Is Our Public Education System Crippling Society?

[rumborak]

my actual argument which is that public schools are low quality

that I agree with

and unsustainable

That I disagree with, since it's based on your notion that nothing should cost tax money.

and that vouchers can bring some stability and competition

Dude, look at Sweden, and all of our arguments on top of that.
Vouchers simply don't do it; let's find something else. I don't see the point of trying to find a way of looking at the data so that we might convince ourselves that vouchers work after all. They don't; move on.

rumborak

[eric42434224]

Another side note is the quality of teachers and benefits.  The benefits that teachers get in public schools cant even compare to the pathetic benefits you get in private schools.  They get way better pay, better health insurance, and 403(b) and/or 457 -(both similar to 401(k)s ), better life & disability insurance, and pensions.  Not only does this increase the cost per child (in response to your cost effectiveness comparison between public and private), but will be a factor in getting and keeping the better teaching talent.  Some private schools offer benefits, but many offer none.  I would be interested in seeing what the health and retirement benefits would be for a school that has 30 kids and 2 teachers set up in someones converted garage.

[bosk1]

To take the question in the OP and go a different direction with it, here's my short response:

The public education system in this country is completely broken and is a joke.  Yes, there are some wonderful teachers out there and there are some terrific schools.  There are also some fantastic parents who get involved and help their children excel no matter how good or how bad a given school is.  But the system as a whole is failing miserably, IMO.  Is the solution privatization?  I really don't know what the solution is, to be honest.  I think the problem is far too big and complex for me to know what the solution is, frankly.  

What I do know is that an alternative solution that most people in this country know next to nothing about is homeschooling.  We got into home schooling with our kids not really knowing the full gamut of options and resources out there, but we have been discovering a lot as we go.  And I will say that if done properly, it can educate far better than the public school system is equipped to do.  I have seen it work with great success with various friends who are at all different stages (we have some friends who homeschooled whose kids are now done, have completed college, and are now working adults, some who have young kids, and some at various stages in between).  As far as our kids, our boys are starting second grade and kindergarten, and while it is still very early, here are some of the upsides we have seen:  Our kids are far ahead of their peers in their education.  Our second grader is years ahead of the CA standards in reading and math, and has been learning some history, science, foreign language, and creative arts (drawing and piano, which he is also doing well at).  Our son in kindergarten can already read and do some basic math.  His friends, who are all smart kids, can't really do either.  And they both enjoy learning, which is tremendous.  I mean, do we have days where they are difficult and moan about opening the books?  Sure.  But overall, they are enjoying themselves, as are we in being so actively involved in their learning.  We also enjoy the ability to plan meaningful field trips where they see what they are learning about hands-on instead of just learning from a book, or doing non-traditional things at home that help them learn in a more hands-on way.  For instance, when our oldest was learning about how plants work on a very basic level, it isn't just reading it in a book.  They read it.  Then maybe we go visit a farm and see it on a mass level.  Then we go out in the garden and plant something and they take care of it for a few months and actually get to see it up close and personal.  Or, for another example, they are learning fractions in math class.  Yes, there is the traditional book work.  And then there is the also familiar working with things like cutout pizza wedges and such.  But then they go into the kitchen and bake stuff with my wife and she shows them how to measure, and that this cup is half a cup and it takes two of those to make a whole cup, and so on, so they see fractions from a very practical, useful standpoint that they can related to even as small children.  On top of that, the whole process is just so much more efficient.  We can get so much more done in less time than it takes in public school.  And because we are always ahead of schedule, it's nice doing things spontaneously like declaring "P.E. day!" and packing up the van to head to the ski slopes, or some such.  Of course, it's a lot more work for us.  But the payoff, especially in comparison to what we've seen from the public school system as a whole, is huge.


tl;dnr:  public education = teh suxx

[eric42434224]

Homeschooling can just as easily be a complete disaster for the kids.  Few parents have the economic, time, patience, and educational means to properly educate a child.  

[bosk1]

Homeschooling can just as easily be a complete disaster for the kids.  

Yes, it can be.  It takes commitment from the parent(s) to do it properly.  But part of the reason it has gained so much traction over the last 20 years or so is because it works. 

Few parents have the economic, time, patience, and educational means to properly educate a child.  

That is simply not true.  Most parents are far better equipped than the current system to properly educate a child.  Few may realize it because they have no idea what to do.  But resources for learning how to do it properly abound.

[hefdaddy42]

I agree that homeschooling can be a fantastic option for many families.  I know several who have had great successes.

Of course, I've seen a few failures as well.  But unfortunately, that's life.

My children (well, child; the oldest is starting high school now) attend a local charter school, and we have been 1000% happy with our choice.

[Sir GuitarCozmo]

Without having read any of this and only having seen the term "homeschool", I will say this:  I personally feel like homeschooled children miss out on a ton of vital socialization experiences that public school kids don't.  I wouldn't trade my memories of high school for anything.

[eric42434224]

Homeschooling can just as easily be a complete disaster for the kids.  

Yes, it can be.  It takes commitment from the parent(s) to do it properly.  But part of the reason it has gained so much traction over the last 20 years or so is because it works.  

Few parents have the economic, time, patience, and educational means to properly educate a child.  

That is simply not true.  Most parents are far better equipped than the current system to properly educate a child.  Few may realize it because they have no idea what to do.  But resources for learning how to do it properly abound.

Im not talking about the availability of curriculum in regards to being equipped.  Im talking about the parents have sufficient proficiency in the educational material themselves, not to mention the skills in presenting the material in a proper way.  The child could learn in different ways (auditory vs visual) and the parent would never know.  Not to mention that many parents just dont thave the patience or commitment to do it, even though they feel they do.
It works in some cases (like yours), and it shows good results...because the parents that make that move and commitment are the kind of parents that are able to do it properly.  The fact is, unfortunately, the overwhelming majority of parents would be horrible home school teachers, regardless of cirriculum availability.  And I wont even go into the lack of social interaction and development.  Just talk to any teacher, and ask the percentage of parents that wont even take a fraction of their day to contunie and supplement education at home after school.  it is abysmally low.  Home schooling will never be more...and never should be more than a educational niche.

If you want to truly change the education system, one important component (more than many others discussed here, like vouchers) would be to have more educational involvement and support from the parents after school and over the summer.  School is thought of as simply a babysitter to too many parents.  School alone, no matter how good, is not the only piece of the puzzle.  My daughter goes to private school, and went to private pre-k.  Why does she test off the charts in every aspect?  Fine motor skills, speech-language, social, etc....was it the school?  No.  She is way ahead of other kids in the same program.  It is all because we support and continue what is taught at school.

[j]

That is simply not true.  Most parents are far better equipped than the current system to properly educate a child.  Few may realize it because they have no idea what to do.  But resources for learning how to do it properly abound.

I don't share your high opinion of "most parents", but I'm glad your family is having such success with homeschooling.

That said, I think the one huge flaw *inherent* to homeschooling is the absence of the social facet of public education.  (EDIT: Damn, Cozmo beat me to it!) That was far and away the most valuable part of public school for me, and there's really no way to re-create it.  Sure I played in sports leagues and did other activities that brought some of that to the table, but I don't think there's a substitute for the consistent, daily exposure to a large group of peers in that context.  You (ideally) learn to interact, work with others, handle conflicts, and a multitude of other crucial social skills.

As for the actual "education" side of things, it's crap.  I've always been an inquisitive person who enjoys learning about things, so while the public school system failed miserably in that regard, I was still learning quite a bit on my own.  But not everyone comes out of it okay.

I'm with rumborak in that I hardly think privatization of the school system will solve any of its major problems.  But I also think that the standards in place for curricula and for gauging student and teacher performance are wildly misguided, as is the absolute clusterfuck of bureaucracy that comprises the administrative portion of the school systems.

-J

[bosk1]

Without having read any of this and only having seen the term "homeschool", I will say this:  I personally feel like homeschooled children miss out on a ton of vital socialization experiences that public school kids don't.  

Having gone through public school myself and having observed a lot of homeschoolers as I mentioned above, I have to say:  (1) That is perhaps the most common criticism of homeschooling I have seen; and (2) At least in most cases, it simply isn't true.  It is a common misperception, but is just that:  a misperception.  Again, you have a some parents who do it wrong.  But most make sure their kids get tons of socialization, and most of the homeschoolers I have seen end up being more socially adept than most of their peers, which I think is very interesting.  But they aren't just at home in a bubble 24/7.  Most have tons of friends and tons of opportunities to spend time with other kids.  In fact, a lot of the learning itself is collaborative, either between siblings or in groups of homeschoolers.  One of the things I didn't mention above is that, especially as they progress to upper grades, there are plenty of opportunities for class sessions, whether they are classes at a charter school, paid private group classes, or group classes taught by parents.  For instance, my kids each have a 2-hour language class once a week through a charter school, and have other individual subject classses that are available as well.  Because a lot of the learning is collaborative and/or in a small group setting, they not only get to interact, but IMO get more out of that interaction because (1) they are encouraged to interact, and (2) they interact in a more manageable sized group where nobody just gets lost in the crowd.  And that doesn't even get into the endless list of activities that groups of homeschool families do together.  I can see where the lack of socialization concern comes from, and I fully understand how someone who doesn't have the knowledge of how homeschooling generally works would think that, but for the most part, it is a myth.

[rumborak]

One of the things I see in the US is that there's essentially a "brain drain" to schools, i.e. the parents that care enough about the educational standards are the ones who also have the money and thus send their kid to a "better school". What that does is leave the public schools with kids of uneducated and poor parents. I think partly the reason why European public schools work better than American ones is that almost everybody goes to them, and thus you have the concerned parents push for improvements in the schools.

rumborak

[Sir GuitarCozmo]

I can see where the lack of socialization concern comes from, and I fully understand how someone who doesn't have the knowledge of how homeschooling generally works would think that, but for the most part, it is a myth.

As you well know, our understanding of things is always filtered through the lenses of our own experience, so yeah, I'm not probably ever really going to "get it", as it were.  Though I may have gotten "lost in the crowd" to a degree in high school, it was alright.  I think back on it all very fondly and cannot begin to fathom it having been any other way.

[El Barto]

I think the style of teaching that Bosk is referring to is kick ass.  My issue with homeschooling is exactly the problem my mother cites.  No kid should spend that much time with his mother.  There needs to be some separation. 

[bosk1]

@j:  See my post above to Cozmo.

@Eric:  Yeah, I hear what you are saying.  I agree that a lot of parents aren't involved and treat school more like babysitting.  They assume (wrongfully, IMO) that the school has it all covered and figured out, and they don't need to be involved.  They don't have a clue what they should do, and shy away from figuring out what they can do to help their kids.  I can't say whether that's "most" parents or not.  But at least a lot of parents put their complete trust in a system that is broken.  It sounds like we essentially agree on that, even if we may disagree on the particulars.  And you are right that when parents get involved, the results are almost always better, whether it be in public school, private school, homeschool, whatever.  But I think that most parents would find that they are more than equipped to help their kids and just don't know it because they trust the school system so implicitly that they never bother to take the initiative to figure out how they can contribute to their child's education.  The distinction I made is that I think most parents can; it's just that they don't take the time to do.  If forced to take more personal responsibility for their child's education, I think we would see that a great many parents can do it.  Maybe I'm just naive, but I believe it's more a question of motivation than ability.  Or maybe "responsibility" is more the right focus.  For parents who are willing to truly take responsibility for their child's education, I just tend to think most parents can do it.  But if they aren't willing to really take that responsibility, their kids are probably better off in some other system because no matter the resources, the parents aren't going to properly equip themselves.

And as far as resources, I'm not only talking about curriculum, but resources on how to teach, which also includes counselors (i.e. counselors who counsel the parents on what to do and how to do it), advisors, books for the parents, other home school parents who have themselves had to deal with various issues, etc.  Really, the support network and materials out there to help homeschool parents and students succeed are boundless.

Anyhow, I'll get off my soapbox about homeschooling.  I'm not trying to persuade anyone that it is the cure-all.  I realize my experience with it makes me biased, and my bias probably makes me oversell its benefits, just as detractors probably oversell the perceived flaws.  It's not a perfect system.  But if done right, it can be a tremendous alternative.  Returning to my original point, I'm just saying it has worked well for us and for a lot of other people, and I just wanted to dispel some of the popular myths that have been thrown out there about it.

[Dr. SeaWolf]

Without having read any of this and only having seen the term "homeschool", I will say this:  I personally feel like homeschooled children miss out on a ton of vital socialization experiences that public school kids don't.  I wouldn't trade my memories of high school for anything.

This, and I don't think I feel qualified to teach things like Social Studies, History, and English Literature at the high school level.  I'd sooner have someone with a specialized college education in the subject teach them that stuff.

Plus, the scene in Jesus Camp where the mom is teaching his child about how evolution and global warming are the devil's lies left a bad taste in my mouth.

[hefdaddy42]

bosk, my child's charter school offers classes for home-schoolers, just like you mentioned.  And those home-schoolers are eligible to participate in other activities at the school as well (including, but not limited to, sports).

[bosk1]

bosk, my child's charter school offers classes for home-schoolers, just like you mentioned.  And those home-schoolers are eligible to participate in other activities at the school as well (including, but not limited to, sports).

Yeah, same where we are.  There are also private subject matter classes taught by individuals who either are homeschool parents, or who run their own business teaching classes for homeschoolers or kids who need special help in an area.  I think that's especially important in later grades where, as SeaWolf mentioned, you get to a level of depth in some subjects that parents may not feel qualified to teach.  I mean, part of the homeschool idea is to eventually get the kids to a point where they because largely self-sufficient and independant in their learning and the parent guides more than teaches (more along the "classical" model of education that you see in most colleges).  And the materials generally help the parent get up to speed as well.  But, yeah, in later grades, it's more common to have a group of kids attend, say, biology class at the charter school or all over at a parent's house who specializes in that area, and then another parent teaches a different subject, and so on.  And a lot of parents also transition their kids fully into public school at later ages and only do homeschooling for the earlier grades.  As I said, lots of options.

Sorry, I'm gushing again when I meant to only type a 2-sentence reply.  Can you tell I really love this system?   

[eric42434224]

I find a combination works best.  My child gets to experience learning and social interaction outside the family, and is taught by educated and qualified educators with great resources.  We also do a sort of "home-schooling" ouselves to reinforce the cirriculum that is taught at school, as well as "fill in" in areas that the child may need assistance, and in areas we feel are important that arent covered in traditional school cirriculum.  I think that the single solitary thing (and cheapest) that would improve the educational system is more, consistent, and accountable, parental involvement.  

EDIT: It seems to be a symptom of society to blame everyone else but yourself.  If your local school isnt doing enough, you need to take action.  You can complain about the beaurocracy all day, but that isnt going to directly affect your childs education in any meaningful way.  Neither is vouchers.  Personal responsibility of making sure your own child is getting the proper education is what is needed.  Too many parents think that the school is the only place where a child is educated, and get mad when it isnt up to par.  With such a massive organization, it is impossible to cater to every childs needs....that is the responsibility of the...oh yeah....the PARENT.   

[bosk1]

I think that the single solitary thing (and cheapest) that would improve the educational system is more, consistent, and accountable parental involvement. 

I could not agree more.  I just don't know how you make more parents take responsibility for their child's education to a degree that compels them to be more actively involved. 

[El Barto]

Plus, the scene in Jesus Camp where the mom is teaching his child about how evolution and global warming are the devil's lies left a bad taste in my mouth.

This raises an interesting point.  If I want to teach my kids that the universe (and therefore the sun) revolves around the Earth as God created us at the center, should I be allowed to?  How about a history lesson that chronicles the battle between the Gods of Olympus and the Titans?

[Dr. SeaWolf]

Clearly the mom in the movie is getting away with it.

[eric42434224]

I think that the single solitary thing (and cheapest) that would improve the educational system is more, consistent, and accountable parental involvement.  

I could not agree more.  I just don't know how you make more parents take responsibility for their child's education to a degree that compels them to be more actively involved.  

I dont think we can.  I would even go as far as saying that the problems with the educational system are less about the school, the system, the beaurocracy, etc...and WAY more about family involvement.  Not only would the children of each specific family have a better education if the family was involved in schooling, but the school, system, and beaurocracy itself would be improved greatly.  Everybody wants the system to change but they wont change their own behavoir.

One of the major reasons the education is better at the private schools (like the one my oldest goes to) is that there is WAY more parental involvement.  This is likely due to the fact that the parents that send their kids to private schools may have education as a higher priority, but the results are plain to see.  Parents at the school every day, taking time to help the teachers with projects, trips, materials, etc.  The ciriculum and materials, in most cases, is the same as the public schools....as well as teacher/student ratio.  What is the difference?  Parental involvement in the school and educational process....as opposed to school as daycare.

[bosk1]

I agree.  To put it another way, the problems with the public education are symptoms of a bigger problems.

[hefdaddy42]

I agree.  To put it another way, the problems with the public education are symptoms of a bigger problems.

Yep.

[Seventh Son]

I just wanna say, concerning people choosing what school they go to: Growing up the bus was the only way to get to school because there was only one car available and that was used for the working parent to get to work, meaning going to a different school other than the closest one never was an option.

[j]

Without having read any of this and only having seen the term "homeschool", I will say this:  I personally feel like homeschooled children miss out on a ton of vital socialization experiences that public school kids don't.  

Having gone through public school myself and having observed a lot of homeschoolers as I mentioned above, I have to say:  (1) That is perhaps the most common criticism of homeschooling I have seen; and (2) At least in most cases, it simply isn't true.  It is a common misperception, but is just that:  a misperception.  Again, you have a some parents who do it wrong.  But most make sure their kids get tons of socialization, and most of the homeschoolers I have seen end up being more socially adept than most of their peers, which I think is very interesting.  But they aren't just at home in a bubble 24/7.  Most have tons of friends and tons of opportunities to spend time with other kids.  In fact, a lot of the learning itself is collaborative, either between siblings or in groups of homeschoolers.  One of the things I didn't mention above is that, especially as they progress to upper grades, there are plenty of opportunities for class sessions, whether they are classes at a charter school, paid private group classes, or group classes taught by parents.  For instance, my kids each have a 2-hour language class once a week through a charter school, and have other individual subject classses that are available as well.  Because a lot of the learning is collaborative and/or in a small group setting, they not only get to interact, but IMO get more out of that interaction because (1) they are encouraged to interact, and (2) they interact in a more manageable sized group where nobody just gets lost in the crowd.  And that doesn't even get into the endless list of activities that groups of homeschool families do together.  I can see where the lack of socialization concern comes from, and I fully understand how someone who doesn't have the knowledge of how homeschooling generally works would think that, but for the most part, it is a myth.

I'm saying that, for better or worse, there is no substitute for the daily environment of a public school and the micro-pseudo-society it becomes over time.  In my opinion, exposure to both the good and the bad is important: sometimes you're in a large group where it's difficult to be heard, sometimes there's no one to breathe down each individual student's neck and urge them to participate, sometimes you have to work with obnoxious jack-offs who aren't motivated and won't pull their weight, etc.  This stuff is reality; when everything is so carefully engineered to be an "ideal" environment for learning, there are none of the uncertain, uncontrollable elements of working and learning and interacting in the real world.

I know people who were homeschooled for periods growing up, and I know it can be done well or very, very poorly.  And I don't doubt that there are innumerable ways to get your kids into situations where they will develop socially.  And I'm sure most kids who are homeschooled *properly* end up being socially adept or at least competent without ever setting foot in a large public school.  But I think it was quite valuable for me personally (and I know it has been for others), and I've seen a lot of cases of homeschooled kids who end up lacking in social skills as young adults.

-J

[Dr. SeaWolf]

I just wanna say, concerning people choosing what school they go to: Growing up the bus was the only way to get to school because there was only one car available and that was used for the working parent to get to work, meaning going to a different school other than the closest one never was an option.

This.  Also, both my parents worked, so homeschooling wasn't an option for me either.  

It was thanks to the great education I received in public school (I didn't live in a rich area either, and I was in a class of over 200 students) that I got my start as a scientist, and I don't think I would have gotten as far as I have if I didn't have expert, enthusiastic, college trained science teachers in high school.  As far as homeschooling is concerned, I just can't see parents being able to provide the same level of science education, unless they themselves are scientists.  They also don't have the laboratory equipment and expertise to run some of the hands-on experimental experience I had in high school, including animal dissection (I hated it, but I learned a lot), studies of chemical reactions, thermodynamics experiments with calorimeters, and basic physics experiments with incline planes, ballistic pendulums, etc.

Please tell me how parents can replicate that kind of science education, or how private schools are intrinsically better than well-funded, expert-staffed public schools.

[orcus116]

Let's just start over and go back to trades and apprenticeships.

[eric42434224]

Please tell me how parents can replicate that kind of science education, or how private schools are intrinsically better than well-funded, expert-staffed public schools.

I believe that homeschooled children do have access to use public schools in cases like this...where teachers with more expertise and labs are required.

And I dont think Private schools are intrinsically better.  I do think that generally, the parents that send their children to private school are more involved and accountable.  That makes a big difference.

[bosk1]

...They also don't have the laboratory equipment and expertise to run some of the hands-on experimental experience I had in high school, including animal dissection (I hated it, but I learned a lot), studies of chemical reactions, thermodynamics experiments with calorimeters, and basic physics experiments with incline planes, ballistic pendulums, etc.

Please tell me how parents can replicate that kind of science education...

Again, for that sort of thing, there are a few options:  (1) By the time kids get to the age where they're doing that sort of thing, have them enrolled either full time or part time in public school; (2) Have them enrolled in a formal science class taught at a private school, charter school, or traditional public school; or (3) Have them enrolled in a homeschool class taught by either a parent or a private teacher who is a scientist and rents or otherwise has access to a proper lab at a high school, community college, etc.  There may be other options as well that I am unaware of.  That stage is a few years away for us, and I definitely don't know everything there is to know about what options are available.

I'm hoping FW chimes in in this thread since he was homeschooled through high school and can speak more to how his parents did things in the later grades.  He is definitely an example of someone who not only successfully homeschooled all the way through, but has also gone to college and knocked his college classes, including science, out of the park in terms of grades.

[Nigerius Rex]

I spent my first two years of high school in a public school, and finished the second two with a program called independent study. I was assigned however much schoolwork I thought I would be able to do over a week of time and at the end of the week I met with an assigned teacher at my assigned public high school to discuss/correct/get help with anything I had completed over that week. It offered a lot of freedom and I could work at my own pace which was either much faster or much slower depending on the type of work but altogether allowed early graduation and a high school diploma. It also allowed me to make up a huge number of credits I had been missing in math due to the way public school math classes worked which was move on regardless of whether you understand it or not.

As far as science labs go, I don't know if there are any scientific principles that you cant demonstrate without lab equipment aside from dissection. I was never much into science, but I took the required classes which were physical and earth science and they were only 2 classes over two years during which we only did three or four labs or something like that. I am sure you could arrange a low cost rental or trip somewhere where you could do labs and other things.

[Fiery Winds]

Thanks for calling me out bosk!  

There were a couple different things we did when we had a science class.  For biology, we actually ordered dissection kits online and followed along with a lab manual and dissected an earthworm, a frog, and something else I don't remember.  For those times where it wasn't feasible to learn at home, we participated in a "co-op" with a group of other homeschoolers where we were taught by someone with more knowledge.  For example, with Chemistry, one of the parents was a chemist so he was able to help us out.  We also went on numerous field trips to see science in action, to supplement the book learning.  Both my sister and I probably didn't have as extensive a science education as public school, but both my sister are in the science field and doing well at it.

Another option available to a lot of people is community college.  Before graduating high school, I had already taken Trig, Pre-Cal, Physics 1, English 1, Spanish 1 and 2, and AutoCAD at the local community college.  It counted for high school credit AND college credit.

I should also point out that there are different "degrees" of homeschooling.  Some go completely off the grid, and while that works for some people, I think some level of integration is necessary, be it with a charter school, private school, etc.  For me, we were in a satellite program with a private school, so we reported our grades and we got official transcripts and I was even able to graduate on campus with the rest of the full-time students.  I participated in choir for a while and played on the varsity baseball team.  In fact, almost half of the varsity team were homeschoolers.

Because we were part of a satellite program, there were a lot of students to socialize with.  We had our own Student Council, of which I was President my senior year.  We organized events where we could all get together, and most of us were taking classes at each others houses several times a week.  Not to mention my involvement in Boy Scouts, I was heavily socialized during school.

I will agree with what some of you are saying that the number 1 problem in education is parental involvement.  I'm in a teaching credential program to teach in a public school ironically, and the statistics don't lie.  The schools with more parental involvement perform much better.

[William Wallace]

I don't think I feel qualified to teach things like Social Studies, History, and English Literature at the high school level.  I'd sooner have someone with a specialized college education in the subject teach them that stuff.

Homeschooling doesn't necessarily mean the parents take on sole responsibility for teaching their children.

Plus, the scene in Jesus Camp where the mom is teaching his child about how evolution and global warming are the devil's lies left a bad taste in my mouth.

I won't argue; that was completely retarded on her part. But not every parent is a moron. Also, think of how many kids graduate high school and know nothing about science. They may avoid the science-is-evil propaganda, but they're still uneducated. That's precisely why considering alternatives is a good idea.

[Dr. SeaWolf]

As far as science labs go, I don't know if there are any scientific principles that you cant demonstrate without lab equipment aside from dissection.

I would say as a physicist that it would be EXTREMELY hard to teach basic physics without demonstrations.  Concepts like conservation of momentum, static vs. kinetic friction, and electrostatic potential are exactly that; concepts... until they are observed firsthand.

[Nigerius Rex]

Physics isn't a high school requirement. But I can see what you are saying if you specifically wanted to study physics or an upper field that required it or meet the pre req for a transfer.