The Rush Thread v. Clockwork Angels

[TL]

Counterparts is a great album. TSoL is the only weak spot.

[King Postwhore]

Counterparts is a great album. TSoL is the only weak spot.

Amen.  1000% correct.

[ytserush]

Random thought: Leave That Thing Alone is my favorite instrumental of all time, if only because it reminds me of the Stardust Speedway level from Sonic CD, and old Sonic games have my favorite video game music. That and it's just rockin' on its own anyway.

I guess this is the part where I admit that whenever I put Leave That Thing Alone on a mix disc I always follow it with the Different Stages version. Pure bliss.

I've also put this song one repeat for hours on end sometimes and soak up the genius.

[ZBomber]

LTTA is great, but I'm not a huge fan of Counterparts. I know people say it's one of their best later albums, but I think it is just a bit too bland. Some songs are really good, but as an album it doesn't cut it for me.

[Pols Voice]

I'm not a big Counterparts fan. It contains a few of the worst Rush songs ever. Cut to the Chase and Leave That Thing Alone are great, though. Why don't they play CTTC live?

[glaurung]

I don't think there's a bad song on Counterparts.

[skydivingninja]

Counterparts is perfect as is.

[Nick]

No album with Stick it Out is perfect.

[Pols Voice]

Nobody's Hero, Alien Shore, and Cold Fire are crap.

[Nick]

Except those are all great songs.

[ZBomber]

Stick it Out always makes me think of dicks

[skydivingninja]

I don't get the problem with Stick it Out.

[ZBomber]

STICK OUT YOUR TONGUE
DON'T SWALLOW MY SEED

[senecadawg2]

I was thinking about starting a whole new thread to ask these questions, but I realized that would be pointless.

1. what are the best rush 'starter' albums?
currently I've really gotten into Moving Pictures and Permanent Waves, but I know that I'm missing out on a lot of the other not-so-popular stuff. Suggestions?

Also, 2. What are your favorite classic prog rock albums? Including the two rush albums I have, my other favorite is Yes's Fragile. As I am pretty new to the genre I am also looking for a lot more suggestions.

thanks

[Nick]

First off, your a noob, what do you think you're doing making smart decisions and such?

Secondly you have the two best starter albums. I would suggest moving to what are my two favorite albums ever (answering your 2nd question), and what are stylistically similar to Permanent Waves, A Farewell to Kings and Hemispheres.

[ZBomber]

I was thinking about starting a whole new thread to ask these questions, but I realized that would be pointless.

1. what are the best rush 'starter' albums?
currently I've really gotten into Moving Pictures and Permanent Waves, but I know that I'm missing out on a lot of the other not-so-popular stuff. Suggestions?

Also, 2. What are your favorite classic prog rock albums? Including the two rush albums I have, my other favorite is Yes's Fragile. As I am pretty new to the genre I am also looking for a lot more suggestions.

thanks

Definitely go to 2112, A Farewell to Kings, and Hemispheres next. After that, I'd hit their earlier 70s output and then move on to their 80s albums.

As for classic prog... these are all great albums
King Crimson - In The Court of the Crimson King
Yes - Close to the Edge
Genesis - Foxtrot
Pink Floyd - Meddle/Animals
Jethro Tull - Aqualung

[MasterShakezula]

Nobody's Hero, Alien Shore, and Cold Fire are crap.

Don't mean to revive a dead debate, but Nobody's Hero and Cold Fire are my favorites off of CP.

[KevShmev]

Cut to the Chase and Leave That Thing Alone are great, though. Why don't they play CTTC live?

I'd love for them to finally play that live, if only to see Lerxst nail that wonderful solo.

Counterparts is perfect as is.

Truth.

Nobody's Hero, Alien Shore, and Cold Fire are crap.

Crazy talk.

I don't get the problem with Stick it Out.

It's nothing special, but it is fine for what it is: a straight-forward rocker.  Plus, it being the first single from CP, at the time, given that Rush hadn't really gone heavy in a long time, when you first heard that riff, it was like, "Woah, they are ready to really rock again."

I was thinking about starting a whole new thread to ask these questions, but I realized that would be pointless.

1. what are the best rush 'starter' albums?
currently I've really gotten into Moving Pictures and Permanent Waves, but I know that I'm missing out on a lot of the other not-so-popular stuff. Suggestions?

Aside from those two, albums like 2112, A Farewell to Kings, Hemispheres, Grace Under Pressure, Power Windows, Counterparts and even Roll the Bones would be good places to go next.

[Zydar]

Nobody's Hero, Alien Shore, and Cold Fire are crap.

Cold Fire and Nobody's Hero are awesome!

[dbrooks22]

I would go from MP and PW to an 80's or 90's album, for reasons stated in the previous page of this thread.  If you stick with 76-81 Rush, it will be harder to understand mid to late 80's Rush.  You should try Roll the Bones or Presto next - just so you can experience the other side of the spectrum.

[KevShmev]

I am all for trying the other end of the spectrum, but, for God's sake, do NOT go with Presto next.  I know there is a small contingent of the fanbase that swears by it, but it is generally one of the least favorites by the fans AND by the band.  I would save that till the very end, along with Test for Echo. 

[dbrooks22]

I am all for trying the other end of the spectrum, but, for God's sake, do NOT go with Presto next.  I know there is a small contingent of the fanbase that swears by it, but it is generally one of the least favorites by the fans AND by the band.

Incorrect.  This is categorically NOT one of the band's least favorites.  They dusted it off and brought out the title track Presto on the Time Machine tour.  And "The Pass" is one of their favorite songs.  Presto is musical gold, but it is very far from mainstream Rush, and doesn't sound like anything the band did 10yrs prior (or after).  It will take some time to assimilate, but you will certainly be rewarded for it.

[Nick]

Um, there is no arguing that Presto is generally one of the fan bases least favorite Rush albums. And although the band has stated they love The Pass, they've been lukewarm on other aspects of the album in the band's biographies and such.

[dbrooks22]

Um, there is no arguing that Presto is generally one of the fan bases least favorite Rush albums. And although the band has stated they love The Pass, they've been lukewarm on other aspects of the album in the band's biographies and such.

I'm not disagreeing about the fanbase.  Hell, much of the 'fanbase' (including Portnoy) abandoned Rush as they moved toward electronic sounds in the 80's.  I know that the band was not happy with the over-production of Presto (as with the other Rupert Hine album, RTB), but has always been very happy with the songs themselves.  

[KevShmev]

That's not true either.  In the Contents Under Pressure book, Peart stated how they felt like the songs didn't live up to their potential, and Geddy said how the songs were interesting, but not great, and how they don't look at that album and think, "This is our best work."  They even said that Roll the Bones had much stronger songs (as it was easy to compare the two since they had similar production, although RtB had a tad more oomph).  I think the fact that songs from the album have gotten very little live play since they reunited in the early 00s says a lot; The Pass was played on the VT tour, the title track was played on the Time Machine tour, and that's it.  

[dbrooks22]

That's not true either.  In the Contents Under Pressure book, Peart stated how they felt like the songs didn't live up to their potential, and Geddy said how the songs were interesting, but not great, and how they don't look at that album and think, "This is our best work."  They even said that Roll the Bones had much stronger songs (as it was easy to compare the two since they had similar production, although RtB had a tad more oomph).  I think the fact that songs from the album have gotten very little live play since they reunited in the early 00s says a lot; The Pass was played on the VT tour, the title track was played on the Time Machine tour, and that's it. 

I don't disagree with what you have said here.  The band has been justifyably critical of aspects of the album.  And i agree with most that RTB has stronger songs.  But there is a difference between not thinking an album is "Our best work" and "this is one of our least favorite albums."  Plus, the members of Rush tend to change their opinions about their back catalogue as time goes on.  For example, Neil has stated several times over the past few years that he looks at MP as their "first" album.  Which pretty much discounts all of the genius recorded beforehand.  (After Presto was released, Neil thought it was their best album to date.  It was actually the only reason he agreed to tour - he wanted people to hear it).  And everyone knows how Alex felt about the band's synth-heavy work in the 80's.  So you have Peart discounting everything from the 70s, and Lifeson discounting most of the 80s.  And yet all 3 of them seem to agree that Stick it Out should be on the setlist tour after tour (blah)...

[KevShmev]

If I had a nickel for every time a musician called his newest album his best, I'd be sitting on a throne right now.   Musicians always think their newest album is either their best or one of their best.  Hell, Alex Lifeson at one point thought Vapor Trails was Rush's best album.

Also, Alex wasn't wild about the synth stuff at the time, but he has, by his own admission, come around to really liking a lot of that material.   

And it is not like Stick It Out has been on the setlist tour after tour, like you said.  It hadn't been played since 1997 until the Time Machine tour of the past year plus.  Granted, it was still an odd choice, but it's not like it has been a live mainstay of any kind.

[contest_sanity]

For some reason, I feel like I remember reading that in devising the set-list, each member was allowed to pick one or two songs that were "untouchable."  And I think "Stick It Out" was one of Geddy's because of the prominent bass part.  Not sure how Alex feels about the song, but I'm sure Peart doesn't view it as one of his lyrical masterpieces.  Anyway, if this recollection is accurate, and it may not be, then that means there wasn't even unified agreement on the song.

EDIT: BTW, I love "Stick It Out."  One of my favorites off an excellent, excellent record.

[dbrooks22]

If I had a nickel for every time a musician called his newest album his best, I'd be sitting on a throne right now.  Musicians always think their newest album is either their best or one of their best.  Hell, Alex Lifeson at one point thought Vapor Trails was Rush's best album.

Also, Alex wasn't wild about the synth stuff at the time, but he has, by his own admission, come around to really liking a lot of that material.  

And it is not like Stick It Out has been on the setlist tour after tour, like you said.  It hadn't been played since 1997 until the Time Machine tour of the past year plus.  Granted, it was still an odd choice, but it's not like it has been a live mainstay of any kind.

Yeah, i was going to say that.... Rush is one of those bands that always thinks their latest record is their best.  They do a good job convincing me too... but after a few years the threads come bare.

Wow - has it been that long since they had SIO on the setlist?  I'm getting old.  But you know why that song is etched in my Rush-concert memory?  Because the crowd cheering goes silent whenever they play it.  It's hard not to notice.

[King Postwhore]

Nobody's Hero, Alien Shore, and Cold Fire are crap.

I don't even.......  WAT?!

[dbrooks22]

And yet all 3 of them seem to agree that Stick it Out should be on the setlist tour after tour (blah)...

I think when i was typing this before i was getting it mixed up with that other piece of garbage that they insist on playing tour after tour - One Little Victory.  

[KevShmev]

Yeah, I wish they would ditch One Little Victory as well.  The intro is awesome, but the rest is pretty meh.  I suspect they have a personal fondness for it because of the significance.

I remember them talking years ago about how they each had one song (or was it two?) that they could put in the set list and the other two couldn't veto it.  I assume they still do it, but I just haven't seen or heard them talk about it in a long time.

[contest_sanity]

I remember them talking years ago about how they each had one song (or was it two?) that they could put in the set list and the other two couldn't veto it.  I assume they still do it, but I just haven't seen or heard them talk about it in a long time.

Maybe I just made my own logical jump in concluding "Stick It Out" to be one such song.

[ZBomber]

What are the other two picks then?

[contest_sanity]

I don't know if they've ever said, or even if they admitted "Stick It Out" was one.  I think I may have just assumed it was one because I knew of the practice and also because Neil IIRC kinda slammed it in Contents Under Pressure.