn't been any source material to extrapolate from for a couple seasons now.....the 'fan theories' have been in full throttle mode and when/if they don't happen people are getting pretty mad...it's the same fate that SW's is suffering from. A lot of folks believe 'their' version of how it should go is better than what they're seeing.

to Adami's continuing point....the writing and character depth has suffered with the lack of GRM's books and writing etc etc to draw from. They've replaced the nuance of the show with a more simplified version. For me, doesn't bother me or matter much. Still enjoying the heck out of the show and I'm sure I'll be satisfied with what they give us. GRM consulted them and has 'directed' them on the path that he's going to take the books.....but, if you're looking to 'blame' anyone it should be GRM himself as he's had ample time to produce the next installment of his books.

Grappler

Quote from: gmillerdrake on May 01, 2019, 07:46:20 AM
I think when the Seasons done and you can look at it as a whole it'll be fine.

Honestly, the only 'issue' I've seen is since there hasn't been any source material to extrapolate from for a couple seasons now.....the 'fan theories' have been in full throttle mode and when/if they don't happen people are getting pretty mad...it's the same fate that SW's is suffering from. A lot of folks believe 'their' version of how it should go is better than what they're seeing.

to Adami's continuing point....the writing and character depth has suffered with the lack of GRM's books and writing etc etc to draw from. They've replaced the nuance of the show with a more simplified version. For me, doesn't bother me or matter much. Still enjoying the heck out of the show and I'm sure I'll be satisfied with what they give us. GRM consulted them and has 'directed' them on the path that he's going to take the books.....but, if you're looking to 'blame' anyone it should be GRM himself as he's had ample time to produce the next installment of his books.

I love this post and your assessments.  At the end of the day, it's a TV show.  Nothing more.  A fantastic one at that - I'm enjoying going on the journey and not spending much time on what is or isn't in the show, or nit picking everything to death.  If they end the show without the Azor Ahai prophecy even being touched on, I wouldn't care.  With Melisandre's death, I'd think that it probably won't be brought up in the final three episodes, as she seemed to be the only character that was so focused on the prophecy.   

Things will happen one way in the show and another way in the books.  I don't think there's anything wrong with that.