Cheers for the reply man!
Hey, welcome! Good to hear someone else's opinon on the matter, but there are a few points I'd like to address;
We need to be very careful with thinking we know the right answer here without even taking Canon Law and Christ's words into account for this all. Water is a requirement for Baptism per Canon Law and the Rite of Baptism. It can be performed by anyone, even an Atheist just so as long as the water is natural (not mineral water )
Eh??? Sorry, I don't agree with this at all. You're saying a person who has no belief in God can baptise someone in his name? How is that even possible? And as long as the water contains no minerals? Thats crazy, as I would imagine most of the water the apostles would've baptised in were teeming with them ( @ teeming), being natural water sources. I won't comment on the whole thing about Canon Law, or Catholicism for that matter; thats a can of worms for another thread.
Sorry, natural water as in "real" water. Not something like club soda or gatorade. [] Remember the Rite of Baptism is above human power. We simply perform the rite. It God who baptises. A sacrament is a rite that can only be fulfill with God. The sacramentals of the rite are for human purposes only but have a significant meaning. This is why anyone can baptise one who "truly" wishes to be baptised. It is not the human that makes this sacrament possible, it is God.
Ahh right, got you on the water thing
I don't agree with you about the whole 'anyone can perform a baptism' though; I don't see a scriptural basis for that. I know that Jesus said to his
disciples to go and baptise in His name, I don't know where this idea that anyone can baptise came from, but if you could show me a source or better yet a scripture that'd be good to see
To me it just seems silly that someone who outright denies the existence of God could baptise someone in His name.
Why would we believe that anyone not actively seeking something is going to find this object? There is a penny on such and such street. The odds of you finding this penny when you are not actively looking for it it is next to impossible. But if you are looking for it, you will end up finding it as you begin to inquire more and more into where this penny is. Knowing this, why do people expect to find salvation when they are not actively looking for it? And also, why should God refuse salvation to someone who may never know what baptism is but is still actively seeking Him. That put's the cart before the horse.
Let me just say that my stance on this whole topic is a bit further up in this thread; basically I'm not too sure on whether or not it is required but I believe that God is beyond any ritual or rite that we believe in, taking the example of Saul and Annanias (baptism), and the thief on the cross (no baptism, yet still saved). My questions are just so I can understand where you're coming from, not in any way an attack on what you believe, friend
Anyway, I agree with your notion that God is sovereign, but I don't think you've really addressed my question, which is really based on the topic of this thread; What I'm reading from this quote in a nutshell is: "Baptism is required for salvation, but, when it comes down to it, it isn't because God makes the final judgement". Am I reading that right? Again, just wanting to clarify your stance
But also remember children back in the good old days of Christianity were not baptised until they were around 7 or 8 and they were baptised, had communion and confirmation all at the same time.
Again, I'm not sure about this as the whole communion at a certain time and confirmation thing are Catholic rituals that I have no in depth knowledge of. Do have some sort of source for the above quote?
I do not but it's common historical knowledge. I would assume wikipedia should provide one for you. I may be wrong about the age but I'm 100% sure I'm right about all three happening at once in history.
Ahh, I see the problem; I'm seeing baptism from a 'believer's baptism' (
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Believer%27s_baptism) perspective, and you from a Catholic perspective. Confirmation and communion rites are foreign to me, and there's no problem in that. Thanks for sharing, Vivace.