Are Christians enlightened?

[AndyDT]

Are most Christians enlightened in the sense of conscious of their being something beyond form or are they fixated, attached or identified with a concept e.g. the Bible, Jesus?

[Vivace]

Are most Christians enlightened in the sense of conscious of their being something beyond form or are they fixated, attached or identified with a concept e.g. the Bible, Jesus?

Given that the statement above places Christ in that which has form and not into the category of being something beyond form I am a bit confused as to what you really mean? Do you mean are Christian focused on that which is beyond human existance, that of The Kingdom? The answer is yes. Do you mean that Christians are focused on that which has form or material such as the Bible? I would say that there are quite a few, even non-christians, or religious who seem fixated on the Bible. Although the Bible is considered the Word of God it is right for it to be a focus of attention, but to place it above God or Christ in priority is not a proper place for it. The Bible is that which is the written Word of God, written by man, divinely inspired by God. Although there is no absolute proof in the Bible being 100% correct, Christians still hold to a faith in the Bible that it does in fact contain the authentic Word of God, despite that which those who transcribed the Bible were imperfect themselves. But to place the Bible above Christ and/or God is not correct nor do I think it should be the complete focus of attention insofar that you do not place below that which is inferior.

The term enlightened could be used but I think a better term called "blessed" is a better term. Also just because the term blessed is a better term doesn't mean that blessed is a restricted term. The idea that anyone can be enlightened can be the same as the idea that anyone can be blessed. I just blessed puts more emphasis on God, where enlightened just places the emphasis on the human being and the intellect.

[hefdaddy42]

I think he is talking about enlightenment from a Buddhist perspective.

And as far as I know, the answer for Christians is "No," as far as I understand the concept, and as far as how most Christians live and act.

[bosk1]

Yeah, the term "enlightened" is problematic and does not really jibe with Christian teaching.  I think a way of sort of answering the question in Christian terms is that Christians and those seeking Christ have access to the one source of eternal truth.  However, this does not mean that Christians are somehow "superior" in any way shape or form.  Having access to God should lead to an attitude of humility toward God and man (Jesus taught [and still teaches] his followers to be servants and not to think for a moment that they are superior to anyone).  It's a shame far too many people miss that, but I guess that's a subject for another thread.  Also, what any particular individual, whether they call themselves Christian or not, chooses to do with that knowledge is an entirely different matter.  But, again, I'm not sure I would refer to it as "enlightenment" because, at least to me, that term has connotations that simply do not apply to Christian teaching.

[Adami]

I'll go with a no.

[Seventh Son]

The only entity in all of Christianity that could count as being "enlightened" would probably be Jesus.

[rumborak]

Yeah, "enlightened" is a bad term to use. I was actually thinking of enlightened as in "Age of Enlightenment", which is something completely different.

rumborak

[Vivace]

Ah! Yes, enlightened in that sense does not really apply to the Christian religion, or even the Judaic or Muslim religion for that matter. However there were movements to bring together the Buddist tradition with Catholicism. Thomas Merton was a huge influence for that. Not sure where it is now.

[Philawallafox]

the right answer

[AndyDT]

Yeah, the term "enlightened" is problematic and does not really jibe with Christian teaching.  I think a way of sort of answering the question in Christian terms is that Christians and those seeking Christ have access to the one source of eternal truth.  However, this does not mean that Christians are somehow "superior" in any way shape or form.  Having access to God should lead to an attitude of humility toward God and man (Jesus taught [and still teaches] his followers to be servants and not to think for a moment that they are superior to anyone).  It's a shame far too many people miss that, but I guess that's a subject for another thread.  Also, what any particular individual, whether they call themselves Christian or not, chooses to do with that knowledge is an entirely different matter.  But, again, I'm not sure I would refer to it as "enlightenment" because, at least to me, that term has connotations that simply do not apply to Christian teaching.

An emanation of  universal love is not the Christian way? Or just for mankind? Or just for Jesus? Or just for Jesus' death?

[bosk1]

Again, Andy, you are using terminology that I find a bit odd in terms of describing Christianity, but here is a passage that I think addresses what you are saying:

35 Then one of them, a lawyer, asked Him a question, testing Him, and saying, 36 “Teacher, which is the great commandment in the law?”
37 Jesus said to him, “ ‘You shall love the LORD your God with all your heart, with all your soul, and with all your mind.’[d] 38 This is the first and great commandment. 39 And the second is like it: ‘You shall love your neighbor as yourself.’[e] 40 On these two commandments hang all the Law and the Prophets.”

Jesus is saying that all of the commandments really can be summed up as:  (1) love God; (2) love your fellow man.  Of course, how that plays out in a myriad of everyday situations is a lot more complex.  But to your point (as I understand it, anyway), yes, love is to pervade everything that the Christian thinks, says, and does.

[AndyDT]

Again, Andy, you are using terminology that I find a bit odd in terms of describing Christianity, but here is a passage that I think addresses what you are saying:

35 Then one of them, a lawyer, asked Him a question, testing Him, and saying, 36 “Teacher, which is the great commandment in the law?”
37 Jesus said to him, “ ‘You shall love the LORD your God with all your heart, with all your soul, and with all your mind.’[d] 38 This is the first and great commandment. 39 And the second is like it: ‘You shall love your neighbor as yourself.’[e] 40 On these two commandments hang all the Law and the Prophets.”

Jesus is saying that all of the commandments really can be summed up as:  (1) love God; (2) love your fellow man.  Of course, how that plays out in a myriad of everyday situations is a lot more complex.  But to your point (as I understand it, anyway), yes, love is to pervade everything that the Christian thinks, says, and does.

I'm continually told though that none of this is essential, all that is needed is to acknowledge Jesus as the one and only saviour. There's even a vagueness when I ask, about whether it's my own personal saviour, or whether I have to believe it's the only way to God for everybody. i.e. it's not enough to love all *or* to have your own belief in Jesus. You have to be ready to believe its the same for everybody which to me is utterly wrong-headed.