Israel's Blockade Aimed to Collapse Gaza Economy

[ack44]

The Israeli government has always justified its Gaza blockade by claiming that they were preventing militants from acquiring weapons. They would also continually deny that there was a humanitarian crisis in Gaza. But cable leaks show that devastation of the Gaza economy was exactly what the Israeli government wanted.

https://www.forbes.com/feeds/ap/2011/01/05/business-financial-impact-ml-wikileaks-gaza-blockade_8238631.html

A U.S. diplomatic cable released by Wikileaks says Israel's blockade of the Gaza Strip was meant to push the area's economy "to the brink of collapse."

The March 3, 2008, document, published Wednesday by Norway's Aftenposten newspaper, clearly spells out one of Israel's chief objectives of the blockade: to cause widespread economic hardship in a bid to weaken the Hamas government.

Israel imposed the blockade after Hamas militants seized control of Gaza in June 2007. According to the cable, Israeli officials repeatedly told American diplomats that the embargo sought to damage the Gazan economy "without quite pushing it over the edge."

Under international pressure, Israel has eased the blockade since a deadly naval raid on a Gaza-bound flotilla last spring.

On a similar note, corruption at Gaza cargo crossings have come to light.

https://www.jpost.com/International/Article.aspx?id=202577

WikiLeaks: Coca Cola, P&G, HP and others charged 75 times the standard price to import goods through the Karni crossing.

Why does the U.S. put up with this shit? Truly ridiculous.

[Adami]

Oh no another anti-israel thread by Ack. Shocker.

Eh, I'll chime in eventually.


Oh by the way, the very article you quote says they don't want to collapse it. Good job not being psychotically one sided.

[El Barto]

So out of curiosity, does perpetuating misery on them to undermine their government seem like a reasonable thing to you, Adami?  I certainly understand your issue with the poster, but the post itself is an interesting (though not terribly surprising) confirmation.  What say you?

[Adami]

So out of curiosity, does perpetuating misery on them to undermine their government seem like a reasonable thing to you, Adami?  I certainly understand your issue with the poster, but the post itself is an interesting (though not terribly surprising) confirmation.  What say you?

I hate the current Israeli government and almost everything it does.


That answer? I could start listing every single policy of theirs that makes smash my palm into my forehead....but who has that kind of time?

[El Barto]

Yeah, I knew that.  I guess I didn't even need to ask.  It's just sometimes hard to reconcile your criticism of anti-Israel posts with your criticisms of Israel. 

[Adami]

Yeah, I knew that.  I guess I didn't even need to ask.  It's just sometimes hard to reconcile your criticism of anti-Israel posts with your criticisms of Israel.  

Broken records bother me I guess? I mean seriously, the guy spends so much time bashing Israel, yet if I suggest he's not 100% objective I get yelled at.


By the way, I love my country. I am a proud Israeli, and so forth. But I hate the government as of the last like  10 years if not more. I know a lot of americans just turned hating the leaders into hating the country, but I didn't for Israel.

[ack44]

Oh no another anti-israel thread by Ack. Shocker.

I make about three Israel-related threads a year (and about one Iran thread). The many posts I make in the threads are usually responses to misinformed opinions, which seem to be on the decline recently. The Israeli-Palestinian conflict hardly gets any coverage in the U.S. when large numbers of people aren't dying, so I think my threads are plenty justified.

[Adami]

Oh no another anti-israel thread by Ack. Shocker.

I make about three Israel-related threads a year (and about one Iran thread). The many posts I make in the threads are usually responses to misinformed opinions, which seem to be on the decline recently. The Israeli-Palestinian conflict hardly gets any coverage in the U.S. when large numbers of people aren't dying, so I think my threads are plenty justified.

Still wondering why you have a hard on for Israel, where there are WAY worse things going on in the world that you ignore and don't post about it whenever you have the oppurtunity.

[ack44]

Israel's always interested me. I did a big research paper and presentation on media bias against Israel in high school and I'm even going to Israel in February (to see historical sites mostly). Israelite tradition has even had an influence on ancient Japan.

Yes there are more terrible things going on in the world, most of which we will probably never hear. As I've said before the Israeli-Palestinian conflict is important because it's the front-line of the conflict between the West and the Muslim world, so it does deserve attention.

[Progmetty]

front-line?! it's the only line! They don't want the west to sense that but it's the truth that we all keep dancing around.
Lately I've been reading more Western accounts of Arab/Israeli wars, utterly disgusting, pieces of bull shit bundled in books.

[Adami]

Let's not forget that before 1948, the arab countries and groups all lived in perfect harmony with each other for thousands of years.

[Progmetty]

Before 1948 the internal political struggles in the middle east was perfectly normal comes-with-being-human kinda power struggles, I've recently seen B&W videos of the Palestinian exodus and the Jewish immigrations, one video was a Palestinian guy in a suit trying to explain how things "really are serious" and that the immigrations are a "start of something bigger and far more brutal since the militias showed up", I dunno exactly when that video is dated but it's extra footage that comes with The World At War documentary, it looked like a cry for help.
I see all this and laugh at the state of Arabs now, yes we deserve it, we were slackers then we were military soldiers then criers then victims then rebels then Guerrilla warfare soldiers (that's terrorists for Westerns), summing up the last 70 years of Arab affairs.
We deserve every bit of it, it sucks to be ashamed of Egypt but the more I read the more I see we had so many chances, so many fuckin chances wasted, some people tell me I'm too harsh on Egypt which never actually fought Israel, it was always America's might we went to war with so we never actually stood a chance, I believe that's the truth but I fight with admitting it cause I hate simply throwing blame away from where I stand.
Don't get me wrong, yay Israel from this end, may the smartest always win, dumb fucks and slackers deserve to perish.

[Adami]

Wow, such hate.

[rumborak]

Hmm, while I can see that a blockade will put economic stress on a country, I don't see how it would weaken a government. If anything it will strengthen support for Hamas.

Regarding there morality of it, who cares. Everybody plays dirty in the Middle East.

rumborak

[Adami]

Hmm, while I can see that a blockade will put economic stress on a country, I don't see how it would weaken a government. If anything it will strengthen support for Hamas.

Regarding there morality of it, who cares. Everybody plays dirty in the Middle East.

rumborak

If only everyone treated palestinians like.................every other arab country, minus jordan who just happens to have a palestinian queen.

[rumborak]

To be honest, I stopped caring about the Middle East. It's kinda the Excalibur for American presidents ("If I can be the guy bringing peace to the Middle East, I'll be the best president ever!"), but as long as there are countries surrounding Israel whose presidents deny Israel the right to exist, there will be no peace.
IMHO, the only thing that will really calm the region is energy independence. Because once the Middle East becomes just another region with morons who like to bash their heads (of which there are many others) and they become isolated, I think they will have to turn inward and start working on deserving the attention they currently get for free.

 rumborak

[ack44]

To be honest, I stopped caring about the Middle East. It's kinda the Excalibur for American presidents ("If I can be the guy bringing peace to the Middle East, I'll be the best president ever!"), but as long as there are countries surrounding Israel whose presidents deny Israel the right to exist, there will be no peace.

Are you thinking of Ahmadinejad? At least all the presidents of countries bordering Israel have long accepted Israel's right to exist as far as I know. It would sure help the cause for peace if the Arab countries actually showed more political support for Palestine, but most of them are political allies of the West and would prefer not to offend Israel (Turkey is an exception since the flotilla incident).

[Adami]

You're HONESTLY of the impression that the lack of support for the palestinian people is because the arab countries don't want to piss off america?

That's a pretty insane thought that completely removes the possibility that most arab countries could not care less about the palestinian people.


Jordan may have accepted Israels right to exist, Egypt possibly too. As far as I know, that's it. Lord knows Lebanon and Syria don't.


Not like Lebanon is a real country anyway.

[ack44]

You're HONESTLY of the impression that the lack of support for the palestinian people is because the arab countries don't want to piss off america?

That's a pretty insane thought that completely removes the possibility that most arab countries could not care less about the palestinian people.


Jordan may have accepted Israels right to exist, Egypt possibly too. As far as I know, that's it. Lord knows Lebanon and Syria don't.

Not like Lebanon is a real country anyway.

I was talking about political support, not popular support. The Arab people in general care a lot about the Palestinians. They view them as fellow Arab brothers. The Arab governments is a entirely different issue. You could say they "don't care about the Palestinian people" if you want to put it that way, I'm not arguing against that. The reason they "don't care" is because helping them usually doesn't give them a political advantage. There are other things that do.

The way I see it, if you have diplomats in said country, then you accept that county's right to exist. It's kind of strange to claim that one country doesn't accept the right of existence of another country when diplomacy is happening. Diplomacy would not happen if one side was claiming the other shouldn't even be there.

[Adami]

If the arab countries actually cared about palestinians they wouldn't treat them like garbage. There's a reason most palestinians chose to stay in the horribleness of Gaza and the West Bank as opposed to going to another country. Oddly enough, the Israelis treat them a lot better.

Also ironically, as "pro israel" as you claim the media is, it only reports what THEY do to the palestinians. You never hear about how bad Egypt treats them or other countries.

[ack44]

If the arab countries actually cared about palestinians they wouldn't treat them like garbage. There's a reason most palestinians chose to stay in the horribleness of Gaza and the West Bank as opposed to going to another country. Oddly enough, the Israelis treat them a lot better.

Also ironically, as "pro israel" as you claim the media is, it only reports what THEY do to the palestinians. You never hear about how bad Egypt treats them or other countries.

I don't remember claiming the media is pro-Israel. Do you have any links for what you're talking about specifically, about Arab countries treating Palestinians badly? The only things about Egypt I hear is that they crack down on secret tunnels to Gaza.

[Adami]

https://www.fmreview.org/FMRpdfs/FMR20/FMR2013.pdf

That talks a little about palestinians in egypt. If you got o Refugee.com or whatever you can find how terrible lebanon treats them too.

I don't have the desire to do a lot of work for a guy who won't under any condition stop hating Israel. But there you go, you can do more research if you want, but I doubt you'll look at anything that isn't anti-israel.

[Progmetty]

Yes, we crack down on the tunnels to Gaza real bad, word in Egypt on the people level is that our government is doing it to avoid an American breakdown on Egyptian government with all it's corruption, we are highly corrupt right now, we are a police state living under the emergency law since 1981, the parlement and presidential elections are being faked every time, proof is overwhelming of that but nothing happens, talk = disappear, we know that once we become slightly more inconvenient for Israel; America has a lot of excuses to crack down on us, suddenly we will need democracy and freedom and as usual the result will be beautiful; one less angle for Israel to worry about
Our government is playing that card shamelessly, we can't go easy about the path to Gaza or America will fuck us, either financially or with a military offense, do you want to be even poorer than you already are dumb ass? do you want that piece of bread to get even more expensive? let's see you care about the starving children in Gaza then.

[Super Dude]

Oh, another anti-Israel thread. This is getting to be like how Andy used to be about the Anglosphere.

[Adami]

Oh, another anti-Israel thread. This is getting to be like how Andy used to be about the Anglosphere.

Oh good you're here. I can take a break.

[Progmetty]

I was talking about political support, not popular support. The Arab people in general care a lot about the Palestinians. They view them as fellow Arab brothers.

True, myself excluded, the Palestinians suffering is the most thing the normal Arabic man thinks about with an overwhelming sense of guilt, you have to understand that Arabs are now at a point where seeing the star of David leaves the same psychological impression that the Swastika leaves for Jewish people, uneasiness, oppression, helplessness.

[ack44]

Oh, another anti-Israel thread. This is getting to be like how Andy used to be about the Anglosphere.

It's an anti-Gaza blockade thread at best. Respond to actual content or don't post.

[Adami]

I was talking about political support, not popular support. The Arab people in general care a lot about the Palestinians. They view them as fellow Arab brothers.

True, myself excluded, the Palestinians suffering is the most thing the normal Arabic man thinks about with an overwhelming sense of guilt, you have to understand that Arabs are now at a point where seeing the star of David leaves the same psychological impression that the Swastika leaves for Jewish people, uneasiness, oppression, helplessness.

Clearly you have no idea how jews feel when they see a swastika.

Oh I forgot, your point was just that israelis are nazis. Gotcha.

[Progmetty]

Not my point at all Adami, seriously.

[Adami]

Either way....

Clearly you have no idea how jews feel when they see a swastika.

[emindead]

Warm inside, but not in the good way?

Well, for one it's interesting that the domino effect has started in Latin America. Brazil, Chile, Venezuela and others are recognising the Palestinian State, so maybe that will help with their economical situation for once. Colombia of course is Pro-Israel and won't recognize Palestine until Israel and them coexist with fraternal love, in other words not in our life-time.

Hey, Adami, why don't you come to visit Colombia? We love Jews and gold. Especially the latter. Especially me.

[ack44]

https://www.fmreview.org/FMRpdfs/FMR20/FMR2013.pdf

This is a very interesting article. But the points here can't be summed up by saying "Arabs don't care about Palestinians." Initially, Palestinian refugees lived peacefully in Egypt for decades;

The rise to power of Gamal AbdelNasser in 1952 ushered in a golden age for Palestinians in Egypt. Palestinians were regarded as equal to
Egyptian nationals and were able to access education and other state services and to work without restrictions.

But later, things get nasty;

However, by the late 1970s the dispersed Palestinian communities in Egypt were increasingly affected by tensions between the Egyptian government and the Palestinian liberation organisation. The Camp David peace agreement and the assassination of Egypt’s culture minister by the
Palestinian faction headed by Abu Nidal in 1978 proved a turning point. Laws and regulations were amended to treat Palestinians as foreigners. Rights to free education, employment and residency were rescinded. The state media projected negative images of ‘ungrateful’ Palestinians and accused them of having brought about their expulsion by their greed and willingness to sell their land to Zionists. As a result, many Egyptians believe that Palestinians are rich, economically powerful and influential and deserve neither sympathy nor assistance.

That last sentence rings an odd bell, lol.

The refugees, it seems, found themselves in a shitty situation after some political events. I've been trying to look into the assassination by the PLO but can't find much on it.

[Super Dude]

Oh, another anti-Israel thread. This is getting to be like how Andy used to be about the Anglosphere.

Oh good you're here. I can take a break.

Forget it dude; shouting at a wall is as useless as trying to talk to one.