Author Topic: Mike Portnoy leaves Dream Theater  (Read 425400 times)

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Offline antigoon

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Re: Mike Portnoy leaves Dream Theater
« Reply #2205 on: October 07, 2010, 10:11:23 PM »
I have a confession to make. I think this is one of the best things that could have happened to DT. As of late I had found DT boring and predictable, and their musical output interested me less and less. This development not only provides seemingly endless entertainment due to the drama factor (I was getting afraid it had already died down), but it also adds a new spark to DT, and that's good.

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Offline emindead

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Re: Mike Portnoy leaves Dream Theater
« Reply #2206 on: October 07, 2010, 10:11:57 PM »
I'm not saying this would happen, but here's a hypothetical nobody has talked about:  Mike was key in providing a lot of the structure and arrangement of DT's songs.  What happens if that element is suddenly removed, but a lot of other things stay the same?  I.e., what if we get an album that is a JP/JR shredfest, but lacking the kind of structure and arrangement that Mike brought to the table?  I mean, it would be pretty ironic if the next album came out, and people were like, "What the--MIKE, PLEASE COME BACK!!!"   :lol
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Offline orcus116

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Re: Mike Portnoy leaves Dream Theater
« Reply #2207 on: October 07, 2010, 10:12:04 PM »
I think a lot of things about predictability is good

I'd be curious to hear why. For me the thing that makes a band like Dream Theater deliver is their ability to surprise and wow. Predictability doesn't seem to work well into that kind of style.

Offline j

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Re: Mike Portnoy leaves Dream Theater
« Reply #2208 on: October 07, 2010, 10:13:18 PM »
I have a confession to make. I think this is one of the best things that could have happened to DT. As of late I had found DT boring and predictable, and their musical output interested me less and less. This development not only provides seemingly endless entertainment due to the drama factor (I was getting afraid it had already died down), but it also adds a new spark to DT, and that's good.

rumborak

I agree that *something* needed to shake things up a little, although I think it's too bad that things are going down the way they are.  Hopefully it will result in good music from both Portnoy and DT, like Barto said.

I'm not saying this would happen, but here's a hypothetical nobody has talked about:  Mike was key in providing a lot of the structure and arrangement of DT's songs.  What happens if that element is suddenly removed, but a lot of other things stay the same?  I.e., what if we get an album that is a JP/JR shredfest, but lacking the kind of structure and arrangement that Mike brought to the table?  I mean, it would be pretty ironic if the next album came out, and people were like, "What the--MIKE, PLEASE COME BACK!!!"   :lol

This is always a possibility, but with regard to your specific example, I'm confident that Petrucci, Rudess, and Myung (and possibly LaBrie, I don't know) will have no trouble structuring and arranging their music.

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Offline bosk1

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Re: Mike Portnoy leaves Dream Theater
« Reply #2209 on: October 07, 2010, 10:14:11 PM »
Oh, I know.  And I'm not predicting that will happen.  I'm just saying that it would be incredibly funny given all the speculation that things will be better.
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Re: Mike Portnoy leaves Dream Theater
« Reply #2210 on: October 07, 2010, 10:20:06 PM »
Oh, I know.  And I'm not predicting that will happen.  I'm just saying that it would be incredibly funny given all the speculation that things will be better.

Well aside from behind-the-scenes videos, we don't really know how in-depth, or specifically what it is that Mike does with/for every song, so we can't be TOO sure how much of the arranging is credited to Mike and his suggestions. It could've been a third of the song, or less, or even more! But I'm willing to bet that the remaining members will now have more to say in the song's arrangements. I think JR is a great arranger, and his writing on the last five albums have been fantastic! I also think JP is a great writer, and whatever he brings to the board, the rest of the band will delightfully offer opinions on tweaking things.

I think it would be kind of silly for fans to ridicule the next album's song arrangements because we would never KNOW what Mike would've done with those songs, so we can't really compare. We also can't know how past songs would sound had Mike not suggested any creative input as far as the arrangements went. If it's a shredfest that we get, we can't really know if that's what Mike would've wanted or not. He could've wanted MORE balls and shredding than whatever we'll get... or less! The world may never know...

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Offline ReaPsTA

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Re: Mike Portnoy leaves Dream Theater
« Reply #2211 on: October 07, 2010, 10:26:37 PM »
I'm not saying this would happen, but here's a hypothetical nobody has talked about:  Mike was key in providing a lot of the structure and arrangement of DT's songs.  What happens if that element is suddenly removed, but a lot of other things stay the same?  I.e., what if we get an album that is a JP/JR shredfest, but lacking the kind of structure and arrangement that Mike brought to the table?  I mean, it would be pretty ironic if the next album came out, and people were like, "What the--MIKE, PLEASE COME BACK!!!"   :lol

It's kind of weird, because JP and JR's past works are so wild when it comes to structure. They seem to either keep things very concise and straight forward, or go for very crazy and/or expanded structures.
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Offline Gorille85

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Re: Mike Portnoy leaves Dream Theater
« Reply #2212 on: October 07, 2010, 10:36:54 PM »
I'm not saying this would happen, but here's a hypothetical nobody has talked about:  Mike was key in providing a lot of the structure and arrangement of DT's songs.  What happens if that element is suddenly removed, but a lot of other things stay the same?  I.e., what if we get an album that is a JP/JR shredfest, but lacking the kind of structure and arrangement that Mike brought to the table?  I mean, it would be pretty ironic if the next album came out, and people were like, "What the--MIKE, PLEASE COME BACK!!!"   :lol

It's kind of weird, because JP and JR's past works are so wild when it comes to structure. They seem to either keep things very concise and straight forward, or go for very crazy and/or expanded structures.

I noticed that too.

Offline axeman90210

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Re: Mike Portnoy leaves Dream Theater
« Reply #2213 on: October 07, 2010, 11:16:45 PM »
I think a lot of things about predictability is good

I'd be curious to hear why. For me the thing that makes a band like Dream Theater deliver is their ability to surprise and wow. Predictability doesn't seem to work well into that kind of style.

well from the rest of Nick's post he seemed to be talking more about predictability in their schedule/operating as a band rather than the music, which I get.

Personally I hadn't been a fan of the last few albums, but I thought Black Clouds... was a great step forward for them. I'm curious to see what this next album will end up sounding like
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Offline Orbert

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Re: Mike Portnoy leaves Dream Theater
« Reply #2214 on: October 07, 2010, 11:23:10 PM »
I'm not saying this would happen, but here's a hypothetical nobody has talked about:  Mike was key in providing a lot of the structure and arrangement of DT's songs.  What happens if that element is suddenly removed, but a lot of other things stay the same?  I.e., what if we get an album that is a JP/JR shredfest, but lacking the kind of structure and arrangement that Mike brought to the table?  I mean, it would be pretty ironic if the next album came out, and people were like, "What the--MIKE, PLEASE COME BACK!!!"   :lol

It's kind of weird, because JP and JR's past works are so wild when it comes to structure. They seem to either keep things very concise and straight forward, or go for very crazy and/or expanded structures.

I noticed that too.

And DT's albums have always had the shorter, more concise songs, and the longer tunes which sometimes might have been padded a bit by shredfests.  The ratio has varied a bit from album to album, but overall I don't expect that aspect of DT's music to change a lot.

Offline Lowdz

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Re: Mike Portnoy leaves Dream Theater
« Reply #2215 on: October 08, 2010, 04:20:54 AM »


It's kind of weird, because JP and JR's past works are so wild when it comes to structure. They seem to either keep things very concise and straight forward, or go for very crazy and/or expanded structures.
[/quote]



Sounds like a perfectly good, balanced DT album to me!

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Re: Mike Portnoy leaves Dream Theater
« Reply #2216 on: October 08, 2010, 05:24:34 AM »
Oh, I know.  And I'm not predicting that will happen.  I'm just saying that it would be incredibly funny given all the speculation that things will be better.
Well I think we are going to find out a lot about the band on the next album. We've all made assumptions about the band, if only naturally, based on what we've observed. One of the assumptions is that MP would never NOT be a member of the band...so anything is fair game now. I think that is the real drama at this time.
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Offline 7StringedBeast

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Re: Mike Portnoy leaves Dream Theater
« Reply #2217 on: October 08, 2010, 08:15:20 AM »
"Mike Portnoy: Goodbye Cruel World....."

...Wait what?
Being discussed here already: https://www.dreamtheaterforums.org/boards/index.php?topic=17334.msg621461#msg621461
Um, but isn't that thread supposed to be in this thread? :p

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Offline ReaPsTA

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Re: Mike Portnoy leaves Dream Theater
« Reply #2218 on: October 08, 2010, 08:17:34 AM »

Quote
It's kind of weird, because JP and JR's past works are so wild when it comes to structure. They seem to either keep things very concise and straight forward, or go for very crazy and/or expanded structures.

Sounds like a perfectly good, balanced DT album to me!

Maybe, but I'm thinking it might be just crazy and insane. Wither and Forsaken are very good but compacted song. On the other end of the spectrum, listen to the Night with Petrucci and Rudess album. Those songs are long. Or Insectsamongus by Rudess, possibly the biggest non-sequitor of a song I've ever heard (although I do like it. 2:45 - 3:03 is like the coolest thing ever)
« Last Edit: October 08, 2010, 02:43:41 PM by ReaPsTA »
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Re: Mike Portnoy leaves Dream Theater
« Reply #2219 on: October 08, 2010, 08:42:31 AM »
I think a lot of things about predictability is good

I'd be curious to hear why. For me the thing that makes a band like Dream Theater deliver is their ability to surprise and wow. Predictability doesn't seem to work well into that kind of style.

well from the rest of Nick's post he seemed to be talking more about predictability in their schedule/operating as a band rather than the music, which I get.

Bingo.
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Offline yorost

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Re: Mike Portnoy leaves Dream Theater
« Reply #2220 on: October 08, 2010, 09:55:19 AM »
I'm not saying this would happen, but here's a hypothetical nobody has talked about:  Mike was key in providing a lot of the structure and arrangement of DT's songs.  What happens if that element is suddenly removed, but a lot of other things stay the same?  I.e., what if we get an album that is a JP/JR shredfest, but lacking the kind of structure and arrangement that Mike brought to the table?  I mean, it would be pretty ironic if the next album came out, and people were like, "What the--MIKE, PLEASE COME BACK!!!"   :lol

Yeah, Mike helped with the structures of the songs. But that doesn't mean the other members don't know anything about song structure...
That's why it was worded as a "what if" statement.

Offline LTE3

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Re: Mike Portnoy leaves Dream Theater
« Reply #2221 on: October 08, 2010, 10:56:43 AM »
Ya know, this has sat with me for a while, and although my disappointment in Mike's attitude as of late has left me infinitely disappointed, I tried to analyze WHY some of us feel, shall I say, almost betrayed by his rash reaction towards things. And I realized that, well, its because Mike set his bar SO damn high by being great for what has seemed like an eternity, so a sudden 180 degree twist to a more self-fulfilling mindset has left us all in a tail spin trying to figure out where it all went wrong.
So I say, Mike, go, have your day. Make decisions for number 1 for a while and explore that path and see if it satisfies you. It would be dumb of me not to admit that if anyone has earned the right to a little bit of "me" focus, its Mike. I for one can say that Mike has given us plenty in the past 25 years, so that even if he never gets back on the same path or in the same mindset, I'm happy to say that he gave me plenty. I never want to be an expectant fan. Sure, its tough when you open your hands and the faucet just floods you with all sorts of good stuff, and it can leave you scratching your head when it suddenly, without much warning, just stops. But that is life, and I'm going to learn to live with it.
The bright side is both DT and Mike will move on. And once all this blows over, it will be a sad, silly joke of the past that we can shrug off as some exposed wounds and hurt feelings. I'm not saying Mike shouldn't be held responsible for his actions, but I can say that, as of now, I simply don't care anymore. It really doesn't effect me. Not nearly as much as I initially thought it might. I'm over it. I'm sure a lot of you will come to a similar conclusion sooner or later.

Well said, all the curent Mike haters will be the same one's cheering like crazy when he makes his return in a year.
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Offline skydivingninja

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Re: Mike Portnoy leaves Dream Theater
« Reply #2222 on: October 08, 2010, 10:59:00 AM »
I sincerely hope he doesn't return, and if he does return, not for a long while and only if the new drummer needs to leave or dies or something.

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Re: Mike Portnoy leaves Dream Theater
« Reply #2223 on: October 08, 2010, 11:03:06 AM »
I sincerely hope he doesn't return, and if he does return, not for a long while and only if the new drummer needs to leave or dies or something.
I don't care what he has said since this he quit. I wish he'd come back tomorrow!

I watched a video of him playing with A7X, and I have to say, he looks like there grampa playing with them. He looks out of place. Its silly to me.
« Last Edit: October 08, 2010, 11:16:10 AM by tick »
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Offline hefdaddy42

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Re: Mike Portnoy leaves Dream Theater
« Reply #2224 on: October 08, 2010, 11:05:48 AM »
Ya know, this has sat with me for a while, and although my disappointment in Mike's attitude as of late has left me infinitely disappointed, I tried to analyze WHY some of us feel, shall I say, almost betrayed by his rash reaction towards things. And I realized that, well, its because Mike set his bar SO damn high by being great for what has seemed like an eternity, so a sudden 180 degree twist to a more self-fulfilling mindset has left us all in a tail spin trying to figure out where it all went wrong.
So I say, Mike, go, have your day. Make decisions for number 1 for a while and explore that path and see if it satisfies you. It would be dumb of me not to admit that if anyone has earned the right to a little bit of "me" focus, its Mike. I for one can say that Mike has given us plenty in the past 25 years, so that even if he never gets back on the same path or in the same mindset, I'm happy to say that he gave me plenty. I never want to be an expectant fan. Sure, its tough when you open your hands and the faucet just floods you with all sorts of good stuff, and it can leave you scratching your head when it suddenly, without much warning, just stops. But that is life, and I'm going to learn to live with it.
The bright side is both DT and Mike will move on. And once all this blows over, it will be a sad, silly joke of the past that we can shrug off as some exposed wounds and hurt feelings. I'm not saying Mike shouldn't be held responsible for his actions, but I can say that, as of now, I simply don't care anymore. It really doesn't effect me. Not nearly as much as I initially thought it might. I'm over it. I'm sure a lot of you will come to a similar conclusion sooner or later.

Well said, all the curent Mike haters will be the same one's cheering like crazy when he makes his return in a year.
There will be no return.
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Re: Mike Portnoy leaves Dream Theater
« Reply #2225 on: October 08, 2010, 11:40:40 AM »
At first I went "oh shit", than I was like "about time". I'm hoping now we won't get crap like this;

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Re: Mike Portnoy leaves Dream Theater
« Reply #2226 on: October 08, 2010, 11:48:37 AM »
That ''meeeeei'' sounded amazing, too bad it didn't end up on the album.

Offline Tick

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Re: Mike Portnoy leaves Dream Theater
« Reply #2227 on: October 08, 2010, 11:52:29 AM »
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Offline orcus116

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Re: Mike Portnoy leaves Dream Theater
« Reply #2228 on: October 08, 2010, 11:59:33 AM »
I think a lot of things about predictability is good

I'd be curious to hear why. For me the thing that makes a band like Dream Theater deliver is their ability to surprise and wow. Predictability doesn't seem to work well into that kind of style.

well from the rest of Nick's post he seemed to be talking more about predictability in their schedule/operating as a band rather than the music, which I get.

Bingo.

That was a poor use of predictability, Nick. You get an F.

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Re: Mike Portnoy leaves Dream Theater
« Reply #2229 on: October 08, 2010, 12:17:23 PM »
Oh, I know.  And I'm not predicting that will happen.  I'm just saying that it would be incredibly funny given all the speculation that things will be better.
Well I think we are going to find out a lot about the band on the next album. We've all made assumptions about the band, if only naturally, based on what we've observed. One of the assumptions is that MP would never NOT be a member of the band...so anything is fair game now. I think that is the real drama at this time.

This is the precise reason why I don't want MP to come back.  He's been the foundation on which Dream Theater has rested for around a quarter of a century.  Now I'm really eager to see what happens when that foundation is taken out from under them, for better or worse (or neither, if that be the case).
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Re: Mike Portnoy leaves Dream Theater
« Reply #2230 on: October 08, 2010, 01:23:07 PM »
Ya know, this has sat with me for a while, and although my disappointment in Mike's attitude as of late has left me infinitely disappointed, I tried to analyze WHY some of us feel, shall I say, almost betrayed by his rash reaction towards things. And I realized that, well, its because Mike set his bar SO damn high by being great for what has seemed like an eternity, so a sudden 180 degree twist to a more self-fulfilling mindset has left us all in a tail spin trying to figure out where it all went wrong.
So I say, Mike, go, have your day. Make decisions for number 1 for a while and explore that path and see if it satisfies you. It would be dumb of me not to admit that if anyone has earned the right to a little bit of "me" focus, its Mike. I for one can say that Mike has given us plenty in the past 25 years, so that even if he never gets back on the same path or in the same mindset, I'm happy to say that he gave me plenty. I never want to be an expectant fan. Sure, its tough when you open your hands and the faucet just floods you with all sorts of good stuff, and it can leave you scratching your head when it suddenly, without much warning, just stops. But that is life, and I'm going to learn to live with it.
The bright side is both DT and Mike will move on. And once all this blows over, it will be a sad, silly joke of the past that we can shrug off as some exposed wounds and hurt feelings. I'm not saying Mike shouldn't be held responsible for his actions, but I can say that, as of now, I simply don't care anymore. It really doesn't effect me. Not nearly as much as I initially thought it might. I'm over it. I'm sure a lot of you will come to a similar conclusion sooner or later.

Well said, all the curent Mike haters will be the same one's cheering like crazy when he makes his return in a year.
There will be no return.

I'm still trying to fathom why I stated my disappointment disappointed me :lol

I'm by no means excusing Mike's actions. I simply don't care anymore. I'm not really concerned either way about his return, honestly. It is what it is. I'm done with the emotional investment in this, as it only leads to negativity.

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Re: Mike Portnoy leaves Dream Theater
« Reply #2231 on: October 09, 2010, 06:01:01 PM »
Idk, maybe I'm wrong, but I think we're putting too much time on Mike's reactions instead of Dream Theater's future. I think that whatever they produce next will be awesome.
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Offline YtseJam

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Re: Mike Portnoy leaves Dream Theater
« Reply #2232 on: October 09, 2010, 09:48:52 PM »
One can only hope! I won't miss MP's terrible vocals on studio albums though. Live -no problem but on the albums? I think his ego definitely got the better of him. Maybe this will be dream theater next instead of mike portnoy theater.

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Re: Mike Portnoy leaves Dream Theater
« Reply #2233 on: October 09, 2010, 11:26:39 PM »
I don't think MP dominated creativity to the point where it became "Mike Portnoy Dream Theater."
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Re: Mike Portnoy leaves Dream Theater
« Reply #2234 on: October 10, 2010, 04:01:26 AM »
I don't care anymore.  If MP never comes back, I won't lose any sleep, as long as the other 4 guys keep making albums, I'm sure I'll be happy.

Offline Tick

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Re: Mike Portnoy leaves Dream Theater
« Reply #2235 on: October 10, 2010, 07:10:02 AM »
I was talking about Mike with a good friend who was over my house for dinner with his wife last night. We had not spoke about the whole thing since the day it transpired, and he has no interest in following the drama at all, so he knows not what has transpired. He just shook his head when I told him how ugly it is getting.
I honestly wholeheartedly believed after his interview with Eddie Truck that he would be back after an album without him. I now fear that he has created a monster and burned his bridges. Now I'm not so sure he will return. Money always plays a factor in these things and now I think his future with DT may rest on the success of the record without him. If its a huge hit and the tour sells well, I think that may spell his permanent departure.
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Offline Orbert

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Re: Mike Portnoy leaves Dream Theater
« Reply #2236 on: October 10, 2010, 07:21:26 AM »
tick, I know you are among the many fans who have trouble envisioning Dream Theater without Mike Portnoy, but I just don't see where the concept of him coming back, after one album or ever, even comes from.  The number of times someone has left a band and then returned is very, very small.  I'm not talking about leaving for a couple days because there was an argument; I'm talking about leaving for at least an album and a tour, then returning to the lineup.  It was never more than wishful thinking that he would come back, and as you point out, the odds are already getting shorter every day.

Offline Chino

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Re: Mike Portnoy leaves Dream Theater
« Reply #2237 on: October 10, 2010, 07:31:47 AM »
I sincerely hope he doesn't return, and if he does return, not for a long while and only if the new drummer needs to leave or dies or something.

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Offline Tick

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Re: Mike Portnoy leaves Dream Theater
« Reply #2238 on: October 10, 2010, 08:20:39 AM »
tick, I know you are among the many fans who have trouble envisioning Dream Theater without Mike Portnoy, but I just don't see where the concept of him coming back, after one album or ever, even comes from.  The number of times someone has left a band and then returned is very, very small.  I'm not talking about leaving for a couple days because there was an argument; I'm talking about leaving for at least an album and a tour, then returning to the lineup.  It was never more than wishful thinking that he would come back, and as you point out, the odds are already getting shorter every day.
Well, I just thought he sounded so melancholy in the Eddie Truck interview, and he almost seemed like he wanted back in at some point. That was just my take from what I heard.
His hurts however have put him in a place that have made his POSSIBLE return a less likely scenario. I was convinced he would be back when he left. Now, I don't really think he will, but I wouldn't rule it out. As I said, I believe the fans will help make that decision by what transpires in the coming months.
Whatever happens, I want to remain a Mike fan as he was my favorite member, but if his future winds up being the full time drummer for AV7 that will cease to be the case for me. At that point I would just wait to see what side projects he does.

Now we are all left to wonder if the band feels a weight lift off them from his departure? A part of me thinks this is the case.
Yup. Tick is dead on.  She's not your type.  Move on.   Tick is Obi Wan Kenobi


Offline rumborak

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Re: Mike Portnoy leaves Dream Theater
« Reply #2239 on: October 10, 2010, 08:43:18 AM »
tick, I know you are among the many fans who have trouble envisioning Dream Theater without Mike Portnoy, but I just don't see where the concept of him coming back, after one album or ever, even comes from.  The number of times someone has left a band and then returned is very, very small.  I'm not talking about leaving for a couple days because there was an argument; I'm talking about leaving for at least an album and a tour, then returning to the lineup.  It was never more than wishful thinking that he would come back, and as you point out, the odds are already getting shorter every day.
Well, I just thought he sounded so melancholy in the Eddie Truck interview, and he almost seemed like he wanted back in at some point. That was just my take from what I heard.

First of all, I thought Eddie was nigh useless in that interview, in the sense that he said just about anything MP wanted to hear to make him feel better. That is, he was so ridiculously siding with Mike, there was just little base in reality for that siding.
And yeah, I agree with that Mike seemed to harbor the (semi-)unspoken wish to return to DT soon, maybe after one album. I really wonder whether he's sitting at home wondering wtf happened in the last month and how it made it ever so more difficult o return.

rumborak
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