9/11 Nine Years Later / my thoughts...

[Tick]

 As we approach the 10 year mark since the attacks, this is what I think.
Nine years ago when the 9/11 attacks took place America was in a state of shock. We all came together as one for 15 minutes. Stood in a circle, held hands, and shared a coke.
Here we are nine years down the road and what has been the result of the terrorist attacks? The extremists I believe did above and beyond what they may have thought they did on that fateful day.
They united a country for a short period of time, but divided one for the long haul.
As a result I see more fear, hatred, prejudice, ignorance, and division then ever before.
On a day of remembrance in NYC today, it should be a time of reflection and peace. Instead it will have the potential for violence and unrest. Its exactly what the extremists would have hoped would be the case. They must love what they are seeing. They don't even need to attack us today as a reminder of that day. We will probably do the damage ourselves.
By protesting mosques, talking of burning Korans, we rise a level of hate that must make the extremists salivate.
Its like the episode of the twilight zone when the aliens wreak havoc then watch from above as we destroy ourselves.
Hell, they are probably watching Fox news today with hot Lamb kebabs, falafel, and pita bread chips, laughing there asses off like its a Superbowl party.
In a country built on the principles of freedom we see it challenged at all turns, from the people wanting to tell others what they can and can not do to our president telling us whats best for us, and leaving us little choice in the matter.
I feel a double sadness today. One for the memory of that horrible event nine years ago, and one for the horrible result of it being exhibited more and more, each and every day.

[Adami]

Very good post. I also heard rumors that 9/11 changed everything.

[El Barto]

Good post, most of which I agree with.  Sadly, it was fairly predictable.  I remember telling people the first week that the terrorists already won, and it really pissed people off.  Unfortunately, with the leadership of the time and the political climate they fostered, it was inevitable.  The desired goals of the administration played right into their hands, and their best means of accomplishing them was the polarization of the people.  Combined with extraordinary arrogance which blinded them to the bigger picture,  America did far more damage to itself than the terrorists could ever have imagined. 

[73109]

Hell, they are probably watching Fox news today with hot Lamb kebabs, falafel, and pita bread chips, laughing there asses off like its a Superbowl party.

Nice post El Barto.

[Tick]

Very good post. I also heard rumors that 9/11 changed everything.

It did?

[ainamotore]

All missing the point. 911 was revenge, not initiation. Revenge for us sticking out noses where it does not belong and getting involved with wars in the Middle East, purely to defend our economic interests.

If we took care of our own energy needs, we would not need to be bombing their citizens to defend our economic interests. We have oil in the Gulf, oil in the Atlantic, oil in Alaska. It should be drilled and drilled and drilled some more so that we have zero dependence on the savages of the Middle East for our energy needs.

We should NEVER ALLOW ourselves to be dependent on Islam for our oil.

But no, we allow envirofascists to stifle us to protect a few inconsequential animals, and our sons die to procure oil from theocratic human ballast whose civilizations are still mired in the Dark Ages.

Will we learn? No. We will wave flags, believing we are right BECAUSE IT IS US, and continue down the same old stupid and immoral road.

[Adami]

All missing the point. 911 was revenge, not initiation. Revenge for us sticking out noses where it does not belong and getting involved with wars in the Middle East, purely to defend our economic interests.

If we took care of our own energy needs, we would not need to be bombing their citizens to defend our economic interests. We have oil in the Gulf, oil in the Atlantic, oil in Alaska. It should be drilled and drilled and drilled some more so that we have zero dependence on the savages of the Middle East for our energy needs.

We should NEVER ALLOW ourselves to be dependent on Islam for our oil.

But no, we allow envirofascists to stifle us to protect a few inconsequential animals, and our sons die to procure oil from theocratic human ballast whose civilizations are still mired in the Dark Ages.

Will we learn? No. We will wave flags, believing we are right BECAUSE IT IS US, and continue down the same old stupid and immoral road.

I think if you don't credit whichever republican/libertarian manifesto you copied that from, then it's plagiarism.

[Sigz]

Wait... so 9/11 is the fault of environmentalists?

[Adami]

Wait... so 9/11 is the fault of environmentalists?

What isn't?

[Tick]

All missing the point. 911 was revenge, not initiation. Revenge for us sticking out noses where it does not belong and getting involved with wars in the Middle East, purely to defend our economic interests.

If we took care of our own energy needs, we would not need to be bombing their citizens to defend our economic interests. We have oil in the Gulf, oil in the Atlantic, oil in Alaska. It should be drilled and drilled and drilled some more so that we have zero dependence on the savages of the Middle East for our energy needs.

We should NEVER ALLOW ourselves to be dependent on Islam for our oil.

But no, we allow envirofascists to stifle us to protect a few inconsequential animals, and our sons die to procure oil from theocratic human ballast whose civilizations are still mired in the Dark Ages.

Will we learn? No. We will wave flags, believing we are right BECAUSE IT IS US, and continue down the same old stupid and immoral road.

Thank you for that wonderful rhetoric. Have a nice day.

[ainamotore]

I think if you don't credit whichever republican/libertarian manifesto you copied that from, then it's plagiarism.

Awesome, it's not nearly my best stuff either.

[ainamotore]

Wait... so 9/11 is the fault of environmentalists?

It is the fault of the statist-collectivist trends of the past 40 years which subsume environmentalism and other irrational movements.

[Adami]

Wait... so 9/11 is the fault of environmentalists?

It is the fault of the statist-collectivist trends of the past 40 years which subsume environmentalism and other irrational movements.

Huh, I thought it was the fault of a group of people who commited the act. But I guess people aren't responsible for their actions anymore, as long as liberals can be to blame.

[ainamotore]

Wait... so 9/11 is the fault of environmentalists?

It is the fault of the statist-collectivist trends of the past 40 years which subsume environmentalism and other irrational movements.

Huh, I thought it was the fault of a group of people who commited the act. But I guess people aren't responsible for their actions anymore, as long as liberals can be to blame.

Well, let's see. Who bombed who first?

[Adami]

No one bombed america.


Also, doesn't matter who did what first. People are responsible for their own actions. The people in the WTC didn't bomb anyone, as far as I know.

[El Barto]

All missing the point. 911 was revenge, not initiation. Revenge for us sticking out noses where it does not belong and getting involved with wars in the Middle East, purely to defend our economic interests.

If we took care of our own energy needs, we would not need to be bombing their citizens to defend our economic interests. We have oil in the Gulf, oil in the Atlantic, oil in Alaska. It should be drilled and drilled and drilled some more so that we have zero dependence on the savages of the Middle East for our energy needs.

We should NEVER ALLOW ourselves to be dependent on Islam for our oil.

But no, we allow envirofascists to stifle us to protect a few inconsequential animals, and our sons die to procure oil from theocratic human ballast whose civilizations are still mired in the Dark Ages.

Will we learn? No. We will wave flags, believing we are right BECAUSE IT IS US, and continue down the same old stupid and immoral road.

Your first sentence was pretty much dead on.  Unfortunately, you then went into a misplaced and absurd attack on one side of the political spectrum.  Blaming your so-called envirofascists, whateverthefuck they are, is surprisingly short-sighted.  We've been meddling in other people's business for ages and oil is only one of many different reasons for it.  I'd say that anti-Communist hysteria was a much bigger contributor to our follies.  Our unyielding belief that democracy is the best solution for everybody.  Propping up Israel.  Let's not forget the military/industrial complex that rakes it in every time we go off half-cocked.  And while I suspect you'd agree with me on all of these points, you make yourself look shallow by only blaming the Al Gore types. 

Something else to keep in mind is that while there are plenty of folks in the world who hate America for meddling in other people's affairs, nobody likes unhelpful bystanders either.  Letting people get slaughtered because you can't be troubled to help out because it doesn't benefit you in any way doesn't win many friends, either.  There's kind of a damned either way phenomenon at work here. 

[icysk8r]

All missing the point. 911 was revenge, not initiation. Revenge for us sticking out noses where it does not belong and getting involved with wars in the Middle East, purely to defend our economic interests.

If we took care of our own energy needs, we would not need to be bombing their citizens to defend our economic interests. We have oil in the Gulf, oil in the Atlantic, oil in Alaska. It should be drilled and drilled and drilled some more so that we have zero dependence on the savages of the Middle East for our energy needs.

We should NEVER ALLOW ourselves to be dependent on Islam for our oil.

But no, we allow envirofascists to stifle us to protect a few inconsequential animals, and our sons die to procure oil from theocratic human ballast whose civilizations are still mired in the Dark Ages.

Will we learn? No. We will wave flags, believing we are right BECAUSE IT IS US, and continue down the same old stupid and immoral road.

Your first sentence was pretty much dead on.  Unfortunately, you then went into a misplaced and absurd attack on one side of the political spectrum.  Blaming your so-called envirofascists, whateverthefuck they are, is surprisingly short-sighted.  We've been meddling in other people's business for ages and oil is only one of many different reasons for it.  I'd say that anti-Communist hysteria was a much bigger contributor to our follies.  Our unyielding belief that democracy is the best solution for everybody.  Propping up Israel.  Let's not forget the military/industrial complex that rakes it in every time we go off half-cocked.  And while I suspect you'd agree with me on all of these points, you make yourself look shallow by only blaming the Al Gore types. 

Something else to keep in mind is that while there are plenty of folks in the world who hate America for meddling in other people's affairs, nobody likes unhelpful bystanders either.  Letting people get slaughtered because you can't be troubled to help out because it doesn't benefit you in any way doesn't win many friends, either.  There's kind of a damned either way phenomenon at work here. 

I think if you don't list me as a source it's considered plagiarism.

No, but seriously.  I agree 110%.

[Seventh Son]

I nominate El Barto for best poster on DTF.

[Sigz]

https://www.theonion.com/articles/we-must-retaliate-with-blind-rage-vs-we-must-retal,11537/

The Onion is scarily prophetic.

[In The Name Of Rudess]

Something else to keep in mind is that while there are plenty of folks in the world who hate America for meddling in other people's affairs, nobody likes unhelpful bystanders either.  Letting people get slaughtered because you can't be troubled to help out because it doesn't benefit you in any way doesn't win many friends, either.  There's kind of a damned either way phenomenon at work here.  

There have been numerous attempts by other countries to take action against Israel (to take your example). However, each and every time the US used its veto in the U.N. council. The number of times the US used its veto is preposterous: If the United States had not invoked its veto this many times, the record against Israel would total 100 resolutions condemning or otherwise criticizing its behavior or supporting the rights of Palestinians. So it's not like other countries want to be unhelpful bystanders, they're more of less forced by the US.

[Adami]

Something else to keep in mind is that while there are plenty of folks in the world who hate America for meddling in other people's affairs, nobody likes unhelpful bystanders either.  Letting people get slaughtered because you can't be troubled to help out because it doesn't benefit you in any way doesn't win many friends, either.  There's kind of a damned either way phenomenon at work here.  

There have been numerous attempts by other countries to take action against Israel (to take your example). However, each and every time the US used its veto in the U.N. council. The number of times the US used its veto is preposterous: If the United States had not invoked its veto this many times, the record against Israel would total 100 resolutions condemning or otherwise criticizing its behavior or supporting the rights of Palestinians. So it's not like other countries want to be unhelpful bystanders, they're more of less forced by the US.

Not calling you a liar or anything, but do you have any links to back that up? I'd love to read them.

[In The Name Of Rudess]

Something else to keep in mind is that while there are plenty of folks in the world who hate America for meddling in other people's affairs, nobody likes unhelpful bystanders either.  Letting people get slaughtered because you can't be troubled to help out because it doesn't benefit you in any way doesn't win many friends, either.  There's kind of a damned either way phenomenon at work here.  

There have been numerous attempts by other countries to take action against Israel (to take your example). However, each and every time the US used its veto in the U.N. council. The number of times the US used its veto is preposterous: If the United States had not invoked its veto this many times, the record against Israel would total 100 resolutions condemning or otherwise criticizing its behavior or supporting the rights of Palestinians. So it's not like other countries want to be unhelpful bystanders, they're more of less forced by the US.

Not calling you a liar or anything, but do you have any links to back that up? I'd love to read them.

Here you go: https://www.ifamericansknew.org/us_ints/p-neff-veto.html

[Adami]

Here you go: https://www.ifamericansknew.org/us_ints/p-neff-veto.html

Well that was a horribly biased and extremely poorly worded opinion article. However, if your point simply was "they hate us because (amongst other things) we support Israel", then fair enough.

[SnakeEyes]

These are my thoughts:

https://liveshots.blogs.foxnews.com/2010/09/10/old-friend-challenges-bin-laden/?test=latestnews

[In The Name Of Rudess]

Here you go: https://www.ifamericansknew.org/us_ints/p-neff-veto.html

Well that was a horribly biased and extremely poorly worded opinion article. However, if your point simply was "they hate us because (amongst other things) we support Israel", then fair enough.

The article is almost entirely made up of information he got from verifiable sources (there's a list at the bottom). I don't see how an article that was almost entirely made up out of facts could be biased and opinionated. Poorly worded, okay, if that's your opinion. But the information is correct and verifiable. And from the information I get this: The US has used its veto numerous times to prevent action being taken against Israel. Just plain facts.

[William Wallace]

These are my thoughts:

https://liveshots.blogs.foxnews.com/2010/09/10/old-friend-challenges-bin-laden/?test=latestnews

That doesn't get to the heart of the issue. Sure, most Muslims object to Al Qaeda's ideology and attacks on innocent people. But the reality is that our constant intervention in the Middle East has provided a pretext for these extremist groups to kill people and blow shit up. If, for example, we never ousted elected leaders and installed dictatorial stooges in their place, as was the case in Iran, there would be little justification for attacking us.

[Perpetual Change]

For awhile, I had the audacity to hope that the right and left at least now could both agree that our involvement in the middle-east is not only pointless, but causing the decline of our nation. Now looks like everyone believes in it again. What the hell?

[Dublagent66]

You thought 9/11 was bad?  Has anybody stopped to consider for one second, the possibility of a nuclear weapon being detonated in an American city?  What kind of contingency plan does America have for that?  How many Americans think that will never happen in the future?  I realize how tragic that day was and I'll never forget.  But, looking on the bright side of things, it could've been exponentially worse.  Will we be prepared for whatever happens next?  I wonder...

[El Barto]

No we're not prepared and there isn't any real contingency plan.  However, life will go on.  I can think of plenty of things that have happened to cities all over the world that were worse than that possibility.  Dresden, London, Berlin, Nagasaki, Hiroshima, Port-au-Prince, and countless others.  I don't think any device Achmed manages to set off will come close to matching that level of destruction (though the loss of life might be just as high if it's in Manhattan).  I'm just curious if Americans will handle it as well as others have.  Unfortunately, I have my doubts. 

[King Postwhore]

No we're not prepared and there isn't any real contingency plan.  However, life will go on.  I can think of plenty of things that have happened to cities all over the world that were worse than that possibility.  Dresden, London, Berlin, Nagasaki, Hiroshima, Port-au-Prince, and countless others.  I don't think any device Achmed manages to set off will come close to matching that level of destruction (though the loss of life might be just as high if it's in Manhattan).  I'm just curious if Americans will handle it as well as others have.  Unfortunately, I have my doubts. 

I think the problem is, achmed is not a country, but a philosophy. It's hard to attack a philosophy without borders around it.  How do you realy get to a small militant group that's spread out everywhere?

[Progmetty]

so that we have zero dependence on the savages of the Middle East for our energy needs.

One savage middle eastern here is wondering if there are still rules on DTF against such an insult? cause if it's every man for himself and I'm allowed to let out some of that savage I have inside me then that wouldn't be so civilized.

[Adami]

so that we have zero dependence on the savages of the Middle East for our energy needs.

One savage middle eastern here is wondering if there are still rules on DTF against such an insult? cause if it's every man for himself and I'm allowed to let out some of that savage I have inside me then that wouldn't be so civilized.

I'm not sure if I am counted in that insult, since I'm middle eastern, but I think he just meant arabs. But I guess there's no punishment? And if there is, I guess it was done privately.

But, considering I haven't seen him post here in a while, that might be a hint that it was dealt with.

[Seventh Son]

so that we have zero dependence on the savages of the Middle East for our energy needs.

One savage middle eastern here is wondering if there are still rules on DTF against such an insult? cause if it's every man for himself and I'm allowed to let out some of that savage I have inside me then that wouldn't be so civilized.

I'm not sure if I am counted in that insult, since I'm middle eastern, but I think he just meant arabs. But I guess there's no punishment? And if there is, I guess it was done privately.

But, considering I haven't seen him post here in a while, that might be a hint that it was dealt with.

Yeah, I would say so. Besides, he's just an obvious troll from what I've seen so far. I wouldn't let him rile you up, look at the other stuff he posted.

[PlaysLikeMyung]

so that we have zero dependence on the savages of the Middle East for our energy needs.

One savage middle eastern here is wondering if there are still rules on DTF against such an insult? cause if it's every man for himself and I'm allowed to let out some of that savage I have inside me then that wouldn't be so civilized.

I'm not sure if I am counted in that insult, since I'm middle eastern, but I think he just meant arabs. But I guess there's no punishment? And if there is, I guess it was done privately.

But, considering I haven't seen him post here in a while, that might be a hint that it was dealt with.

Yeah, I would say so. Besides, he's just an obvious troll from what I've seen so far. I wouldn't let him rile you up, look at the other stuff he posted.

This might be a good time to bring up this point:

Where has millahhhhhhhh been recently?

[hefdaddy42]

I'm convinced that an EMP event would be much more damaging to the country than a mere nuclear weapon.