Train of Thought Appreciation Thread

[Ħ]

Really?  To me, IAW is MILES ahead of SC...I don't think Learning to Live is on the same level as Constant Motion!  I love CM to death, probably would make my top 20, but still...Learning to Live, man! *shakes head in disbelief*

[bosk1]

Well, if I had to rank the songs head to head, the I&W songs in each category would mostly finish ahead of the SC songs in the same category.  But I would still rank both Learning to Live and Constant Motion, for example, as "stellar" songs even though the former is a better song than the latter.

[Seventh Son]

It was a grower for me.  I used to think the way you did about it until I realized I was wrong.  The only truly bad song on that album is Another Day.

Another Day is amazing!

My rankings I guess:

Images and Words (BIG SURPRISE HUH)
Awake
Falling Into Infinity (Nearly half of this album is in my top 20, that more than makes up for the dismal half of it)
Six Degrees of Inner Turbulence
Scenes From a Memory (I'm guessing SFAM being #5 is blasphemy?  )
When Dream and Day Unite
Black Clouds and Silver Linings
Train of Thought
Octavarium
Systematic Chaos

[Ħ]

What is WDADU doing above BCSL?

[hefdaddy42]

What is WDADU doing above BCSL?

Because he likes it better?

[Ħ]

That's probably why but I have my suspicions.

Actually I forgot that Seventh Son has a crazy song ranking.  I think Killing Hand is number 5 or something.  That would explain a lot.

[Seventh Son]

That's probably why but I have my suspicions.

Actually I forgot that Seventh Son has a crazy song ranking.  I think Killing Hand is number 5 or something.  That would explain a lot.

I like Black Clouds, but no song on it cracks my top 30 while WDADU has at least 2 songs in it (Ytse Jam is in the top 25). Half the album is in my top 50.

BC&SL just felt like a "by the numbers" album by Dream Theater. Its good, but not anything super special.

[j]

What is WDADU doing above BCSL?

Because it is objectively better?

Fixed.

SS, flip FII and SDOIT and our album rankings are identical.

-J

[Seventh Son]

What is WDADU doing above BCSL?

Because it is objectively better?

Fixed.

SS, flip FII and SDOIT and our album rankings are identical.

-J

I just love FII so much that I have to put it at #3. Three bad songs, 1 decent song and seven awesome songs including Trial of Tears, Lines in the Sand, Hollow Years, Hell's Kitchen, Peruvian Skies, New Millennium and Anna Lee! 

but lolopinions

[j]

I love it too.  I guess the way I look at it is that FII's highs are way higher than SDOIT's, but it's lows are also lower.  Either way, it's a close call.

-J

[gabeh1018]

Someone mentioned earlier how they thought this album was mixed well, personally i think it is overall their worset sounding album, sonically that is. Besides that when i first heard this in 2003 i was extremely happy with this album. I listen to every song except HTF, but either way the album has aged wel for me. Favorite on the album is itNoG.  But there is some pretty awesome unisons on this album.

[RoeDent]

ToT doesn't really attract me, tbh. At the moment, the only reason I'd buy it is to complete the Twelve Step Saga.

[Implode]

That's why I bought it. That was about 3 months ago and I didn't start liking it until now. It's not by favorite album, but it's not ignorable like before.

[wolfking]

My favourite DT album, it's amazing.

[atmyne]

yo dawg, I heard u like appreciation threads, so we made an appreciation thread appreciation thread so you can appreciate whilst you appreciate.

but seriously, as this was probably the album that got me into them, I find it interesting that it ended up being my least favorite of their albums. Still think that stream & ITNOG are awesome

[Zydar]

As a new fan in 2007 I discovered these songs through the Budokan DVD, and I really liked As I Am and This Dying Soul. But as I got their other albums I found ToT slowly dropping on my DT album ranking list. It's been on the lower half ever since (around 7-8), but I do love ITNoG still and I'm glad I got to see it live last year on PN09. I don't know, the album feels too one-dimensional to me.

[ricky]

does anyone else not like vacant?

[hefdaddy42]

does anyone else not like vacant?

Why would anyone not like Vacant?  It is atmospheric, haunting, sparse, and gorgeous.  It's the best song on the album.

[Ħ]

does anyone else not like vacant?

Me.  JLB really oversings this one.

[?]

I'd rank TOT 6th or 7th, but it's still great. There are simply so many great DT albums! In the Name of God is one of my favorite DT songs. But I have to say that TOT suffers a bit from its one-dimensional style IMO.

[TAC]

. But I have to say that TOT suffers a bit from its one-dimensional style IMO.

Yeah, I think that's the problem with ToT, at least for me. Plus, compared to Live At Budokan, where the songs really come alive, the studio versions come off as king of flat. You'd think an album with that many good songs would rank higher. It's a thing even I'm guilty of.

[AwakeFromOctavarium]

This album and SC have aged most terribly for me. I almost never listen to even ITNOG, which is obviously the best song in the album. It's like I have completely no urge to listen to this album at all. Too much wankery imo. *flameshield*

[jsem]

As I Am 

Itnog & SOC are classics.

Still TOT doesn't make it to a top 3 in my personal list. I couldn't bother making one atm... would req too much thinking

[jdprsaga]

In my opinion, in the name of god saved ToT of being the worst for me.

as a side note: I wish people uses "in my opinion" more often....

[Seventh Son]

In my opinion, in the name of god saved ToT of being the worst for me.

as a side note: I wish people uses "in my opinion" more often....

because saying "in my opinion" after every single statement is practical when its obviously assumed to be an opinion in the first place

[orcus116]

Well some people can't wrap their brain around the fact that just because someone states an opinion you disagree with it doesn't automatically mean they're pushing stuff as facts. It's a cute defense mechanism though despite being a very pointless one.

[jdprsaga]

In my opinion, in the name of god saved ToT of being the worst for me.

as a side note: I wish people uses "in my opinion" more often....

because saying "in my opinion" after every single statement is practical when its obviously assumed to be an opinion in the first place

i will not make references but you can clearly see some of the people in forums express their opinions as general facts and show not much respect in different opinions.

Then there's some people that don't need to say "in my opinion" because the way the act is an obvious reflection that they do are open and were telling their opinion in the first place .

Well lets not fight/arg. over this

[Seventh Son]

In my opinion, in the name of god saved ToT of being the worst for me.

as a side note: I wish people uses "in my opinion" more often....

because saying "in my opinion" after every single statement is practical when its obviously assumed to be an opinion in the first place

i will not make references but you can clearly see some of the people in forums express their opinions as general facts and show not much respect in different opinions.

Then there's some people that don't need to say "in my opinion" because the way the act is an obvious reflection that they do are open and were telling their opinion in the first place .

Well lets not fight/arg. over this

Where has anyone here done that? Does saying "Rush is better than Dream Theater" make it a fact? No, of course not, its an opinion. Just not everyone likes to go and say "in my opinion" after EVERY GODDAMN STATEMENT. It pisses me off when shit like this happens.

Well some people can't wrap their brain around the fact that just because someone states an opinion you disagree with it doesn't automatically mean they're pushing stuff as facts. It's a cute defense mechanism though despite being a very pointless one.

Sadly I agree.

[jdprsaga]

Where has anyone here done that? Does saying "Rush is better than Dream Theater" make it a fact? No, of course not, its an opinion. Just not everyone likes to go and say "in my opinion" after EVERY GODDAMN STATEMENT. It pisses me off when shit like this happens.

Ok, i guess we disagree in this matter, no problems tho, lets move on.

ToT have some great highlights for me.. the best one is "in the name of god" which rates top 5 in my songs list.

then..
     Honor thy father
     Endless sacrifice: from the instrumental break to the end
     some parts from this dying soul

Vacant is an amazing song but depending on my mood.

And the rest of ToT is rated in my least fav songs from DT.

Must of the time i skip every song from ToT but itnog

[Infinite Cactus]

When I first heard Train of Thought it was my second favorite album by DT. But over time, I only find myself listening to As I Am, Honor Thy Father and ITNOG if at all.

Awake
Images and Words
When Dream and Day Unite
Falling Into Infinity
Black Clouds and Silver Linings
Octavarium
Six Degrees of Inner Turbulence
Systematic Chaos
Scenes From A Memory
Train of Thought

[Occasional_Madman]

I honestly love this album to bits. This Dying Soul has one of my faveorite choruses.

[robwebster]

In my opinion, in the name of god saved ToT of being the worst for me.

as a side note: I wish people uses "in my opinion" more often....

because saying "in my opinion" after every single statement is practical when its obviously assumed to be an opinion in the first place

I think the act of deference is what people like.

For starters, nobody's doing themself a favour by speaking in absolutes. "Factiness" is a rich spectrum. Dropping the "maybes" and "to an extents" and "as far as I'm concerneds" is like buying a box of crayons, and only EVER using the red one. If you're not qualifying your opinion with opinion words, you're not saying precisely what you mean. It's a very clumsy way to communicate. Speaking in absolutes kind of means they're devalued when you actually do want to state something as a fact. And as that boundary isn't always crystal clear, I think it's only sensible to be precise at all times.

But, more importantly (or hey! less importantly, why not), people are more likely to like you. Sometimes opinions are implicit, and that's fine. If I say "The Ministry of Lost Souls is crap," it's obvious that I don't mean that as an objective fact, sure. But if I say "I'm not fond of the Ministry of Lost Souls," I'm allowing people to disagree with me. It's not hostile. It's not insulting. And it places the blame in my own court. It's not an attack on a work that someone likes, it's an opinion you've taken from said work. Not insulting, not degrading, not vicious.

'Course, sometimes you want to be vicious. But if you're being aggressive, it'd be a bit rich not to expect others to be defensive.

I don't know. I think it's fair to be nitpicky. And I don't think it's fair to dismiss the idea of saying what you mean, as opposed to saying roughly what you mean and expecting everyone else to judge the context correctly. Sometimes it's obvious. Other times it's not.

(Speaking of nitpicks, all "you"s in the above post are totally impersonal. As in "what one means." Not as in "Seventh Son, I am talking directly to you." I'm just far too colloquial for that shizzat, y'all.)

[Seventh Son]

In my opinion, in the name of god saved ToT of being the worst for me.

as a side note: I wish people uses "in my opinion" more often....

because saying "in my opinion" after every single statement is practical when its obviously assumed to be an opinion in the first place

I think the act of deference is what people like.

For starters, nobody's doing themself a favour by speaking in absolutes. "Factiness" is a rich spectrum. Dropping the "maybes" and "to an extents" and "as far as I'm concerneds" is like buying a box of crayons, and only EVER using the red one. If you're not qualifying your opinion with opinion words, you're not saying precisely what you mean. It's a very clumsy way to communicate. Speaking in absolutes kind of means they're devalued when you actually do want to state something as a fact. And as that boundary isn't always crystal clear, I think it's only sensible to be precise at all times.

But, more importantly (or hey! less importantly, why not), people are more likely to like you. Sometimes opinions are implicit, and that's fine. If I say "The Ministry of Lost Souls is crap," it's obvious that I don't mean that as an objective fact, sure. But if I say "I'm not fond of the Ministry of Lost Souls," I'm allowing people to disagree with me. It's not hostile. It's not insulting. And it places the blame in my own court. It's not an attack on a work that someone likes, it's an opinion you've taken from said work. Not insulting, not degrading, not vicious.

'Course, sometimes you want to be vicious. But if you're being aggressive, it'd be a bit rich not to expect others to be defensive.

I don't know. I think it's fair to be nitpicky. And I don't think it's fair to dismiss the idea of saying what you mean, as opposed to saying roughly what you mean and expecting everyone else to judge the context correctly. Sometimes it's obvious. Other times it's not.

(Speaking of nitpicks, all "you"s in the above post are totally impersonal. As in "what one means." Not as in "Seventh Son, I am talking directly to you." I'm just far too colloquial for that shizzat, y'all.)

Its not being hostile at all unless you happen to interpret it that way. Which in that case you interpreted what that person said incorrectly.

After a while of discussion with music, I find that just saying what I want to say is far easier than adding an "in my opinion" at the end of it every time I say it. If I think Systematic Chaos is shit, then that's just my opinion. And its pretty obvious its my opinion. Its a strong one, true. But that was the intention, because I strongly think that to be true. That's not to say you aren't allowed to have your own opinion, I just think you're wrong and I strongly disagree with you. There's still room for someone else to have a different opinion.

[orcus116]

Its not being hostile at all unless you happen to interpret it that way.

On DTF there's a 100% chance of that usually. We're all smart as hell (except Wrath) but man do we have some thin-skinned people around here.

[Seventh Son]

Its not being hostile at all unless you happen to interpret it that way.

On DTF there's a 100% chance of that usually. We're all smart as hell (except Wrath) but man do we have some thin-skinned people around here.

Eh, I just shrug most things like that off. Nearly everything I say about music causes skydivingninja to threaten to kill me but it doesn't bother me one bit. Its the internet ffs, you might as well as have some thick skin about you.