My frustrations with Growls, Screams, and other Harsh Vocals

[MetalManiac666]

I'm going to be the first, and most likely last, person to say the following:

Harsh vox > clean vox

[j]

Out of curiosity, can I ask what it is that you prefer about harsh vocals?  That is, what makes them "superior" to clean vox, in your view?

-J

[MetalManiac666]

Out of curiosity, can I ask what it is that you prefer about harsh vocals?  That is, what makes them "superior" to clean vox, in your view?

-J

Most people in this thread have stated that growls have to be very well done for them to appreciate them at all.  For me, that's essentially the way I view clean vocals.  Most of it just doesn't do anything for me.  And like many here find growls to be annoying at times, I find singing to be annoying at times.  For example, Neil Young's vocals completely kill his music for me.

Also, I find anger and aggression to be the emotions I get the most out of when it comes to music in general.  A large part of why I enjoy bands like Opeth so much is the "evil" sound you get from Mikael's, along with other harsh vocalists', growls.

[j]

Out of curiosity, can I ask what it is that you prefer about harsh vocals?  That is, what makes them "superior" to clean vox, in your view?

-J

Most people in this thread have stated that growls have to be very well done for them to appreciate them at all.  For me, that's essentially the way I view clean vocals.  Most of it just doesn't do anything for me.  And like many here find growls to be annoying at times, I find singing to be annoying at times.  For example, Neil Young's vocals completely kill his music for me.

Also, I find anger and aggression to be the emotions I get the most out of when it comes to music in general.  A large part of why I enjoy bands like Opeth so much is the "evil" sound you get from Mikael's, along with other harsh vocalists', growls.

Gotcha.  For the record, clean vocals can definitely suck too, and they can really bring down music at times.  But I see what you're saying.

-J

[SPNKr]

I think this has been around forever. The first times people really heard harsh vocals was in punk and hardcore punk, then thrash metal. I think there's the roots to what metalcore became like.

It was like when music was becoming more noisy, even in the 60s when simple rock music was absolute shit to people. The kids liked it though, see?

[Zook]

Thanks Marty. Now I understand.

[yeshaberto]

the reality, though, is that the fad will pass away soon enough

[SPNKr]

the reality, though, is that the fad will pass away soon enough

exactly

[AwakeFromOctavarium]

Out of curiosity, can I ask what it is that you prefer about harsh vocals?  That is, what makes them "superior" to clean vox, in your view?

-J

Most people in this thread have stated that growls have to be very well done for them to appreciate them at all.  For me, that's essentially the way I view clean vocals.  Most of it just doesn't do anything for me.  And like many here find growls to be annoying at times, I find singing to be annoying at times.  For example, Neil Young's vocals completely kill his music for me.

Also, I find anger and aggression to be the emotions I get the most out of when it comes to music in general.  A large part of why I enjoy bands like Opeth so much is the "evil" sound you get from Mikael's, along with other harsh vocalists', growls.

I agree with this post. Growls can bring down music, but so can clean vocs. As long as it's well executed, I really don't complain with growls or clean vocs.

[Zook]

Bunch of slack-jawed f*ggots around here. Harsh vocals will make you a god damned sexual Tyrannosaurus, just like me.

[King Postwhore]

Bunch of slack-jawed f*ggots around here. Harsh vocals will make you a god damned sexual Tyrannosaurus, just like me.

Only if your butt slamming your metal boyfriend.

And if you find a girl that likes to have sex to growls, RUN AWAY AS FAST AS YOU CAN.

She'll eat you alive and wear your skin.

[Ben_Jamin]

Growls are good when executed well, by that I mean when the music calls for them, not when you use them just too. It shows basically an angry emotion. Its pretty hard to make clean vocals fit the hardcore metal style most bands do nowadays, but then again I'm one who thinks those bands needs female vocals since it works well. Examples are The Agonist, Deadlock, Luna Mortis.

[SoundscapeMN]

if others understood what I like to call 4C-Syndrome I could totally relate to this with production/compression/mixing/mastering issues.

But as far extreme metal vocals, I have come to the point where if the clean vocals suck; i.e. in tone or frankly, if the singer is sounding totally cheesy buttrock to me (Scar Symmetry for example), I would much rather hear any kind of extreme vocals.

Now on the flipside, a few bands who do them like Dillinger Escape Plan and Deftones (and I'll include Exotic Animal Petting Zoo) the punk-screaming seems so upfront and eventually grates on me, I can't tolerate it.

I might add as well, a few of these immature sounding high-pitched singers like Anthony Green of Circa Survive I have the exact same issue with that others have with extreme vocals. It's like fingernails-on-a-chalkboard that anything good with the music is totally moot given how distracting/annoying/unstomach-able the vocals are. And how high in the mix/upfront they are, that they stick out too much and ruin it.

But most extreme vocals are not so high in the mix, that I tend to focus on the other parts of the music and at times, eventually the vocals start to stand out and become a better part of the band's sound.

But 1st and foremost, I take them in like a rhythm guitar part.

[Adami]

You know what? Flame me all you want, but I'm gonna say it.


No vocals > Vocals.

In fact:


No music > Music

[SoundscapeMN]

well one day I think I may give up with music and just watch movies and read books, so I'm with you Adami.

[SPNKr]

Bunch of slack-jawed f*ggots around here. Harsh vocals will make you a god damned sexual Tyrannosaurus, just like me.

Oh my FUCKING god!! I only just remembered where that's from

[faemir]

if the singer is sounding totally cheesy buttrock to me (Scar Symmetry for example), I would much rather hear any kind of extreme vocals.

Huh. Most people regard Christian very very highly, even on the internet.

[Lowdz]

Bunch of slack-jawed f*ggots around here. Harsh vocals will make you a god damned sexual Tyrannosaurus, just like me.

If ever a post and an avatar went perfectly together, this was it!

[Kyo]

It seems more and more like I have to choose between interesting new stuff with vocals I'm not crazy about or standard metal fare I've heard by a hundred bands already with vocals that are pretty tolerable.

Or you could just listen to instrumental music! 

[SoundscapeMN]

if the singer is sounding totally cheesy buttrock to me (Scar Symmetry for example), I would much rather hear any kind of extreme vocals.

Huh. Most people regard Christian very very highly, even on the internet.

well, apparently I'm not most people. He sounds like so many of those cheesy 80's metal singers, I cannot take his voice seriously, nor enjoy it or the band's music.

[Edan the Man]

if the singer is sounding totally cheesy buttrock to me (Scar Symmetry for example), I would much rather hear any kind of extreme vocals.

Huh. Most people regard Christian very very highly, even on the internet.

well, apparently I'm not most people. He sounds like so many of those cheesy 80's metal singers, I cannot take his voice seriously, nor enjoy it or the band's music.

Wait what? Not liking something is fine and dandy but.... are we listening to the same Scar Symmetry?

[Algo Fonix]

It's weird for me.  I can appreciate them, but I rarely ever enjoy harsh vocals, and I find it harder to really care about how good the lyrics are if they're growled at me (of course I guess that helps when the lyrics are really, really bad).  I love Between the Buried and Me.  I enjoy the music so much it makes me hurt in the pants, but I could definitely do with a LOT more clean vocals. 

At the same time... some music seems to fit with harsh vocals... because it's harsh music.  Maybe that's just because I've heard so much of it over the years that it seems normal, but I find it fitting sometimes.  But I still don't really like it all that much.

I like it when a man sings like he has no testicles.  That's the sign of a real man.  No balls, all voice.  Wait, what?

[Gadough]

I love harsh vocals. Done correctly and in their proper place, and especially coupled with good clean vocals, they enhance music tenfold for me. Opeth and BTBAM being perfect examples of that.

I can understand why you don't like them though. Personal preference. But, it really brings my piss to a boil when uninformed people say "it's just yelling into a microphone and it takes no talent; anyone can do it." Not liking harsh vocals is a matter of opinion. But saying they take no talent to properly execute is simply incorrect.

[sneakyblueberry]

I had a thought the other day;  To me, growled vocals are just like distorted guitar.  I bet a whole bunch of people were up in arms when the first guitarists started using fuzz/overdrive on their guitar.  Growling is just another effect. 

[King Postwhore]

I had a thought the other day;  To me, growled vocals are just like distorted guitar.  I bet a whole bunch of people were up in arms when the first guitarists started using fuzz/overdrive on their guitar.  Growling is just another effect. 

That's a good point.  I could point out that I also don't like balls to the walls distortion all the time in my music also. Used in small amounts as a tool I like it.  Used all the time, not so much.

[Adami]

I had a thought the other day;  To me, growled vocals are just like distorted guitar.  I bet a whole bunch of people were up in arms when the first guitarists started using fuzz/overdrive on their guitar.  Growling is just another effect. 

It's more thnan an effect. Distorted guitars can still hit every note a non distorted guitar can. Screamers don't hit nearly as many notes as singers.

Flange is an effect. Growling is a style.

[Ben_Jamin]

^Yup just like how Rap is a style. Growls have become overused to the point where its cool to growl

[Ħ]

I can see where people say rapping is a lot like growling.  The only difference is that while growls suck 90% of the time, rap sucks 100% of the time.

[faemir]

I'll take growling over wailing any day.

[Sigz]

I can see where people say rapping is a lot like growling.  The only difference is that while growls suck 90% of the time, rap sucks 100% of the time.

lol

[sneakyblueberry]

I had a thought the other day;  To me, growled vocals are just like distorted guitar.  I bet a whole bunch of people were up in arms when the first guitarists started using fuzz/overdrive on their guitar.  Growling is just another effect. 

It's more thnan an effect. Distorted guitars can still hit every note a non distorted guitar can. Screamers don't hit nearly as many notes as singers.

Flange is an effect. Growling is a style.

Good point.  I think my point still stands though.  Guitarists wanted distortion to give their tone a bit more grit, the same could be said for harsh vocalists. 

Only pedophiles use flange nowadays.  Its so dirty its not funny. 

[Gorille85]

I can see where people say rapping is a lot like growling.  The only difference is that while growls suck 90% of the time, rap sucks 100% of the time.

lol

[SPNKr]

I can see where people say rapping is a lot like growling.  The only difference is that while growls suck 90% of the time, rap sucks 100% of the time.

lol

[Portrucci]

I can see where people say rapping is a lot like growling.  The only difference is that while growls suck 90% of the time, rap sucks 100% of the time.

lol

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UKjj4hk0pV4

0:23 onwards

[Ħ]

I can see where people say rapping is a lot like growling.  The only difference is that while growls suck 90% of the time, rap sucks 100% of the time.

lol

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UKjj4hk0pV4

0:23 onwards

Thanks for proving my point.