The Haken thread v. Restoration

[Nick]

If you listen to my interview with Ross (https://www.wpapu.com/int012.html), I actually make a comparison between CK and SB.

[snapple]

Awesome album

[ich bin besser]

Live on Thursday. Can't wait to see them again! 

[TimmyHiggy]

I've got my ticket to see them in London on the 24th, really can't wait. They were so awesome last time I saw them!

[Crow]

Just got this, listening for the first time.
The transition from The Path to Atlas Stone is just perfect, I'm already loving this. Maybe more comments as I go edited into this post xD

[mike099]

The songs really grow on multiple listens.  There is so much variety and some beautiful vocals. I also love the other 2 cd's.  Especially fond of  Drowning in the flood and Eternal Rain from the first cd.  I like the point of no return, but the circus music ruins the song for me.

[me7]

The songs really grow on multiple listens.  There is so much variety and some beautiful vocals. I also love the other 2 cd's.  Especially fond of  Drowning in the flood and Eternal Rain from the first cd.  I like the point of no return, but the circus music ruins the song for me.

              for disliking the quirky music
         for calling it circus (the word is appropriate for "Aquarium" though)
  for misspelling the song's name

EDIT: wait a minute, did you edit your typo or did I imagine you misspelling the title as "Point of know Return"

[Implode]

Everything Mike said was valid.

[Heretic]

especially the beautiful vocals part <3

[Mosh]

The songs really grow on multiple listens.  There is so much variety and some beautiful vocals. I also love the other 2 cd's.  Especially fond of  Drowning in the flood and Eternal Rain from the first cd.  I like the point of no return, but the circus music ruins the song for me.

              for disliking the quirky music
         for calling it circus (the word is appropriate for "Aquarium" though)
  for misspelling the song's name

EDIT: wait a minute, did you edit your typo or did I imagine you misspelling the title as "Point of know Return"

 

[ariich]

I've got my ticket to see them in London on the 24th, really can't wait. They were so awesome last time I saw them!

YAY! See you there.

[mike099]

The songs really grow on multiple listens.  There is so much variety and some beautiful vocals. I also love the other 2 cd's.  Especially fond of  Drowning in the flood and Eternal Rain from the first cd.  I like the point of no return, but the circus music ruins the song for me.

              for disliking the quirky music
         for calling it circus (the word is appropriate for "Aquarium" though)
  for misspelling the song's name

EDIT: wait a minute, did you edit your typo or did I imagine you misspelling the title as "Point of know Return"

Just for the record, I did not intend to refer to Haken music as quirky.  The circus comment was a joke  and yes, I did misspell the song title, caught it and fixed.

The Mountain truly gets better each time I listen.

[mike099]

I was on the Haken site yesterday and found it interesting that Mike Portney called 'The Mountain' the best progressive album of 2013.  I know most folks do not like to talk about grammy nominations, but if 'The Mountain' is nominated, would the category be Alternative Music - Alternative Album? 

The Rock field is Rock Performance, Metal Performance(Hard Rock and Metal combined for 2014 Grammy), Rock Song and Rock Album.
I see DT as a possibilty for the Rock field, but not Haken, even though parts of The Mountain rock.

Thanks to this site for introducing me to this band.   If they come to Atlanta, I may make that 3 hour trip.  They probably will not come to Nashville(smaller market), even though we have some excellent 1,500-5,000 seat venues.

[me7]

...and it doesn't and with Mike Portnoy, Jordan Rudess also named TM as his favourite album of the year so far in this interview: https://www.dreamtheater.co.il/2013/09/28/jordan-answers/
These young lads are going places, I tell'ya

[Nick]

There is a 0.00% chance Haken will even be nominated for a Grammy. I love them, but they have zero mainstream exposure.

[Zook]

Tried listening to The Mountain. Made it past Cockroach King (that was tough) and then the next song, but gave up afterwards... Haken is officially not for me.

[Orthogonal]

What is it about them you don't like? There are a number of folks on DT that don't like Haken that I find a little surprising.

[Mosh]

Different strokes..

I for one love The Mountain. Maybe it even beats the first two. This band is amazing.

[jammindude]

Absolutely HOOKED on Cockroach King.  Can't wait til my copy arrives in the mail.   Just ticked that it's gonna take so long.  I ordered from an Amazon seller in the UK (because Amazon was out) in the last week of September....and it's going to take 4 weeks to get here.

***SIGH***

[Zook]

What is it about them you don't like? There are a number of folks on DT that don't like Haken that I find a little surprising.

First of all, I think Celestial Elixir is a masterpiece. It took a while to appreciated the circus parts (even listening to an edited version I made for a while) but they don't bother me anymore. I also think Streams is good, minus the growls. Tried listening to Visions. Actually I listened to the whole thing at work a long time ago. Don't remember a thing. The problem with Haken, my problem with Haken is that the vocal melodies or lack there of don't do it for me. Listening to The Mountain, it started out ok, but then Cockroach King starts and it's... what the hell? Some of you may know my dislike of Mike Patton. I think the dude is an overrated try hard. His goofy wackiness isn't entertaining, just annoying, as is CK. That intro, fuck. There were actually a few parts of the song that did sound good, but couldn't save it. The next song was kind of just there, and I gave up afterwards.

Haken sounds to me like prog by the numbers, with heavy influence from the 70s. It's boring. There are little to no good catchy vocal melodies either. I'm happy for these guys getting some attention. They are super talented, but their music just doesn't appeal to me. I just don't get it. Prog album of the year it is not, Mr. Portnoy.

[MrBoom_shack-a-lack]

I find it funny that people that dislike Haken often have the reason that it's to wacky or weird. To me those parts are refreshing in a time where prog should sound like a streamlined copy of just about everything else. If you find a section too wacky for you, I would argue that being a good thing because that was most likely their intention.

[Bolsters]

I find it funny that people that dislike Haken often have the reason that it's to wacky or weird. To me those parts are refreshing in a time where prog should sound like a streamlined copy of just about everything else. If you find a section too wacky for you, I would argue that being a good thing because that was most likely their intention.

I get your point, even agree with it, but you generally don't really want too much of a good thing, either. I sprinkle salt on my food, I don't pour it on. The wackyness in Haken's music, like salt, can be too much for some people or just enough for others. And let's face it, Haken's wackyness is some pretty strong salt. Even I wasn't a fan of this band at all before The Mountain, mostly for this reason.

[MrBoom_shack-a-lack]

I find it funny that people that dislike Haken often have the reason that it's to wacky or weird. To me those parts are refreshing in a time where prog should sound like a streamlined copy of just about everything else. If you find a section too wacky for you, I would argue that being a good thing because that was most likely their intention.

I get your point, even agree with it, but you generally don't really want too much of a good thing, either. I sprinkle salt on my food, I don't pour it on. The wackyness in Haken's music, like salt, can be too much for some people or just enough for others. And let's face it, Haken's wackyness is some pretty strong salt. Even I wasn't a fan of this band at all before The Mountain, mostly for this reason.

Well I don't see their wacky parts as "salt" or "topping", to me those parts are a part of their music and what makes them interesting to me. So they can have as much "wackiness" as they want imo.

[ariich]

Completely agree with you Boom, but then that sort of music won't be for everyone.

However, I really don't think Haken are that wacky. For someone who listens predominantly to very straightforward music, then yeah that would make sense, but for a prog band they're really not that quirky.

[Zook]

It isn't even really the wackiness. The melodies just aren't there. Even if CK wasn't on the album, it still isn't very interesting.

[me7]

I think you contradict yourself when you say that they are just "prog by the numbers" and then suggest that cutting CK from the album would improve it. CK is the most distant song from "prog by the numbers" I've heard this year.

[mike099]

There is a 0.00% chance Haken will even be nominated for a Grammy. I love them, but they have zero mainstream exposure.

Yes, ashamed there is not a progressive category.  I looked at the bands that made up the alternative categories from past years and they would not fit and I agree you have to have some mainsteam exposure to get nominated.  Taken as a whole, The Mountain is great.  The only song I cannot get into is the last song on the cd(Somebody).

[ElliottTamer]

I get your point, even agree with it, but you generally don't really want too much of a good thing, either. I sprinkle salt on my food, I don't pour it on. The wackyness in Haken's music, like salt, can be too much for some people or just enough for others. And let's face it, Haken's wackyness is some pretty strong salt. Even I wasn't a fan of this band at all before The Mountain, mostly for this reason.

I have to say that at first the wacky parts did not go down too well with me, but after listening to it quite a lot it no longer sounds weird...
My suggestion for those who don't like Haken is to give them a few more tries. Today, or a month, or a year from now. When I first listened to Aquarius I was thoroughly unimpressed. When I listened to it the second time a year later I started liking it and with the third listen I became a bit obsessed. Surprisingly, pretty much the same happened with Visions: first listen, meh. After several listens: AMAZING! I have to admit this almost did not happen to me on The Mountain (though Falling Back to Earth and In Memoriam did take some listens to really click)
But hey, not everybody has to like them, though it sure would be nice if they did...

Anyway, yesterday I got to see them live for the first time in Das Rind, Rüsselsheim! I'm probably heavily biased, but it was seriously awesome. The band has a lot of chemistry and they all really look like they're having fun. Ross does all kind of crazy things while not singing and I was completely impressed by how great his singing was! It sounded just the same as in the albums with just a few cool variations added in for flavor! Raymond is absolutely insane on the drums, I seriously thought he was going to have a heart attack or something... It was also really cool that almost all of them helped with the vocal harmonies at one point or another (Oh, and unless I got it wrong it looked as if Diego was singing even when he was not on the microphone XD). It was also quite impressive to see Richard, Charlie and Tom playing: I knew their songs were complex, but I'm not enough of a musician to really know how hard it is until I see someone playing it live... There quite a few jokes (with puppets!) and a few "Goodbye, Tom" moments as well. After the show the band left the stage and mingled with the crowd, signing albums, LPs, taking picture, and generally being friendly and nice.

For those interested, here's the set-list as I remember it:

1. The Path Unbeaten (it was their coming-onto-the-stage song)
2. Atlas Stone
3. Eternal Rain
4. Shapeshifter
5. In Memoriam
6. Cockroach King
7. Drowning in the Flood
8. Diego's Keyboard Solo
9. As Death Embraces
10. Tom's Bass Solo
11. Pareidolia
12. Somebody

Encore: Visions (!!!)

I was a bit disappointed they didn't play Because It's There, but then again to really satisfy me they would have had to play all of their three albums...

[Heretic]

LOL at thinking the vocal melodies on this album aren't interesting. They are absolutely amazing. The chorus of Cockroach King, TEARING DOWN THE WALLS OF ETERNITYYY, Because It's There in its entirety... everything vocal-wise is above par. I have no idea how anyone could think the vocal melodies aren't good. Yeah, sure, the music might not be your type, but criticizing the vocal melodies on this album just aggravates me.

[mike099]

I get your point, even agree with it, but you generally don't really want too much of a good thing, either. I sprinkle salt on my food, I don't pour it on. The wackyness in Haken's music, like salt, can be too much for some people or just enough for others. And let's face it, Haken's wackyness is some pretty strong salt. Even I wasn't a fan of this band at all before The Mountain, mostly for this reason.

I have to say that at first the wacky parts did not go down too well with me, but after listening to it quite a lot it no longer sounds weird...
My suggestion for those who don't like Haken is to give them a few more tries. Today, or a month, or a year from now. When I first listened to Aquarius I was thoroughly unimpressed. When I listened to it the second time a year later I started liking it and with the third listen I became a bit obsessed. Surprisingly, pretty much the same happened with Visions: first listen, meh. After several listens: AMAZING! I have to admit this almost did not happen to me on The Mountain (though Falling Back to Earth and In Memoriam did take some listens to really click)
But hey, not everybody has to like them, though it sure would be nice if they did...

Anyway, yesterday I got to see them live for the first time in Das Rind, Rüsselsheim! I'm probably heavily biased, but it was seriously awesome. The band has a lot of chemistry and they all really look like they're having fun. Ross does all kind of crazy things while not singing and I was completely impressed by how great his singing was! It sounded just the same as in the albums with just a few cool variations added in for flavor! Raymond is absolutely insane on the drums, I seriously thought he was going to have a heart attack or something... It was also really cool that almost all of them helped with the vocal harmonies at one point or another (Oh, and unless I got it wrong it looked as if Diego was singing even when he was not on the microphone XD). It was also quite impressive to see Richard, Charlie and Tom playing: I knew their songs were complex, but I'm not enough of a musician to really know how hard it is until I see someone playing it live... There quite a few jokes (with puppets!) and a few "Goodbye, Tom" moments as well. After the show the band left the stage and mingled with the crowd, signing albums, LPs, taking picture, and generally being friendly and nice.

For those interested, here's the set-list as I remember it:

1. The Path Unbeaten (it was their coming-onto-the-stage song)
2. Atlas Stone
3. Eternal Rain
4. Shapeshifter
5. In Memoriam
6. Cockroach King
7. Drowning in the Flood
8. Diego's Keyboard Solo
9. As Death Embraces
10. Tom's Bass Solo
11. Pareidolia
12. Somebody

Encore: Visions (!!!)

I was a bit disappointed they didn't play Because It's There, but then again to really satisfy me they would have had to play all of their three albums...

Because It's There is a great song.  Hope they come to the US.  I may get to see them if I am willing to travel.

[me7]

Tom's departure note cited a "busy 2014 touring schedule" as one reason for his leaving. Chances are that InsideOut wants to send them to the US as well.

[Nick]

As a support act it *could* *maybe* happen, but even that could very well be a stretch.

[Zook]

LOL at thinking the vocal melodies on this album aren't interesting. They are absolutely amazing. The chorus of Cockroach King, TEARING DOWN THE WALLS OF ETERNITYYY, Because It's There in its entirety... everything vocal-wise is above par. I have no idea how anyone could think the vocal melodies aren't good. Yeah, sure, the music might not be your type, but criticizing the vocal melodies on this album just aggravates me.

LOL at you getting worked up over my opinion. Seriously, . I'm not in here bashing the band, I just gave my reasons for not liking them in a constructive manner. You probably don't like the new Dream Theater, I think it's great. Tastes, shmastes.

[Nel]

The wackiness only bugs me if it's interrupting something beautiful or awesome. Cockroach King is awesome because the whole song is pretty out there; it lets you know what you're getting into the second it starts. Besides, The Mountain doesn't really have any of that song-interrupting weirdness, or at least, nothing that sticks out as much as it did on the other two.

[me7]

The wackiness only bugs me if it's interrupting something beautiful or awesome. Cockroach King is awesome because the whole song is pretty out there; it lets you know what you're getting into the second it starts. Besides, The Mountain doesn't really have any of that song-interrupting weirdness, or at least, nothing that sticks out as much as it did on the other two.

I get what you mean about Aquarius (although it doesn't harm the album for me), but Visions? Visions as an album isn't quirky at all since they put all the weird stuff in the title track only, I think it's Haken's least quirky album.