The Mike Portnoy Appreciation/Discussion Thread (merged)

[MirrorMask]

Bringing this back on topic, MP is getting a colonoscopy! The man does love to share. Maybe we'll get pics!

https://www.instagram.com/p/B2hornHjbw9/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link

 

Some things are not meant to be shared in public, oh boy

I agree that he shouldn't overshare, but a man of his age is doing the right thing. I remember Geezer Butler saying that Ronnie James Dio strongly refused one. Check ups are always a good thing, especially when not shared online 

[nobloodyname]

Bringing this back on topic, MP is getting a colonoscopy! The man does love to share. Maybe we'll get pics!

https://www.instagram.com/p/B2hornHjbw9/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link

 

Some things are not meant to be shared in public, oh boy

All joking aside, if there's even a remote possibility that his post has a positive effect on someone's health, excellent. It should never be taboo.

No doubt someone will come along to say that's not his intention but so what? He's clearly nervous about it and will benefit from the banter it caused.

[MoraWintersoul]

I'm not sure I want to interrupt this interesting conversation  but I've been mulling over this:

I've lost the passion for
MP and his multitude of projects. I keep trying but I'm not sure
how much longer I will keep buying music that I know won't have
any lasting impact.

and MP's quote about wanting people to go to multiple shows if they can, and it just hit me that MP is maybe discovering the actual reason why there's not a lot of accomplished musicians who do this freewhelin', uh, wheel of projects thing that he is doing right now. It's a question of whether it's financially, artistically or emotionally feasible.

There's about 30-50 bands that I like enough to the point that I'm always spending money on them and talking them up everywhere. I'll buy every shirt design I like, if I see a vinyl in stock I'll order one even if it's not my favorite album, if there's a show a flight away I will consider going. A band that's not on the list will have a hard time getting my money unless they're playing in my city or I like their new album enough to buy it in physical format. I'm assuming Mike isn't hurting for money, so I'll move on to my next point.

It must be very hard for Mike to transition from meeting people who have Majesty logo tattoos and who talk about loving his lyrics to ACOS to... still meeting all the same people 10 years after he quit Dream Theater, but a dwindling number of them as he just hasn't had a prog metal project that captured the imagination of his fanbase to that extent. It must feel very hurtful to him, and he must dismiss it as people just being haters, because how else is he supposed to feel about that? But that's the way it is. You have the fanbase you have and they like what they like, and for most of them, it's not hard rock, lyrical Christian soft prog or thrash metal. Hey, it could be worse: half of the people lamenting the loss of Kevin Moore's artistic genius all over DT's Youtube comments aren't even aware he has published albums since leaving the band.

If you asked most Mike Portnoy fans to name their top three Mike Portnoy albums, 9/10 would list DT albums, and the remaining person would list one Transatlantic along with their two fave DT albums. Most famous musicians don't really give a crap if they'll surpass their masterpiece in the eyes of the public; they are happy to have a masterpiece to their name. But Mike has been out to prove himself. Sadly, it's just unlikely that he'll be in a band that's as loved and acclaimed as Dream Theater because there aren't many bands like that to begin with.

[The Walrus]

To add to Mora's (excellent) post - DT spent, what, 2 years sitting on the music for Images & Words, just trying to find a singer who would do the music justice? Now Mike struggles to practice one section for 30 minutes. At his age he's not going to put the same amount of blood, sweat, and tears into his work no matter what he says, and divying all that work up amongst a bunch of projects which only serves to divide his fanbase more (do I go to Winery Dogs? or Neal Morse? or Flying Colors? what about the other 20 bands I want to see but can't afford to see them all? etc.). Not many 50+ year olds have that fire of a young extremely hungry 20-something with nothing but fresh ideas and a desire to play.

[Stadler]

Happy birthday to Hef, Stads, and me!

Happy birthday to all you guys!

And Happy Birthday to my brothers here.  Cheers!

[TAC]

Happy birthday to Hef, Stads, and me!

Happy birthday to all you guys!

And Happy Birthday to my brothers here.  Cheers!

A great month for birthdays, I must say, right Cram?

[The Walrus]

January is better. 

[Dublagent66]

MP is doing so many things right now, I can't seem to keep up.  The guy is just non-stop go go go...

[ProfessorPeart]

Bringing this back on topic, MP is getting a colonoscopy! The man does love to share. Maybe we'll get pics!

https://www.instagram.com/p/B2hornHjbw9/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link

 

He's all good! He did post a pic, but it was of the monitor with his record and stats up. As someone that works in healthcare, I know better than to violate HIPAA.

[ytserush]

September 8th.  I know this because my birthday is the 10th.

September 10th was when Test For Echo was released in 1996, but I'm sure you don't need to know that. Oh...and belated Happy Birthday!

[ytserush]

September 8th.  I know this because my birthday is the 10th.

Mine is the 9th.  I didn't see the announcement until the morning of my birthday that year.

Happy birthday to me!

Happy Birthday!  September 9th 1982 was when Signals was released, but probably didn't need to know that either!

[ytserush]

Bringing this back on topic, MP is getting a colonoscopy! The man does love to share. Maybe we'll get pics!

https://www.instagram.com/p/B2hornHjbw9/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link

 

Some things are not meant to be shared in public, oh boy

All joking aside, if there's even a remote possibility that his post has a positive effect on someone's health, excellent. It should never be taboo.

No doubt someone will come along to say that's not his intention but so what? He's clearly nervous about it and will benefit from the banter it caused.

Absolutely.

Wasn't all that thrilled about mine but I was pretty glad once it was over. Preparation obviously was the worst part.

[ytserush]

To add to Mora's (excellent) post - DT spent, what, 2 years sitting on the music for Images & Words, just trying to find a singer who would do the music justice? Now Mike struggles to practice one section for 30 minutes. At his age he's not going to put the same amount of blood, sweat, and tears into his work no matter what he says, and divying all that work up amongst a bunch of projects which only serves to divide his fanbase more (do I go to Winery Dogs? or Neal Morse? or Flying Colors? what about the other 20 bands I want to see but can't afford to see them all? etc.). Not many 50+ year olds have that fire of a young extremely hungry 20-something with nothing but fresh ideas and a desire to play.

Maybe I'm just lucky but I don't see those bands you mention as dividing for me. I'm into all of them.

The line for me was projects like A Mob, AX7 and Metal Allegiance. Sons of Apollos is kind of the middle where I have one foot in and one foot out.

[TAC]

Bringing this back on topic, MP is getting a colonoscopy! The man does love to share. Maybe we'll get pics!

https://www.instagram.com/p/B2hornHjbw9/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link

 

I heard the experience was a nightmare as the issues were sevenfold.

But he passed his test with um..flying colors.

[Stadler]

To add to Mora's (excellent) post - DT spent, what, 2 years sitting on the music for Images & Words, just trying to find a singer who would do the music justice? Now Mike struggles to practice one section for 30 minutes. At his age he's not going to put the same amount of blood, sweat, and tears into his work no matter what he says, and divying all that work up amongst a bunch of projects which only serves to divide his fanbase more (do I go to Winery Dogs? or Neal Morse? or Flying Colors? what about the other 20 bands I want to see but can't afford to see them all? etc.). Not many 50+ year olds have that fire of a young extremely hungry 20-something with nothing but fresh ideas and a desire to play.

Not to argue, and not to repeat myself (I'm certainly doing the latter), I don't expect Mike to woodshed for 8 hours a day.  It's the rare "hero" that really does that anymore (Slash has said that he does, Neil Peart famously did that), and that's fine.  You get a vocabulary, and you expand in other ways.   

I'm more concerned with the splintering, and how he's gone about trying to "beat" what came before.   I think the beauty of Dream Theater is that it appealed to those that like BNWOHM, that like Thrash, that like hair metal, that like hard rock, that like whatever it is you call Journey, that like whatever it is you call Rush...   now there's the "metal" project, the "old school prog" project, the "new school prog" project, the "Beatles/Muse" project, the whatever it is you call AMob, the "Deep Purple/classic rock" project...  I think it's a mindset.  If you go in trying to "make the best prog-metal album you can" in that moment, it focuses your thinking.  If you go in trying to "make history" (no, I'm not really joking) in that moment, it can't help but expand your thinking.

I'm not in Mike's head, so I have no idea how close - or not - I am, but that's certainly what it SEEMS like.   

[gzarruk]

And to add to all of that, I think Mike is being naive to think he'll have the level of success he had with DT, after 25 solid years of building the band/brand, with his many new(er) bands that spend most of their time being inactive while he is doing something else. Building a successful band requires constant effort and hard work, and actually sustaining that through time, no matter how many "big" names are playing with you. IMO he should focus on building few bands instead of trying to juggle 6 bands at the same time and take pride in it.

[Lethean]

I think several of the above posts have some great points.

I just don't know if Mike is really naive or if at this point his expectations are too high; maybe he's fully aware that it's not likely he'll have the same success he did with DT? 

Part of me agrees that he should spent more time with one or two bands instead of spreading himself out so much, but maybe he's happier doing what he's doing. 

@Stadler - for my own personal tastes, I completely agree with you.  I think part of the reason why DT is so special is because of different elements they bring into it.  But for others, maybe it's not that way.  Bands like Metal Allegiance and Winery Dogs have fans who would never be interested in DT.  And while DT might sometimes bring in thrash elements, if that's what you're really looking for, DT probably isn't going to satisfy that for you.  So I can see from a (non-DT) fan perspective that some of his projects might hold a lot of interest, and from his own playing perspective, maybe he's just having fun doing the "compartmentalized" approach because he can focus on something he enjoys that he didn't get to do consistently with DT.

Having said all that... I'm not interested in much of what he's doing.  Flying Colors is the one that holds the most interest to me.  But I'm OK with my interest falling off a little bit; I might have rather had him try to put together a prog metal project, but I can look to other bands for that instead.

[Stadler]

I have more DT material than any other band besides the Dead, and it's because when I got into them - '92, with the release of Images and Words - they were literally the ONE band that was sort of a go-to shopping experience.   It was like listening to James Hetfield, Neil Peart, Steve Perry, Tony Banks and Chris Squire jamming together. 

[cramx3]

Happy birthday to Hef, Stads, and me!

Happy birthday to all you guys!

And Happy Birthday to my brothers here.  Cheers!

A great month for birthdays, I must say, right Cram?

Yup, celebrating my birthday this weekend in Vegas 

[bosk1]

Part of me agrees that he should spent more time with one or two bands instead of spreading himself out so much, but maybe he's happier doing what he's doing. 

Well, yeah, I think that's what it comes down to.  He is doing things this way because, regardless what you or I might think he should do, this is what he wants to do.  I think he does wish that one of his projects would take off, and I'm sure he would focus a bit more on that one if one of them did.  But he wants to have that diversity of people he is working with and diversity of styles (even if we might subjectively feel that there isn't much meaningful diversity to us between FC, NMB, and TA). 

I mean, he didn't want to outright leave DT.  But at the same time, he was burned out on what DT was doing and wanted a break, AND he didn't want to sacrifice doing a lot of other things because that is just what he feels compelled to do. 

Putting all that together, I think it's a lot more complicated of an emotional decision than simply "he should focus on one thing and build that up." 

[TAC]

Happy birthday to Hef, Stads, and me!

Happy birthday to all you guys!

And Happy Birthday to my brothers here.  Cheers!

A great month for birthdays, I must say, right Cram?

Yup, celebrating my birthday this weekend in Vegas 

I'm not.

[SystematicThought]

I think he does wish that one of his projects would take off, and I'm sure he would focus a bit more on that one if one of them did.  But he wants to have that diversity of people he is working with and diversity of styles (even if we might subjectively feel that there isn't much meaningful diversity to us between FC, NMB, and TA). 

I agree with everything you said, I just wanted to comment on this part. I don't think you can have it both ways though. He's spread himself out so much that I don't think one band can ever truly take off. A project can't take off if he doesn't want to dedicate a lot of time to it. He seems to have wanted Sons of Apollo to take off, but he and Derek blew that one. I think Winery Dogs could really take off if he dedicated more time to it, but he doesn't want to and Ritchie doesn't seem to want to either. And I understand that he wants to expand his horizons, it's what he wanted to do, but he'll never have that level of success again like he did with DT.

At the end of the day though, MP doesn't seem to be hurting for money, so he's gonna be okay. He definitely seems happier than ever, I just think eventually he'll want to have that control again like he did with DT.

[Adami]

I'm not sure this has been talked about much, in regards to his project's viability and longjecity, but it's more than just Portnoy spreading himself too thin.

Look at the people he's forming these bands with.

None of them are bands that even have a chance of making it big, they're all essentially lesser or so forms of super groups. With rare exception, he surrounds himself with well-known, very busy people.

Ritchie Kotzen? Busy doing tons of solo stuff, he ain't got time to make Winery Dogs his main band.
Billy Sheehan? He's busy doing all of MP's stuff and the other 50,000 things he does. He's a great jam/session guy, but if he isn't a legacy member, he's not dedicating the time to just you.
Neil Morse? Got his own stuff. Flying colors is just a fun gig.
Dave LaRue? Same.
Steve Morse? Dude has BIG stuff he isn't ever going to sideline for Flying Colors.
Jeff Scott Soto? Feels like he does 50 gigs himself. He and Bumblefoot are most likely to stick with a long term band, but neither of them have the song-writing skills to do so (notice I said song writing, not talent).
David Elefson? Nuff said.
Alex Skolnick? Busy busy busy.

You guys get my point.

If all you do is surround yourself with well establish guys, you're just having fun at this point.

If he wants a real band with real potential, he needs to find unknowns that aren't dedicated to so many things or their own huge things. But he's quite unlikely to do that.

[King Postwhore]

Adami.  You need to psychoanalyze who you're talking about.   His compulsive behavior says it will never happen.  While I enjoy 80% of his output these days he forced his way out of that situation because of his compulsions.

[Adami]

Adami.  You need to psychoanalyze who you're talking about.

Not for free. 

[King Postwhore]

 

Ah.  If only you had your multiple degrees in the late 80's.

[SystematicThought]

It would be cool to see MP start a band with a group of up and coming musicians...wouldn't be hard to find some. But I think that would be one of the worst things an up and coming musician could do, starting a band with MP. He'd take too much of the spotlight away from the newcomers and they would develop in a really weird way. It would end horribly.

It would also be cool to see MP start a project with completely different people out of his comfort zone

[MirrorMask]

It would be cool to see MP start a band with a group of up and coming musicians...wouldn't be hard to find some. But I think that would be one of the worst things an up and coming musician could do, starting a band with MP. He'd take too much of the spotlight away from the newcomers and they would develop in a really weird way. It would end horribly.

Not really the same thing, since they're more live players than active partecipants in the studio albums, but Alice Cooper started playing live with a bunch of relative unknowns and year after year the live lineup estabilished itself, and so people started to recognize and grow fond of the other musicians.

Sure, "MP and a bunch of newcomers" as a band would start being all about MP,  but say that they make a nice album, and then they make another good one, people would eventually start to notice the guitar player or the singer and see them more than just "those kids hanging out with MP".

[Stadler]

Dangerous territory here, what with not being a professional in the field and all, but...

It's human nature that many of us are afraid to fail, and that can manifest itself in many different ways.  With Mike I think the constant surrounding with "all-stars" is partly a way to have fun, partly a way to get eyeballs from multiple angles, partly a validation on what is no doubt a stellar career, but partly it's a way to take the heat off.  What happens when Mike is in a band with Stadler, TAC, Kingshmegland and El Barto (i.e. a bunch of no-names) and 40 people show up at the gigs?   How does that get processed? 

[bosk1]

Part of me wishes, on his behalf, that A7X would have changed their plans and decided to extend his contract and keep him on.  His style fit well with them, and he seemed to really have fun playing that music and playing to those huge crowds.  But on the other hand, I see the real potential for that to have gone south after a couple of album and tour cycles just because he NEEDS to be involved in other things as well.   

[goo-goo]

Part of me wishes, on his behalf, that A7X would have changed their plans and decided to extend his contract and keep him on.  His style fit well with them, and he seemed to really have fun playing that music and playing to those huge crowds.  But on the other hand, I see the real potential for that to have gone south after a couple of album and tour cycles just because he NEEDS to be involved in other things as well.

Not a big fan of A7X but I did hear the album where MP played and then also heard the one with the new drummer and I must say, the newer one felt a bit lacking in the drumming department. Nightmare felt more energetic.

[DTA]

Part of me wishes, on his behalf, that A7X would have changed their plans and decided to extend his contract and keep him on.  His style fit well with them, and he seemed to really have fun playing that music and playing to those huge crowds.  But on the other hand, I see the real potential for that to have gone south after a couple of album and tour cycles just because he NEEDS to be involved in other things as well.

Not a big fan of A7X but I did hear the album where MP played and then also heard the one with the new drummer and I must say, the newer one felt a bit lacking in the drumming department. Nightmare felt more energetic.

Are you talking about Hail to the King or The Stage? Because the drumming on The Stage is awesome. I feel bad for the drummer on HTTK because the band basically told him to keep it simple on drums ala the Black Album and all's anyone talks about now is how boring his drumming is.

[gzarruk]

Seriously, looking back at the DT/MP split nine years ago, he could've started a DT-ish prog metal band with a great lineup around then (I still remember when he announced he was going to work with Russell Allen, and then... ) and pour all his effort into it, and the story now could be very different. Just look at where Haken is now after 10 years of giving it all they got and not being discouraged by not seeing inmediate success at first. And I'm sure there are better examples out there.

And I get it, though, at that time he was burnt out from the DT cycle and wanted to spread his wings doing a lot of different things instead of building a new "big" project from the ground, but IMO the biggest flaw there is that it only works for so many years. He could've started a couple side projects for the first couple years, and then focus full time on a main gig, but that main thing never came and he went all in on the "let's saturate the market with MP releases lolz" approach to the point where now, as Adami was explaining, pretty much all of his bands are side projects, both for him and for most of the other members. On top of that, many of the people he works with are shared between these different bands (Neal Morse, Billy Sheehan, the guys engineering and mixing the albums, etc) which narrows the reach of the projects even more by making them way too similar sometimes (Breath of Angels sounds just like Peaceful Harbor, Love Letter sounds similar to The Ways of the Fool, and TWOTF's instrumental section is pretty much the same as Black as the Sky, to name a few).

To be fair, A7X was his choice at first, like Bosk was saying, but it obviously didn't play out the way he expected it to be. I think the idea of joining a well stablished band and using his arranging/production skills fully in that band would be another good option for him to consider, given where Mike's professional career is at right now. The problem there, tho, would be to find a big enough band that needs a drummer and that is satisfying musically for him to stay, and there's not many bands that'd fit that criteria out there. And it's not like he could go solo and just tour with a bunch of no names either, unless they are pretty good writers too, because MP isn't exactly a songwriter by himself. He needs good songwriters like Morse, Petrucci, Rudess, etc.

[goo-goo]

Part of me wishes, on his behalf, that A7X would have changed their plans and decided to extend his contract and keep him on.  His style fit well with them, and he seemed to really have fun playing that music and playing to those huge crowds.  But on the other hand, I see the real potential for that to have gone south after a couple of album and tour cycles just because he NEEDS to be involved in other things as well.

Not a big fan of A7X but I did hear the album where MP played and then also heard the one with the new drummer and I must say, the newer one felt a bit lacking in the drumming department. Nightmare felt more energetic.

Are you talking about Hail to the King or The Stage? Because the drumming on The Stage is awesome. I feel bad for the drummer on HTTK because the band basically told him to keep it simple on drums ala the Black Album and all's anyone talks about now is how boring his drumming is.

It was HTTK. Should I check out The Stage then?

[Lethean]

Everyone has some good and interesting points here.  And again - I agree with them in terms of what I'd want as a fan.  If he'd started some awesome prog metal project (with vocals I like), I'd probably be enjoying it and more into what he's doing than I am now.  But whether or not he'd be in a better position - I really can't say.  I was just thinking about Haken in connection with this gzarruk.  But while they're doing well and they're really loved by the prog metal community - they're not playing places as big as where I've seen either The Winery Dogs or Flying Colors.  Maybe he'd have gotten to those places with his own prog band, maybe not... it's hard to say.