Author Topic: Official Helloween thread v. Pumpkins United  (Read 92089 times)

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Offline wolfking

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Re: Official Helloween thread v. Pumpkins United
« Reply #1085 on: September 10, 2019, 02:40:07 PM »
Heaven Tells No Lies has amazing melodies, that's why. Definitely one of the best on Gambling imo. Great lyrics too which is not something I can usually say for the band. The "I will return, you have to burn" part is heavy as hell too.

Funny, that's the one thing I don't get.  I don't think the melodies are overly great.  It's a good song but not one of my favs.  Maybe I'll try it once more.

Online TAC

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Re: Official Helloween thread v. Pumpkins United
« Reply #1086 on: September 10, 2019, 02:43:37 PM »
Made my list! :tup
would have thought the same thing but seeing the OP was TAC i immediately thought Maiden or DT related
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Online MirrorMask

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Re: Official Helloween thread v. Pumpkins United
« Reply #1087 on: September 13, 2019, 03:03:38 AM »
Just hot off the press: Forever and One live!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v5ceqdP9Hbk

So nice to see Kiske and Deris sitting together and having fun with the song!
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Re: Official Helloween thread v. Pumpkins United
« Reply #1088 on: September 13, 2019, 03:00:45 PM »
Fucking Brilliant!

Also nice to see them give Sasha the solo spot.
would have thought the same thing but seeing the OP was TAC i immediately thought Maiden or DT related
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Offline wolfking

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Re: Official Helloween thread v. Pumpkins United
« Reply #1089 on: September 13, 2019, 04:39:02 PM »
Just hot off the press: Forever and One live!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v5ceqdP9Hbk

So nice to see Kiske and Deris sitting together and having fun with the song!

That was simply a brilliant performance.  Can't wait for this DVD.

Offline wolfking

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Re: Official Helloween thread v. Pumpkins United
« Reply #1090 on: September 15, 2019, 03:52:55 AM »
7 Sinners songs moving forward;

Are You Metal?
Who is Mr Madman?
World of Fantasy
Long Live the King
You Stupid Mankind
If A Mountain Could Talk
I'm Free

Offline wolfking

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Re: Official Helloween thread v. Pumpkins United
« Reply #1091 on: September 15, 2019, 04:01:01 AM »
Straight Out of Hell songs moving on;

Nabataea
World of War
Far From the Stars
Waiting for the Thunder
Asshole
Make Fire Catch the Fly
Church Breaks Down

Offline Evermind

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Re: Official Helloween thread v. Pumpkins United
« Reply #1092 on: September 15, 2019, 04:16:52 AM »
Asshole?

I mean it's a fun song but how the hell is this one in and Burning Sun isn't? :biggrin:
This first band is Soen very cool swingy jazz fusion kinda stuff.

Offline wolfking

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Re: Official Helloween thread v. Pumpkins United
« Reply #1093 on: September 15, 2019, 04:23:58 AM »
Asshole?

I mean it's a fun song but how the hell is this one in and Burning Sun isn't? :biggrin:

I love the groove, and it's like Sasha knows my boss haha.  The lyrics sum him up perfectly and it struck a nerve as soon as I heard it.

Burning Sun is good, but I never unerstood the amount of love.  I much prefer Far From the Stars for the type of song.

Looking at Tim's list again, I think there will be a lot of different songs.  Maybe only around 10 the same in the 25.

Online MirrorMask

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Re: Official Helloween thread v. Pumpkins United
« Reply #1094 on: September 15, 2019, 04:37:45 AM »
https://www.themetalvoice.com/single-post/2019/09/14/Helloween-Michael-Weikath-On-The-New-Album-we-are-going-to-play-it-safe-nothing-unexpected

Some catching up with Michael Weikath, nothing earth shattering but the vibes are good in pumpkinland!
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Offline Polarbear

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Re: Official Helloween thread v. Pumpkins United
« Reply #1095 on: September 15, 2019, 05:14:06 AM »
Most significant piece of information from that interview, was the bit when he said that the new record will be co-produced by their house producer Charlie Bauerfeind and Dennis Ward!

I'm stoked that Dennis Ward is part of the team! That man is a beast. He played with and produced Unisonic, among other things!
« Last Edit: September 15, 2019, 05:25:59 AM by Polarbear »

Offline wolfking

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Re: Official Helloween thread v. Pumpkins United
« Reply #1096 on: September 15, 2019, 05:15:21 AM »
Dennis Ward means the sound quality should be pretty strong.

Online TAC

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Re: Official Helloween thread v. Pumpkins United
« Reply #1097 on: September 15, 2019, 08:35:17 AM »
Dennis Ward means the sound quality should be pretty strong.

Hopefully they give Charlie a placebo control board.
would have thought the same thing but seeing the OP was TAC i immediately thought Maiden or DT related
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Offline wolfking

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Re: Official Helloween thread v. Pumpkins United
« Reply #1098 on: September 15, 2019, 02:10:35 PM »
Dennis Ward means the sound quality should be pretty strong.

Hopefully they give Charlie a placebo control board.

 :lol yep, we can only hope.

Offline wolfking

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Re: Official Helloween thread v. Pumpkins United
« Reply #1099 on: September 22, 2019, 01:46:39 PM »
I haven't forgotten about the 25.  I didn't listen to MGGR but I think the only ones that that have any potential in moving on is the title track and Swing.

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Re: Official Helloween thread v. Pumpkins United
« Reply #1100 on: September 22, 2019, 03:22:46 PM »
Swing is an awesome tune.
would have thought the same thing but seeing the OP was TAC i immediately thought Maiden or DT related
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Re: Official Helloween thread v. Pumpkins United
« Reply #1101 on: September 28, 2019, 07:23:03 PM »
Trailer #2 for United Alive

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bi9SFhUEzI0

Gave me goosebumps.
would have thought the same thing but seeing the OP was TAC i immediately thought Maiden or DT related
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Offline wolfking

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Re: Official Helloween thread v. Pumpkins United
« Reply #1102 on: September 29, 2019, 04:41:29 AM »
Well, here we go, my top 25.  Last week at work was one of the worst ever and I feared this wasn't going to happen at some point.  After a quiet weekend with the misses like we normally do I sit for a couple of hours here on Sunday night winding down alone before I tackle another week, I decided to do this. 

You all laughed at the amount of songs I passed through each album and I can't blame you.  I discovered Helloween through The Dark Ride when it came out and haven't looked back.  I love the Deris era so much and listening through all the albums made me realise just how influential these albums are when I was a late teenager and then going through my 20's and into my 30's.  They fill me with so much joy and as much as I love the Keeper albums, Deris era Helloween is where it's at.

The funny thing is, the amount of songs I said moved on, I just made my 25 in 5 minutes right now.  I opened up a notepad on my desktop and listed 25 songs while looking through the album files on the computer.  I was amazed how easy it was.  Ranking the songs is loose, but near enough.  Although picking a favourite really is hard and would probably change from time to time.  But I made sure I was happy with the top 10.  No doubt a lot of these picks will surprise people, especially the top 10 I think.  My writeups will be pretty brief however.

A few special mentions before we start that just missed out;


Final Fortune (Gambling with the Devil)

Great Markus composition here, love the melodies.  I love the pre chorus too.  All over just a catchy fun song.


World of Fantasy (7 Sinners)

Pretty much the same formula as Final Fortune.  Markus follows the same formula but comes up with another ear catcher.


Never Be A Star (Rabbit Don't Come Easy)

I wanted to mention this one as it's underrated as hell.  Sure it's repetitive as fuck, but damn catchy.  Great 80's vibe especially in Weiki's solo, that's the best part easily.  Weiki may not be the most technical guitarist but he knows how to put together a simple solo when it's needed.  This one is perfect.


The Invisible Man (Keeper Legacy)

Great tune, and the thing I love most is the key changes at the end.  Crazy as hell.  Great melodies and wonderful solo from Sasha.


My Life For One More Day (Keeper Legacy)

Just a cool song.  Great groove and awesome melodies in the chorus.  Some cool riffs and great solo section.


We Burn (The Time of the Oath)

This burns.  Not much to say, it's a ripper.  Sucks it had to miss out.  Love the High Live version.


If A Mountain Could Talk (7 Sinners)

This just missed out on making the 25.  A lot going on in this one and one of Markus' more complex compositions.  Definitely has his trademark melodies in the chorus too.  The real highlight of this one is Sasha's wonderful slower solo, fuck that's awesome.

Offline wolfking

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Re: Official Helloween thread v. Pumpkins United
« Reply #1103 on: September 29, 2019, 04:53:07 AM »
Album countdown part 1;

10 My God Given Right

This isn't as bad as I've been making out, but when you put it against the rest, it kind of is.  I actually didn't mind it when it came out, but then I stopped lying to myself and admitted it wasn't Helloween at their best.  The bonus tracks are just horrid and if you cut them off, it makes it look better.  The title track and Swing are good songs.  I laughed so hard when I heard If God Loves Rock and Roll for the first time.  Markus should sue Andi for that one.

9. The Time of the Oath

8. Master of the Rings

I find it hard to split these two.  I think if you take the best songs from both, you have a wonderful album.  The production on Oath lets it down I think just a tad more.  It's funny, I find Master more consistent on a whole but some tracks on Oath are stronger on their own, plus there are more Oath songs in my list than Master.  Both great albums to kick start the band back into gear though and revive the band.  Would love to hear a remix of both.

7. Straight Out of Hell

This is a GREAT album.  It's not quite top tier Helloween like the rest, but it's pretty damn close.  Lot's of variety here which is good and bad.  I think it dips a bit in the middle but a lot of the tunes are very strong in their own right.

Online TAC

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Re: Official Helloween thread v. Pumpkins United
« Reply #1104 on: September 29, 2019, 05:49:33 AM »
Kade, we're heading out first thing this morning. I'll chew on this tonight!
would have thought the same thing but seeing the OP was TAC i immediately thought Maiden or DT related
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Offline wolfking

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Re: Official Helloween thread v. Pumpkins United
« Reply #1105 on: September 29, 2019, 02:42:56 PM »
Kade, we're heading out first thing this morning. I'll chew on this tonight!

No probs.  This list is VERY different to yours mate.  I'll try and do an update every day.

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Re: Official Helloween thread v. Pumpkins United
« Reply #1106 on: September 29, 2019, 02:44:14 PM »
Well, other than The Time Of The Oath, we got the same bottom 3 albums.
would have thought the same thing but seeing the OP was TAC i immediately thought Maiden or DT related
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Re: Official Helloween thread v. Pumpkins United
« Reply #1107 on: September 29, 2019, 07:03:02 PM »
Ordered the United Alive bluray from Nuclear Blast.  Can't wait until it shows up!  I've been jamming to a ton of Gamma Ray and Kai Hansen's solo disc lately, and TAC's comments on the Deris-era Helloween got my curious about some of those discs.

I have the Treasure Chest compilation, with some remastered, remixed tracks.  It seems to have the early Deris-era hits through The Dark Ride.  So I have checked out 7 Sinners and Gambling with the Devil based on TAC's assessment of those being the heaviest.  I've been loving both records.  Also The Dark Ride, simply because I love the heavier, darker feel of those songs, and Keeper/Legacy, since I've heard a few of those songs in the past before.

I'm working on a few of the live albums now as well - High Live, Keeper Legacy Tour.  This is great stuff, and I do enjoy him as a singer, even though I was very much only into the Kiske era songs for a long time.

Thanks to all for the recommendations and discussion of these albums!   :metal

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Re: Official Helloween thread v. Pumpkins United
« Reply #1108 on: September 29, 2019, 07:06:28 PM »
 :metal

That's why we're here!



The thing is Deris just finally clicked with me. I really struggled for the longest time. He really is fantastic. But what I love about him is that he is fearless vocally.
would have thought the same thing but seeing the OP was TAC i immediately thought Maiden or DT related
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Offline v_clortho

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Re: Official Helloween thread v. Pumpkins United
« Reply #1109 on: September 29, 2019, 09:01:56 PM »
I'd have Time of the Oath at number 1. That might include the Kiske albums as well.

Offline wolfking

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Re: Official Helloween thread v. Pumpkins United
« Reply #1110 on: September 29, 2019, 10:18:02 PM »
I'd have Time of the Oath at number 1. That might include the Kiske albums as well.

Wow.  just shows the strength of the band.

Offline wolfking

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Re: Official Helloween thread v. Pumpkins United
« Reply #1111 on: September 29, 2019, 10:18:18 PM »
Ordered the United Alive bluray from Nuclear Blast.  Can't wait until it shows up!  I've been jamming to a ton of Gamma Ray and Kai Hansen's solo disc lately, and TAC's comments on the Deris-era Helloween got my curious about some of those discs.

I have the Treasure Chest compilation, with some remastered, remixed tracks.  It seems to have the early Deris-era hits through The Dark Ride.  So I have checked out 7 Sinners and Gambling with the Devil based on TAC's assessment of those being the heaviest.  I've been loving both records.  Also The Dark Ride, simply because I love the heavier, darker feel of those songs, and Keeper/Legacy, since I've heard a few of those songs in the past before.

I'm working on a few of the live albums now as well - High Live, Keeper Legacy Tour.  This is great stuff, and I do enjoy him as a singer, even though I was very much only into the Kiske era songs for a long time.

Thanks to all for the recommendations and discussion of these albums!   :metal

 :metal

Offline wolfking

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Re: Official Helloween thread v. Pumpkins United
« Reply #1112 on: October 01, 2019, 05:44:18 AM »
Here we go......


25. Paint a New World (Gambling with the Devil)

This one was always a fav right away when I heard the album.  Ripper of a song.  Feels a bit different for the band too.  Love the guitars in the intro and the general speed of the song for the darker tone throughout is excellent.  The pre chorus is very very good and it's nice and tight with the intro lending the backing for the chorus.  Pretty standard solo section but how the darker diminished tones then lead into the intro again is glorious.  Just doesn't let up, great tune.


24. The Time of the Oath (The Time of the Oath)

This has Roland's name written all over it and I like how it's the closer to the album.  I always kind of preferred the High Live version though.  The production of the album hurts the song, but the tune is dark and strong enough to be here.  Love Roland's playing and I especially like how between the first chorus and second verse you have a tasty  solo yet the main solo section is all harmonized.  I like that.  I find the solo after the first chorus interesting too.  It sounds like Roland is playing some phrygian or phrygian dominant or something but it's all straight minor with one flattened 5th in there.  Interesting sound for the note selections.  Shows Roland's tasty phrasing as a guitarist.


23. Pleasure Drone (Keeper Legacy)

I think this will surpsrise most.  This is pretty basic Helloween, but I always loved this song.  Nice groove, Andi sounds great and just a bloody wondeful chorus, really really good.  It's the star here.  I really like the half time breakdown going into the solo.  A great dual solo from Sasha and Michael too.  You know what I love, Sasha plays a similar 3 note melody (F, F#, Eb) first appearing at 2:26, then at 2:32.  His run after that uses variations running down the scale giving off the feel of those 3 notes which is clever.  His solo is very complete and ties together well, BUT when Michael comes in and repeats that melody at 2:53, that sends me over the edge.  The harmony afterwards even has that feel too.  One underrated, brilliantly put together solo section.  Killer chorus again to finish it off.


22. Long Live the King (7 Sinners)

This one snuck up on my a bit more than it use to once I replayed through all the albums.  Shit this mother fucker rips.  Dani owning the drums there.  The fast Iced Earth style galloping filtered throughout especially in the prechorus is monstrous.  The chorus is all sorts of brutal too.  What I like is the speed of the chorus, yet Andi just sings 'long live the king.'  Amazing contrast with the music.  The middle 8 section is pretty expected but the riffing keeps it going.  Great climax up with the key changes too in the little solo.  There's not much there in the way of solos but it doesn't need it.  Ripper tune.


21. Before the War (The Time of the Oath)

This is one I probably like more due to High Live also, but even on the album, it's a favourite.  Manic intro and wastes no time.  Great contrast to the verse and the pre chorus then going into the very melodic chorus.  The way the melodies in the chorus resolve is wonderful.  The solo section is a ripper.  It's interseting the song is in Dminor, then the staccato section which seems like it's in an F# phrygian with chromatics then into the awesome open string harmony section in B.  Roland plays in A minor only for Weiki to move to E minor with some nice harmonic minor flavours in there.  The crazy key changes and frantic pace is the reason I really like this one and is very underrated.



Album number 6....

6. Gambling with the Devil

I really like this one, but I like the others more.  I didn't get the hype as much as others did, and a few tracks which I enjoy I never understood the amount of love.  It's a top album and the bonus tracks are better than quite a few album tracks.
« Last Edit: October 01, 2019, 03:38:34 PM by wolfking »

Online TAC

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Re: Official Helloween thread v. Pumpkins United
« Reply #1113 on: October 01, 2019, 03:44:08 PM »
All great songs Kade. Paint A New World is so comforting to listen to. Not sure how to explain that.. :lol but it is just so damn easy on the ears.


I think Pleasure Drone is real solid. Proves what a strong album that is with a rank n file track like that.
would have thought the same thing but seeing the OP was TAC i immediately thought Maiden or DT related
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Offline wolfking

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Re: Official Helloween thread v. Pumpkins United
« Reply #1114 on: October 01, 2019, 04:19:48 PM »
All great songs Kade. Paint A New World is so comforting to listen to. Not sure how to explain that.. :lol but it is just so damn easy on the ears.


I think Pleasure Drone is real solid. Proves what a strong album that is with a rank n file track like that.

Agree.

I think the differences between a lot of songs on my list and yours will really highlight the strength of these albums.

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Re: Official Helloween thread v. Pumpkins United
« Reply #1115 on: October 03, 2019, 07:04:04 PM »
I'm kind of confused on the formats of United Alive. I'm buying from Amazon, but they don't really have good descriptions. According to Nuclear Blast, the CD and BR versions are different.  I was hoping they'd come together.
would have thought the same thing but seeing the OP was TAC i immediately thought Maiden or DT related
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Offline wolfking

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Re: Official Helloween thread v. Pumpkins United
« Reply #1116 on: October 04, 2019, 12:41:57 AM »
I'm kind of confused on the formats of United Alive. I'm buying from Amazon, but they don't really have good descriptions. According to Nuclear Blast, the CD and BR versions are different.  I was hoping they'd come together.

I saw on my local store a big hardcover book thing with Blu Ray and DVD plus CD.  I hope there's just a DVD/CD version.

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Re: Official Helloween thread v. Pumpkins United
« Reply #1117 on: October 04, 2019, 08:07:14 AM »
I ordered the 2 Blu Ray set direct from Nuclear Blast, since I switched to digital only on just music a few years ago.  Nuclear Blast has a 3 cd set and a separate 2 blu ray set. 

I haven't seen any versions with DVD's and didn't trust anything on Amazon, since they weren't clear about what each format had.

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Re: Official Helloween thread v. Pumpkins United
« Reply #1118 on: October 05, 2019, 07:05:15 PM »
Link to Helloween's Rock In Rio performance.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TvB5W0LnZfY
would have thought the same thing but seeing the OP was TAC i immediately thought Maiden or DT related
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Offline wolfking

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Re: Official Helloween thread v. Pumpkins United
« Reply #1119 on: October 07, 2019, 04:37:46 AM »
Seems like the wrong time to update the 25 with the new live album approaching, but I doubt I'll be able to get my hands on that for a bit so fuck it;

20. I Live For Your Pain (The Dark Ride)

Another one that probably most wouldn't regard as top 25 material, but this one always jumped out to me when I first got into Helloween and this album.  It's so damn catchy and easy to get into.  The thing that interests me the most is the low Soilwork style B open tuning.  I haven't studied every Helloween song, but I'm not sure how many are in this tuning if any, but damn I love the heaviness of it.  It's weird as it's in E minor and gives the sound of an E minor type classic metal tune but with the low heaviness, very cool.  Love the bass and just love everyhting about it.  It has an 80's Lizzy Borden type of feel to it, and a bit different from the band.  A shame it never got any recognition from the band.  It would be a great live tune.


19. Listen to the Flies (Rabbit Don't Come Easy)

Probably the one track on the album most would lean towards in the favourites department.  The killer hook is Andi in the chorus, so simple but so damn good.  Great speed and I love Mark Cross' drumming here, really solid.  I really like the harmonic minor tones scattered around the song too, and another noticeable part is Sascha's simple Malmsteen style 3 note appregios over the 3 strings.  It's really quite simple but nicely executed.  I like the first part of the solo section better than the freestyle shred of the second half.  Killer tune.


18. Make Fire Catch the Fly (Straight Out of Hell)

I put these two together because it's hard to split them, and since I think they are pretty much go together, I ranked them together.  I think this one has edged Listen to Flies just a bit.  I think the chorus is a bit stronger.  The 'til I die' line from Andi in the chorus is amazing.  Really enjoy the guitar melodies in the solo too.  Great key changes during the solos too and builds tension back into the chorus making it sound stronger again IMO.  A real underrated Helloween gem hidden away towards the end of the album.


17. The Departed (Sun is Going Down) (The Dark Ride)

Uli Kusch is an incredible drummer and just as good a songwriter.  This is again different for teh band with an almost industrial feel.  Such a simple single note riff an octave apart really drives the song.  Andi sounds great as usual but really suits this darker style and the tone and timbre in his voice here really feels comfortable for him.  I like the lyrics and with the lyrics and music gives great atmosphere and imagery.  I LOVE the very short solo, fuck that's awesome, probably my fav part.  I always thought it was Roland but it has more Weiki's tone I think.  How it repeats at the end of the song is just glorious.  Andi's vocals melodies at the end too are brilliant.  Another song that doesn't get much attention from the band but probably because it's an Uli song.


16. Hell Was Made in Heaven (Rabbit Don't Come Easy)

This is the bands go to song from this album and it's pretty clear why.  Although Markus' getting an album trackthat is the lead song performed by the band seems rare, especially when Markus seems to be the go to b-side man.  Anyway, that's irrelevant.  It's impossible to dislike this song right?  I like the contrast between the verse and prechous and then again exploding into the amazing chorus.  Helloween 101 in this chorus and as good as anything they've ever done.  The pre solo riff is generic as fuck but the extended solo section is most welcome, especially with all the wonderful harmonies in there which reminds me of old school Keeper style.  The lryics are lovely also.



Album number 5....

5. 7 Sinners

I enjoy the direction the band took on this one.  It does surprise me that Weiki inparticular made the point when the album was coming out how they went heavier and detuned their guitars etc. etc.  We all know Weiki fired Uli and Roland as he felt they were taking the band in a heavier direction and that decision always felt weird with this album and of course with other songs even on Rabbit and Gambling that were quite on the heavy side.  Nevertheless, I've always liked this one, but the thing that let's it down is the production.  It sounds muddy and weak.  The finished product would have been so much better with some clearer production.  Even if it had the production of Rabbit it would have sounded so much more powerful.  Song wise, there's not much to complain about here, the band are on point here. Again, it's number 5 as the other albums are better but with good production it probably would be higher.